Fantine said:

Now if they just go after the rural entrepreneurs along I49 cooking meth out of sudafed.

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Keep your grubby jackboots off my sudafed.

The Liturgist said:

The problem with this anomialist argument is that it presupposes sin to be a false construct and seems to miss the point agreed upon by the early church, that sin was real, that sin is real, that sin remains a real problem for Christians even after they profess faith, and is a means by which some, if possible, might even fall away from the faith (Calvinists and others might take different views on whether they had a real faith or not to begin with, but nonetheless, a falling away can occur and a vector by which this occurs seems to be through different categories of sIn).

Thus I stand by my assesment of the earlier post as exquisite; this extreme sort of nuda fide argument would I suspect make Martin Luther very uncomfortable (indeed I would rather enjoy seeing the commentary of @MarkRohfrietsch @ViaCrucis or @Ain't Zwinglian on this issue), despite the great effort Luther put into the idea of the law vs. gospel dichotomy.

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love works no ill


Romans 13:10 Love worketh no ill to his neighbour: therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

Romans 3:27 Where is boasting then? It is excluded. By what law? of works? Nay: but by the law of faith.

fhansen said:

Fair enough, except that I liked what you were saying here. To the extent that we remain in Him, we will have received that love and it will remain and grow, especially as we express or act upon it. From that point, we won't be breaking the commandments whether or not we've ever heard them. In this way the requirement for holiness in order to enter life found in Rom 6:23 and elswhere is satisfied.

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but this is not about liking whats said is it, its about liking what we can do through that love and faith in us.

I hope you see you are all too easily corrected, as all you are is a little to one side so a little adjustment is all thats required on you

SabbathBlessings said:

The word "end" in the original Greek means

τέλος
telos
tel'-os
From a primary word τέλλω tellō (to set out for a definite point or goal); properly the point aimed at as a limit, that is, (by implication) the conclusion of an act or state (termination [literally, figuratively or indefinitely], result [immediate, ultimate or prophetic], purpose); specifically an impost or levy (as paid): - + continual, custom, end (-ing), finally, uttermost. Compare G5411.

Christ is the goal of the law for righteousness, not that the law ended as Jesus stated so clearly

Mat 5:19 Whoever therefore breaks one of the least of these commandments, and teaches men so, shall be called least in the kingdom of heaven; but whoever does and teaches them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of heaven.

Least in heaven means lost i.e. not there. Mat5:20

Why we need to be careful of plucking a verse here or there and not reconciling. There is a salvation warning about twisting Paul's words 2Peter 3:16 Paul never taught lawlessness, it just out of context. Paul said what matters, is keeping the commandments of God. 1Cor7:19

And yet why are you promoting lawlessness which is sin 1John3:4

Sadly not everyone is born of God. Paul speaks of those who are not and what that looks like

Rom 8: 7 Because the [c]carnal mind is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, nor indeed can be. 8 So then, those who are in the flesh cannot please God.

So if we are not subjecting oursevles to the law of God I would really consider more time in prayer.

Yet Paul said breaking the commandments and quoted from them will not inherit the Kingdom of God just a few verses down.


Gal 3:19 Now the works of the flesh are evident, which are: [d]adultery, [e]fornication, uncleanness, lewdness, 20 idolatry, sorcery, hatred, contentions, jealousies, outbursts of wrath, selfish ambitions, dissensions, heresies, 21 envy, [f]murders, drunkenness, revelries, and the like; of which I tell you beforehand, just as I also told you in time past, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God.

Which is what Jesus said Rev 22:14-15 Mat 7:23

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The law ended because death ended, the devil who had the power over death, and Jesus Christ alive from the dead, thats love the Holy Ghost born again, the law ended as it was not that faith, it served its purpose, and because it had no love, no Spirit, it killed, now it is kindness, gentleness, mercy, it saves, not kills.


Hebrews 2:11 For both he that sanctifieth and they who are sanctified are all of one: for which cause he is not ashamed to call them brethren,
12 Saying, I will declare thy name unto my brethren, in the midst of the church will I sing praise unto thee.
13 And again, I will put my trust in him. And again, Behold I and the children which God hath given me.
14 Forasmuch then as the children are partakers of flesh and blood, he also himself likewise took part of the same; that through death he might destroy him that had the power of death, that is, the devil;
15 And deliver them who through fear of death were all their lifetime subject to bondage.




Many teaching is for those following law still, so they need to be reminded that the things they break while....keeping law...are them still being carnal, and not belief in the Spirit.

