Was Ceremonial Law Abolished?

[HARK!]

It wasn't that hard of a question. It was in his nature to eat fruit, so he could be tempted.

It's not an easy question for someone who considers it.

The creatures of the garden were vegetarian. There was no death there. Adam eats of an evil tree; and the next thing you know, he's wearing an animal skin. His son is killing animals, and his other son is killing people. It seems that after Adam ate of this forbidden tree that Adam had a taste for death. Did he have a taste for death before he ate of the tree? Would a mad cow have a taste for meat before he tried it?

 

[klutedavid]

Yet ALL prophecy isn't.

Context is key.

P.S. Earth hasn't passed.

The earth does not have to pass.

All prophecy does not have to be fulfilled. The judgement of mankind related prophecies do not have to be fulfilled, by Jesus at Calvary. During His life and death on the cross Jesus fulfilled everything written about Him.

That is what the scripture states.

Only the fulfillment of the requirements of the law; someone who perfectly obeyed the law. And someone who could be a perfect sacrifice in fulfillment of the requirements, that the sacrifices demanded for forgiveness.

Think through what you are saying. All prophecy is a ridiculous statement.

 

[CharismaticLady]

It's not an easy question for someone who considers it.

The creatures of the garden were vegetarian. There was no death there. Adam eats of an evil tree; and the next thing you know, he's wearing an animal skin. His son is killing animals, and his other son is killing people. It seems that after Adam ate of this forbidden tree that Adam had a taste for death. Did he have a taste for death before he ate of the tree? Would a mad cow have a taste for meat before he tried it?

You are missing the point. Today, if you put a nice juicy steak in front of a lamb, would it eat it? Could it resist the temptation?

 

[HARK!]

You are missing the point. Today, if you put a nice juicy steak in front of a lamb, would it eat it?

I doubt it. How hungry is this sheep? Might he be tempted if he was hungry enough? Maybe. If you tricked him, and started mixing meat into his grain pellets, he very well might end up like a mad cow; but that would be Satanic.

We can go on with 'what if's' all night. What are you getting at?

 

[klutedavid]

Yes the law is fulfilled in Christ. However fulfill simply means to make full - not abolished. The law points to Christ. The law is a tutor or guardian which leads us to Christ. Torah simply means "instruction." The job of the tutor is to instruct. That is what the law does; it instructs and leads us to Jesus. If the law did not exist anymore, than how would people know right from wrong and what constitutes as sin? How would people know what to repent of since the knowledge of what constitutes as sin is dictated by the law?
That is why Paul wrote "Do we then make void the law through faith? No, in no wise, to the contrary we establish the law" (Rom 3:31). No one is justified by the law but through the law comes knowledge of sin (Rom 3:20).
We must be careful not to throw out the baby with the bath water.

The law gives us a background in what sin constitutes. On the other hand, put yourself under the law and invite the judgment of God on yourself.

Have a look at what happened to the Jews. They had the law and are still paying for that failure to obey it, even to today.

The law condemns everyone who kneels before it; that is the function of the law.

No one can obey the law in thought and deed.

 

[CharismaticLady]

I doubt it. How hungry is this sheep? Might he be tempted if he was hungry enough? Maybe. If you tricked him, and started mixing meat into his grain pellets, he very well might end up like a mad cow; but that would be Satanic.

We can go on with 'what if's' all night. What are you getting at?

Nature. After Adam sinned we were born with a sin nature. That is what Jesus came to cure. The sin in our nature. That is the whole reason for being born again of the Spirit. We are a new creation. Jesus condemned sin in the flesh. In other words, He took sin out of our nature. This is also why even though Jesus was a man, He had the seed of God in Him. Resisting temptation was easy for Him, and He made it easy for us. That is the reason for 1 John 3:9.

So if you no longer want to sin, and don't, is the law still necessary for you? It is why those who walk in the Spirit (this new nature) are not under the law.

I really need to go to bed. I've been trying to explain this to you for hours and I'm exhausted, but it was important.

 

[CharismaticLady]

Good night.

 

[HARK!]

I really need to go to bed. I've been trying to explain this to you for hours and I'm exhausted, but it was important.

So do I, I've stayed up much later than I wanted to; because I've enjoyed our discussion. I'll try to remember to respond to this post tomorrow.

Goodnight CharismaticLady.

 

[CharismaticLady]

@HARK!

2 Peter 1:

2 Grace and peace be multiplied to you in the knowledge of God and of Jesus our Lord, 3 as His divine power has given to us all things that pertain to life and godliness, through the knowledge of Him who called us by glory and virtue, 4 by which have been given to us exceedingly great and precious promises, that through these you may be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

Jesus had the divine nature of His Father; and we as reborn creatures are no longer sinners, but children of God with His Spirit in us.

 

[DamianWarS]

It's not an easy question for someone who considers it.

The creatures of the garden were vegetarian. There was no death there. Adam eats of an evil tree; and the next thing you know, he's wearing an animal skin. His son is killing animals, and his other son is killing people. It seems that after Adam ate of this forbidden tree that Adam had a taste for death. Did he have a taste for death before he ate of the tree? Would a mad cow have a taste for meat before he tried it?

Adam defaulted to leaves not animal skin. God gave him the animal skin outfit which of course points to God's redemption that it is through his blood sacrafice that Adam's shame was covered not through Adam's insufficient leaves.

