Prove me wrong: Every possible starting point to the 70 Weeks Prophecy faces insurmountable problems

[EclipseEventSigns]

The 69 weeks are determined upon Daniel's people - the Jews, and Jerusalem.

Jesus was born in Bethlehem, not Jerusalem.

Jesus arrived in Jerusalem, in John 12:12-15, riding a donkey - not by descending from heaven. He was hailed as the messiah, the King of Israel who comes in the name of the Lord.

Riding the donkey fulfilled a prophecy in Zechariah 9:9

John 12:12 On the next day much people that were come to the feast, when they heard that Jesus was coming to Jerusalem,

13 Took branches of palm trees, and went forth to meet him, and cried, Hosanna: Blessed is the King of Israel that cometh in the name of the Lord.

14 And Jesus, when he had found a young ass, sat thereon; as it is written,

15 Fear not, daughter of Sion: behold, thy King cometh, sitting on an ass's colt.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

Zechariah 9:9 Rejoice greatly, O daughter of Zion; shout, O daughter of Jerusalem: behold, thy King cometh unto thee: he is just, and having salvation; lowly, and riding upon an ass, and upon a colt the foal of an ass.

The 360 day "prophetic" year of Anderson/Hoehner has been proven as impossible. The math does not work out with established dates of the Babylonian calendar.

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

The 69 weeks are determined upon Daniel's people - the Jews, and Jerusalem.

Jesus was born in Bethlehem, not Jerusalem.

Jesus arrived in Jerusalem, in John 12:12-15, riding a donkey - not by descending from heaven. He was hailed as the messiah, the King of Israel who comes in the name of the Lord.

Riding the donkey fulfilled a prophecy in Zechariah 9:9

John 12:12 On the next day much people that were come to the feast, when they heard that Jesus was coming to Jerusalem,

13 Took branches of palm trees, and went forth to meet him, and cried, Hosanna: Blessed is the King of Israel that cometh in the name of the Lord.

14 And Jesus, when he had found a young ass, sat thereon; as it is written,

15 Fear not, daughter of Sion: behold, thy King cometh, sitting on an ass's colt.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

Zechariah 9:9 Rejoice greatly, O daughter of Zion; shout, O daughter of Jerusalem: behold, thy King cometh unto thee: he is just, and having salvation; lowly, and riding upon an ass, and upon a colt the foal of an ass.

Again, very little understanding of Jewish custom and religion. The magi knew exactly what the star(sign) meant at that particular time and travelled to Jerusalem to find the new messiah. Both Simeon and Anna were waiting in Jerusalem and the temple expecting the new messiah. They knew that the baby messiah would need to be presented at the temple at some point.

All of them probably had a proper understanding of the 70 Weeks prophecy. They knew what year the messiah would be born as that is the end point of the 62 Weeks.

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

The missing puzzle piece is that it was God Himself who gave the command to return to and rebuild Jerusalem. Gabriel told Daniel to reread Jeremiah to find out where and when this had been done. He gave him a play on words. That it would not just be the subject matter but the very words themselves he should look for. "sub" and "bana". Where did God use those words? And Jeremiah includes the date when this was done. He doesn't just give one date. He gives two so that it was very specific. This was in 587 BC.

Each group of Weeks has a specific purpose. And a particular start and end. They are not combined. In fact, what no one has noticed in the modern era, is that there isn't just one gap. There are two gaps. But that's not all. Each gap is itself a grouping of Weeks. The first gap was 14 Weeks (98 years) long. The second gap is approaching 290 Weeks (2030 years) long. The entire prophetic timeline is made up of groups of Weeks.

This interpretation is the most accurate because:
1. it takes the prophetic text literally (the years are proper years)
2. it syncs with the historical information in the Bible
3. it syncs with the prophecies in Isaiah, Jeremiah, Daniel and Ezekiel
4. it confirms the purposes given for the 70 Weeks
5. it provides a proper and accurate understanding of the Hebrew text and customs

And it passes the Ezra 6:14 Challenge.

