GoldenBoy89 said:

Probably not worth the risk finding out if it’s true or not and be sent to a Salvadoran prison.

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Why would a European tourist get sent to a Salvadoran prison?

GoldenBoy89 said:

Is it not?

Just listen to how Trump characterizes our major cities. They are all awash with crime, violence and corruption and he’s supposed to be our biggest cheerleader to the world. It’s no wonder foreign visitors would rather pass on a trip to the US.

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It's true some of the large Dem run cities are dangerous. In fact, I think the State Department should issue a Travel Advisory for Chicago. Better yet, maybe a Living Advisory - "Don't live there".

Jesus specifies that Daniel has duel prophecy fulfillment.
" And pray that your flight may not be in winter or on the Sabbath. For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been since the beginning of the world until this time, no, nor ever shall be." - Matthew 24:20-21

So we have to start with that. I think to argue only 1 fulfillment disregards the other and will become a stalemate where both can be true. There seems to be in Daniel where the destruction of the 2nd temple does indeed fulfill this prophecy but the part it doesn't fulfill is what Jesus says that their flight is in winter and going into the beginning of Daniel 12. We know the destruction happened during the summer as the Jews still mourn that day as the 9th of Av. The war of the Romans and Jews during that time actually took place in a 7 year span of time but by the end, a lot of Jews were slaughtered. So the historical account of the 2nd temple is a prophecy play by play of Daniel but there seems to be an extension that did not happen and thats when we get to the idea of end time fulfillment where their flight will be in winter and the rest of it will play out including Daniel 12.

Regardless if you believe Titus or Nero to be the deciding factor in the play out of the the destruction of the 2nd temple, the fact they were both Roman means the anti-christ does not have to be a Jew. This is why a lot of people think the roman empire will rise again but honestly, my personal opinion is that the "anti-christ" will be from the Islamic faith. Their hatred of Christians and Jews, their global jihad ideology and even their endtime eschatology makes them an interesting candidate.

Bradskii said:

Gee, you must read and listen to so much European media.

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Some, yes. Mostly from the U.K. since we (almost) speak the same language. I can sometimes find translated stuff from other countries. But for about 6 months I've been binging on and off watching travel vlogs made by people who are visiting the U.S. for the first time. It's interesting to get their different perspectives on things, and hear what expectations they had that turned out to be true or not true.

More than one couple has said their friends seriously tried to dissuade them from making the trip, warning them that they'd either get arrested, get shot by a cop or shot by a criminal, lol.

Bradskii said:

I have. A number of times totalling very many months and multiple states. We found Americans to be some of the friendliest and most generous people we've ever met. And we've travelled a lot.

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That's what I've heard from every vlogger. Some had previously heard that Americans were friendly, but were still surprised at how friendly they really are.

Bradskii said:

Your current government is the problem. Not the people. It's your government. It's an absolute dumpster fire.

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It's the best government I've had in my lifetime.

Bradskii said:

And no, I won't be going to the World Cup. But I can't wait to see what a multiple national crowd thinks of Trump when he makes an appearance at the opening ceremony. Especially as a fair proportion of the crowd will be from south of the border. But hey, you can put all the booing and catcalls down to the influence of the media.

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A fair proportion of every crowd here is from south of the border.

The Barbarian said:

I don't remember any history text saying that a particular race is the only source of slavery. Whites happened to be the people who instituted slavery in this nation, but the great majority of abolitionists were also white.


Marxism, National Socialism, "Christian" Nationalism (the last not being Christian at all). All of these are intrinsically evil. Other than white supremacists and Nation of Islam (which is like Christian nationalism not representative of a religion) I don't remember anyone saying a particular race was intrinsically evil.

But some ideologies are just evil. White supremacy, for example. KKK, Marxists and Nazis. Those guys.

No race is intrinsically evil, because there are no biological human races. The idea of "genetic identity" for different races is a fairy tale pushed by white supremacists and early creationists.

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A quote from the link in the OP
Begin quote
“You cannot tie imperialism and racism and slavery to just one race, which is pretty much what every single exhibit does,” Michaels said, adding: “Every single thing is like, ‘Oh, no, no, no, this is all because White people bad,’ and that’s just not the truth.”
End quote'

Michie said:

That’s just incredibly stupid that someone would suffer because their name was Karen or whatever the latest trend was in these silly wars people keep starting. People are so easily brainwashed with whatever the latest trend is. People need to stop finding their identities in this muck and stop painting others with their muck covered brushes. It’s just virtue signaling and climbing whatever social ladder they are enamored with at the moment. It’s transparent and gross.

