Florida (Tampa) hospitals won't mandate vaccine for workers

[Nithavela]

So it's a therapeutic. It does nothing to stop the spread.

You're absolutely right. It prevents human lifes from ending. How useless is that?

 

[Nithavela]

It's about one half of one percent. Which could easily be attributed to a few doses left out too long before injection. Or some other unfortunate thing. Which is exactly like other vaccines. They are not 100%. There is error in how the vaccines are produced or stored or injected.

There's been some researched into some people being genetically unable to get the immunity provided by the vaccination because they can't fold a protein a certain way. Maybe that research will help develop a vaccine that works for those people.

 

[Nithavela]

No it is not like other vaccines. Vaccines are to give you immunity. Correct that vaccines are not 100%. Which means you could get the disease anyway. With the covid vaxine, that is not true. They can and do spread the virus, as well as many get sick. That they do not usually get as sick because of the shot, puts it in more of a therapeutic category. Vaxines are for immunity, therefore you do not spread it period.

I'm sorry that your education system failed you.

 

[ForHimbyHim]

I'm sorry that your education system failed you.

Wow that escalated to insults quickly!

 

[Nithavela]

Wow that escalated to insults quickly!

You seem to have a rather low bar for "insults". I only pointed out that your education seems to have failed to teach you what vaccination is and what it isn't.

 

[KCfromNC]

Because it does not work like the other vaxs. Since it does not stop the spread it is useless to stop the spread.

Since the brakes in cars have failed at least once in known history we can conclude that no brakes in any cars do anything to ever stop a car.

Hmm, there might be a bit of a hole in that thinking.

 

[KCfromNC]

Make a list for what?

Places not to go to if one gets sick enough to need a hospital. You know, freedom.

 

[KCfromNC]

Maybe the hospital could just advise for mask use, sterlisation and hand-washing procedures before operations too. Since it's a free country...

I mean, hand washing isn't 100% effective against disease. I heard of someone's brother's friend from work's uncle who washed their hands daily and still got the flu. Therefore handwashing does nothing to prevent disease.

Am I doing this right?

 

[ThatRobGuy]

It does nothing to stop the spread

Just to make sure we're using the same terms here, when you say "it does nothing", are you saying I, as a vaccinated person am just as likely to catch covid as an unvaccinated person?

If I'm one of the unfortunately breakthrough cases, sure, I can spread it to someone else. However, if I don't get infected in the first place, then I'm not going to spread it.

 

[ThatRobGuy]

You've bypassed what the Tampa Bay News said. It said thousands of Doctors and nurses won't take the vaccine. It didn't focus on janitors or clerks.

I didn't bypass it, I addressed it directly by saying they were using vague & broad descriptors.

"Thousands of local doctors, nurses and medical workers are unvaccinated."

"Thousands of Doctors, nurses, and medical workers" encompasses broad range of people.

...and I'd like to see the breakdown there, as well as establishing the type of practice each is working in.

It could be a case where there's some Chiropractors in Tampa Bay area (who are technically called 'Doctors', but are notoriously anti-vaxx), or some people running voodoo clinics like these
Experts — Tampa Bay Holistic Wellness
Tampa Acupuncture & Holistic Doctor for Alternative Medicine Naturopathic

...and a few thousand CNAs and LPNs (who, while serving an important role, don't have extensive medical or scientific training, and thus, their opinions shouldn't be given any more weight that most peoples')

And the statement "Thousands of Doctors, nurses, and medical workers" would semantically be true, but that's very different than saying "Thousands of MDs in Tampa Bay don't want to get the vaccine"


When you tighten up the descriptors, and focus only on practicing physicians (instead of using terms like 'medical workers'), the numbers look very different.

The American Medical Association (AMA) today released a new survey among practicing physicians that shows more than 96 percent U.S. physicians have been fully vaccinated for COVID-19, with no significant difference in vaccination rates across regions. Of the physicians who are not yet vaccinated, an additional 45 percent do plan to get vaccinated.

So > 96% of actual Doctors took the vaccine, and of the < 4% who haven't yet, nearly half of that small subset plan to.

