BelieveItOarKnot said:

Obviously you're creeping up on the obvious

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Had Jesus over for a meal lately; have you?

BelieveItOarKnot said:

Preferred sight is blood and guts for the devil and his messengers, whatever that means in the Spiritual sense

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Jesus tells us, in Revelation 20, - the fate of all the ungodly spirits and peoples.
Why do you make it into a Hollywood spectacle?

rjs330 said:

For less than a month.

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Aah, yes. So let's let you starve right away by choice. Aah, I can smell the Christian compassion in the air.

Bro.T said:

A man asked Jesus this very question, "...What good thing shall I do that I may have eternal life?", and Jesus replied, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments. (Matthew 19:16-19).

Faith and works go together and you can't have one without the other. "Here is the patience of the saints; here are they that keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus" (Revelation 14:12).

The bible says, we must not only be a hearer of the word, but a doer of the word also (James 1:21-22). We must do the same to receive eternal life. "FAITH WITHOUT WORKS IS DEAD” (James 2:20).

work out your own salvation with fear and trembling" (Philippians 2:12).

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You seem to think any order at all is good order, but it is chaos.


This time, do not ignore what is shown to you, to all, because if you do I will return them to you.

Your two quotes of Matthew 19 and James 2, are included right here, and I am showing us all the meaning of them when placed TOGETHER.

Also first, I am answering again what you have turned away from, and you WILL NOT TURN AWAY FROM THE TESTIMONY, nor will anyone on this Christian forum.



To get at last a little foundation and structure, some stability, we remember what Jesus told us, WHY HE CAME TO THE EARTH, to set thee household against one another.

He says the purpose of this CLEARLY, it is regarding being WORTHY of Him, which is not loving father or mother more than Him, or son r daughter more than Him. ( which is the purpose He made, division in the household so some believe and others may not.)

After this, and it is AFTER, whoever then DOES NOT TAAKE THEIR CROSS, ( the ones who do not believe in those households do no take their cross) are NOT WORTHY OF HIM.

Jesus tells the SAME AGAIN, if they have lost their life, ( ONLY BY THE DIVISION THAT CHRIST CAME TO THE EARTH TO SET.) FOR HIS SAKE, they shall FIND IT. Likewise those who are not divided, not loving Christ more, and the divided ones less, NOT WORTHY OF HIM, have not taken their cross, NOT WORTHY OF HIM, they have found their life, they shall lose it. (NOT WORTHY OF HIM/ARE KNOWN TO HAVE DONE NONE OF WHAT IS FOR HIS SAKE.)

Next is the all important part, which you turned away from bro t.

Jesus began to SHOW HIS DISCIPLES, how He MUST GO TO JERUSALEM AND BE KILLED, AND BE RAISED AGAIN THE THIRD DAY.

Peter savoured the things of men, like this so called conversation on this thread, and tries to tell the Lord this shall not be unto Him.

But Christ turned and told Peter, GET BEHIND ME SATAN, you are an OFFENCE UNTO ME, for you SAVOUR THE THINGS THAAT BE OF MEN, NOT THE THINGS THAT BE OF GOD. (I had given bro t scripture about how to do the works of God BY BEIEF IN JESUS CHRIST, it is as the scripture verifies, by PERCEIVING THE LOVE OF GOD THAT HE LAYED HIS LIFE DOWN FOR US, so we should LAY OUR LIVES DOWN FOR THE BROTHERS.

Jesus then tells His DISCIPLES, if any man WILL COME AFTER HIM, let him DENY HIMSELF, and TAKE UP HIS CROSS, and FOLLOW HIM.

Jesus repeats again what He had told about HIs mission for the whole world, in Matthew 10:34-39, WHOSOEVER WILL SAVE HIS LIFE SHALL LOSE IT, and WHOSOEVER WILL LOSE HIS LIFE FOR CHRISTS'S SAKE, SHALL FIND IT.

These are the WORKS JESUS REWARDS US FOR, as Revelation 14:12 shows the FAITH OF JESUS, not as bro t or anyone else tries to IMPLY, but strictly as the Lord Jesus Christ HIMSELF TESTIFIED in THE GOSPEL. ( NO MAN HAS ANY PRIVATE INTERPRETATION or they preach ANOTHER JESUS/MANY FALSE PROPHETS/TEACHERS rise to DECEIVE MANY.)



