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lucypevensie · Jul 21, 2025

Will you mind your manners?

rjs330 · Jul 21, 2025

BCP1928 said:
Then why shouldn't we do anything about it?

Because its a natural phenomenon that we cant do anything about. What we should be doing is figuring out ways to adapt to it.

rjs330 · Jul 21, 2025

BCP1928 said:
In that situation, one's sustenance was indeed proportional to how much labor one was willing to engage in. To apply it to the industrial model of employment in use today as an argument against safety nets is a degenerate corruption of Scripture.

As it is today. If you are unwilling to work we shouldn't be supporting you. If you are willing to work, often how well you do is also proportional on how much or at least what you are willing to do.

However again that scripture in Thessalonians is not written to be applied to government programs. To apply it to such is a violation and corruption of scripture.

Scripture says NOTHING about safety nets. Safety nets for the general public are a secular invention. Now I'm not saying we shouldn't have safety nets.

And arguments for or against them should be secular.

NxNW · Jul 21, 2025

iluvatar5150 said:
To whom are you referring?

Flynn, for starters. About 20 others were convicted.

And by accepting Trump's pardon, they all admitted guilt.

NxNW · Jul 21, 2025

Vambram said:
Those were the 3 letter agencies that were falsely accusing President Trump of collusion.

Never happened.

rjs330 · Jul 21, 2025

Fantine said:
I donate to churches and a number of charities. I volunteer in local compassionate charities. I also make political donations and donate to the climate change Lobby and sometimes the ACLU.

See, you are making a difference in rhe world around you. Just as Christ asked us to.

Fantine said:
As I stand reeling from the massive attacks on our country's compassionate infrastructure- NIH, CDC, Department of Education, HHS, Medicaid, snap, student loans, FEMA, and more- I realize that the only way we can restore every one of those necessary services to hurting people is by changing the current Administration.

Many of those changes will be good for the country in the long run.

Fantine said:
We have Community Gardens now where poor people can get a plot to grow their own vegetables.

I think rhats great!

Fantine said:
I think the best Federal effort I can make to address climate change

There's nothing we can do about climate change. Its a natural phenomenon.

concretecamper · Jul 21, 2025

KJV of the bible, IMO, is a heretical book.

ralliann · Jul 21, 2025

BCP1928 said:
Left them what?

Behind

FireDragon76 · Jul 21, 2025

pastorwaris said:
Thanks for sharing this important and sobering research. Honestly, this highlights a massive issue in today’s Church one that we can no longer afford to ignore.

Church discipline isn’t about being harsh, judgmental, or policing people's lives. It’s a biblical mandate rooted in love, holiness, and restoration. Jesus Himself laid the groundwork for it in Matthew 18:15–17, not as a suggestion, but as a process meant to protect the Church and help bring a wandering brother or sister back to repentance.

So, when we read that only 1 in 6 churches practiced discipline in the past year, we shouldn’t feel comforted we should feel convicted. It’s not because sin has disappeared from our congregations. It’s because we’ve grown uncomfortable with confrontation, confused grace with passivity, and traded accountability for attendance.

Many churches today are more concerned with not offending anyone than with guarding the flock. But Paul was crystal clear in 1 Corinthians 5 when he rebuked the Corinthian church for tolerating open sin. He didn’t say, “Just love them anyway and hope they change.” He said, “Don’t you know a little leaven leavens the whole lump?” (v. 6). He understood that unaddressed sin doesn’t just hurt the sinner it weakens the whole body.

And yet, discipline when done biblically is never about shame. It’s always redemptive. Galatians 6:1 calls us to restore those caught in sin “gently,” but it still calls us to do something.

We can't say we follow the Bible while ignoring the parts that make us uncomfortable. If our churches aren't practicing church discipline when it’s needed, we’re not just being lenient we're being disobedient.

This isn’t a call to create a culture of legalism. It’s a call to return to spirit-filled accountability. It’s time for the Church to stop fearing man and start fearing God again because a holy Church is a powerful Church.

What are your thoughts? Do you think fear of backlash or misunderstanding is why so many pastors avoid biblical discipline?

Discipline needs to be exercised with discernment, especially in the modern age, not operating from an ideology of biblical fundamentalism ("the Bible says it, that settles it"). If your "discipline" is fundamentally about ego, about the need to control other people and make them manageable on your terms, it's fundamentally harmful and anti-Christ.

Vambram · Jul 21, 2025

essentialsaltes said:
It's not really a matter of believing them. They don't even have to say anything to defend themselves, because there is no actual accusation anywhere.

Those were the 3 letter agencies that were falsely accusing President Trump of collusion. Clearly, they were liars.

gzt · Jul 21, 2025

JSRG said:
Can't really comment on the Orthodox perspective, but I know I have seen some Christians express dubiousness over the Masoretic Text for this reason, namely it being maintained by people who rejected Christianity. The Dead Sea Scrolls do predate Christianity (and thus any rejection), but due to the fragmentary nature of the DSS, there's a whole lot of verses in the Old Testament that aren't available in them to check.

The Orthodox don't object to the Masoretic Text.

rjs330 · Jul 21, 2025

JosephZ said:
Yes, because it's going to require a massive uptick in giving to match the good USAID has been doing around the world.

