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The Reality of Free Will

C
concretecamper said:
100 percent

You speak about weakness,
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Precisely. . .free will is power to make moral choices.
concretecamper said:
not free will
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Contraire. . .completely free will is the power to make all moral choices.

If he can't make 'em all, his free will is limited. . .can he choose to be sinless? . . . he cannot. . .his free will is limited.
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Hell doesn't exist and there is no eternal suffering, instead bad peolle just cease to exist

Hentenza
walter45 said:
1. Because my logic includes every scripture on a Bible topic, not just a few scriptures that obviously do not agree with the other scriptures throughout the Bible.

2. Everlasting life is a consistent teaching in the Bible, and there are no scriptures that explain it is only figurative or symbolic.

When some scriptures disagree with other scriptures, would that be the correct understanding? Especially when we discover the Eternal fire is not eternal.
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Or maybe is just your interpretation that puts the scriptures in tension. You can’t just choose the ones you like and ignore the others.
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What are you listening to right now? (24)

DragonFox91
I am behind listening to all the music posted!

Here is the Spanish version of the famous Way-Maker song.

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Last week we sang this song like they sing it here:
Login to view embedded media This song in general gets shared a lot here, it's such a good song, I like it, it's good for my soul
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Slipped disc

FutureAndAHope
I believe in God's healing power.

1Co 12:28 And God has appointed these in the church: first apostles, second prophets, third teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, administrations, varieties of tongues.

If you like, I will add you to daily prayer.

But if God chooses not to heal, and there is a treatment that would help, I pray for that also.
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The Reality of Free Will

Hentenza
concretecamper said:
I choose to be charitable to you by not insulting you ignorance.
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Good for you but then you have never been very charitable with those that don’t agree with you or your church and you call those ignorant so you are not doing a good job being charitable. I guess you don’t have free will being charitable.
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Hell doesn't exist and there is no eternal suffering, instead bad peolle just cease to exist

walter45
Hentenza said:
By your logic then why should we take salvation as eternal life?
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1. Because my logic includes every scripture on a Bible topic, not just a few scriptures that obviously do not agree with the other scriptures throughout the Bible.

2. Everlasting life is a consistent teaching in the Bible, and there are no scriptures that explain it is only figurative or symbolic.

When some scriptures disagree with other scriptures, would that be the correct understanding? Especially when we discover the Eternal fire is not eternal.
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A Christian response to "No Kings."

C
childeye 2 said:
This is the problem so long as you believe it to be true --> "That they don't is the proof of the pudding."
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Oh, indeed! . . . talk is cheap.

if one doesn't put his money where his mouth is--prove the allegations of illegality in court--he is just sounding brass and tinkling cymbal.
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The Reality of Free Will

concretecamper
Clare73 said:
Are you sure about that?.
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100 percent
Clare73 said:
If you are unable to make any particular moral choice, you will is not completely free, it is limited.

The will of fallen man is unable to make the moral choice to be sinless, therefore, fallen man's will is not completely free, it is limited.
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You speak about weakness, not free will

Another example of not understanding free will.
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When does blindness occur?

FutureAndAHope
A New Dawn said:
Both are true. Adam’s rebellion against God is what led to the fall, which in turn resulted in the default of blindness to all men. We all live in rebellion and blindness. We don’t become blind, though, we are born blind.
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From the initial post:

Note: blindness in this post is not referring to Spiritual Ignorance, but rather a deep blindness that prevents salvation from occurring. We are all born with Spiritual Ignorance, blindness in this post refers to that which prevents salvation.​

When Jesus comes sight comes, He shows us who God is.

John 9:41 Jesus said to them, "If you were blind, you would have no sin; but now you say, 'We see.' Therefore your sin remains.​
​
Joh 15:22 If I had not come and spoken to them, they would have no sin, but now they have no excuse for their sin.​

Man is not blind to God; God gives us that sight, man is just overpowered by sin:

Rom 1:18-19 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who suppress the truth in unrighteousness, because what may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them.​

When we accept Christ He gives us power over that sin, by both forgiving it (if we sin), and strengthening us by the Holy Spirit (to not sin).
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The Reality of Free Will

C
concretecamper said:
Free will is ability to make A moral choice, not the ability/power to make ALL moral choices.