When in belief/led of the Spirit the law is through, we are NOT UNDER THE LAW, and when we do what is right, there is NO LAW AGAINST THESE THIGNS OF THE SPIRIT.



Galatians 3:2 This only would I learn of you, Received ye the Spirit by the works of the law, or by the hearing of faith?

Galatians 5:18 But if ye be led of the Spirit, ye are not under the law.
19 Now the works of the flesh are manifest, which are these; Adultery, fornication, uncleanness, lasciviousness,

Galatians 5:22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, gentleness, goodness, faith,
23 Meekness, temperance: against such there is no law.
24 And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts.
25 If we live in the Spirit, let us also walk in the Spirit.

Abraham1st said:

you seem to be questioning for nothing much, what Jesus Christ brought was grace, and sin was what was before what Christ brought, and truth is what was not brought before, as there is no truth in death which was on all the world, so sin did change, the command to repent was given to all the world, and the preaching of the cross is what causes that repentance, as men can then believe in life and no longer death.

Sin was all there was, along, and binding, then eternal life came, which is Jesus Christ coming in the flesh which the antichrist spirit denies, so confession of this alone is the overcoming of sin, which could not be overcome before, so sin did change, it was defeated, it was replacing death by life, sin in its strength to weakness and gone, nailed to the cross of Christ, for us to also be risen away from sin up into heaven with Him.

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The problem with this anomialist argument is that it presupposes sin to be a false construct and seems to miss the point agreed upon by the early church, that sin was real, that sin is real, that sin remains a real problem for Christians even after they profess faith, and is a means by which some, if possible, might even fall away from the faith (Calvinists and others might take different views on whether they had a real faith or not to begin with, but nonetheless, a falling away can occur and a vector by which this occurs seems to be through different categories of sIn).

Thus I stand by my assesment of the earlier post as exquisite; this extreme sort of nuda fide argument would I suspect make Martin Luther very uncomfortable (indeed I would rather enjoy seeing the commentary of @MarkRohfrietsch @ViaCrucis or @Ain't Zwinglian on this issue), despite the great effort Luther put into the idea of the law vs. gospel dichotomy.

Abraham1st said:

Actually to be saved you believe in God raising HIs Son from the dead, and what happens is you receive the gift of the Holy Ghost, and are filled with the love of God.

The commandments to obey ( of the law) where given to people with no belief, no Holy Spirit, no love of God, and that was why the commandments of the law were given, because people have to be taught as with a school master ( the law) how to love, but that could never be understood until Jesus Christ came, then the school master is put away, as all childish things are, ( which is the law for those with no Son of God in them.) and the law of faith now applies, it also cant be taught by any man, it is your own faith, so all law teaching is heretical.

Here is a good deal, you dont teach me and i wont teach you.

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Fair enough, except that I liked what you were saying here. To the extent that we remain in Him, we will have received that love and it will remain and grow, especially as we express or act upon it. From that point, we won't be breaking the commandments whether or not we've ever heard them. In this way the requirement for holiness in order to enter life found in Rom 6:23 and elswhere is satisfied.

BelieveItOarKnot said:

The whole batch was already determined guilty. Romans 3:9, Romans 3:19

One Sole Exception, of course

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I think most of them were posthumously deified, as it is with the canonisation of saints. The one exception? Augustus. Who bears too many resemblances to Jesus to be ignored.

7thKeeper said:

As teens, doubtful. And we are stretching "brutally" if that brutality didn't end up causing anything permanent. Doubt that's a legal term either.

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Their parents should be paying the price... In dollars.

Say no to thuggery.

7thKeeper said:

Could he? He had no permanent injuries, so considering that and how well he healed up...

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Well, I don’t want to live in a society where people can just beat other people up without consequences, just as long as they "heal up".

...Though, I'll admit, if I were somehow beat up by some thugs, I would like to at least be able to get $40,000. for the inconvenience. That would be better for me than them receiving jail time.

fhansen said:

I don't know why, since Jesus is God. And yes, that union or communion is a state of justice/righteousness. It removes us from the unjust alienation from Him that Adam initiated for humankind. This is basic Christianity. And turning seriously back to the flesh marks a point of not remaining in Him; it certainly isn't a mark of His child.

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Here is an interesting thought, the mark of a child of Jesus Christ, to be someone that is approved on a forum, or disapproved of, OR, it is by reality, and by if we did have the love of God in ourselves, to love others with the way the love of God is perceived/believed by us, so we know that it was freely given to us, so we freely give to them.



