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  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.

SO HOW DO YOU KNOW YOU ARE SAVED ??

Jesus said someone giving another a cup of water will not lose their reward.

Mark 9:41
For whosoever shall give you a cup of water to drink in my name, because ye belong to Christ, verily I say unto you, he shall not lose his reward.

Giving a cup of water salvation it is then...pretty low bar ain't it?

1 John 4:7 makes it even simpler. Anyone who loves knows God and is born of God. To me that can technically apply to everyone, don't you think?

Why is it we think it's mandatory to threaten ourselves or other people with possible eternal torture anyway? It's kind of sick, really, if you think about it.

I have no issues with hell, and devils heading there. But I really can't see it for people. There's not a single named example of this supposed fact in the entire Bible. You might think with all the possible candidates at least ONE NAMED PERSON could have been singled out as an example? But alas, there is not a one to confirm this so called fact.

So why take on that darkness to anyone?

People who supposedly serve under threat of possible hell to themselves are brown nosing to save their own sorry hides. Like God is a criminal holding a gun to them. Who wouldn't cough up to save their life in that kind of setup?

Jesus had zero respect for that setup:

Marr. 25:
25 And I was afraid, and went and hid thy talent in the earth: lo, there thou hast that is thine.
26 His lord answered and said unto him, Thou wicked and slothful servant, thou knewest that I reap where I sowed not, and gather where I have not strawed:
27 Thou oughtest therefore to have put my money to the exchangers, and then at my coming I should have received mine own with usury.
28 Take therefore the talent from him, and give it unto him which hath ten talents.

Servants under duress might not walk away from the table with anything

Haven't you ever belonged to a sect where the congregants were just waiting for anyone to say or do anything they considered "out of line" so they could pounce on someone else with the proclamation of possible hell? It's really sickening, such sects. The churches are unfortunately filled with such megalomaniacs. There's just some compelling in their hearts that makes them want to be the arbiter of some other person's eternal fate.

The only long term survivor in this entire format is God in any case:

1 Cor. 15:28
And when all things shall be subdued unto him, then shall the Son also himself be subject unto him that put all things under him, that God may be all in all.

Who in their right mind would hold on to themselves, when they could simply give up everything to have Perfection Dwell in them? Seems like a pretty fair deal, don't you think?
And giving some one a cup. of water is. GREAT. if Christ is speaking to an. ISRAELITE and you are standing. before Christ

is BIG. and this what will happen to. Israel !!

Now this what will happen. to. those saved BY. GRACE and PLACED into. the BODY OF CHRIST is in. 1. Cor 2:9. , Just as to

has been. written. which. the EYE. did not SEE , and the EAR did not HEAR and did NOT. come up upon the HEART

of MAN. the THINGS. God PREPARED for the Ones LOVING Him.

dan p
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The Lutheran Hail Mary and the Orthodox Angelic Salutation

O Blessed Virgin, Mother of God, what great comfort God has shown us in you, by so graciously regarding your unworthiness and low estate. This encourages us to believe that henceforth He will not despise us poor and lowly ones, but graciously regard us also, according to your example.

O blessed Virgin and Mother of God,
how very little and lowly
were you esteemed,
and yet God looked upon you
with abundant graces and riches
and has done great things for you.
Indeed, you were not at all worthy of this.
But high and wide, above and beyond your merit,
is the rich, overflowing grace of God in you.
How good, how blessed are you
for all eternity, from the moment
you found such a God!

(From Luther’s commentary on the Magnificat, 1521. WORKS OF MARTIN LUTHER - THE MAGNIFICAT - TRANSLATED AND EXPLAINED 1520-1

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Should Trump have been banned from running for president?

I suspect all Satanists and Witches who promote and practice child sacrifice in the form of abortion vote Democrat. "That is the party they side with in this country."
I am not sure you want to follow that bizarre logic too far.

Just so we're clear, you consider Satanists and Witches to be morally equal with Nazis?

