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  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.

Hell doesn't exist and there is no eternal suffering, instead bad peolle just cease to exist

Only one has eternal life, that's the point. The righteous into eternal "life" The first in that equation do not get life. Eternal destruction is eternal punishment. There's no coming back from that. They will perish. And Malachi 4 describes exactly what will happen to them.
Both eternal punishment and eternal life are fully constrasted in this verse. Either both are eternal or none are. The Greek proves that both are. The first in the equation get eternal punishment. One can’t get eternal punishment if one is dead.

Malachi 4 speaks nothing about death although the mention of chaff and ashes might seem to.
Hebrews 6:1 and 2 is just stating that we don't have to lay the foundations again. Once we know those we can move on past the milk. If you are talking eternal judgement. The second death is eternal.
I mentioned Heb. 6 because it teaches that the judgement is eternal. The second death is indeed eternal.
So you don't believe in death at all? Is that what you're stating? Even though Christ states fear the one that can destroy both body and soul in hell. And when we see it called the second death then we know it coincides with Christ's earlier teaching.
Look, those in the lake of fire remain in the lake of fire. They will never enter the gates of the New Jerusalem or be given access to the tree of life. Only those that washed their robes are invited.

“Blessed are those who wash their robes, so that they will have the right to the tree of life, and may enter the city by the gates. Outside are the dogs, the sorcerers, the sexually immoral persons, the murderers, the idolaters, and everyone who loves and practices lying.”
‭‭Revelation‬ ‭22‬:‭14‬-‭15‬ ‭NASB2020‬‬
It's easier when we take the bible as a whole on this subject.
Exactly.
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Trump sends troops to the 'warzone' of Portland...

We become what we allow. The protestors who are blocking roads, blocking ICE facilities, attacking agents are the lowest common denominator and as long as we as a society allow this then we become this.

I've been actively watching as many videos as I can and I have to say I believe ICE is doing this wrong. Part of the reason is all they do is drive the protestors back so they can get in and out. My belief is that this doea not create law and order because they just come back. What should be done is that they should come in with trucks and then start arresting everyone they can who refuses to move. Put em in the trucks and haul them away to the nearest federal security facility and book them in. Then do that every single time. Have body cameras going have other employees filming and documenting when they were told to leave and their refusal to do so. Tell them twice we and when they refuse you arrest them.

This is a way for the guard to be used without actually having to police anyone. They are the logistics and transportation mechanism for arrests.

I'm sure people will come back after being bailed out, but they could be arrested again and again for all I care. This in NOT protesting, this is obstructionist and Disorderly and if they push an agent like I saw then its assault.

But bottom line the Agents MUST do a better job of doing their job to document and record their interactions and reasoning for arrests. What they are doing now, just isn't working.
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PAUL EXPLAINS WHY ISRAEL WAS SET ASIDE , PERIOD. !!

There might lie some truth in your above post, but "that" is not the reason we're not under the law. The law was never given to us gentiles but solely to Israel and Israel alone Exo 24. Being under Grace is not something new either, Abraham was under Grace as wel, see Rom. 4.

Aristarkos
And glad to see you. again !!

Read Gal 6:15 and give your reply. as to what it means. BUT HERE is my answer. !!

Gal 6:15 says :

# 1. For in. Christ Jesus.

# 2 NEITHER

# 3. CIRCUCISION is of any FORCE , meaning. JUDAISM

# 4. NOR UNCIRCUMCISION. , meaning GENTILES

#. BUT. a NEW CREATION. ?? meaning THE BODY OF CHRIST.


A good verse in Gal. 6:16. ??

what say you ?

dan p
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Hell doesn't exist and there is no eternal suffering, instead bad peolle just cease to exist

hen He will answer them, ‘Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did not do it for one of the least of these, you did not do it for Me, either.’ These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.””
Only one has eternal life, that's the point. The righteous into eternal "life" The first in that equation do not get life. Eternal destruction is eternal punishment. There's no coming back from that. They will perish. And Malachi 4 describes exactly what will happen to them.

