Saw a good one this morning on the way to the dog park....

BelieveItOarKnot said:

You just bought the essentially Godless position of freewill whereby God is eliminated from His Own creation and not involved whatsoever so He can't be blamed

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Ok, so go ahead and blame God for man's sin, as if God isn't powerful or smart enough to make a free and morally accountable being.

BelieveItOarKnot said:

What freewillers never think of is that maybe, just maybe God is great enough to overcome anything and make good of it

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God can do whatever He wants to do in His wisdom, and isn't confined by your rules or mine

BelieveItOarKnot said:

I think God will take great pleasure in finally putting away the power of evil, as if were nothing

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Well, then why would He create it to begin with, just to watch man suffer for awhile on earth? You seem to present a God who creates evil and then pats Himself on the back for overcoming evil?

Christsfreeservant said:

And under the authority of God we are to go and make disciples of Christ of people of all nations, baptizing (where possible), and teaching them to obey our Lord’s New Covenant commandments.

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Yet Jesus said His Gospel was of the Kingdom of the Father and this is what we were to spread. The Father ‘s Will be done, not mankind’s or elohims

They all think it takes money to keep their branch of the religion going, but that was never Jesus’ teachings. Actually He was anti-reiligion. He expected us to act, not institutionalize.

Bobthebomb said:

So, why are you certain? What, outside of growing up indoctrinated, made you say "Yes, I believe this is true?"

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I find your second sentences characterization highly objectionable and prejudicial.

The reality is, there will always be doubt because there is no faith without doubt. People tend to build their convictions on personal experience, through answered prayers and momentary sensations of God's presence. There's a saying in the church "God has no grand children." What this means is there's no substitute for personal relationship, especially not handed down religion. The Bible says "Taste, and see..." and that's the beginning of the story, tasting God. Once you've done that, He will begin to provide the reasons necessary.

I say this because at one point I abandoned everything about faith except for a desire for Jesus to be real. He used that desire to lead me to a point where now I believe that within the Bible God has provided His self-disclosure and everything we need to know about Him is written in those pages. So long as you do not frustrate the mustard seed that your experience has planted, it will grow into faith though how it will get there will be a journey. I encourage you not to resist, not to harden your heart against the drawing of God.

What if Jesus is the telos of Torah and, thus, the fulfillment of the sabbath rest—and therefore "Today" is the sabbath rest for the people of God?

The variant reading of 616 vs 666 is incredibly ancient, St. Irenaeus actually talks about this in his writings only ~100 years after the Revelation was written. Irenaeus argues that the 616 variant is wrong.

I think that the fact that both are ancient (I'm not about to claim dogmatically which variant is what St. John himself wrote, though I am inclined toward the traditional reading) is actually a strong argument for the case that St. John intended 666/616 as a reference to Nero.

The difference between 616 and 666 if using Hebrew Gematria (and Gematria was huge in the ancient world, both Hebrew and Greek forms) is a single letter--Nun. It's the difference between Nero Kaiser and Neron Kaiser (Hebrew transliteration: NRW QSR and NRWN QSR), depending on whether one uses the Latin form (Nero) or the Greek form (Neron).

-CryptoLutheran

JohnB445 said:

That the Bible is the word of God,

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There's nuance to this across denominations, so it depends on what you mean.

JohnB445 said:

that Jesus is God in the flesh.

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Yeah

JohnB445 said:

Now when it comes to salvation, or any other topic what can all Christians agree on?

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That salvation cannot be had apart from Jesus in some form or fashion.

RDKirk said:

I think we can be sure Job had been taught a different creation account than Genesis, and still had that account in his mind as he came to know God.

And the same was true of the Philippian jailer.

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Yeah, though my point wasn't about Job but about God referencing the Uritic myth of primordial chaos beasts that preceded creation. The myth in question is the myth of Yam, which God puts Himself in the place of Yam in defeating the chaos beasts and tweaks the myth by removing any sense of struggle or use of His and Leviathans body within the creative act. It's significant because it shows that God is not above relying on myths and human understanding to convey His message, albeit with tweaks to those myths.

public hermit said:

Well, that's a pitiful account. Are these "objects of destruction" created for that purpose?

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Nonsense. They made their choices.

ThatRobGuy said:

But they weren't "white victimhood" arguments...