-CryptoLutheran
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Selfishness

A social contract isn't between me and the state. The state is simply the local authority in charge of the administration thereof. The contract is between you, me, and everybody else. So long as the contract is fairly derived and equitably applied everything is hunky-dory, but in such circumstances where it isn't, the obligation to abide by it is diminished.
And in essence the "contract" is what are you doing for the "tribe". Are you doing things that benefit the tribe or are you just a drain on it's ability to survive? If you steal bread in a circumstance where there is no viable alternative, the theft may be seen as justified. If you steal bread because it is easier than working for it, then it becomes detrimental to society.
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Why do people hate ICE...

Basically there are two main positions on Immigration law. Those who want safety and secuirty of borders but also law and order in society. Then there are the radical Marxist ideologues who want open borders and defund the police as they believe there should be no borders and law and order is oppression.

Horse dung.

-CryptoLutheran
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Mississippi School Homecoming Celebrations Turn Deadly as 8 People are Killed 20 Injured in Separate Shootings

I don't believe it is a problem. If somehow you could prove that 7% of murders were committed with guns purchased from legitimate private sales then we could talk about it being a problem. Why 7% you ask? I know its arbitrary, but I firmly believe that during the BLM protests 7% turned into riots. And I called that a problem. So I am trying to be consistent.
I appreciate your approach, even if the 7% figure is arbitrary, as you said. Since there's no way of knowing an exact percentage, we will probably never reach an agreement on this subject. Either way, since private sellers are a significant source of trafficked firearms and a significant number of homicides are committed by shooters who purchased guns directly from a private seller, that leads me to believe that the percentage of homicides that result from private gun sales is likely higher than 7%.

What is a trafficked gun? I don't follow. Is it illegal? Because when referring to trafficking we are referring to illegal activity of trafficking. If its a legal sale then it can't be trafficking. So
, what do you mean?
Here is the definition according to the Department of Justice: “the movement of one or more firearms into the illegal market for a criminal purpose.”

Firearm trafficking can involve the intrastate, interstate, and international movement of firearms and comprises:

• Trafficking in new firearms by large-scale straw purchasers, organized straw purchasing rings,
and small-scale straw purchasers that acquire firearms from FFLs, at gun shows, or other
premises; by corrupt FFLs; or by unlicensed makers.

• Trafficking in secondhand (or “used”) firearms by large-scale straw purchasers, organized straw
purchasing rings, and small-scale straw purchasers that acquire firearms from FFLs, at gun
shows, or other premises; by unlicensed sellers through flea markets, newspaper ads, gun
publications, the internet, personal associations,
or bartering and trading within criminal
networks; or by corrupt FFLs.

• Trafficking in new and secondhand stolen firearms involving guns stolen from FFLs, or thefts
from common carriers, private residences, and vehicles.


The most frequent types of trafficking channels identified in ATF investigations were unlicensed firearm dealing by private persons (40.7%) and straw purchasing from FFLs (39.5%). ATF investigations revealed a variety of illegal diversions from lawful firearm commerce including trafficking in firearms through online marketplaces (3.6%) such as Craigslist, OfferUp, eBay, Armslist, and Gunbroker; at gun shows, flea markets, or auctions (3.0%); social media platforms (2.7%) 2 such as Facebook and Instagram; and through peer-to-peer applications (1.0%) such as WhatsApp, TikTok, and Tinder.

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Is belief/non-belief a morally culpable state?

What is the relation between belief and moral culpability? Is it wrong to believe/not-believe certain things?

Is it wrong to believe X if a more thorough investigation would show that X is false? In other words, do we have a moral obligation to do as thorough an investigation as possible before accepting the truth/falsity of X? If so, how would we know when our investigation is sufficiently thorough?

I assume the answer may differ depending on the belief in question. Beliefs that lead to right/wrong actions will clearly have a moral component. But what about beliefs regarding evolution or that the earth is flat/spherical?

