Nazis Return to Charlottesville

[Moral Orel]

Never finished the first? I'd be lying if I didn't admit that I think the love story in the middle of it drags down the momentum a bit...but it's a thematically rich movie. It's got obvious themes of "what constitutes alive?" and "what defines oneself?" mixed in with themes of slavery, emotion, duty, crime...it's a pretty deep movie firing on a lot of levels. I'm lowering my expectations for the new one though...I'd just see it because I like dystopian future settings.

I love all that stuff too, I don't remember why it didn't grab me. Ex Machina was great.

lol yes...I know exactly what you're talking about and I wouldn't mind seeing them handled that way too.

People need to be calmly rude, that's all.

 

[Ana the Ist]

I love all that stuff too, I don't remember why it didn't grab me. Ex Machina was great.

People need to be calmly rude, that's all.

Ex Machina was great...saw that one in the theater too.

 

[Rescued One]

Am I alone in thinking that the media attention they've been getting and counter protestering they've attracted is less productive than just ignoring them?

I wholeheartedly believe in ignoring them!

 

[Rion]

Am I alone in thinking that the media attention they've been getting and counter protestering they've attracted is less productive than just ignoring them?

Pretty much.

I would guess that they're trying to rile people up to get a reaction, so that they can whine about being "persecuted" by the "violent" left.
Ringo

...are you referring to Antifa? Cause, yeah, they're violent.

 

[Yonny Costopoulis]

So after ranting and raving like a lunatic about NFL players respectfully and peacefully kneeling in protest against racial discrimination, just curious, has our current and glorious leader managed to say anything about Nazis returning to Charlottsville?

Or is it only black people who disrespect America by protesting, and when white supremacists honor traitors it's totally cool.

I mean I know the answer already, but just thought I'd ask.

-CryptoLutheran

Why would Trump speak out against "some very fine people"?

 

[Ringo84]

Pretty much.



...are you referring to Antifa? Cause, yeah, they're violent.

Sure...why not. Because antifa in Charlottesville defended counterprotestors from Nazis, defended First United Methodist (which had a "safe space" available with water and light snacks for people who were in town), and they defended Congregation Beth Israel. For all the hand-wringing and moral panic about the "violent" antifa, those guys are not the ones walking down the street chanting "Jews will not replace us" underneath swastika banners.
Ringo

 

[Rion]

Sure...why not. Because antifa in Charlottesville defended counterprotestors from Nazis, defended First United Methodist (which had a "safe space" available with water and light snacks for people who were in town), and they defended Congregation Beth Israel. For all the hand-wringing and moral panic about the "violent" antifa, those guys are not the ones walking down the street chanting "Jews will not replace us" underneath swastika banners.
Ringo

No, they're the ones busting non-nazi's heads open like melons and chanting/writing "Liberals will get the bullet too."

 

[Ringo84]

No, they're the ones busting non-nazi's heads open like melons and chanting/writing "Liberals will get the bullet too."

According to conservative "news" outlets, of course. But I really just feel so sorry for those poor, poor neo-Nazis who are getting punched in the face. It really tugs at my heart strings.
Ringo

 

[Rion]

According to conservative "news" outlets, of course. But I really just feel so sorry for those poor, poor neo-Nazis who are getting punched in the face. It really tugs at my heart strings.
Ringo

So you're denying any of the stuff in say... Berkeley happened?

 

[Ringo84]

So you're denying any of the stuff in say... Berkeley happened?

Nope. I'm just saying that it's an isolated example among many examples of antifa protecting people from the neo-Nazi hordes.
Ringo

 

[ViaCrucis]

I wholeheartedly believe in ignoring them!

Those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it.

History teaches us that we cannot ignore Nazis, we can't ignore them and pretend they'll go away. "Ignore them" is fine when we're talking about harmless trolls on a message board or in the comments section of a Youtube video. "Ignore them" isn't fine when we're talking about groups of emboldened fascists walking and chanting down main street. We, as a society, can't ignore the threat they represent.

The answer isn't violence, but the answer isn't pretending like if we ignore them they'll go away--they aren't going to go away.

Attacking individual Nazis with violence not only is counterproductive, it also ignores the fact that there are bigger problems at the root that need to be addressed.

As a society we need to be assertive that what they stand for and represent is intolerable. And we do that by robbing them of their power. Pastor Bonhoeffer once said that the Christian cannot merely bandage the wounds of the victims of the wheels of injustice, we must drive a spoke into the wheel itself. The Rev. Martin Luther King Jr correctly says, "Injustice anywhere is injustice everywhere".

"First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me."

