mindlight said:

This and South America is where the church is most vibrant. This is at the heart of the switch away from a Western led world order. Not that I have given up on the West yet, revival is still possible

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South America has its own kind of occulture, where Catholicism or Catholic symbols frequently blend with local religions. Brazil has alot of African-influenced religions and new religious movements, in particular. And I suspect Neo-Pentecostalism in Brazil will eventually fall victim to the same kind of political coding and nationalism that happened in the US, limiting its appeal.

Truth7t7 said:

Yes the democratic way is to elect a president who won by a popular vote in 2024 to do exactly what he promised, NPR & PBS are wasted taxpayer dollars "Gone"!

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Then let Congress vote on it, as the Constitution requires.

Truth7t7 said:

Great Job Donald J. Trump, MAGA, America First!

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Keep on drinkin' that Kool-Aid.

-- A2SG, oh yeah!

home fire

mindlight said:

You , like Trump, think parochial, but the pope thought global.

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The future of world civilization is going to pivot to Africa and Asia.

Steve the stenographer

thoroughbred

Hans Blaster said:

I've seen no evidence they believe otherwise. (Just like I've seen no evidence of their god.)

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In this case 'beauty isin the eye of the beholder'. Or evidence of God is in the belief or the believer. The bible speaks of some who 'look but do not see'. That the evidence for God is in His creation, the invisible laws that govern reality.

So the atheist and materialist will only see what they see in the material and physical. But the theist will see something non physical that has real presense and substance giving it a realness that transcends the material world.

Romans 1:20
For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that people are without excuse.

Hebrews 11:1
Now faith is the substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen.

This is the amplified version
Now faith is the assurance (title deed, confirmation) of things hoped for (divinely guaranteed), and the evidence of things not seen [the conviction of their reality—faith comprehends as fact what cannot be experienced by the physical senses].

numb

Jeffrey Bowden said:

The human AC will have no ability to sustain a lethal wound, then make that wound heal allowing the AC to rise from the dead.

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A demon does not have the power to bring the person back to life.

Jeffrey Bowden said:

Ezekiel's prophecies span from 593 BC to 571 BC, a period of about 22 years, with his ministry beginning in 593 BC. Ezekiel 28 has nothing to do with the future Trib. Therefore it has nothing to do with the AC.

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Ezekiel 28:1-10 is addressed to the prince of Tyre - a code name for the Antichrist person.
Ezekiel 28:12-19 is addressed to the king of Tyrus - a code name for Satan.

Ezekiel 28:2 Son of man, say unto the prince of Tyrus, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Because thine heart is lifted up, and thou hast said, I am a God, I sit in the seat of God, in the midst of the seas; yet thou art a man, and not God, though thou set thine heart as the heart of God:

9 Wilt thou yet say before him that slayeth thee, I am God? but thou shalt be a man, and no God, in the hand of him that slayeth thee.

In 2Thessalonians2:3-4, we read....

3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;

4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

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So Ezekiel 28-2 and 2Thessalonians2:4 is about the person sitting in the place reserved for God... making the claim of having achieved God-hood.

Gregory Thompson said:

I agree they're not angels, but the 24 elders do seem to be part of the life forms that compose God's domain.

According to the letters to the seven churches in revelation a particular trial needs to be 'overcome' in order to rule with a rod of iron, so ruling with Christ is not for everyone.

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well, I don't think that the overcoming/ruling is meant just for people at the end, but the overcoming is done by the blood of the lamb, the word of their testament and not loving their life unto death.
I don't think that people in the first century would be ruled out of co-ruling with Jesus because they weren't living during great tribulation, much less people between then and now. Just being born at the wrong time so your rewards are less ..
that part I'm not feeling like that's how it operates, only those who are alive during the "particular trial"
like if you want to get that specific then you have to apply it only to the first century Church of Thyatira.
... and I don't think that's the intended meaning to take. I think the letters are applicable to all believers, and I think the overcoming is "in Christ" The same way that people overcame persecution in the 1st century, is the same way people overcome when ISIS or other Islamic terrorist groups martyr them today, which is going to be the same way people overcome during great tribulation.
I do not believe that ruling and reigning is going to be limited to believers at a specific time.
I believe all believers will rule something. It will vary in scope. For instance Adam and Eve were rulers. They had no human subjects, they ruled over the Earth however and had dominion over every other living thing.

That is ultimately what God created us to do, we're in His image and God is a ruler. So part of being the image of God is to rule. It doesn't always mean rule over other people however. There will be those that do that. Other people will rule other living things.

But the 24 elders are in heaven before John sees it, and they've already been rewarded, and describe themselves as redeemed from the Earth.

Thus, they are human beings, redeemed ones at that.

The leftover mysteries are:
is 24 a symbolic number that represents a much larger number of believers from the "Church age" as pretrib would believe?
is this a flash forward (though I doubt anyone would think this particular thing is a flash forward, people do believe Revelation 7 is)?
is it just a symbol representing a future that hasn't happened yet as an amillennialist or idealist would believe?
Or are they actual redeemed people who were resurrected bodily and currently live in heaven to not die twice, which is what I lean towards?

Vidu said:

Did God create himself, you think? From nothing, before the universe?

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I believe in Genesis 1 although I do have a very far fetched theory.

Kylie said:

And how do you empirically measure that?

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exactly

Akita Suggagaki said:

But what other kind of evidence can we qualify as valued? We were talking about personal experience for a while. But even that turns out to be emperical because we would be looking for positive changes in a believer's life that can been observed and measured.