Hebrews 6:1 and 2 is just stating that we don't have to lay the foundations again. Once we know those we can move on past the milk. If you are talking eternal judgement. The second death is eternal and that is judgement.

So you don't believe in death at all? Is that what you're stating? Even though Christ states fear the one that can destroy both body and soul in hell. And when we see it called the second death then we know it coincides with Christ's earlier teaching.

It's easier when we take the bible as a whole on this subject.
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A Christian response to "No Kings."

It seems to me the more pressing issue should be the syncretism that is happening with Republicanism being equated with Christianity. It seems to me that such political posturing shows far too much comfort with secular power for a faith that is at least partially tasked with speaking truth to power. The no kings rally is a purely political protest, and so doesn't really demand a specific Christian response other than possibly engaging with the protesters regarding the gospel message that while injustice and oppression may be the order of the day, God is aware and will avenge the poor.
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U.S. Releases Video of Attack on Semi-Submersible and Sends Survivors Home

What are their names? And what has that got to do with what I asked?

Actual fentanyl or the ingredients? What other drugs.

Perhaps Americans should stop taking illegal drugs. It's not as if the cartels were making them - they are seeking them out and paying good money.
Just tell people to stop taking drugs? You mean hold them accountable for their actions?
Can we apply this across the board?
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Rest in The Lord

“Rest in the Lord and wait patiently for Him;
Do not fret because of him who prospers in his way,
Because of the man who carries out wicked schemes.
Cease from anger and forsake wrath;
Do not fret; it leads only to evildoing.
For evildoers will be cut off,
But those who wait for the Lord, they will inherit the land.
Yet a little while and the wicked man will be no more;
And you will look carefully for his place and he will not be there.” (Psalm 37:7-10 NASB1995)

In the day and time in which we live, and I live in the USA, wicked people who are plotting and carrying out wicked schemes seem to be massive in numbers. And they are in our governments, in our news media, in our educational systems, in the institutional market-driven “churches,” in the world of medicine, in pastorates, in businesses, in social media, in the music industry (including in some “Christian” music), in the entertainment industry, in advertising and marketing, and in lots of other places, too.

Sadly these wicked people and their wicked schemes have worked their way into many of the presentations of the gospel of Christ and of our salvation. And what they have done is to divide the gospel message, to cut it in half, basically, and to discard the half they don’t like while they retain the half that they do like. But a deliberate half-truth is a lie. Scriptures being removed from their biblical context are being made to say what they do not say if taught in the correct biblical context. And this is mostly deliberate.

And those who have created and carried out these divisions of truth are predatory people who inject venom (poison, lies, deceptions) into their prey for the full purpose to turn them away from the truth to follow after the lies. So, they pull Scriptures out of their correct biblical context, and they twist them to say what they do not teach, if taught in context, and sometimes they will use a succession of Scriptures, out of context, to teach a false gospel. And many naïve people are believing and are spreading the lies.

What many of these liars are teaching is that all we have to do is to make a verbal confession of faith in Jesus Christ, of him as Lord, and of faith in his bodily resurrection, and now we are saved from all sins, and heaven is now guaranteed us as our final resting place. But they do this through teaching the Scriptures out of context and by ignoring the half that they don’t want to accept. And many people are buying into the lies (half-truths) because then they can continue in their sinful practices without feeling guilty.

But Jesus Christ taught that to come to him we must deny self, take up our cross daily (die daily to sin), and follow (obey) him. For if we hold on to living in sin and for self, we will lose our lives for eternity. But if we deny self, die daily to sin, by the Spirit, and we walk in obedience to our Lord and to his commands, in his power, then we have eternal life with God. For not everyone who calls him “Lord” will enter the kingdom of heaven, but the one DOING (obeying) the will of God (see Luke 9:23-26; Matthew 7:21-23).