Matthew 10:35 For I am come to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.
36 And a man's foes shall be they of his own household.
37 He that loveth father or mother more than me is not worthy of me: and he that loveth son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me.
38 And he that taketh not his cross, and followeth after me, is not worthy of me.
39 He that findeth his life shall lose it: and he that loseth his life for my sake shall find it.

Matthew 16:21 From that time forth began Jesus to shew unto his disciples, how that he must go unto Jerusalem, and suffer many things of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be killed, and be raised again the third day.
22 Then Peter took him, and began to rebuke him, saying, Be it far from thee, Lord: this shall not be unto thee.
23 But he turned, and said unto Peter, Get thee behind me, Satan: thou art an offence unto me: for thou savourest not the things that be of God, but those that be of men.
24 Then said Jesus unto his disciples, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross, and follow me.
25 For whosoever will save his life shall lose it: and whosoever will lose his life for my sake shall find it.
26 For what is a man profited, if he shall gain the whole world, and lose his own soul? or what shall a man give in exchange for his soul?
27 For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels; and then he shall reward every man according to his works.




I told bro t, if he did not understand, he had to return an answer that exceeded what I had shown.

Even his own quotes wont be accepted by him, I know because his answer did not exceed, yet he returned one and repeated what he had already given, as if it had weight to it.

Jesus OF COURSE REPEATS, what was ALREADY TOLD BY HIM, in BOTH Matthew 10, and Matthew 16. But bro t, or others, don't seem to recognise this ?

Jesus firstly is REVEALING that the RICH MAN, is made to be a SORROWFUL testimony, of one that wont be having any treasure in heaven, and wont COME AND FOLLOW CHRIST.

I included Mark 10:21, as this reveals both things Jesus has said in the PURPOSE why He came to the earth, for some to TAKE UP THE CROSS, and FOLLOW HIM. (the division in the households was made in all the earth BY HIS SWORD/OF HIS MOUTH/THE WORD..)

So the rich man went away, and could not have TREASURE IN HEAVEN.

But LOOK bro t, or anyone else, how CONVENIENT the other quote bro t had given, like giving commandments to do, did not SEE ? That the SAME CONTINUATION that Jesus has set forth, is SEEN RIGHT HERE IN JAMES 2, how these TESTIMONIES OF THE TRUTH, all speak to WHO GOD HAS CHOSEN, THE POOR, RICH IN FAITH. ( PROVING ALSO THE QUOTE OF REVELATION 14:12/THE FAITH OF JESUS, ARE THE SAME CHOSEN POOR, RICH IN FAITH.)

But these LAW KEEPER FALSE PROPHETS/COMMANDMENT FALSE TEACHERS, AMONG US, are the ones who have DESPISED THE POOR, as the RICH MEN BLASPHEME THAT WORTHY NAME BY WHICH WE ARE CALLED. (WHICH IS THE SAME EXAMPLE OF THE RICH YOUNG RULER IN MATTHEW 19.) and they being law teachers are the sinners who are CONVINCED OF THE LAW THEY TEACH as TRANSGRESSORS, AND ARE GUILTY OF ALL...



Matthew 19:21 Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me.
22 But when the young man heard that saying, he went away sorrowful: for he had great possessions.

Mark 10:21 Then Jesus beholding him loved him, and said unto him, One thing thou lackest: go thy way, sell whatsoever thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come, take up the cross, and follow me.

James 2:5 Hearken, my beloved brethren, Hath not God chosen the poor of this world rich in faith, and heirs of the kingdom which he hath promised to them that love him?
6 But ye have despised the poor. Do not rich men oppress you, and draw you before the judgment seats?
7 Do not they blaspheme that worthy name by the which ye are called?
8 If ye fulfil the royal law according to the scripture, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself, ye do well:
9 But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
10 For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.

Strong in Him said:

almost no one agrees with your interpretations of Scripture

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Actually the fact is that most people simply don't have any beliefs about the Prophesies. All is just ignored or maybe used as examples, like Psalms 23, which does have Prophetic content.

But what I see here, is vehement rejection of a viable interpretation of Zechariah 5. without a sensible or feasible alternative explanation.
You say the lead cover has no significance. Then why is it mentioned?
You say the object that looks like a 'scroll' is not the same as the 'basket', or 'barrel'? But both are round flying objects and what Zec saw in verses 6-11, would have been the placement of the nuke device into the missile.