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The misogyny is rife in this thread.

Makes sense. How else can he pose as the one true savior? He must be the only one who can solve the problem. SMH.

Jipsah said:

"Facts" being what you decide they are based on your a priopri beliefs, isn't that right?

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Facts are those things that are proven true...such as the Earth revolves around the sun...

Jipsah said:

Then I take it you should embrace Flat Earth, since Flerfies declare that The Bible Says The Earth is Flat, and that all emoirical evidence to the contrary is a studied deceit propagated by somebody or other for apparently inexplicable "reasons". Sounds a lot like the "young earth" position, doesn't it?

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No because I believe that Science has proven as a fact that the Earth is round and not flat. The Bible does not say the earth is flat anywhere...now if someone were to translate or understand it that way - they would be foolish since the facts tell us otherwise. So fix your translation or understanding of what the Bible says.

Those before Jesus put their trust in Moses....The word of Moses was meant to be believed (they were directly from God)...Moses gave them a direct literal history for them. Your comments border on blasphemy - good luck.

childeye 2 said:

Do you comprehend how this framework is using a positive/negative dichotomy to establish sound reasoning when parsing semantics?

This is an objectively true dichotomy ---> Knowledge/ignorance. <-- Objectively Knowledge precedes ignorance
This is a subjectively true dichotomy ---> ignorance/Knowledge. <-- Subjectively ignorance precedes Knowledge

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No, I don't understand what you are trying to say with this, it seems to be a nonsequitor.

childeye 2 said:

This is an objectively true dichotomy --> dichotomy Knowledge/ignorance --> relative to Truth.

This --> Left/Right is an east/west dichotomy. It represents two opposing directions of SPIN each with their own left/right SUBJECTIVE view.

The left/right dichotomy is used to represent any two opposing yet equally valid subjective points of view in a three-dimensional framework. In this dichotomy the objectively true dichotomy Knowledge/ignorance exists as an abstract center between the left and right hand in both opposing subjective dimensions of reasoning.

In the east/west dichotomy a term that connotes a positive on the LEFT hand of one spin will connote a negative on the LEFT hand of the opposite spin. These two hands left/right represent a give/take or a take/give depending on the spin. Subsequently constant course correction is necessary to maintain an equilibrium.

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All of this seems to depend on assertions, with no clear criteria to distinguish the dichotomies nor any way to say anything meaningful based on them.

childeye 2 said:

No. While I suppose the sentiment that the Creator existed before the creation could be considered a tautology, the dichotomy Creator/creation would not qualify as a true dichotomy. So, I'm saying that the term God is deemed as trustworthy and carries those sentiments as a course of theistic reasoning based on Faith.

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childeye 2 said:

God and people.

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childeye 2 said:

So what are you saying, you don't believe what you see?

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Nope, I'm saying what I see is not enough to move to deeper knowledge. No mode of inference is possible without poisoning the well in some way.

childeye 2 said:

I don't view my approach to knowledge as dogmatism since dogmatism implies based on opinion. Like I've said over and over, my approach to knowledge is that facts are learned not imagined. You could accurately say my belief is that reality dictates what is factually true, not me.

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You may not view it as such, but it's the route you seem to be going with as your response to the trilemma. And while dogmatism does ordinarily convey that it is built on authority, it's synonymous with an axiomatic or definitional approach to solving the trilemma.

Unfortunately rigid bodies don't exist in relativity.

Fun thought though.

childeye 2 said:

Wow, sounds like you were doing great till you pushed the rebellion button. I don't mean to criticize, I've done the same thing. We need to think of better ways to say things keeping in mind we're dealing with damaged minds. Probably could have mentioned that only one of these images is true and the other false and whichever image WE believe in, will live in OUR hearts. Hence, it comes off as we're all the same.

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Well, this was a long conversation that took place over several days; and I (as well as the at least 6 other people replying to his thread) had extended several suggestions. He was just stubbornly insistent on refuting everything EVERYONE said. I was just the one who spent the most time in the thread trying to help him change his mind.