Pointing out that modern equity advocates view everything through that lens isn't expressing white victimhood. It's merely pointing out what I see as the flaw in their argument.

The "white victimhood" accusation is a just a trope that people use to shut down opposing viewpoints.


It's not unlike the "any criticism of the government of Israel makes you an antisemite" rationale.

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No trope, you simply are making a false accusation that exposes the lens you view things through rather than those you criticize. Your "argument" is nothing but an emotional appeal that itself presents the issue through the lens of race and attempts to put white people as victims of "racism". It says nothing about those you criticize, and everything about you.

Always in His Presence said:

never said he did it - I said what if it was withing his authority to do it.

That would mean he did nothing wrong.

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If he did do it, he didn't tell his Commander in Chief. Then Trump is asked on national TV, looks more foolish than he normally does and has to say he knows nothing about it. But hey, I've got the answer I wanted: if Hegseth did it you don't think he did anything wrong.

JohnB445 said:

That the Bible is the word of God, that Jesus is God in the flesh.

Now when it comes to salvation, or any other topic what can all Christians agree on?

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Jesus died for our sins, and by the grace of God we are saved because of what Jesus has done for us.

-CryptoLutheran

Xeno.of.athens said:

What is your opinion?

Hebrews is written to whom? And does its intended readership shape the way you will interpret its words?

God, having spoken long ago to the fathers in the prophets in many portions and in many ways, in these last days spoke to us in His Son, whom He appointed heir of all things, through whom also He made the worlds, who is the radiance of His glory and the exact representation of His nature, and upholds all things by the word of His power; who, having accomplished cleansing for sins, sat down at the right hand of the Majesty on high, having become so much better than the angels, as He has inherited a more excellent name than they.
Heb 1:1-4 LSB

God spoke to US in His Son ... Is that phrase sufficient to identify the intended readership? Who is "us"?

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I think the most immediate and right-in-our-face answer is Jewish Christians. A more nuances answer is that it probably is addressed to Jewish Christians who are dealing with persecution for being Christians (Rome, generally, at least before 70 AD, tolerated Judaism; but when Christianity began to be viewed as distinct from Judaism, Rome did not have that same tolerance). The author seems very concerned with trying to encourage his readers to remain faithful to Jesus, to remind them that what they have in Christ is greater than what they had before; there is a Great High Priest, greater than the high priest in Jerusalem; and the author warns his readers about the danger of giving up their Christian hope, that they will forfeit their salvation if they do so. So underlaying the epistle seems to be certain Jewish Christians who may be considering abandoning Christianity and returning to Judaism.

-CryptoLutheran

I grew up going to church, so it was something was born and raised into. What made me believe it was true then? It was always a part of my life, and so it was all I knew—but there was more to it than that. Growing up going to church and being an active member was a positive experience, instilling values that have guided me my whole life (I am now 54). I made the decision at age thirteen to be baptized into the church. If I had any doubt (and I didn't), I would not have gone through with it. Simply put, I believed, because of the loving church family, because of my experiences, which I attribute to the Holy Spirit and the presence of God.

So why then did I leave the church a few years later at the age of sixteen? I still believed in God. The world was tugging at me. I was becoming an adult, and I wanted to experience life outside of my sheltered upbringing. In other words, it wasn't my disbelief in God, but my own selfish desire to break free from what was restraining me from living the life everyone else was living; life without restriction.

I left the church and lived a life of excess. It took thirty years, but I finally reached a point where I couldn't continue living the way I was living anymore. I had multiple addictions that were wrecking my health, to the point where I had to make a change or it would've been life-threatening. The worst part is the regret from the shameful things I've said and done, which still haunt me to this day as memories I can't forget.

I'm getting ahead of myself though, so let's rewind eight years, which would be twenty two years into my binge.

Of course, I believed in God, but my desire to live life on my own terms turned me into some sort of agnostic. (It was a convenient arrangement so I wouldn't have to take responsibility for my own actions.) I thought I was happy, but I wasn't. I was spiraling out of control. And then my father passed away.

This is the part where I answer your question. So, why are you certain? What, outside of growing up indoctrinated, made you say "Yes, I believe this is true?"