This interpretation of Zechariah 5:1-11, is proof that God knows the preparations and the outcome of Iran's satanic hatred of Israel and Jeremiah 49:35-37, +, tells us what He intends to do about it.

I’ve been watching this thread with minor participation. I keep the Sabbath and believe it is an eternal decree; however, I’ve been waiting for Catholics and Protestants to defend and justify keeping Sunday. The Catholic teaching is that keeping Saturday (Sabbath) is a sign of the Old Covenant, and keeping Sunday (The Lord’s Day) is a sign of the New Covenant in remembrance of the Resurrection. I disagree; however, I would like to learn how the Catholic teaching is justified by Scripture. If my brothers and sisters in Christ keep the Lord’s Day to fulfill the fourth commandment, it is a good thing, but how is it justified other than tradition and the decrees of the Roman Church in 321 AD ?

NxNW said:

Special Report: Inside the Trump family’s global crypto cash machine — Reuters

The U.S. president’s family raked in more than $800 million from sales of crypto assets in the first half of 2025 alone, a Reuters examination found, on top of potentially billions more in unrealized “on paper” gains. Much of that cash has come from foreign sources as Donald Trump's sons have...

stocks.apple.com

The U.S. president’s family raked in more than $800 million from sales of crypto assets in the first half of 2025 alone, a Reuters examination found, on top of potentially billions more in unrealized “on paper” gains. Much of that cash has come from foreign sources...

DUBAI - Eric Trump was in Dubai on family business. Meeting with a Chinese businessman and his associates on the sidelines of a cryptocurrency conference in May this year, the son of U.S. President Donald J. Trump ran through his usual talking points about the inefficiency of traditional banks and his own famous father’s run-ins with financiers.

Then came the pitch. Buy at least $20 million of “governance tokens” in the Trump family’s crypto business, World Liberty Financial, and become part of a venture that Eric Trump predicted would soon embody the future of finance in America...

In the first half of this year, the Trump Organization’s income soared 17-fold to $864 million from $51 million a year earlier, according to Reuters calculations based on the president’s official disclosures, property records, financial records released in court cases, crypto trade information and other sources. Of the first-half total, $802 million – more than 90% – came from Trump crypto ventures, including sales of World Liberty tokens.

That $864 million payday represents actual income – cash flowing, free and clear, into Trump family coffers. Reuters’ calculations were reviewed by half a dozen crypto and real estate experts and a certified accountant who has studied the U.S. Internal Revenue Service’s approach to crypto.

“These people are not pouring money into coffers of the Trump family because of the brothers’ acumen. They are doing it because they want freedom from legal constraints and impunity that only the president can deliver.”
-- Kathleen Clark, law professor at Washington University

"B-b-but Trump's not taking a salary!"

Isn't this what they falsely accused Biden of doing? Though as we all know, Biden never took a single dollar, while Trump's taken nearly a billion (so far).

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Well, maybe that's better than taking in multiple millions from China or insider trading

Clare73 said:

Man's will is not totally free if it cannot make the moral choice to live sinlessly.

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Indeed

No one other than God Himself has ever made a perfect choice

There is only one honest freewill choice, and that is to see and choose to speak honestly of the fact that we are all guilty sinners at all times, period.

Freewill moral choosers always choke on that fact

No one, no not one will stand self justified in the face of God. They may provide a good chuckle at their best

The democrats were mad when Trump said “I can shoot someone and still be elected”, even though Trump never wanted people to be shot. That being said, meanwhile in Virginia voted for someone who wants children to die in order to enact certain political change.

fhansen said:

choosing life, we still must participate, we must choose at the end of the day. And continue to do so throughout our lives.

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Your position just makes grace into classic legalism

A typical thou shalt not, or else set up

There is no escape from the guilty verdict no matter how much whitewash is applied

At the end of the day, everyone will have been determined to be sinners, no exceptions.

Moral choosers will not be standing on the winners platform because no such choosers will ever be sinless

A platform for hypocrites would be more appropriate for such, and in line with truth

And a special platform for liars

Now, how many freewillers want to choose honesty? I'd suggest there's not too many takers

Yeah buts abound

Oh no! And we all remember 1985 as the year without Thanksgiving turkey.