As far as people being “broken”? You understand that we all are; and…. dang, ya know if all of us are commanded to repent, why’s he think he’s exempt? One testimony I’d seen on YouTube of a woman coming out of homosexuality stated: “The gospel costs all of us something.” (Which is true, in that we all have our crosses to bear. Which includes things we need repenting of too!)

So, yeah. I understand dealing with broken people. But again too; if we wish to justify ourselves; “Eternity” doesn’t hear our prayers either.

Although, I admit too, it can be hard to know which way to “call it”. Certainly true that we all need wisdom.

Keep in mind that the motion has to be transmitted down the atoms of the scissors, so no, the end would open years afterwards.

But then again, the scissors would break from the stress, or the gravitational pull from the scissors would wreck the solar systems.

Stopped_lurking said:

How many of the escapees were foreign nationals and repeat offenders?

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I don't see the relevance of your question. What percentage of the escapees were foreign nationals; and how does that compare to the percentage of the prison population that is composed of foreign nationals? Let's start there.

If you would like to make an argument that is backed up with some facts; I'll entertain it...irrational fears founded in speculation...notsomuch.

AetheriusLamia said:

It seems this does not reduce the suffering, but merely adds a kind of tether rope so you continue in the storm rather than be washed away by it.

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Suffering doesn't always go away. We must learn how to cope with the suffering and to not let it destroy us.

SabbathBlessings said:

We find all Ten of the Ten Commandments in the New Covenant including the Sabbath.

The Sabbath is still a commandment of God in the NT.

Luke 23:56 Then they returned and prepared spices and fragrant oils. And they rested on the Sabbath according to the commandment.

And the Sabbath remains for the people of God.

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No. Jesus had just been buried and not yet resurrected, Jesus was not yet our sabbath rest and the new covenant had not began.

SabbathBlessings said:

Heb: 4:9 There remains, then, a Sabbath-rest for the people of God;

The rest used in this verse literally means keeping the Sabbath

sabbatismos: Sabbath rest
Original Word: σαββατισμός
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: sabbatismos
Pronunciation: sab-bat-is-mos'
Phonetic Spelling: (sab-bat-is-mos')
Definition: Sabbath rest
Meaning: a keeping of the Sabbath, a Sabbath rest.

God's people keep God's commandments (His version) and the Sabbath is a commandment of God, that God placed in the same unit as not to worship other gods and not murder our neighbor. Why we see the Sabbath-keeping all throughout the entire Bible including the NT kept by Jesus and the apostles and His faithful followers.

Sadly man changed God's Sabbath that most follow as He warned us would happen Dan 7:25

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Actually you are making generalizations here that refute your interpretation. Let’s look at a few more verses here to clarify what the writer of the book intended.

“Therefore, we must fear if, while a promise remains of entering His rest, any one of you may seem to have come short of it.

[“Therefore” here continues uninterrupted what was being taught in chapter 3 which was the importance of having faith in Christ. This faith is what allows the believer to enter the rest spoken of here.]

For indeed we have had good news preached to us, just as they also did; but the word they heard did not benefit them, because they were not united with those who listened with faith.

[some that heard the gospel and did not believe]

For we who have believed enter that rest, just as He has said, “As I swore in My anger, They certainly shall not enter My rest,” although His works were finished from the foundation of the world.

[those that believe enter that rest. This is clearly not taking about the Sabbath rest because even those that do not believe in Christ can still enter the Sabbath rest such as Jews]


For He has said somewhere concerning the seventh day: “And God rested on the seventh day from all His works”; and again in this passage, “They certainly shall not enter My rest.” Therefore, since it remains for some to enter it, and those who previously had good news preached to them failed to enter because of disobedience, He again sets a certain day, “Today,” saying through David after so long a time just as has been said before, “Today if you hear His voice, Do not harden your hearts.”

[back to faith. An exhortation to believe. Obviously David was not preaching the good news of Christ. David sets a certain day not the Sabbath day because this relates to the faith that is needed to enterHis rest now]

For if Joshua had given them rest, He would not have spoken of another day after that.
[Old testament Joshua could not have given them rest but New Testament Joshua (Jesus) can give them rest through faith.]

Consequently, there remains a Sabbath rest for the people of God. For the one who has entered His rest has himself also rested from his works, as God did from His.