1 John 3:14 We know that we have passed from death unto life, because we love the brethren. He that loveth not his brother abideth in death.
15 Whosoever hateth his brother is a murderer: and ye know that no murderer hath eternal life abiding in him.
16 Hereby perceive we the love of God, BECAUSE HE LAYED HIS LIFE DOWN FOR US: and we ought to lay down our lives for the brethren.
17 But whoso hath this world's good, and seeth his brother have need, and shutteth up his bowels of compassion from him, how dwelleth the love of God in him?
18 My little children, let us not love in word, neither in tongue; but in deed and in truth.
19 And hereby we know that we are of the truth, and shall assure our hearts before him.

(staff edit)
I’m not quite sure what you are trying to say other than we have rest in God’s grace through Christ. Considering my Roman Catholic neighbors and friends, they are simple folk who keep the traditions of their families in relation to religion. Ask them about the changes in the prices of grain, and they can out think the best of PhD s. However, many of them love God and believe Jesus rose from the dead, but they hold fast to the authority of the Roman Church. What I find commendable is that they might have a field of wheat ready to harvest with a rain in the forecast, but they won’t harvest the grain on Sunday, because it is the Lord’s Day and work is forbidden.

fhansen said:

I don't know why, since Jesus is God. And yes, that union or communion is a state of justice/righteousness. It removes us from the unjust alienation from Him that Adam initiated for humankind. This is basic Christianity. And turning seriously back to the flesh marks a point of not remaining in Him; it certainly isn't a mark of His child.

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This is the kind of elegant Christological soteriology I like to see: incarnational and Trinitarian.

37 corresponds to the Ordinal value of the word chokmah (wisdom)

chokmah (wisdom)
חָכְמָה
8. ח Chet 8
11. כ Kaf 20
13. מ Mem 40
5. ה He 5
Σ 37 (left column)

The verses in the King James Bible in which the word wisdom appears multiple times are

And Solomon's wisdom excelled the wisdom of all the children of the east country, and all the wisdom of Egypt. 1 Kgs 4:30
And there came of all people to hear the wisdom of Solomon, from all kings of the earth, which had heard of his wisdom. 1 Kgs 4:34
Wisdom is the principal thing; therefore get wisdom: and with all thy getting get understanding. Prov 4:7
I communed with mine own heart, saying, Lo, I am come to great estate, and have gotten more wisdom than all they that have been before me in Jerusalem: yea, my heart had great experience of wisdom and knowledge. Ecc 1:16
For wisdom is a defence, and money is a defence: but the excellency of knowledge is, that wisdom giveth life to them that have it. Ecc 7:12
Then said I, Wisdom is better than strength: nevertheless the poor man's wisdom is despised, and his words are not heard. Ecc 9:16
Concerning Edom, thus saith the Lord of hosts; Is wisdom no more in Teman? is counsel perished from the prudent? is their wisdom vanished? Jer 49:7
There is a man in thy kingdom, in whom is the spirit of the holy gods; and in the days of thy father light and understanding and wisdom, like the wisdom of the gods, was found in him; whom the king Nebuchadnezzar thy father, the king, I say, thy father, made master of the magicians, astrologers, Chaldeans, and soothsayers; Dan 5:11
For after that in the wisdom of G-d the world by wisdom knew not G-d, it pleased G-d by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe. 1 Cor 1:21
Howbeit we speak wisdom among them that are perfect: yet not the wisdom of this world, nor of the princes of this world, that come to nought: 1 Cor 2:6
But we speak the wisdom of G-d in a mystery, even the hidden wisdom, which God ordained before the world unto our glory: 1 Cor 2:7

(4*30)+(4*34)+(4*7)+(1*16)+(7*12)+(9*16)+(49*7)+(5*11)+(1*21)+(2*6)+(2*7) = 973!

The name Jesus appears a total of 973 times in the King James Bible


S.: King James Pure Bible Search

The text of this Bible edition is a revision of the King James Version. The well-known King James Version (KJV) of 1611 was slightly revised and published in 1769 (also known as the Authorized Version) with embedded Strong's numbers by Oxford University, namely
Benjamin Blayney, 158 years after the original publication of the KJV, which is a revision of the older “Bishop's Bible” based on the Hebrew and Greek original texts. Since its first publication in 1611, it has been the most influential English translation of the Bible. Seven editions were subsequently published; the 1769 edition is the one mainly used today. This text forms the basis of today's KJV Bibles.