Do we have a moral obligation to seek the truth? I'm not sure that we do. Is it wrong to believe what is false?

Please avoid theological subjects such as whether one is morally culpable for belief/non-belief in God since such subjects are not allowed in this forum. I know that's a big ask, but I believe we can do it! Maybe I'm wrong in so believing, i.e., such a belief is false, but is it morally wrong for me to so believe?
When I was a child, I assumed people chose what they believed. Then I grew up.

Here is the problem:

1. Our senses are not entirely accurate. Our eyes, ears, etc., don't always work the way they should and there are many things that exist for which we have no ability to sense.

2. Our perception is not completely reliable either. Perception is the ability to properly interpret sensory data. Even if our bodies are functioning as designed we make mistakes. Optical illusions are well known, as are hallucinations, and these things are far more common than people want to think. Do you realize just how common it is for people to not quite hear a word, and insert the wrong word into the blank spot?

3. Contrary to popular thinking, human beings are incredibly irrational creatures. We have inherited biologically ingrained cognition errors that literally block us from reaching accurate conclusions: confirmation bias, primacy effect, projection, need for closure, illusion of control.... I could probably list 30 different cognitive distortions that keep us from the truth.

IMHO, it's a miracle that human beings can function as well as we do.

Do I think we have a moral imperative to try to find the truth? Yes. But I would say we have just as strong a moral imperative to humbly realize just how fallible we are, and to extend grace to those who are "wrong," because after all, that wrong person could be us.

I am not Christian, and quite frankly I find the Christian notion that God will eternally reward or eternally torture someone due solely to their honest errors seems morally outrageous to me. It would be the worst sort of injustice to punish a person for something that is beyond their control. And folks, that's just not the God I love and serve.
  • Informative
Reactions: timothyu
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About one-world government and the future of this world

Her near-death experiences seems to align with what was written in the bible though, especially since she saw a one-world government which was predicted in the bible. And she also saw wars on a large scale, which was one of the stuffs predicted in the bible as well
-
Anyone can have some knowledge of The Bible and come up with any kind of supposed future events
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If sins were to be ranked by how bad it is, what would be the top 10 sins?

That said a lot of people don’t understand what this sin is, and since I’ve been a member of CF I’ve seen about 20 frightened teenagers and young adults in the early 20s, most from denominations that lack the high quality catechesis of the Roman Catholic Church and certain other denominations, appear on the forums terrified they have blasphemed the Holy Spirit (none of them had). Its very important we explain to the youth what is meant by this sin because the existential terror felt by those kids was both real and dangerous in that they were close to despair, a passion as potentially soteriologically harmful as pride.
Yes! Well said!
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All The Days of My Life

“One thing I have asked from the Lord, that I shall seek:
That I may dwell in the house of the Lord all the days of my life,
To behold the beauty of the Lord
And to meditate in His temple.” (Psalm 27:4 NASB1995)

“The house of the Lord” today is not a physical building built by human hands. So when you go into a building which they call “church,” you are not entering into the house of the Lord. And you are not standing on holy ground when you enter into what they call the church sanctuary, or worship center, as I was taught in my youth. A building is just a building regardless of what name you give to it, for God does not dwell in buildings built by human hands. He dwells in the human hearts of those who are surrendered to him.

[Acts 7:48-50; Acts 17:24-25; John 14:23; Ephesians 3:17; Romans 5:5]

The house of the Lord now is not a physical place, but it is spiritual. It is the church (not a physical building or location), the body of Christ, the body of believers in Jesus Christ who have died with Christ to sin and who are now to be walking in obedience to our Lord’s commands. We, the body of Christ, are now where God dwells by his Spirit. We, the people of God are his church, not a building, and not a church denomination. And we can gather together anywhere appropriate at any time of day, any day of the week.