For by God-gifted faith in Jesus Christ, which is not of our own doing, we are crucified with Christ in death to sin and raised with Christ to walk in newness of life in him, no longer to live as slaves to sin but as slaves to righteousness in walks of obedience to God’s commands. We are no longer to permit sin to reign in our mortal bodies to make us obey its desires. For if sin is what we obey, it results in death. But if obedience to God is what we obey, it results in sanctification, and its end is eternal life with God (see Romans 6:1-23).

And we learn in 1 John 1-3 that if we claim that we have fellowship with God, but yet we walk in darkness (sin), we are liars. If we claim that we know God, but we do not obey his commandments, in practice, we are liars. For it is not the one who claims he is “in Christ” who is “in Christ,” but it is the one who has denied self, died with Christ to sin, and who is now walking in obedience to our Lord and to his commands, in practice, and no longer in sin. We have the hope and the promise of eternal life with God in heaven.

[Matthew 7:13-14,21-23; Luke 9:23-26; John 10:27-30; Acts 26:18; Romans 1:18-32; Romans 2:5-10; Romans 3:23; Romans 6:1-23; Romans 8:1-14; 1 Corinthians 10:1-22; Galatians 5:16-24; Ephesians 2:8-10; Ephesians 4:17-32; Ephesians 5:3-6; Titus 2:11-14; Hebrews 3:1-19; Hebrews 4:1-13; Hebrews 10:19-39; Hebrews 12:1-2; 1 Peter 2:24; 1 John 1:1-10; 1 John 2:3-6; 1 John 3:4-10; Revelation 2:1-29; Revelation 3:1-22]

But these biblical truths are largely being ignored in favor of the half-truth “gospels” which are spreading so rapidly in our time. And even some people who claim to have rejected the lies and to have embraced the truth of the gospel are not now showing evidence of having had heart transformations and of having died with Christ to sin, and of now walking in obedience to his commands. They may put on a show of righteousness, but they are still living wicked and evil lives in addiction to sin; not in obedience to God.

But, although we should be speaking the truth of the gospel of Christ to the people, and we should be refuting the lies of the enemy, we should not fear what these evil people are doing or what they might do to us. We should be watchful and prayerful so that we do not get caught in their webs of deceit. But we have no power within ourselves to stop the evil from taking place. And so we wait on God, for him to act, and we trust the Lord with our lives, and we put our circumstances in his hands, and we trust in his sovereignty.

As the Deer

By Martin J. Nystrom
Based off Psalm 42:1


As the deer panteth for the water
So my soul longeth after You
You alone are my heart's desire
And I long to worship You

You alone are my strength, my shield
To You alone may my spirit yield
You alone are my heart's desire
And I long to worship You

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Rest in The Lord
An Original Work / October 19, 2025
Christ’s Free Servant, Sue J Love

A Christian response to "No Kings."

As a Christian standing on the sidelines I find it interesting and amusing.

The ongoing fixation on one man. First he was a fascist and Nazi and everything else under the sun. Now he's a King lol. What next Willy Wonka. Actually thats probably not a bad description lol.

In some ways it is the people who are fixated that are making him a King. They keep saying it until they believe it. They dedicate time and effort to make it an issue in their life that it controls their thinking.

If they spent as much time making Christ King and proclaiming His truth in the streets we would be better off.
Maybe there should be a One King rally, one king-Jesus
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Morality without Absolute Morality

I'm well aware of the dictum that says the more we know the more that we realise that we don't know. But what we have learned in the first place should still be available. It's not like you're Homer and have to forget a bunch of stuff to learn something new. So what good is all that book learnin' if it means that you don't generate some opinions on matters such as objective morality?
Seems to me that you don't understand that dictum, because it's function certainly does call into question "past" knowledge...because what leads to the realization is just how tenuous even our most trustworthy sources of information are. So everything we think to be true at present is questionable whether we can call it knowledge, with ordinary skeptical challenges like Munchaussen's trilemma only being compounded by more recent skeptical insights like the existence of Gettier problems. The more we learn and challenge what we know, the more we realize that there isn't a single unimpeachable source to draw any knowledge from. Of course, I am not talking about ordinary truths like things that are immediately present to our perceptions but any attempt to make sense of such things. This goes doubly for moral questions, but its a challenge even for less judgment-laden issues.