[the Sabbath rest here is contrasted with those who enter His, Jesus, rest. Notice that the verse states A Sabbath rest rather than the OT Sabbath rest]

Therefore let’s make every effort to enter that rest, so that no one will fall by following the same example of disobedience.”

[Anyone can take Saturday off and celebrate the Sabbath so there is no effort required. The rest here requires the effort of having faith in our Lord Jesus to obtain His rest.]

‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭4‬:‭1‬-‭11‬ ‭NASB2020‬‬
[Annotations mine]

Man did not change the Sabbath, Jesus did.

Delvianna said:

Amen!! And those who are His will take correction and strive to go against sin. They do not feel comfortable in it, but want to be out of it because what matters most is the Lord and not their comfort level. How many times did the ones who God called get beaten, thrown in jail, ship wrecked or even killed? God calls us to uncomfortable places to speak his truth so that when judgement comes, they cannot say they weren't told or weren't warned. Too many Christians have gotten comfortable and only a few are willing to say "Here I am Lord! Send me!"

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Than you for sharing. God bless.

Fervent said:

This sounds like gobbledy gook.

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Do you comprehend how this framework is using a positive/negative dichotomy to establish sound reasoning when parsing semantics?

This is an objectively true dichotomy ---> Knowledge/ignorance. <-- Objectively Knowledge precedes ignorance
This is a subjectively true dichotomy ---> ignorance/Knowledge. <-- Subjectively ignorance precedes Knowledge

Fervent said:

Equilibrium? What does that mean in the context of the circular justification needed to engage with inductive reasoning?

Click to expand...

This is an objectively true dichotomy --> Knowledge/ignorance --> relative to Truth.

This --> Left/Right is an east/west dichotomy. It represents two opposing directions of SPIN each with their own left/right SUBJECTIVE view.

The left/right dichotomy is used to represent any two opposing yet equally valid subjective points of view in a three-dimensional framework. In this dichotomy the objectively true dichotomy Knowledge/ignorance exists as an abstract center between the left and right hand in both opposing subjective dimensions of reasoning.

In the east/west dichotomy a term that connotes a positive on the LEFT hand of one spin will connote a negative on the LEFT hand of the opposite spin. These two hands left/right represent a give/take or a take/give depending on the spin. Subsequently constant course correction is necessary to maintain an equilibrium.

Fervent said:

So you're saying all of those things are tautological?

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No. While I suppose the sentiment that the Creator existed before the creation could be considered a tautology, the dichotomy Creator/creation would not qualify as a true dichotomy. So, I'm saying that the term God is deemed as trustworthy and carries those sentiments as a course of theistic reasoning based on Faith.

Fervent said:

Observed by who?

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God and people.

Fervent said:

Sure, but our perception of that reality is skewed by our point of view. My earlier example of sight remains a good example, since our vision is corrected(inverted and details filled in) compared to the stimuli the eyes respond to.

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So what are you saying, you don't believe what you see?

Fervent said:

I don't expect you to find any issue, I keep bringing it up in reference to your dogmatic approach to knowledge. Philosophical skepticism has nothing to do with trust/distrust, since it is a means to bring us to the end of ourselves; which is often required before we can see God.

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I don't view my approach to knowledge as dogmatism since dogmatism implies based on opinion. Truth is not impotent. So like I've said over and over, my approach to knowledge is that facts are learned not imagined. You could accurately say my belief is that reality dictates what is factually true, not me.

Abraxos said:

Yeah, now you're getting it. Basically, Stephanos, in its Christocentric understanding, is a crown of the overcomer just as Christ overcame the world. This means that this crown cannot be given to or seized by an Antichrist, a deceiver, a trickster or what-have-you, who has not carried their cross.

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This is why I had the thought for a while that the first rider are the two witnesses. I do not believe the 2 witnesses are biblically historical literal people like Moses and Elijah because God has never recalled someone from the dead after completing their mission to just send them back into another mission. Instead, time and time again God calls those, then qualifies them. The 2 witnesses would then be overcomers who are sent at the start of the tribulation period to both judge the church and call the unsaved to God.

But then the argument is, there is only one rider. My only argument to that is that the rider is a concept because it was seen in a vision, for us to understand the meaning and shouldn't be interpreted as a 1:1 ratio. A lot of times with symbolism, 1 symbol could depict a bunch of people, like the harlot of babylon being the corrupted church. So the rider could depict both witnesses as a single unit of force, sent for the same mission.