Part of a free and honest non biased press, unlike the hate America lamestream propaganda press pushing their agenda. Refreshing to be getting facts after so long.

The Liturgist said:

Indeed, I wouldn’t use the subscription accounts.

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One last word, , if anyone has a mind to follow AI's lead and snap up an earlier CD-release of Adobe Illustrator to gain access, , forget it. AI maintains you can use an old release like mine to get to the finely crafted PostScript Type 1 fonts but won't always be able to edit them'. False! I can drop the hardcopy in and poof, all typefaces remain updated. Offline install? I could not.

keras said:

No.
Jesus said He would be with us until the end of the age. Matthew 28:20 This is obviously; in a Spiritual sense

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Obviously you're creeping up on the obvious

keras said:

It also blows the 'rapture to heaven' theory into the rubbish bin.

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I'm not into common rapture nonsense either. Preferred sight is blood and guts for the devil and his messengers, whatever that means in the Spiritual sense

AOG Superintendent Doug Clay prays for the nation Sept 11, 2025

JosephZ said:

SNAP could be fully funded for as long as the shutdown lasts if the Republican leadership would allow a vote on a standalone bill to do so. There's only one party to blame for that not happening

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So we should just have a bunch of stand alone bills for everything? I mean we honestly could point to almost everything as very important. So lets just have a stand alone bill for everything we believe we should be spending money on.

I actually would support that. I think we have far too many things passed in big bills. I would much rather see a vote for everything on an individual.basis. Yeah I know it would make Confeess actually have to spend time in session. Well too bad. So if thats what you are for, Im on board.

Otherwise its only your pet project that you want funded because it what you think is important. Theee should be consequences for shutting down the government. Including harming your own constituents if thats what you chose to do. Which is what the democrats did. They shouldn't be able to shut down rhe government and then start funding the things they want funded. Its an extremely scummy thing to do.

Say it aint so said:

We can go that route:

AI Overview


The SNAP reserve fund, or more formally, the SNAP contingency reserve, is an emergency fund appropriated by the federal government to ensure the continuous operation and funding of the Supplemental Nutrition Assistance Program (SNAP). It is intended to be available for "program operations as may become necessary," particularly during funding gaps like a government shutdown or other unexpected circumstances.

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For less than a month.

Warden_of_the_Storm said:

Once again: extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

If you want to claim advanced tech, then actually show the advanced tech. Not what you claim was made by advanced tech, but the advanced tech itself.

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I'm getting confused now. This is a contradiction to what the other poster said in that it is not even necessary to show the tech or device to prove that advanced methods was used.

Who is correct. If you are contradicting each other than is not a good basis.

Apple Sky said:

I can't but it's so obvious he made the earth stationary & level, even by the words used in Scripture such as;

Face.
Level
Unmovable
Circle
Still
Plane
Foundations
Horizon
Compass
Boundaries
Circuit

Proverbs 8:27
I was there when He established the heavens, when He inscribed a circle on the face of the deep,

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I would say that all of the words you list are true of a globe earth, too.

You have a face, yet your head is not flat, so why does the earth have to be flat to have a face?

I tried without success to find a bible verse saying that the earth is level.

A globe can be as unmoveable as a disc.

Where does the bible say that the earth is circular?

The only verse I could find that says the earth was still is:

“You caused judgment to be heard from heaven; The earth feared and was still,” (Ps 76:8 NKJV)

However, the word translated "still" there means to be quiet, be tranquil, be at peace. It says nothing about the earth's shape.

There are no references to the earth being plane. Thinking you meant "plain" I tried that, too. There are plenty of verses that talk of parts of the earth being a plain, (For instance, Sodom and Gomorrah are referred to as cities of the plain) but no verses I could find to say that the whole earth is a plain.

Something does not need to be flat to have foundations. Skyscrapers have them.

The horizon indicates a globe earth. If it were flat, the horizon would not exist. Nor would sunsets and sunrises.

Compass is used to translate various Hebrew words. One means to surround:

Ps 17:9 From the wicked that oppress me, [from] my deadly enemies, [who] compass me about.

Another means a circuit or circle:

Pr 8:27 When he prepared the heavens, I [was] there: when he set a compass upon the face of the depth:

A third, usually with the word "fetched", means to turn around:

2Sa 5:23 And when David enquired of the LORD, he said, Thou shalt not go up; but fetch a compass behind them, and come upon them over against the mulberry trees.

