BlueGreenEarth said:

For everyone's awareness, I am reporting anyone who demonstrates an unwillingness to argue in good-faith in this debate thread and who routinely posts content that does not directly address the objections they have received from their interlocutors.

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Addendum: It is necessary for us to demand intellectual honesty from ourselves and others in this way if we care about having meaningful and productive conversations.

home detention

Well, it is the reason why humans can donate blood and organs to someone on the other side of the country or even world to us. You can't do that if we aren't related genetically.

As an interesting counterpoint, chimps and gorillas, though possessing a much smaller population overall and much more localized ones too, are much more genetically diverse in their own populations to other chimps or gorillas.

SabbathBlessings said:

If only people listened to their own advice.

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If you’re aware of any logical fallacies in my posts, please inform me of them, and I will take corrective action immediately.

All sources which I cite are either mainstream academic sources or Patristic sources representing the views of the early Church.

Hentenza said:

Neither do I. Maybe reconsider the use of emojis.

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That was the "grimace" emoji, not a laughing one. Maybe pay attention to context.

RileyG said:

Anyone ever heard about this? All humans are extended from the same mitochondrial Eve who lived about 200,000 years ago, and therefore, are related.

Life came out of Africa.

Thoughts?

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It's slightly more complex than you've presented, but it's probably best to let it run on the questions as asked, unless it goes seriously off piste.

I think you were implying, correctly that human life came out of Africa. And yes, very definitely, of course we are all related, which makes things like racism not just dangerous and bad, but outrageously stupid. Since I accept evolutionary theory I know I am related to every living thing on the planet. I find it pleasing to reflect on how far back I have to go to find a common ancestor with my cat, or with the sheep grazing behind my house, the magpies circling overhead, or the nettles I can never quite get rid of.

Always in His Presence said:

Five years later, that poor horse still hasn’t moved.

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This is something new he did wrong.

Yttrium said:

What polling booths? My state is all mail-in.

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And trump will order the federal postal service to cease delivery of votes.

Brightfame52 said:

The point is, after telling the man to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shall be saved, they would explain to him the Gospel about Jesus Christ. Duh

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Are you a little child? "Duh"? My point is that the way you said you would answer the question did not include telling him "to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shall be saved". So, are you saying now that your answer to the question would include telling him that he had "to believe on the Lord Jesus Christ" in order to be saved?

Always in His Presence said:

One of the greatest Evangelical Preachers of our time was Dr. Billy Graham. Over 1,000,000,000 people reached with the Gospel of Jesus world wide, with hundreds of millions accepting the gift of Salvation

Remember Evangelicals are not a single denomination:

Here's a breakdown of some of the most prominent evangelical denominations:

Major Evangelical Denominations​

Denomination	Key Characteristics
Baptist	Emphasizes believer’s baptism by immersion and congregational governance. Includes groups like the Southern Baptist Convention and American Baptist Churches USA.
Pentecostal	Focuses on the gifts of the Holy Spirit, such as speaking in tongues and healing. Includes Assemblies of God and Church of God (Cleveland, TN).
Methodist	Originated with John Wesley; emphasizes personal holiness and social justice. Includes United Methodist Church, Wesleyan Church, and Free Methodist Church.
Presbyterian (Evangelical branches)	Governed by elders; emphasizes Reformed theology. Some branches, like the Evangelical Presbyterian Church, are considered evangelical.
Non-denominational Evangelical Churches	Independent churches that uphold evangelical beliefs without formal ties to a denomination. Examples include Life.Church and Elevation Church.
Charismatic Movements	Found within various denominations (even Catholic and Anglican), emphasizing spiritual gifts and personal experience with the Holy Spirit.

Evangelicalism isn't a single denomination—it's a movement that cuts across many traditions

The same is true with Charismatics:

Charismatic Christianity emphasizes the gifts of the Holy Spirit—like speaking in tongues, prophecy, and healing—and has influenced a wide range of denominations. Here's a breakdown of key groups associated with the Charismatic movement:

Charismatic Denominations & Movements​

Group	Description
Pentecostal Churches	These are foundational to the Charismatic tradition. Includes denominations like the Assemblies of God, Church of God (Cleveland, TN), and International Pentecostal Holiness Church.
Charismatic Movement within Mainline Churches	Emerged in the 1960s–70s, bringing charismatic practices into historic denominations like the Episcopal Church, Lutheran Church, and Presbyterian Church.
Catholic Charismatic Renewal	A movement within the Roman Catholic Church that embraces charismatic worship and spiritual gifts, especially since the late 1960s.
Neo-Charismatic Churches	Independent or non-denominational churches that embrace charismatic theology but aren’t formally Pentecostal. Examples include Vineyard Churches, Calvary Chapel, and Hillsong Church.
Third Wave Movement	A more recent wave of charismatic influence, often found in churches like the Association of Vineyard Churches and other evangelical groups that emphasize signs and wonders without traditional Pentecostal structures.