Book learning, if we're reading books that challenge our perspective rather than simply shoring up our personal convictions, drives home the dependence we have on sources that can never be vetted to the point where we are fully informed without some questionable elements being adopted unknowingly. Especially when we come to appreciate just how deep deception and bias runs in the human psyche.
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Can man, without the light of faith, by his reason alone, know that God exists?

Your earlier post:

This is goading and attacking the poster. Hogwash, gibberish and cursing does not lead to a civil discussion. Just stating that you thought that it was subjective reasoning with an explanation would have sufficed.
I have never on a Christian message board demeaned or intentionally goaded another member because that is not who I am! I do not know you and I said nothing about you. My comments were entirely limited to what you posted.
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A Christian response to "No Kings."

Do you have any proof that the liberals speaking out don’t want a president, they want a king?

The whole point of propaganda is to turn positives into negatives. negatives into positives. or make them look the same so that no one can tell the difference.
Oh Geesh yes. We have been seeing that for years. What it has been over ten years that trump came on the scene. This country has seen all the propaganda and corruption enough from the marxists..
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Getting Back in Shape

The hard part for me is the mental transition. All the way into my 40s I didn't really have to try to 'be in shape'. I was active and my friends were active, and I enjoyed it. But I turned 60 this year, which means my peer group is also 60. My friends aren't active and in shape, so I have to go it alone ... or do that awkward thing of hanging out with people half my age.
I'll be 62 in December. I was on track and had lost 70 pounds before the nerve pain took over a year ago
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Hell doesn't exist and there is no eternal suffering, instead bad peolle just cease to exist

First I need to know what verses you are quoting. Your first post did not include any only commentary. The main verse that I would quote would be Matt. 25:46 which contrasts eternal punishment with eternal life so this is not a verse that you can ignore.
I will get those scriptures together soon, thank you for your kind words. :)
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Is 'once saved always saved' a biblical teaching?

-
Nicodemus said to Him, “How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother’s womb and be born?”
-----------------
That which is born of the flesh is flesh, and that which is born of the Spirit is spirit.
And. the earth is round and read ISA 40:22 and. PSALM 147:4. and when. rockets go up. and take pictures the earth is ROUND !!

AND my wife has seen our children born , but never twice. ??

So how is anyone born on. the SPIRIT with a verse ??

And only. God can. in DO IN VERSE 36:26 and 27. DO. THAT !!

That was Israel and NOT GENTILES and read Gal 6:15. and you need help , will be glad to. explain. Gal 6:15. ??

dan p
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A Christian response to "No Kings."

As a Christian standing on the sidelines I find it interesting and amusing.

The ongoing fixation on one man. First he was a fascist and Nazi and everything else under the sun. Now he's a King lol. What next Willy Wonka. Actually thats probably not a bad description lol.

In some ways it is the people who are fixated that are making him a King. They keep saying it until they believe it. They dedicate time and effort to make it an issue in their life that it controls their thinking.

If they spent as much time making Christ King and proclaiming His truth in the streets we would be better off.
I doubt these were from Idaho. They pay people and bus them in.
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Hell doesn't exist and there is no eternal suffering, instead bad peolle just cease to exist

Yes, their part will be in the lake of fire but it doesn't state they live there forever. It's always been life or death. You can't redefine what "death" means. Christ calls it the "second death" for a reason. He taught it very simply in Matthew 28:10 destroy in the Greek is destroy fully.

God is so long suffering because he doesn't want anyone to "perish". It's always been life or death. Nothing in between.