So, to dwell in the house of the Lord all the days of our lives is to be in genuine biblical relationship with Jesus Christ via God-persuaded and God-gifted faith in Jesus Chris whereby we are crucified with Christ in death to sin and raised with Christ to walk in newness of life in him, no longer to live as slaves to sin but now as slaves to God and to his righteousness. We are now his temple. And even if someone builds a “third temple,” it is still not our Lord’s temple, for we are and always will be his temple on this earth.

Now some people believe that if they make a profession of faith in Jesus Christ, or if they verbally confess him as Lord, and believe in his death and resurrection, that they are now saved for eternity regardless of how they live. This is based on a Scripture taught out of context (Romans 10:9). But if we read the Scriptures in their context we will learn that faith in Jesus Christ is something that must be continuous, and it must be shown as genuine by us dying to sin and us walking in obedience to our Lord’s commands.

For, as the Scriptures teach, if sin remains our practice, and not obedience to God, we do not know God, we are not in fellowship with him, and we do not have salvation from sin and eternal life with God. We must continue in Christ and in putting sin to death, by the Spirit, and in walking in obedience to our Lord in surrender to his will if we want to have eternal life with God when Jesus returns for his faithful bride. So don’t believe the lie which says that a one-time profession of faith in Jesus assures you of eternal life with God.

For Jesus Christ taught that to come to him we must deny self, take up our cross daily (die daily to sin), and follow (obey) him. For if we hold on to living in sin and for self, we will lose our lives for eternity. But if we deny self, die daily to sin, by the Spirit, and we walk in obedience to our Lord and to his commands, in his power, then we have eternal life with God. For not everyone who calls him “Lord” will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one DOING (obeying) the will of God (see Luke 9:23-26; Matthew 7:21-23).

For by God-gifted faith in Jesus Christ, which is not of our own doing, we are crucified with Christ in death to sin and raised with Christ to walk in newness of life in him, no longer to live as slaves to sin but as slaves to righteousness in walks of obedience to God’s commands. We are no longer to permit sin to reign in our mortal bodies to make us obey its desires. For if sin is what we obey, it results in death. But if obedience to God is what we obey, it results in sanctification, and its end is eternal life with God (see Romans 6:1-23).

The grace of God, which is bringing us salvation, is training us to renounce ungodliness and worldly passions, and to live self-controlled, upright, and godly lives while we wait for Jesus’ return. For Christ “gave himself for us to redeem us from all lawlessness and to purify for himself a people for his own possession who are zealous for good works.” “For we are his workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand, that we should walk in them.” (See Titus 2:11-14; Ephesians 2:8-10)

And we learn in 1 John 1-3 that if we claim that we have fellowship with God, but yet we walk in darkness (sin), we are liars. If we claim that we know God, but we do not obey his commandments, in practice, we are liars. For it is not the one who claims he is “in Christ” who is “in Christ,” but it is the one who has denied self, died with Christ to sin, and who is now walking in obedience to our Lord and to his commands, in practice, and no longer in sin. We have the hope and the promise of eternal life with God in heaven.

[Matthew 7:13-14,21-23; Luke 9:23-26; John 10:27-30; Acts 26:18; Romans 1:18-32; Romans 2:5-10; Romans 3:23; Romans 6:1-23; Romans 8:1-14; 1 Corinthians 10:1-22; Galatians 5:16-24; Ephesians 2:8-10; Ephesians 4:17-32; Ephesians 5:3-6; Titus 2:11-14; Hebrews 3:1-19; Hebrews 4:1-13; Hebrews 10:19-39; Hebrews 12:1-2; 1 Peter 2:24; 1 John 1:1-10; 1 John 2:3-6; 1 John 3:4-10; Revelation 2:1-29; Revelation 3:1-22]

For Our Nation

An Original Work / September 11, 2012
Christ’s Free Servant, Sue J Love
Recording Via Gerry Peters, music producer and arranger


Bombs are bursting. Night is falling.
Jesus Christ is gently calling
You to follow Him in all ways.
Trust Him with your life today.
Make Him your Lord and your Savior.
Turn from your sin. Follow Jesus.
He will forgive you of your sin;
Cleanse your heart, made new within.