Charismatic Christianity is more of a movement than a single denomination—it flows across many traditions and continues to evolve

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Thanks for this post! Helps some of my questions!

I know there is even a Charismatic Episcopal Church that isn't in full communion with the worldwide Anglican Communion. The Charismatic Catholic renewal is still alive and strong. I think there are even Charismatic Presbyterians, Lutherans, Methodists that exist. It has influenced many different Christians of many different denominations.

For everyone's awareness, I am reporting anyone who demonstrates an unwillingness to argue in good-faith in this debate thread and who routinely posts content that does not directly address the objections they have received from their interlocutors.

Brightfame52 said:

@Spiritual Jew

Both, man initially sinned in Adam Rom 5:12 and then afterwards after he is born a sinner. If Christ didn't die for his sins, he is guilty of every sin he ever committed beginning in Adam. That goes for babies as well, they guilty in Adam, so their first sin was as a grown responsible adult man in Adam

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This is utter nonsense of epic proportions. Babies are not guilty of sin. That is complete lunacy and never taught in scripture anywhere. Everyone naturally has a sinful nature, but that doesn't mean people actually sin from birth or are guilty of sin from birth. Paul taught that he did not become dead in sin until he understood what sin was by way of the law.

Romans 7:7 What shall we say then? Is the law sin? God forbid. Nay, I had not known sin, but by the law: for I had not known lust, except the law had said, Thou shalt not covet. 8 But sin, taking occasion by the commandment, wrought in me all manner of concupiscence. For without the law sin was dead. 9 For I was alive without the law once: but when the commandment came, sin revived, and I died. 10 And the commandment, which was ordained to life, I found to be unto death. 11 For sin, taking occasion by the commandment, deceived me, and by it slew me.

The Liturgist said:

Perhaps before the pandemic Pentecostalism was the fastest-growing denomination, but now I’m pretty sure the Orthodox are in the lead, which is truly remarkable. The number of baptisms and chrismations occurring is unprecedented and is at the point where we are exceeding current capacity levels in terms of available clergy and facilities. Even in Utah, that bastion of the Mormon cult of counterfait Christianity which imprisons so many with in its system of economic and spiritual exploitation, the Antiochians have had amazing success with a network of mission parishes throughout the state.

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If I understand correctly, The Latter Day Saint Church/Mormon Church is shrinking in Utah, despite its immense wealth and emphasis on eternal families etc.

The LDS Church has influenced the state of Utah for decades.

Always in His Presence said:

The fastest-growing Christian denomination globally is Pentecostalism, particularly its Charismatic expressions. Estimates suggest it has grown from fewer than 1 million adherents in 1900 to over 500 million by 2025, with projections to reach 1 billion by 2050. This growth, driven by high conversion rates and active evangelism, is especially strong in the Global South—Africa, Asia, and Latin America—where Pentecostals thrive in economically distressed areas, offering vibrant worship and community networks. Annual growth rates for Pentecostals and Charismatics are around 1.88%, outpacing other Christian groups like Evangelicals (1.8%) and Catholics (1.3%).

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If it's to ask, do you consider Pentecostal, Charismatic, and Word of Faith all related?

I know there are many, many different Pentecostal denominations (such as Assembly of God, Church of God in Christ, Church of God, Apostolic, even oneness Pentecostals, which, per CF standards aren't Christian because they reject the Holy Trinity).

There are some Charismatic groups who do not self-identify as Pentecostal, but also consider themselves Evangelical?

Would you consider yourself, Pentecostal, Charismatic & Evangelical?

The Liturgist said:

This is a very important point and it is for this reason that the Orthodox Church provides Baptism, Chrismation, and the Eucharist to those who join her (unless one has a valid baptism) including infants and children, as these holy sacraments not only protect against demonic activity, but also in the case of Baptism includes an exorcism, like in the Roman Rite (your church historically referred to it a “minor exorcism”).

I do have a concern about unqualified people trying to do exorcisms in cases which are actually mental illness or drug abuse.

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Yup. Every person baptized into the Catholic Church receives a minor exorcism. There is even a special exorcism for the medal of St. Benedict! (Which I had blessed by my parish priest many years ago!)