The 18th Fibonacci number is 2584!

Fibonacci numbers
0, 1, 1, 2, 3, 5, 8, 13, 21, 34, 55, 89, 144, 233, 377, 610, 987, 1597, 2584,

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The Fibonacci sequence begins with (1,1) and each subsequent number is the sum of the two previous numbers, up to the 18th number 2584.

2584 is the sum of the first 37 prime numbers

The 2584th Fibonacci number has 540 digits. The first 37 digits of π, Φ, and e, starting with the first decimal place, add up to 540!

π = .1415926535897932384626433832795028841 = 175
Ф = .6180339887498948482045868343656381177 = 194
e = .7182818284590452353602874713526624977 = 171

175+194+171 = 540

The first occurrence of the number 37 in π, starting with the first decimal place, is followed by the numbers 510.



Starting from the 510th digit in the 2584th Fibonacci number, the following four numbers are 2368,

f2584 =
4726910765465300317806851108876897196101278355111769674149315962118898038095010550508629595867472628
0298867174358837185590065595513091875183063008973976966119821571216929988418084495816662348661942634
7505830680736624271551067867280626047888168396613422625709668348188063591682351904618411743921980378
7579041157074494886854064979009044172932462104387272598377453806366101396131346557267247923696382671
5812227458379520094 662944152646811443659087701999 62658068394864608601687427504302785297768517847238
7118979232368...

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The Greek numerical value of Iésous Christos is 2368!

f2584 =
...9232368446...

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923+446 = 37*37
2368 = 37*64

64 is the isopsephy of the Greek word alétheia, meaning truth!

alétheia (truth)
ἀλήθεια
1. Αα Alpha 1
12. Λλ Lambda 30
8. Ηη Eta 8
9. Θθϑ Theta 9
5. Εεϵ Epsilon 5
10. Ιι lota 10
1. Αα Alpha 1
Σ 64

you wont continue, because of the hopeless situation, or because you cant continue, as i stated, your weak points are visible, they have no credibility to them, and i dont mind your questions, as i can give you my answers

Referring to Plato's Republic...

The Three Children of "The Good" (God the Father)

1. Matter - Material form. The sun is E / c2 in the form of plasma and is the visible form of "The Good."
2. Spirituality - Spiritual form. Spiritual warmth, love, faith, joy, and hope set in a heart to do creative things.
3. Intelligence - Intellectual form. What directed the plasma to cool into the respective elements.

In his Republic, Plato illustrates the doctrine of the divided line through an allegory of a cave in which Socrates describes a group of people who have lived chained to the wall of a cave all of their lives. The people watch shadows projected on the wall by things passing in front of a fire behind them, and begin to ascribe forms to these shadows, which are the closest they get in viewing reality.

Having a prisoner released and journeying upward through the cave into the actual outdoors reflects the gaining of knowledge. Upon gazing at the sun he beholds the chief good and the purest form of light and energy. Having seen these things he then feels the responsibility of liberating his friends from their imprisoned minds. To become enlightened means to pass from opinion to enlightenment. To progress from what seems real to what is actually real.

"The business of us who are the founders of the State will be to compel the best minds to attain that knowledge which we have already shown to be the greatest of all--they must continue to ascend until they arrive at the good; but when they have ascended and seen enough we must not allow them to do as they do now. What do you mean? I mean that they remain in the upper world: but this must not be allowed; they must be made to descend again among the prisoners in the den, and partake of their labors and honors, whether they are worth having or not. But is not this unjust? he said; ought we to give them a worse life, when they might have a better? You have again forgotten, my friend, I said, the intention of the legislator, who did not aim at making any one class in the State happy above the rest; the happiness was to be in the whole State, and he held the citizens together by persuasion and necessity, making them benefactors of the State, and therefore benefactors of one another; to this end he created them, not to please themselves, but to be his instruments in binding up the State. Wherefore each of you, when his turn comes, must go down to the general underground abode, and get the habit of seeing in the dark. When you have acquired the habit, you will see ten thousand times better than the inhabitants of the den, and you will know what the several images are, and what they represent, because you have seen the beautiful and just and good in their truth." - Plato's Republic

To rise to Macro means to escape the clutches of the den, journey outdoors, and catch the reality of the three children of the good... Spiritually, intellectually, and finally materially. And finally, after beholding the "Good" we must not remain in the upper levels but take the journey back down to the cave and do our part to spread light to this darkened world.