SabbathBlessings said:

So your view of the Nicene Creed is that the Holy Spirit will not teach us and bring us back to His word, for those willing. Not sure why the Scriptures I posted would prompt such a response in the first place.

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The Holy Spirit will call us to repentance, but it is in the Church where we hear the Scriptures and learn the faith and we are saved in the church that we have been grafted onto, the Body of Christ, according to St. Paul in 1 Corinthians.

The role of the Holy Spirit and the Church are quite different. If someone commits themselves, due to misunderstanding or the preaching of a charismatic pastor, to a dangerous heresy, that heresy can color their reading of Scripture, and Scripture does not contain within itself defenses against all or even most heresies.

For example, Tertullian, who coined the word “Trinitas” which became “Trinity” who obviously knew a fair amount about the doctrine, came to believe that the Holy Spirit was not the Paraclete, for his rigorism (he believed sins committed after baptism would not be forgiven) led him to separate from the Roman church and to join the Montanist sect, which was led by Montanus, a man who claimed to be the Paraclete, and who was accompanied by two or three women who would engage in ecstatic “prophecy” in the manner one associates with certain oracles of ancient Greece.

NewLifeInChristJesus said:

Jesus' words are often taken to mean something other than what He meant.

It is good to listen to God rather than men.

It has nothing to do with hearing and believing. It has to do with people choosing to enter through the narrow gate instead of following the masses to destruction.

No, it was always through trusting that God would forgive our sins by way of Christ (Ga 3:17-18). And it is true that we who have believed in Christ have the Holy Spirit in our hearts, leading, guiding, directicting, correcting, and comforting us. But this does not speak to how we got here, but to our current condition.

The process is that 1) God communicates to everyone that they are sinners in need of a Savior, 2) some people learn from God and take heed of what they hear, 3) God sends these people to Jesus, and 4) Jesus saves everyone who comes to Him.

The reformed view prevents God from being able to speak to the lost and prevents the lost from being able to comprehend their situation. Romans 1 should be enough evidence that God communicates with the lost, they know His testimony is correct, but they choose to go in a direction that they know is worthy of death. These things do not support the idea that they are dead to the truth and cannot hear. It supports the idea that they can hear the truth and choose to oppose it.

This is a non sequitur. Expectations are not at issue here. What we believe about God is at issue here. And we have put our finger on one disagreement on what each of us believes about God. In my opinion, since this is at the heart of Reformed theology, and since it is its achilles heal, there is no reason to discuss any other of its doctrines.

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Expectations are clearly at issue here. You said “That is a terrible thing to ascribe to God” because it doesn’t meet your expectations of the person and nature of God.

From the beginning God chose for himself a people. Those people didn’t ask for God to choose them, they didn’t say I will trust you to take care of me, in fact, the covenant between God and Abraham was unilateral. God put Abraham to sleep and cut the covenant alone.

You only think there is an Achilles heel in [the Doctrines of Grace], because you want what you believe to be true, but it isn’t because there are no scriptures speaking to free will in the Bible. And if there were, we couldn’t freely choose because our will is a slave to sin until the event of our salvation. Over and over the Bible tells us that the most vile thing come out of our hearts, and nothing short of the intervention of God (like the flood, for one recorded instance) will change us.

For reference:
Genesis 6:5-8 (NASB95) 5 Then the LORD saw that the wickedness of man was great on the earth, and that every intent of the thoughts of his heart was only evil continually. 6 The LORD was sorry that He had made man on the earth, and He was grieved in His heart. 7 The LORD said, “I will blot out man whom I have created from the face of the land, from man to animals to creeping things and to birds of the sky; for I am sorry that I have made them.” 8 But Noah found favor in the eyes of the LORD.

And it was no different in Jesus’ or in the early church time.