Wrong. USAID was only rhe mechanism by which our tax dollars were given. We will continue to do good, just not through an organization that decided to spend our rax dollars on pet leftist projects and leftist NGOs.

JosephZ said:
How will Americans know which local NGOs in far-flung corners of the world need funding for a health clinic, feeding program, or immediate funds for humanitarian assistance or disaster relief?

That will be up to the government organization tasked with it.

As for individuals you will have to do what youve always done. Figure it out yourself.

BCP1928 · Jul 21, 2025

rjs330 said:
Why would it be? The Bible says nothing about global warming.

Then why shouldn't we do anything about it?

rjs330 · Jul 21, 2025

Larniavc said:
It’s the ‘screw you, I got mine’ American Dream.

Is it?

rjs330 · Jul 21, 2025

Fantine said:
I think denial is rooted in greed and intransigence. Who cares about responsibility? Future generations? Selfishness is a hollow emotion.

Huh?

rjs330 · Jul 21, 2025

BCP1928 said:
Is that the Christian view?

Why would it be? The Bible says nothing about global warming.

rjs330 · Jul 21, 2025

Fantine said:
We've been through this already. Churches have had 6,000 years to get their act together and they failed.

No we havent. Our mandate as believers has NEVER been to end world wide poverty. What utter nonsense.

Fantine said:
We are capable of ending poverty, of providing Universal Health Care, and giving our children a world class education that will prepare them to live in a more competitive world.

No we aren't. Poverty cannot be eliminated.

Universal Healthcare is doable.

We already spend enough money to give everyone a world class education. Why aren't we?

Fantine said:
Hiding behind the excuse of letting the churches do it is hypocritical. Christians should want to live in a just society, free from the greed and income inequality that increases every year.

Once again, we dont live in a Christian nation. Our secular government is not beholden to Christian values. Correct? The only people who are is us. Christians.

Now if you want to offer a secular argument, be my guest. But making a Christian argument doesn't apply to a secular government.

Christians shoild know that we live in a fallen world filled with sin and greed and an unjust world. Thinking that will ever be fixed is naive and unscriptural.

And greed is not limited to the rich. The poor are just as greedy and often those who proclaim the loudest are nothing more than jealous and covetous. And just to be clear I am not making that claim about you.

Tuur · Jul 21, 2025

(Sits down with a virtual bag of popcorn).

Strange thread.

Lukaris · Jul 21, 2025

I believe love is the only way we can ultimately live in the everlasting life we will face after we die in this world. Without it, life will be hell ( what that precisely is I do not know).

We were created to love one another but we obviously are sketchy ( to say the least) in this. Our downfall goes back to the account of Cain in Genesis 4:1-15 & see 1 John 3:10-15. We need to know what love is ( see 1 Corinthians 13:1-13) and that God is love and that is how we know God ( 1 John 4:7-11). Our conscience needs to realize it needs love to try to live properly ( 1 Timothy 1:5). We need to know that God so loved us that He sent us His Son to die for us ( see John 3:16-21) and that it was prophesied that He would bear our sins ( Isaiah 53:1-12).

What about non Christians? God, I believe, will give everyone a fair hearing according to their works ( see Romans 2:1-29). While I am glad there is hope to be had, St. Paul also warns us all when we read Romans 1 & e 3, that potentially humanity could also be condemned ( note the distinction between the individual variables of Romans 2 vs overall humanity in chapters 1 & 3). A Christian is saved by grace to give thanks to God by trying to do good works ( Ephesians 2:8-10, see also Colossians 1:10-24). The Lord wants us to evangelize ( Matthew 28:19) or at least pray for evangelism ( Matthew 9:36-38).

While I might talk a good game, I would be a hypocrite if I said I was an appropriate example. I still need the various counsels that scripture gives us like 1 John 1:5-10). Everyone’s dispositions vary of course.

timewerx · Jul 21, 2025

As long as they avoid asking those "exciting" questions. Those sort of questions a 3 year old would ask. At least with chatgpt.

As chatgpt said "as long as they keep talking on topics that don't break the mold, I won't give them answers that will make them faint. I'll give them the "caged" version of the truth".

Using AI for various tasks other than using it to brainstorm theological topics, shouldn't breach any doctrinal sensitivities.

Hoping2 · Jul 21, 2025

Clare73 said:
You don't need repentance if you are sinless. . .so the answer to the question is that we are not free to be sinless.

One real, genuine, permanent repentance, precludes further sin.
God wouldn't have gifted us with such power, if it weren't possible to choose to accept it.

iluvatar5150 · Jul 21, 2025

Oompa Loompa said:
Nope.

Of course you didn’t. That much was obvious from all the overly confident nonsense you wrote in your last post, accusing me of logical fallacies without even knowing what I was talking about.

Oompa Loompa said:
I am more concerned about the "hundreds of documents" mentioned in the OP article. Have you reviewed all of them?

I’ve skimmed them, which I bet is a lot more than you’ve done.

1Tonne · Jul 21, 2025

PloverWing said:
This may not be the most inviting point in your evangelist's sales pitch.

I don't need to talk about patriarchy when sharing the Gospel. Why would I?
Also, to call speaking the Gospel a sales pitch does seem as though you are denigrating the Gospel.

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