The second death occurs at Judgement Day. After that the former things are passed away and all things become new. That statement would be impossible if the Lake of Fire were to still be in play. It won't be.

I hated that I was indoctrinated with this belief but when we take the bible as a whole we see the very nature of God all throughout, his mercy, his love his wish that all would come to repentance so they won't perish. But if he takes no pleasure in that, why would we believe he would take pleasure in torturing someone for an eternity. It has to make sense with how we come to know God through the scriptures and that make no sense.

You quoted John 3:16 and it states shall not "perish" but have everlasting life. You have inserted everlasting life but in another place, thus you are adding something that's not there.
How do you factor in the following verse?

“Then He will answer them, ‘Truly I say to you, to the extent that you did not do it for one of the least of these, you did not do it for Me, either.’ These will go away into eternal punishment, but the righteous into eternal life.””
‭‭Matthew‬ ‭25‬:‭45‬-‭46‬ ‭NASB2020‬‬

How about this one?

“Therefore leaving the elementary teaching about the Christ, let us press on to maturity, not laying again a foundation of repentance from dead works and of faith toward God, of instruction about washings and laying on of hands, and about the resurrection of the dead and eternal judgment.”
‭‭Hebrews‬ ‭6‬:‭1‬-‭2‬ ‭NASB2020‬‬
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Hell doesn't exist and there is no eternal suffering, instead bad peolle just cease to exist

“But for the cowardly, and unbelieving, and abominable, and murderers, and sexually immoral persons, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, their part will be in the lake that burns with fire and brimstone, which is the second death.””
Yes, their part will be in the lake of fire but it doesn't state they live there forever. It's always been life or death. You can't redefine what "death" means. Christ calls it the "second death" for a reason. He taught it very simply in Matthew 28:10. Destroy in the Greek is destroy" fully"

God is so long suffering because he doesn't want anyone to "perish". It's that simple.

The second death occurs at Judgement Day. After that the former things are passed away and all things become new. That statement would be impossible if the Lake of Fire were to still be in play. It won't be.

I hated that I was indoctrinated with this belief but when we take the bible as a whole we see the very nature of God all throughout- his mercy, his love, his wish that all would come to repentance so they won't perish. But if he takes no pleasure in that, why would we believe he would take pleasure in torturing someone for an eternity? It has to make sense with how we've come to know God through the scriptures and that make no sense.

You quoted John 3:16 and it states shall not "perish" but have everlasting life. You have inserted everlasting life but in another place, thus you are adding something that's not there.
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The Nobel Peace Prize went to Venezuela’s Maria Corina Machado - why not Trump? He's solved 8 wars!

And just BTW, the US press totally ignores the public executions of Gazans by Hamas. For the US press, only Israeli attacks count.
Fox, CNN, New York Post, CBS, ABC, NBC...is your internet down?
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Hell doesn't exist and there is no eternal suffering, instead bad peolle just cease to exist

Please cite the scriptures I'm ignoring. Just because I find everlasting fire and everlasting torment not to be taken literally, does that mean I am ignoring them? I have re-examining their meaning within biblical and historical contexts.
First I need to know what verses you are quoting. Your first post did not include any only commentary. The main verse that I would quote would be Matt. 25:46 which contrasts eternal punishment with eternal life so this is not a verse that you can ignore.
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Hell doesn't exist and there is no eternal suffering, instead bad peolle just cease to exist

You can’t just choose the ones you like and ignore the others
Please cite the scriptures I'm ignoring. Just because I find everlasting fire and everlasting torment not to be taken literally, does that mean I am ignoring them? I have re-examining their meaning within biblical and historical contexts.
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Morality without Absolute Morality

The rest of what I might be tempted to say about Absolute Morality or about Normative Moral Relativism would be hashed out from the following sources, and others that I'd add in due time:
As I said, all that book learnin' yet you can't even put forward a position on the differences that you see between objective and relative morality. Except to say 'Go read a book'.

What a complete waste of time (both yours and, more importantly, mine).
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