SabbathBlessings said:

If the law ended, we do not need grace. If there is no need for grace, we do not need a Savior. If we do not need a Savior than we are all lost. Its the same lie that started in the garden that sadly is still working that we can disobey God and live, when God said the opposite.

I hope this works out well for you. Jesus said Mat 7:21-23 Mat 5:19-30 Mat 15:3-14 Mark 7:7-13 but if we do not need faith and faith voids the voice of God to be obedient to Him. I guess we can ignore His teachings and warnings. Whoever we listen to is who we serve. Two paths, our choices have consequences Rom 6:16 Rev 22:14-15

I am not going to continue, but hopefully one will prayerfully consider what teachings they are listening to and following Mat5:19 Col2:8 Mat15:3-14

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the law ended because we found grace, the Saviour found HIs lost sheep, we died in the garden by not being able to follow God, thats why the Son of God had to come in the fulness of time to save us. ( WE ARE NO LONGER SERVANTS, NO LONGER SERVANTS OF SIN.)


Galatians 4:4 But when the fulness of the time was come, God sent forth his Son, made of a woman, made under the law,
5 To redeem them that were under the law, that we might receive the adoption of sons.
6 And because ye are sons, God hath sent forth the Spirit of his Son into your hearts, crying, Abba, Father.
7 Wherefore thou art no more a servant, but a son; and if a son, then an heir of God through Christ.



Thats right, we listen to Jeus, and He is not the minister of sin, but the law is sin.



Romans 6:18 Being then made free from sin, ye became the servants of righteousness.

Romans 6:20 For when ye were the servants of sin, ye were free from righteousness.

NewLifeInChristJesus said:

That explains it. You think oneness with God is living in "a state of justice" which was created by remission of sin and a new heart and spirit with which we can overcome sin and be holy. You think we stay in that state of justice by not sinning too seriously, and if we do, then we remain near to God, His holiness, and His love. This view of oneness with God, as I speculated, is wholely divorced from Jesus' residency in our hearts and the benefits (see list above) that are solely dependent on His presence. Without this aspect of the Christian life, the good part is missing.

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I don't know why, since Jesus is God. And yes, that union or communion is a state of justice/righteousness. It removes us from the unjust alienation from Him that Adam initiated for humankind. This is basic Christianity. And turning seriously back to the flesh marks a point of not remaining in Him; it certainly isn't a mark of His child.

SabbathBlessings said:

In your belief system, is Jesus only righteous for His Sacrifice? But everything else He taught we are to disregard? Not follow His example, not follow His teachings? Is this your belief system? If Jesus was only good for His sacrifice and lived not to be our example to show us how someone righteous lives, taught what someone who is righteous does, we come to Him and He is going to leave us in our sinful state, despite His promise to save us from our sins Mat 1:21

When really meeting and loving God one would want to allow God to make changes inside us, so when someone asks us a question we do not choose to lie, because its breaking His commandments and a reflection of the other spirit's character John8:44, not a reflection of God Heb 6:18 who our character is to become like, If Jesus removed the law, so we could still be sinners, there would be no need for His sacrifice. The fact we need grace means the law still exists. If the law goes, there goes grace, if grace goes, we no longer need a Savior, if we no longer need a Savior, then we are all lost. I can see what the other spirit hates God's righteous laws so much.

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You ask according to scripture, we are to believe with our heart that God raised Him from the dead, to be saved, just that, according to scripture, and it is. ( WE ARE SAVED FRO OUR SINS BY BEING SAVED.)



Romans 10:4 For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to every one that believeth.
5 For Moses describeth the righteousness which is of the law, That the man which doeth those things shall live by them.
6 But the righteousness which is of faith speaketh on this wise, Say not in thine heart, Who shall ascend into heaven? (that is, to bring Christ down from above
7 Or, Who shall descend into the deep? (that is, to bring up Christ again from the dead.)
8 But what saith it? The word is nigh thee, even in thy mouth, and in thy heart: that is, the word of faith, which we preach;
9 That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.
10 For with the heart man believeth unto righteousness; and with the mouth confession is made unto salvation.




Changes occur by being born again, as we believe all old is passed away and all is become new.