So in the bucket of "Thousands of Doctors, nurses, and medical workers", the majority of those thousands would be from the "nurses and medical workers" category, as it'd be mathematically improbable (dare I say, nearly impossible) for Thousands of doctors to be refusing the vaccine in the Tampa bay area.

And with regards to the nurses who are refusing, people need to understand the different designations and tiered credentialing of nurses.

CNA
LPN
RN
NP

CNA can be achieved with a 4-6 week training course, LPN certification can be achieved in a year.

NP requires a graduate degree, focused training on different specialty areas, and can basically function like a doctor in many healthcare settings.


I suspect you'd find that as the level of training, education, and expertise goes up, the vaccine refusal rates go down.

I have an aunt that's an LPN, and not to knock her, she has a tough job that I wouldn't want, but it only took her a year of training, and she still believes in all kinds of wacky stuff (she got herself roped into the HerbaLife pyramid scheme back in the day, and still swears by homeopathy), and her opinion shouldn't be regarded as "insightful" on the topic of immunology.

 

[variant]

Wrong, if you're in the healthcare industry, it should be expected...especially if you're working around other patients. This is a disaster in the making. They should be setting the example.

Otherwise, you have no business being in healthcare.

They might just be looking for bodies to do the work.

 

[ralliann]

You're absolutely right. It prevents human lifes from ending. How useless is that?

That is not the point of forcing the vaccine for hospital workers.

 

[ralliann]

Just to make sure we're using the same terms here, when you say "it does nothing", are you saying I, as a vaccinated person am just as likely to catch covid as an unvaccinated person?

If I'm one of the unfortunately breakthrough cases, sure, I can spread it to someone else. However, if I don't get infected in the first place, then I'm not going to spread it.

Are you saying the vaccinated don't carry the virus asymptomatic?

 

[ThisIsMe123]

Are you saying the vaccinated don't carry the virus asymptomatic?

Not sure how this question is relevant, but I'll pay along.

Say 100% of people in the hospital get vaccinated, but they can spread it to each other, but...the outcome will be far less damaging.

Thus requiring the vaccine

 

[ralliann]

Not sure how this question is relevant, but I'll pay along.

Say 100% of people in the hospital get vaccinated, but they can spread it to each other, but...the outcome will be far less damaging.

Thus requiring the vaccine

N/A. Decided my response would be taken just for "play".

 

[Bobber]

I didn't bypass it, I addressed it directly by saying they were using vague & broad descriptors.

"Thousands of local doctors, nurses and medical workers are unvaccinated."

"Thousands of Doctors, nurses, and medical workers" encompasses broad range of people.

...and I'd like to see the breakdown there, as well as establishing the type of practice each is working in.

So you're acknowledging you have no knowledge as to whether they're not highly qualified or not. They could be which makes your attempt to marginalize them not based on any facts.

 

[Hank77]

.

 

[Hank77]

Are you saying the vaccinated don't carry the virus asymptomatic?

No, they don't unless they have been infected by someone who has the virus. You don't get the virus from the vaccine.
So a vaccinated person does not spread the virus unless they actually catch it just like the unvaccinated person doesn't.

The vaccine immunity helps the vaccinated person reject the virus just like the immunity that a person gets when they have caught covid.

 

[keith99]

I mean, hand washing isn't 100% effective against disease. I heard of someone's brother's friend from work's uncle who washed their hands daily and still got the flu. Therefore handwashing does nothing to prevent disease.

Am I doing this right?

Ironically Mary Mallon did not believe in washing her hands.

 

[Mayzoo]

No, they don't unless they have been infected by someone who has the virus. You don't get the virus from the vaccine.
So a vaccinated person does not spread the virus unless they actually catch it just like the unvaccinated person doesn't.

The vaccine immunity helps the vaccinated person reject the virus just like the immunity that a person gets when they have caught covid.

And vaccinated spread Covid at a much lower rate than unvaccinated since they are less likely to catch the virus, and they carry a lower viral load when they do catch it.