None of the meanings is only possible if the earth is flat.

Any shape can have boundaries.

The word "circuit" occurs 3 times in the KJV. It is the same word as is translated "compass" in 2 Samuel 5:23, and means to turn around:

1Sa 7:16 And he went from year to year in circuit to Bethel, and Gilgal, and Mizpeh, and judged Israel in all those places.
Job 22:14 Thick clouds are` a covering to him, that he seeth not; and he walketh in the circuit of heaven.
Ps 19:6 His going forth is from the end of the heaven, and his circuit unto the ends of it: and there is nothing hid from the heat thereof.


None of those verses where "circuit" occurs mention the earth's shape.

Hans Blaster said:

That is not how hypotheses are tested in science, Steve. What you have proscribed above is exactly how one gets lead down a self-reinforcing path of self-deception.

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We went through this before over the unreal and unfair idea of having to be forced to choose obviously imprecise vases in the limited number of vases (20) that could be selected from the museums to test.

A seperate test using known Egyptian vases in various stones including hand made, softer alabasta and modern CNC vases was also carried out. I linked the comparison which showed the predybastic precision vases were a different class of vase.

But ultimately if your looking for precision why would you not focus on the precision. There has already been many studies on Pottery and various vases over the years. We already have the data.

How is choosing the authentic vases in the museum that look most likely they will meet the precise class to only measure tham to see if they meet the precise class. If a vase visbly looks crooked why bother when we already have many studies on this.

Mercy Shown said:

Scripture makes clear that salvation begins with God’s gracious initiative—no one comes to Christ by their own unaided will. Jesus Himself said, “No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him” (John 6:44). Our hearts are naturally turned away from Him, and apart from the Spirit’s work, we would never seek God (Romans 3:10–11).

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The Drawing is the commencement of Spiritual Salvation Titus 3:5

Apple Sky said:

There is no verse that specifically states that the earth is flat,

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There you are then; that's your argument demolished right there.

You've berated us for not believing Genesis 1 or Scripture, yet you know that "there is no verse that specifically says that the earth is flat".
I shall get that printed on a t shirt and send it to you.

Apple Sky said:

but it's so obvious he made the earth stationary & level, even by the words used in Scripture

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"Obvious" to someone who can't get her head around science and cannot recognise that a) the Bible sometimes uses poetry, b) the Bible is not a science textbook - maybe.

Eldeah said:

So in the synagogue where I go to, I stated the same question. The Rabbi said on the Isaiah verse: "In Hebrew you can interpreted the verse to mean that HaShem is the only deity that was "formed" or "crafted,". But it is better to take interpret it in the meaning of unlike idols, the true God was not created."


I am not looking for ways to support that YHWH was formed. I think a lot of the first 3 chapters of genesis especially the creation(gen1) and formation(gen2) of humanity reflects what happened to YHWH and his Wisdom themselves.

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Assuming YHWH was formed (based on very thin assumptions) only creates another logical problem - who formed Him then? I'd stick with the common and easiest view and use my time/energy for more pressing Theological or Sanctification or Life issues.

What synagogue is that btw if I may ask? In what town?

Apple Sky said:

Rubbish, these are not my views at all.

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In the past you have said things like, "this is fake; NASA want us to believe ......", or "THEY want us to accept ...../THEY are trying to make us believe ...." And almost all the scientists and scientific observations of the world are incorrect/lying/don't know what they are talking about.
You have certainly said that the astronauts that have walked on the moon are lying. Even the Christian astronauts who, you have said, need to repent.
When I once said, "I believe men walked on the moon, that the earth is a globe and I believe and accept Genesis 1", you replied "you can't do."
It wasn't that long ago that you wrote "you don't believe Scripture" and other things. I can't find the post now, I suspect you/someone else removed it.

Once again: extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence.

If you want to claim advanced tech, then actually show the advanced tech. Not what you claim was made by advanced tech, but the advanced tech itself.

In just now thinking about what I just wrote, I came to a supposed willingness to be crucified, with Jesus' help. I looked up and prayed to Him sincerely. Ephesians 1:13 therefore says I have been sealed by the Holy Spirit of promise.

The above sentence means I am saved. But I've "been there" before, only to doubt again very shortly later.