לעולם לא עוד
le'olam lo od
Never again.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Rescued One]

Do you want me to kill them? We have government officials who are supposed to handle these guys.

I wasn't expecting them to go away if I ignored them, but since I am not the one who has a solution, I'll ignore them.

Let us know when you have the solution.

 

[ViaCrucis]

Do you want me to kill them? We have government officials who are supposed to handle these guys.

Violence isn't the solution, as I said.
But neither is ignoring them.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Rescued One]

Violence isn't the solution, as I said.
But neither is ignoring them.

-CryptoLutheran

Please don't tell us what the solution isn't. How does that solve the problem? If you have the answer let the government know.

 

[ViaCrucis]

Please don't tell us what the solution isn't. How does that solve the problem? If you have the answer let the government know.

I'm more interested in what those of us who call ourselves Christians ought to be. And I believe that must be a people who stand on the side of the weak, the poor, and the oppressed. And to add our voice to those crying in pain. I haven't claimed to have some profound answer--but I know what the answer can't be, and the answer can't be silence.

-CryptoLutheran

 

[Rescued One]

I'm more interested in what those of us who call ourselves Christians ought to be. And I believe that must be a people who stand on the side of the weak, the poor, and the oppressed. And to add our voice to those crying in pain. I haven't claimed to have some profound answer--but I know what the answer can't be, and the answer can't be silence.

-CryptoLutheran

So are you going out there to speak up or are you only going to post to CF to criticize others who just might be Christians? Those who have paid attention to my posts know that I stand for justice and liberty for blacks, Asians, Jews, Hispanics, people who are ill and abused, unborn, and all.

 

[Rion]

Those who ignore history are doomed to repeat it.

History teaches us that we cannot ignore Nazis, we can't ignore them and pretend they'll go away. "Ignore them" is fine when we're talking about harmless trolls on a message board or in the comments section of a Youtube video. "Ignore them" isn't fine when we're talking about groups of emboldened fascists walking and chanting down main street. We, as a society, can't ignore the threat they represent.

The answer isn't violence, but the answer isn't pretending like if we ignore them they'll go away--they aren't going to go away.

Attacking individual Nazis with violence not only is counterproductive, it also ignores the fact that there are bigger problems at the root that need to be addressed.

As a society we need to be assertive that what they stand for and represent is intolerable. And we do that by robbing them of their power. Pastor Bonhoeffer once said that the Christian cannot merely bandage the wounds of the victims of the wheels of injustice, we must drive a spoke into the wheel itself. The Rev. Martin Luther King Jr correctly says, "Injustice anywhere is injustice everywhere".

"First they came for the Socialists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Socialist.

Then they came for the Trade Unionists, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Trade Unionist.

Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—
Because I was not a Jew.

Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me."

לעולם לא עוד
le'olam lo od
Never again.

-CryptoLutheran

Ignoring history seems to work for those who support Antifa and the communists.

 

[Rion]

I'm more interested in what those of us who call ourselves Christians ought to be. And I believe that must be a people who stand on the side of the weak, the poor, and the oppressed. And to add our voice to those crying in pain. I haven't claimed to have some profound answer--but I know what the answer can't be, and the answer can't be silence.

-CryptoLutheran

Well, for one thing we can avoid falling into the current moral panic that is presently running wild in our country. Secondly, we can oppose the neo-nazis while not siding with the violent anarcho-communists. Third, rather than going around and punching people we disagree with, we can argue with them and if that doesn't work, mock them. It may sound odd, but by making them the punchline to a joke, you rob them of a lot of power.

 

[Ana the Ist]

Sure...why not. Because antifa in Charlottesville defended counterprotestors from Nazis, defended First United Methodist (which had a "safe space" available with water and light snacks for people who were in town), and they defended Congregation Beth Israel.

How did that work out for Heather Heyer?

For all the hand-wringing and moral panic about the "violent" antifa, those guys are not the ones walking down the street chanting "Jews will not replace us" underneath swastika banners.
Ringo

But they do assault people to stop them from exercising their first amendment rights...

In my lifetime, I can only think of one white supremacist rally where multiple people were assaulted and someone murdered...Antifa's tactics are disgusting.

 

[Yonny Costopoulis]

Sure...why not. Because antifa in Charlottesville defended counterprotestors from Nazis, defended First United Methodist (which had a "safe space" available with water and light snacks for people who were in town), and they defended Congregation Beth Israel. For all the hand-wringing and moral panic about the "violent" antifa, those guys are not the ones walking down the street chanting "Jews will not replace us" underneath swastika banners.
Ringo

Trump clearly stated Antifa is equivalent to Nazis. So that is new reality for many. And if you try and show this is not true? Fake News!!