1 John 3:5 And ye know that he was manifested to take away our sins; and in him is no sin.
6 Whosoever abideth in him sinneth not: whosoever sinneth hath not seen him, neither known him.
7 Little children, let no man deceive you: he that doeth righteousness is righteous, even as he is righteous.
8 He that committeth sin is of the devil; for the devil sinneth from the beginning. For this purpose the Son of God was manifested, that he might destroy the works of the devil.
9 Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin; for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
10 In this the children of God are manifest, and the children of the devil: whosoever doeth not righteousness is not of God, neither he that loveth not his brother.

Galatians 5:14 For all the law is fulfilled in one word, even in this; Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

John 15:12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.
13 Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.
14 Ye are my friends, if ye do whatsoever I command you.

2 Corinthians 5:17 Therefore if any man be in Christ, he is a new creature: old things are passed away; behold, all things are become new.

HIM said:

Sorry you missed the point of that or felt the need to post your post. Take care

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Oh I got the point you were trying to make, but since you based it on a cliche that was literally inapplicable to the name of Christ, and since the point is also theologically questionable, I felt obliged to explain the problem with it.

This is the Douay Rhiems translation of Hosea 4:6

6 My people have been silent, because they had no knowledge: because thou hast rejected knowledge, I will reject thee, that thou shalt not do the office of priesthood to me: and thou hast forgotten the law of thy God, I also will forget thy children

Protestant bibles I have read say, for lack of knowledge, my people perish.


What does this have to do with the “Gay-washed” bible? If we had proper knowledge, this so called translation would not be an issue. If we had proper knowledge of sex aka the marital act

Scripture as well as the Church teaches us that we must FLY fornication ( fly is a medieval form of to word flee to give greater emphasis) we are to mortify the deeds of the flesh and persue chastity.

The marital act is to be oriented towards children. It is improper to say we have had a ceremony in church and have in mind that we are using it to justify treating our spouse with lustful intent. Contraception in intent or practice prevents the consummation of the marital act. The ceremony in Church is therefore licit but not consummate if the intent is contraceptive, and it is subject to annulment because no binding marriage has taken place. This is because the two have not become one flesh and the couple had made their vows in vain. If the couple continues to have intercourse with contraception in practice or intent, they are in mortal sin and need to repent
Yes mortal sin requires full knowledge and consent and we were not explicitly taught this, so we can claim ignorance. God has mercy on whom He has mercy and I cannot judge someone
Once we do have this knowledge, we cannot unknow it and are liable to follow it under pain of mortal sin.


Pope Leo says all are welcome, and it is not for us to judge who wants to come into the Church, but once they are here we need to teach them proper knowledge of the marital act.
We do not teach them to “pray the gay away” as if heterosexual acts are better because they are heterosexual. They are not, and contraceptive heterosexual acts are just as guilty of profaning the marital act as homosexual acts, maybe more so, and they are both mortal sin. If we wish to argue that pleasure in heterosexual acts is superior to homosexual acts, we may as well be arguing that the taste of chocolate is superior to vanilla. It is personal preference and has no baring on the mortal sin involved.

We need to teach and have faith that sex is for children. All Catholics should read the book of Tobit to understand this fact. In the story a woman is widowed seven times because each of her previous husbands, although having a licit marital ceremony, desired her for lust rather than true marriage. In the end Tobias repents and sees it is for children that the marital act is given by God


If we teach sex is for children, then homosexual acts are sterile and their sin is obviously mortal.

Hentenza said:

You don’t mind then that your church started the denomination groups and then was at fault for the creation of a lot more in the 16th century? Ok then.

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I think Martin Luther and a few others did that. All churches have some moniker, the EO is one such name which also covers, among others, ancient churches with the names Church of Antioch, Church of Alexandria, Church of Jerusalem, etc. Simi;larly the Churtch of Rome became known as the Cathilc Church. The eruption of new denomiantions began occuring when they protested against and split from the CC.

Hentenza said:

Ok but you know that I have issues with that teaching.

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Yes, of course.

Hentenza said:

More orthodox? How fully we understand the faith? lol The arrogance. We understand the fullness of the faith just fine.

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Whoever "we" are. As I've mentioned the "we" that includes non-Catholics here who hold to Sola Scripura aren't agreeing on what the faith is on a very basic point!

Hentenza said:

We can argue this in another thread. And BTW you started it in your post 297 by belittling other churches.

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I didn't bring up orthodoxy but at the same time I didn't need to because, of course, everyone here has been arguing about the orthodoxy, the truth, of one belief vs another pertaining to the law. As for belittling? I simply stated a truth, one that you should agree with and most likely applaud while I think less of it.