Romans 3:10-18 (NASB95) 10 as it is written, “THERE IS NONE RIGHTEOUS, NOT EVEN ONE; 11 THERE IS NONE WHO UNDERSTANDS, THERE IS NONE WHO SEEKS FOR GOD; 12 ALL HAVE TURNED ASIDE, TOGETHER THEY HAVE BECOME USELESS; THERE IS NONE WHO DOES GOOD, THERE IS NOT EVEN ONE.” 13 “THEIR THROAT IS AN OPEN GRAVE, WITH THEIR TONGUES THEY KEEP DECEIVING,” “THE POISON OF ASPS IS UNDER THEIR LIPS”; 14 “WHOSE MOUTH IS FULL OF CURSING AND BITTERNESS”; 15 “THEIR FEET ARE SWIFT TO SHED BLOOD, 16 DESTRUCTION AND MISERY ARE IN THEIR PATHS, 17 AND THE PATH OF PEACE THEY HAVE NOT KNOWN.” 18 “THERE IS NO FEAR OF GOD BEFORE THEIR EYES.”
(emphasis not mine)

A lot of things you say sounds good, sure it would be great to have a god who is nothing but loving and compassionate, but the real God is loving and compassionate, but He is also just, and righteous, and vengeful, and Holy, and omnipotent, and omniscient, and omnipresent, and eternal, and sovereign, and immutable. And all those things contribute to how He deals with humans. He is the same yesterday, today, and forever, and HIS will will be done.

Romans 1 is speaking to believers.

I agree 100% with what Tom Homan said there. These narco cartels hate Americans and they must be stopped from killing more Americans.

MrMoe said:

Maybe he is a mentally ill racist. Mental illness and racism are not mutually exclusive. Maybe we’ll find out his true motives someday.

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I see no evidence that he’s a racist. Tell me why you think he is.

Douggg said:

Near the end of the 7 years, in Daniel 11:40-44, the beast-king headquartered in Jerusalem will be attacked from the south, then north, then east.

Why ? We can only speculate. imo, it will be because the beast-king (king of the West, i.e the EU with likely allies of Canada and the United States) will be directing all the middle east oil to the western alliance. Oil being the life blood of the nations, will give them no choice but to attack the beast-king to free up the oil.

It should be noted that the attack from the east will be by the armies of China (Revelation 16:12). In Revelation 9:13-19, there will be a third of mankind killed by a 200,000,000 size army. So I think that will be by the armies of China as they march westward through Pakistan, India. Afghanistan, Iran, Iraq, and other "stan" countries.

So there will be a big battle near the end of the 7 years, Daniel 11:40-44.

As the battle is taking place, like a thief in the night, the sixth seal event will happen and the world will see Jesus in heaven, sickle in hand.

In the face of the threat to their existence, the nations will stop battling with the beast king and his armies, and will unite under the beast-king's leadership (Revelation 16:12-16). And with their armies already in the middle east will gather at Armageddon to prepare for making war on Jesus and His army of heaven.

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This is a mess.

The battle taking place in Rev 9:13-21 (at the start of the 6th Trumpet) has nothing to do with the 6th Bowl war (Armageddon).

The reference to the 200 million army is a reference to the chariots of God in Psalm 68:17's 'tens of thousands, thousands' (2 tens times 10000 times 10000) (2 x 10,000 x 10,000= 200,000,000).


You say that the 'beast king' will be headquartered in Jerusalem, but it says that he invades the 'Beautiful Land' in verse 41. Why is he invading the Beautiful Land (which means the land of Israel) if he is already headquartered there? Answer: he's not headquartered there.

Verses 36-45 have a double meaning: both the Dan 7 Little Horn & the Dan 8 Little Horn.

In the first meaning the Dan 8 Little Horn (the Assyrian) is invading Israel, but the Dan 7 Little Horn (ruler of Tyre) saves/ plucks up Edom, Moab, Ammon. That is what is meant in Dan 7:8's plucking up 3 horns by the Dan 7 Little Horn.

The Psalm 83 coalition is comprised of 10 horns, among which are Edom, Moab, Ammon. (Also includes, Tyre and Assyria).

The Dan 7 Little Horn is the angel that is swearing an oath to heaven in Dan 12:7 - this is the same angel as the Rev 10 mighty angel.

Why does this verse mean?

The Assyrian will pitch his 'tents'/'tabernacle' when his people 'destroy the city and sanctuary' in Dan 9:26.

Tyre will rescue Edom, Ammon, Moab from the Assyrian so as to fulfill Isaiah 11:1-14. Tyre, the Dan 7 Little Horn will confirm the covenant of Dan 9:27 by 'swearing an oath to heaven'. For the first half of the covenant, this is the time of Dan 7:25 and the 1260 days of the 2 witnesses.