 

[SkyWriting]

Yahshua said:

(CLV) Lk 16:17
Yet it is easier for heaven and earth to pass by than for one serif of the law to fall.

After Yahshua ascended, James, Yahshua's brother, ordered Paul to make temple sacrifices to prove that he was obedient to the Torah.

(CLV) Ac 21:23
This, then, which we are saying to you, do. With us are four men having a vow on them.

(CLV) Ac 21:24
Taking these along, be purified together with them, and bear their expenses, that they should be shaving their heads, and all will know that what they have been instructed concerning you is nothing, but you also are observing the elements and you yourself are maintaining the law.

Purify G48

ἁγνίζω hagnízō, hag-nid'-zo; from G53; to make clean, i.e. (figuratively) sanctify (ceremonially or morally):—purify (self).


I. ceremonially

A. to make pure, purify, cleanse

II. morally

G48 - hagnizō - Strong's Greek Lexicon (KJV)

Yes. The law was fulfilled by Jesus and no need to shave heads, rip your clothes, stone prostitutes to death, or any of that. Just accept forgiveness through Jesus.

Ephesians 4:32
Be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, as God in Christ forgave you.

Mark 11:25
And whenever you stand praying, forgive, if you have anything against anyone, so that your Father also who is in heaven may forgive you your trespasses.”

1 John 1:9
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.

Matthew 6:15
But if you do not forgive others their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

Matthew 18:21-22
Then Peter came up and said to him, “Lord, how often will my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? As many as seven times?” Jesus said to him, “I do not say to you seven times, but seventy times seven.

Matthew 6:14-15
For if you forgive others their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you, but if you do not forgive others their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

Luke 6:37
“Judge not, and you will not be judged; condemn not, and you will not be condemned; forgive, and you will be forgiven;

Colossians 3:13
Bearing with one another and, if one has a complaint against another, forgiving each other; as the Lord has forgiven you, so you also must forgive.

 

[SkyWriting]

Were "ceremonial" laws abolished?

Yes, the old covenant, of following the law to be saved, was rendered obsolete.

Hebrews 8:13
In speaking of a new covenant, he makes the first one obsolete. And what is becoming obsolete and growing old is ready to vanish away.

2 Corinthians 5:17
Therefore, if anyone is in Christ, he is a new creation. The old has passed away; behold, the new has come.

James 5:15
And the prayer of faith will save the one who is sick, and the Lord will raise him up. And if he has committed sins, he will be forgiven.

 

[Oldmantook]

The law gives us a background in what sin constitutes. On the other hand, put yourself under the law and invite the judgment of God on yourself.

Have a look at what happened to the Jews. They had the law and are still paying for that failure to obey it, even to today.

The law condemns everyone who kneels before it; that is the function of the law.

No one can obey the law in thought and deed.

Incorrect. I suggest you study Jesus' interactions with the Jewish leaders throughout the gospels and inform yourself accordingly. Get back to me when you put in the appropriate time of study. I won't do your homework for you. I'll just give you one hint: Jesus never condemned the written law as He himself obeyed it - otherwise He would have been guilty of sinning and we both know Jesus was without sin. Instead Jesus condemned the Jews for following their oral law (Talmud), which he also referred to as the traditions of men - instead of following that commandments of God as written in the law of Moses. Ask yourself this: Do you conflate the oral law with the written law?

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

We have the example of Christ doing good works on the sabbath (when Moses executed a man for picking up sticks).

Doing good, even on Shabbat, is never against Torah

 

[Oldmantook]

Doing good, even on Shabbat, is never against Torah

Indeed. The whole point of the law was to fulfill the spirit of the law - to love God and to love our neighbor as ourselves.

 

[DamianWarS]

Doing good, even on Shabbat, is never against Torah

This begs the question is there something unique about doing good on shabbat than other days? It seems to me if you just focus on the being good part than you don't have to worry about the rest.

 

[Yeshua HaDerekh]

This begs the question is there something unique about doing good on shabbat than other days? It seems to me if you just focus on the being good part than you don't have to worry about the rest.

Well the story was about doing good on Shabbat...Shabbat has restrictions that other days do not have.

 

[DamianWarS]

Well the story was about doing good on Shabbat...Shabbat has restrictions that other days do not have.

That apparently are lifted so long as you do good

 

[Dave L]

Yahshua said:

(CLV) Lk 16:17
Yet it is easier for heaven and earth to pass by than for one serif of the law to fall.

After Yahshua ascended, James, Yahshua's brother, ordered Paul to make temple sacrifices to prove that he was obedient to the Torah.

(CLV) Ac 21:23
This, then, which we are saying to you, do. With us are four men having a vow on them.

(CLV) Ac 21:24
Taking these along, be purified together with them, and bear their expenses, that they should be shaving their heads, and all will know that what they have been instructed concerning you is nothing, but you also are observing the elements and you yourself are maintaining the law.

Purify G48

ἁγνίζω hagnízō, hag-nid'-zo; from G53; to make clean, i.e. (figuratively) sanctify (ceremonially or morally):—purify (self).


I. ceremonially

A. to make pure, purify, cleanse

II. morally

G48 - hagnizō - Strong's Greek Lexicon (KJV)

This is a loaded question based on a misunderstanding.

 

[martymonster]

Christ is the fulfilment of the law. All rituals, ceremonies, sacrifices and feasts, are types and shadows, and he is the fulfilment of those types and shadows.