I had a life-changing experience in the emergency room while standing over my father's lifeless body. I should've been a sobbing mess. Yes, I was crying, but something else came over me. Love. Love like I've never felt before in my life. I can only describe it as supernatural. It sustained me through the viewing and the grieving process. So strong was this experience that it gave me an understanding of what true unconditional love is, something that had somehow escaped me up to that point. And then life continued as usual, and I didn't think anything more about the experience itself, but I started to think about life and God, and it got me looking.

I looked everywhere I could where I knew God wouldn't be, to find a truth to support my lifestyle, but everywhere I looked I came up empty, and it only pointed me forward toward God, not away from Him. For eight years after my father died I moved toward a final conclusion, that I didn't see until it was resolved and staring me in the face. That God is actively engaged in our lives.

I can tell you what exactly it was that made me wholeheartedly believe. It was looking at the world and the way Satan has perfected his craft in keeping man in sin. How his hand is in all aspects of our lives, to lead us astray.

I came to the conclusion that I need to start taking my salvation seriously, and that I need to surrender myself to Him. And that's exactly what I did. I got down on my knees and wholeheartedly gave myself to Him and repented of all of my sin, offloading thirty years of regret, and set about living a new life in Him.

Immediately after, things started opening up to me. Hindsight of my whole life and God's hand in it. Even while I was deep in sin He was there protecting me and guiding me. And then the moment in that emergency room, when overwhelming love filled me up completely and sustained me. If there is anything so powerful as what I felt, it is God's unconditional love.

Why believe? Well, there is the overwhelming evidence all around us, but we don't necessarily need that. Something as simple as seeing the other side (Satan's work) can do it. Or something as profound as the overwhelming feeling of unconditional love from God Himself.

There have been many more experiences since that I can only explain as God's work in my life. Too many actually.

God bless!

That story came from a generation with very little education. Family pictured below from that generation. There was no such thing as high school, very little materially, no part in church politics... But the children considered them intelligent, rich, and very spirit filled...

FireDragon76 said:

Don't give it too much relevance. Tiktok and social media can amplify unusual beliefs or attitudes in ways that aren't helpful, or actually reflective of the real world. Furthermore, some people subconsciously or conscious are using Tiktok to get attention. Attention, positive or negative, gets monetized on these platforms.

I've seen alot of purple haired types at my local coffee shop, with more nose rings than my shower curtain, but, I've never met one of these "therians".

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This. I'm friends with plenty of people with dyed hair and piercings--while I've never really dyed my hair other than dying it black a couple times when I was younger (in HS I tried to bleach my hair, which in the late 90s was super in fashion, the result was bright orange deep fried hair, so I haven't tried anything too crazy since); and until just a couple years ago I had several piercings--ears and eyebrow, I removed them when I was hired onto my current occupation. I don't know if this comes to a surprise to those familiar with me on this website, but I've tended toward a more "alternative" aesthetic, and a part of me is still that punk rock and ska loving kid listening to Five Iron Frenzy and NOFX in the late 90s and early 2000s. So dyed hair, piercings, tattoos--that describes most of the people in my life for the last two+ decades.

But just to contribute: Never met anyone that thinks they're an animal. I know that "furries" exist, but it is an incredibly small subculture. Over a decade ago people who supposedly identified as animals or fantasy creatures calling themselves "otherkin" was a thing in some niche online spaces--but it was never a thing. If "therian" is the term used for something similar these days, then it's definitely in the same vein: niche online subculture with a handful of online spaces.

What there definitely isn't: Hordes of teenagers galloping around at all hours of the night and this being some great worry that parents, civic leaders, or society in general should be concerned about.

It's kids being weird, and of the tiny, tiny, tiny number who are currently part of this subculture, we can all sleep comfortably at night knowing that 99% of them will grow out of it by the time they either graduate high school, or somewhere along the way in college.

Now, if your 40 year old child still living in the basement (who doesn't have any debilitating mental trauma or illness) who refuses to get a job, and insists they are StarPuppy3000 or something, well ok, probably time to nudge them toward therapy. But kids? Kids are kids.

-CryptoLutheran

Always in His Presence said:

I would be embarrassed also.

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Who's embarrassed? I'm simply pointing out your deceptive presentation, I have nothing to be embarrassed about because I recognized your deceptive tactics for what they were. My initial response doesn't change whether it is in reply to the OP quotes or the current administrations hamfisted approach.