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The point is the atheist and materialist and the theist or believer in God would see the evidence of that change differently. The materialist like say with pray and miracles will attribute the cause to some matertial cause even if this cannot be explained at the time. They would still attribute it to some unknown material cause.

But the theist will attribute this to God actively working in a persons heart and mind and spirit. In fact from my understanding an atheist or materialist could not believe in spirituality full stop and this would be attributed to feelings or imagination. Which ultimately is deterministic and within the closed phyiscal causes.

There may be some physical effects and changes that come with miracles or God working in peoples lives but those physical changes will be attributed to physical causes as opposed to believers in God believing that the ultimate cause was something beyond from God.

But even without appealing to God or gods many changes cannot be adequately explained by the material and physical causes. Take mind over matter and positive thinking. Or belief itself in something positive and transcedent that may change your life. THis cannot be explained by neurons or electrical signals controlling your body.

Mind and consciousness pose many problems for the atheist materialist. What Chalmers calls the 'Hard problem of Consciousness.

Hans Blaster said:

The Universe doesn't have a center.

That's not a survey. That is a fantasy model of projected populations. (And despite the fantasy elements your "global Christianity manages to grow from 31.4% to a whopping 31.4% in it.)

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Most of the growth in Christianity is probably in Africa, where most growth in general is expected due to increase in population. Even in my lifetime, the country of Nigeria has had huge growth.

There are a few caveats, though. New religions could start, or change over time into something else. People can also practice multiple religions at the same time.

In Nigeria, for instance, there's a hybrid of Islam and Christianity being practiced in some areas.

In the US, the scholar of religion, Christian Smith, has described the fastest growing worldview as occulture or what was in the past called "spiritual but not religious". If it were conceived of as a single religious movement, it would be larger than the Mainline Protestant denominations combined. Most towns have more shops selling crystals, herbs, or essential oils now, than Christian bookstores. Many people believe in UFO's. More people believe that vampires are real than there are Jews, Mormons, and Muslims combined. Some go to organized worship or seminars related to New Age/New Thought spirituality, such as the Unity Church (Marianne Williamson is a good example of this kind of spirituality). A sizeable minority of traditional Christians also have private beliefs associated with occulture, as well.

Toast bread.

Greetings from Thesaaloniki, Greece..
---
Apostle Paul was there..
- during his second missionary journey.
- I & II Thessalonians

Pommer said:

Gee, why’s the flag only got 32 stars? The only time that was in effect was 1859.

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And only 12 stripes.

In many languages, the Christian or monotheistic concept of God has no specific gender.

Also, if women are made in God's image, what does that imply about God's gender exactly?

In some early Syriac biblical texts, the Holy Spirit is referred to with the pronoun "she", because the Hebrew and Aramaic word for spirit, ruah, is feminine.

Dan Perez said:

And I aleady have an OP on why it says that Paul did BAPTIZED , NONE f you EXCEPT CRISPUS and GAIUS and looking

for your rely on Controverial Christian Theolory !

dan p

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"Except for" nullifies your whole point.

Dan Perez said:

In 1 Cor 1:14 it reads , I give thanks that I BAPTIZED none of you , EXCEPT CRISPUS and GAIUS .

But the Greek word WATER // HYDOR is not in the GREEK TEXT !!

What say you , if it is NOT water , how did Paul BAPTIZE // BAPTISO , them ??

And is BAPTISM FOR TODAY ??

WHAT SAY YOU ??

dan p

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Yes, he did.
Water is tacitly understood, as man can't baptize with anything else and continue the church's tradition.

durangodawood said:

Same here. And thats a sorry state.

But the point is this isnt about sudden pope veneration from everybody. Its about how our country is represented to the world.

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Exactly right. If this was some high school prank from a kid who didn't know better or some moron wanting to take a pop at religion, or Catholicism in particular, then it wouldn't be worth commenting on. There are idiots everywhere that will do or say something stupid. But...this is the President Of The United States for heaven's sake. Not some 6th grader.

And you are right that we now don't expect any better. And that is an American tragedy.

Michie said:

I did not call you out. I find the behavior quite hypocritical from those that themselves have criticized the Church in often very poor taste in the past.

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I see no-one like that posting in this thread. No-one at all.

CoreyD said:

How does kingdoms suffer?

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What are you talking about ?

CoreyD said:

It sound you you believe you have the authority to decide here.

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Not at all, but how can a physical, inanimate, place suffer ?

CoreyD said:

I don't see why you would believe that, since the angel of the Lord explains what the lake of fire is... as well as the beast.

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A lake of fire, is a lake of fire.
What description are you using ?

CoreyD said:

It seems evident to me that for some reason, you believe your belief somehow is more important than an explanation or interpretation of Jesus' angel, on what he himself says.
I don't know why you would hold such a position.

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The reason is Matt 25:45-46, and Jude 1:7.

CoreyD said:

I can only think of one reason why a person would think that... and that is, if the Bible is of no account.

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Aren't Matt 25:45-46, and Jude 1:7, biblical ?

CoreyD said:

It's not hard to imagine that, since most professing Christianity feel that way. Many do not even believe one should believe everything is the Bible... Go figure.
Is that the reason, where you are concerned?
Why exactly do you dismiss the angel's interpretation, in favor of your interpretation?

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Please quote what the angel said, and say where that was at.

o_mlly said:

Says one who has advanced degrees in international economics and experience in doing international business east and west.

The curves of demand and supply can only be estimated. Therefore, their elasticity can only be estimated.

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The only person who has claimed otherwise is you, since you have expressed that the elasticity is somehow dependent on tariffs, so that tariffs have a numerical role to play in the given equation.

Are you able to provide a source to evidence such an assertion?