Just read Dan 11 and 12 straight through, the abomination idol of Dan 11:31 will be during Dan 9:26 during the start of the 6th Trumpet (Rev 9:13-21). When Tyre 'rescues' Israel, he will confirm the covenant in Rev 10:5 becoming the 'branch' of Isaiah 11:1 who takes over Edom, Moab, and Ammon (Isaiah 11:14)

He will be the 'Branch who will build the temple' (Zech 6:12-15) thus giving us the double meaning in Dan 11:45 'pitching royal tabernacle'.

But Tyre will be the 'wicked Branch' of Isa 14.

Carl Emerson said:

Our God judges, is jealous, hates sin, is terrible, destroys, gets angry, consumes like a fire, takes vengeance and is intolerant.
Presenting a soft view of God has lead to having a generation of believers that have little comprehension or experience of the “fear” of God.

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This is true, but do not forget - God is infinitely loving - God’s wrath is not a mood he gets into, for Scripture assures us of the principle of Divine Immutability - God, being eternal, does not change and is not mercurial. This is said even of Jesus Christ, our Lord God and Savior, who is like His Father and the Holy Spirit in all respects except relationally and in terms of his having become incarnate as a man, where we are assured that He is the same yesterday, today and tomorrow.

What this means, according to the early church Fathers, but really only the Eastern churches (Eastern Orthodox, Oriental Orthodox and the Assyrian Church of the East and the Ancient Church of the East) teach this in a consistent way, is that the wrath of God is the experience of the consuming fire of God’s love by someone who is opposed to God and hates God and refuses His uncreated grace. That is why the Orthodox Church focuses on preaching the Gospel in a way that promotes repentance and alignment with God, so that we are not burned by the fire of God’s love but rather like the Burning Bush are undamaged by proximity to His presence.

Indeed the Fathers insist that since He is infinitely merciful, the Outer Darkness is a final mercy for those who refuse Him - since being in the luminous presence of God in the New Jerusalem would be an unbearable torment to these people. St. John Chrysostom pointed out that the worst possible punishment would be the realization of what one had excluded oneself from (the bliss of the life of the world to come) through sin.

That is why the church must stress the need for people to repent in this life, lest they are, for their own good, eternally excluded from the life of the world to come and instead wallow in suffering in undying darkness, eaten by the undying worms of the memory of their own sin, consumed by malice and regret and resentment and hatred for God. Because the reality of Hell is far more terrible than the caricature of demons with pitchforks (indeed so too is the reality of demons, who are around us constantly; pneumatic beings, ruled by the Prince of Power of the Air, actively plotting new ways of bringing about our downfall every second of the day.

God have mercy, in the name of Thine only begotten Son Jesus Christ, send down Thy Holy Spirit upon us, and under his direction, conduct all of Thy heavenly host in defense of us against the Evil One, and forgive us our own sins, which are equally repulsive to Thee, but grant us instead through Thy infinite grace a spirit of repentance, love, chastity, obedience, mercy, reverence and charity.

MrMoe said:

Looks like people are focusing on the race AND the crime to me.

I haven’t seen anyone make the claim that every black on white crime is racially motivated here.

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Right, I didn’t say that. I said there’s no evidence this was racially motivated other than the races involved. You’re the one saying it was driven by race.

Why, what evidence is there?

MrMoe said:

I asked myself a similar question during the Daniel Penny and Derek Chauvin incidents. What’s the evidence this one was racially motivated other than he’s white and he’s black?

I’m sure you had the same issue with those incidents too.

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My issue with Chauvin was that he choked a man to death while he was already restrained and lying on the ground, not a threat to anyone. My issue with Penny was never the racial aspect either but the vigilantism. He took it upon himself to be judge, jury and executioner.

By the sound of it, it’s you that’s been focused solely on race in each of these cases.

Clare73 said:

I'm sure you'll understand if I take God at his word in Ro 8:16, 23, 2 Co 1:22, 5:5, Eph 1:13, 14, rather than overriding it with your word.

Nor did you answer my question regarding your having the witness stated by Paul in Ro 8:16, 2 Co 1:22, 5:5.

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It's God's word, not mine that gives balance to the matter, leaving no doubt that a person can walk away from their faith, from their first love, from God. And yes, I've been given witness by the Spirit that I'm His.

With the idea that that state is uncompromisable, is added into the equation by focusing only on passages that affirm it, the carrot, and rejecting the others, the sticks.