Gregory Thompson said:

You may not know this, but there is a common sentiment among protestants that if you need deliverance then you're not saved.

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Hmmm...I actually wasn't aware of that. I won't go into detail, but I know of some Pentecostal lay preachers who do an exorcism of sort. They do it with believers too.

Michie said:

Renowned theologian and New Testament scholar N.T. Wright recently contended that in the new creation, marriage as humans know it won’t exist — yet relationships and desires will be radically transformed in eternity.

In a recent episode of the podcast "Ask N.T. Wright Anything," Wright responded to a listener who asked whether it would feel “awkward” to remarry after the death of a spouse, considering the Christian hope of reunion in the new Heavens and new Earth.

“Will our relationship be much different than it is now?” the listener asked. “If yes, then how? If no, then wouldn’t remarriage be awkward?”

Continued below.

NT Wright says marriage won’t exist in Heaven, but love will be transformed

Renowned theologian and New Testament scholar N T Wright recently contended that in the new creation, marriage as humans know it won t exist yet relationships and desires will be radically

www.christianpost.com

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Yeah, that's my understanding too. Essentially, the sacraments are gifts from God, and the liturgy is where heaven and earth meet. They are a foretaste of the heavenly kingdom.

Always in His Presence said:

Five years later, that poor horse still hasn’t moved.

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The question on my mind is why the horse isn't on trial for violating Florida's statutory rape law.

Being a lousy journalist on a lousy network is ignominious, but not the justice he deserves.

A New Dawn said:

And you know for certain that there were no nonbelievers in that group? How would you know that?

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Why would he refer to them as "holy brothers and sisters" if they included nonbelievers? Also, he was clearly only addressing believers there since nonbelievers didn't have any faith/confidence in the first place that they could keep until the end.

FireDragon76 said:

That may not be the most pastorally sensitive answer- at the least, I notice Wright sometimes has the tendency to lean in with polemical stances initially (perhaps due to his Evangelical background?). It also isn't true across the breadth of the Christian tradition. Eastern Christians believe the reality created by the sacrament of marriage persists, even after death, which is why traditionally remarriage was frowned upon in the East.

Especially in the modern Latin West, there's been more pressure to "move on" and remarry, often remarkably quickly, but even in the Western world not so long ago, people often had extended periods of ritualized mourning, recognizing that the bonds created through marriage persisted.

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I always found the belief about eternal marriage in the Eastern Churches quite fascinating!

Hmmm....would all the mainline Protestant sister Churches in America be considered progressive Christianity? They are as follows:

1. The Evangelical Lutheran Church of America (ELCA)
2. The United Methodist Church (UMC)
3. The Presbyterian Church of America (PCUSA)
4. The Episcopal Church (TEC)
5. The United Church of Christ (UCC)
6. Disciples of Christ (DofC)
7. American Baptist Churches

Jeff Carr said:

I was into progressive Christianity for a number of years. It took me to a very dark place from which I recoiled in repentance and got right with God.

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Happy to hear you are doing ok, now.

FaithT said:

Not quick enough IMO.

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It's all in God's hands. I put my faith in God, not mere men. IMO.

ThatRobGuy said:

Haven't people made that exact same miscalculation before? (pertaining to outsiders assuming Russia would collapse under attrition?)

Soviet Afghan war and the Chechen war would be examples of cases where "conventional wisdom" dictated that they would fizzle out, but where western analysts ultimately underestimated how long things would actually go
(note, in the Soviet Afghan war, we were throwing billions at Russia's opponents just like we are for this one)

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I recall that most outsiders calculated that Kiev would fall in about ten days. And I don't even see how the Chechen war is relevant since sanctions were never implemented against Russia during that war. I believe it would best if Putin suffers utter defeat as a matter of justice. Otherwise, I think Putin would need something truly threatening as an incentive to negotiate.

It's easy to see through the propaganda. Putin invaded Ukraine describing it as a military operation on a "peacekeeping" mission. It was even made illegal in Russia to call it a war. Since reasoning on a falsehood ends in a contradiction, we can notice that when Putin is now asked if he wants peace, he never replies by conveying he wants peace; Instead, he says he's always open to hearing someone's peace proposals. And I also notice Trump conveying that he thinks he knows Putin pretty well and that 'he thinks' Putin wants peace. But I don't believe Putin wants peace; I think he wants a pro-Russian government in Ukraine and greater influence Europe.

As for the costs of war, Russia has hundreds of billions of dollars' worth of assets frozen in Europe, it might be possible that those assets could be used to finance the defense of Ukraine.