Men betraying: Our trust fraying.
On our knees to God we’re praying,
Seeking God to give us answers
That are only found in Him.
God is sovereign over all things.
Nothing from His mind escaping.
He has all things under His command,
And will work all for good.

Jesus Christ is gently calling
You to follow Him in all ways.

Men deceiving: We’re believing
In our Lord, and interceding
For our nation and its people
To obey their God today.
He is our hope for our future.
For our wounds He offers suture.
He is all we need for this life.
Trust Him with your life today.

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All The Days of My Life
An Original Work / October 18, 2025
Christ’s Free Servant, Sue J Love

Mississippi School Homecoming Celebrations Turn Deadly as 8 People are Killed 20 Injured in Separate Shootings

I want to know if these gun sales were legal ones. Not buying from some back street, back alley transaction. Were these guns brought from fun shows? Where they bought from on line legal sales? I don't have enough information on them. Secondly we need to know if a background check would have prevented the gun sale. There is too much missing information to make a qualified statement.

If indeed those those numbers are correct AND those guns were purchased through legitimate sales AND a background check would have prevented the sale then I would agree that its a problem.

Putting the numbers aside, in concept it's not good for someone who gets denied a gun sale from a licensed dealer be able to turn around and buy one somewhere else. We should want robust and logical laws in our society around things such as this.
  • Agree
Reactions: JosephZ
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“Faith, Ethics, and Everyday Choices: How Do We Live Righteously Today?”

Hello brothers and sisters in Christ,


I wanted to start a conversation about ethics and morality from a Christian perspective.
Do you realize that you have placed your thread in an area designated as interfaith?

I'm not a Christian, but I'm going to reply anyhow. My ethics are really quite simple: "What is hateful to you, don't do to others. That is the WHOLE Torah. All the rest is commentary."
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Empathy

A quote from Chuck Kirk.


Now I look at this quote and I get seriously confused. I cannot understand why a person would have a problem with empathy.

How would the Good Samaritan Help someone that thinks their terrible without it?

How can Jesus heal someone without it?

In my view, empathy connects us and allow people sympathy to flow more greatly. It creates stronger bonds between strangers.

So help me understand how and WHY empathy is bad.
All moral systems are built on a foundation of two things: empathy and a sense of fairness. People instinctively know something is wrong because they anticipate and feel the pain it would cause others.

You take away empathy, and what you have is a psychopath or sociopath without a conscience. Sometimes they still manage to be moral, but for practical reasons: they want to avoid negative social consequences (jail, getting fired, etc.). But the odds of harming others go way, way up.
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Ethics of Proselytization

@ViaCrucis

To all the Christians here. I think this has been a wonderful topic and I've enjoyed reading the many comments.

What little I have to add as an outsider is this: everything, EVERYTHING gets measured by "Love your neighbor as yourself." If it's something hateful to you, don't do it to others. Treat others the way you want to be treated.

Via had an important insight when he/she realized that being made a mark for conversion brought into questions the motives why this person had been friendly in the first place. Were they smiling and nice because they genuinely like you and wanted to be your friend? Or was their kindness merely manipulation to get close enough to evangelize? Via felt betrayed, because the odds of deception had significantly risen, and no one likes being deceived. Now apply the golden rule.

Another way you might explore the same issue is to imagine yourself being similarly approached by someone of a different faith. What if someone had been friendly, and then passed you an invitation to their Mosque? Or to a Talmud study? Or passed you a pagan blessing? Because if that makes you uncomfortable even in the slightest, you should have warning red lights going off in your mind that it is NOT okay for you to be evangelizing others in this way.

The Law of Reciprocity is so simple, so basic, so foundational that it is taught in every major world religion. Every child learns it. Yet adults routinely neglect to apply it to our own personal actions. Every one of us needs to spend more time reflecting on our lives. Where have I not loved my neighbor as myself?
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