Like I said, you don't understand free will
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Are you sure about that?. . .Keeping in mind that "free will" is not a Biblial notion, but a human notion.

The Biblical notion is that all men are slaves to sin (Jn 8:34). . .slaves are not free.

If you are unable to make any particular moral choice, you will is not completely free, it is limited.

The will of fallen man is unable to make the moral choice to be sinless, therefore, fallen man's will is not completely free, it is limited.

Or as Jesus puts it, he is a slave to sin (Jn 8:34). . .slaves are not free.
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Is 'once saved always saved' a biblical teaching?

D
Spiritual Jew said:
If all are born lost then why did Jesus say that none that were given Him (referring to the twelve disciples) were lost except one, the son of perdition? You are obviously taking John 17:12 out of context. Based on what you said here, Jesus should have said all of them were lost, not one, but He clearly wasn't talking in the context that you're talking about here.

While we are all born with a sinful nature that will eventually manifest itself when we begin to sin, we do not sin right from birth. If we were objects of His wrath even from birth, that would be complete nonsense. What has a baby done to deserve God's wrath? Absolutely nothing. You are defying all logic with your belief. If God's wrath is on us even from birth, then what do you make of this...

Matthew 19:13 Then little children were brought to Him that He might put His hands on them and pray, but the disciples rebuked them. 14 But Jesus said, “Let the little children come to Me, and do not forbid them; for of such is the kingdom of heaven.”

What do you think, that Jesus was saying that the kingdom of heaven was made up of such as those little children of wrath? Of course He was not saying that, but the way you falsely interpret Ephesians 2:3 would lead to that conclusion.
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AND one GOOD REASON is because. John 17:12 and Matt 19:13 Are and NOT SPEAKING. to the Body of Christ. !!

dan p
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Tree of Church History: How are branches changing currently within Ancient Christian spaces or Traditional ones?

C
Gxg (G²) said:
Good Day,

I hope all here are doing well. I has been a long time since really being present here in the forums - and a lot of things (traumatic, to be honest) that have happened which caused me to need a substantial break. If I am honest, after seeing a tendency in some spaces I left literally embrace open American civil religion / Eurocentrism and xenophobia, it was a lot to process. Awhile ago, I was saddened at how other Evangelicals (Converts, more so in the tradition of Fundamentalists) who came into one parish was investing in started to then try and explain that slavery itself was not really a "bad thing" for African Americans in the U.S.
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Slavery, in itself, is ordained by God (Lev 25:39-46) and while,
like poverty (1 Sa 2:7, Mk 14:7), sickness (Dt 32:39) and disability (Ex 4:11, Jn 9:2-3) also ordained by God,
it is not immoral, it can be undesirable.
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The Receptive Pulpit of Tongues

rocknanchor
Richard T said:
Could you elaborate a bit more? I am confused as to who is in rebellion to those boundaries. Sorry too for broadening the topic.
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Catholic Charities, both Lutheran wings, Presbyterians and government official alike to name a few bearing His name. These do not regard the border laws established in the US and safe to say, dismiss the millions who do enter and gain citizenship legally. They actively commit that which constitutes treasonous behavior. All in the name of welcoming in the ''stranger''. How does it go, , ''commit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake''.
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Hell doesn't exist and there is no eternal suffering, instead bad peolle just cease to exist

Hentenza
walter45 said:
Some scriptures say words about eternal fire and torment, other scriptures say the Wicked will simply vanish, you will look for them and they will be nowhere to be found.

The fire that destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah to ashes, is no longer burning, so that means the words "Everlasting Fire" is not to be taken literally, so why are we taking the words "eternal torment" literally? Especially when the other scriptures clearly say: "they will vanish"
"be cut off" "be burned up" "will not receive their inheritance" "will not get life" "will be destroyed"
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By your logic then why should we take salvation as eternal life?
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Pay Back Evil With Good

Christsfreeservant
jonojim1337 said:
Jesus did go to his Father’s house, and whipped them out. But he was the LORD, and had all the authority to do so. I try to keep my temper towards injustice. It’s good to remember that we can receive the same measure of grace.
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Thank you. Yes, vengeance is God's, not ours to pay.
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