 

[Douggg]

View attachment 336357

The missing puzzle piece is that it was God Himself who gave the command to return to and rebuild Jerusalem. Gabriel told Daniel to reread Jeremiah to find out where and when this had been done. He gave him a play on words. That it would not just be the subject matter but the very words themselves he should look for. "sub" and "bana". Where did God use those words? And Jeremiah includes the date when this was done. He doesn't just give one date. He gives two so that it was very specific. This was in 587 BC.

Each group of Weeks has a specific purpose. And a particular start and end. They are not combined. In fact, what no one has noticed in the modern era, is that there isn't just one gap. There are two gaps. But that's not all. Each gap is itself a grouping of Weeks. The first gap was 14 Weeks (98 years) long. The second gap is approaching 290 Weeks (2030 years) long. The entire prophetic timeline is made up of groups of Weeks.

This interpretation is the most accurate because:
1. it takes the prophetic text literally (the years are proper years)
2. it syncs with the historical information in the Bible
3. it syncs with the prophecies in Isaiah, Jeremiah, Daniel and Ezekiel
4. it confirms the purposes given for the 70 Weeks
5. it provides a proper and accurate understanding of the Hebrew text and customs

And it passes the Ezra 6:14 Challenge.

Why do you have a gap starting immediately after Cyrus gives the command to allow the building of the Temple ? What good did Cyrus's command do if it resulted immediately as a gap?

Also why don't you have the temple building start and completion on your chart ? I show it on my chart.

Also when did the Jews start exiting the Babylonian Captivity ?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

The 49 years begin with Cyrus's command. Which the Jews began exiting the Babylonian Captivity. And during 49 years, the Jews competed the objective of Cyrus command to allow them to rebuild the temple.

You have been reading too much Rashi. His commentary was wrong on most of Daniel 9. I have over 11,000 posts at Messiah Truth, Jewish countermissionary site, since 2003, learning about their beliefs.

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

Why do you have a gap starting immediately after Cyrus gives the command to allow the building of the Temple ? What good did Cyrus's command do if it resulted immediately as a gap?

Also why don't you have the temple building start and completion on your chart ?

Also when did the Jews start exiting the Babylonian Captivity ?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------

The 49 years begin with Cyrus command. Which the Jews began exiting the Babylonian Captivity. And during 49 years, the Jews competed the objective of Cyrus command to allow them to rebuild the temple.

You have been reading too much Rashi. His commentary was wrong on most of Daniel 9. I have over 11,000 posts at Messiah Truth, Jewish countermissionary site, since 2003, learning about their beliefs.

I can't possibly explain it all in a comment section. That's why I have a 7 part video series and a book. If you have an open mind, you can get all your questions answered there. This thread was to "prove him wrong". I have.

 

[Douggg]

Again, very little understanding of Jewish custom and religion. The magi knew exactly what the star(sign) meant at that particular time and travelled to Jerusalem to find the new messiah

Read Matthew 2:1-8. The magi did not know what city at the start of their journey. They saw the star and followed it west, from the east, heading to Jerusalem, the center of activity for the Jews.


Matthew 2:
1 Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem,
2 Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.
3 When Herod the king had heard these things, he was troubled, and all Jerusalem with him.
4 And when he had gathered all the chief priests and scribes of the people together, he demanded of them where Christ should be born.
5 And they said unto him, In Bethlehem of Judaea: for thus it is written by the prophet,
6 And thou Bethlehem, in the land of Juda, art not the least among the princes of Juda: for out of thee shall come a Governor, that shall rule my people Israel.
7 Then Herod, when he had privily called the wise men, enquired of them diligently what time the star appeared.
8 And he sent them to Bethlehem, and said, Go and search diligently for the young child; and when ye have found him, bring me word again, that I may come and worship him also.

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

Read Matthew 2:1-8. The magi did not know what city at the start of their journey. They saw the star and followed it west, from the east, heading to Jerusalem, the center of activity for the Jews.


Matthew 2:
1 Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem,
2 Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.
3 When Herod the king had heard these things, he was troubled, and all Jerusalem with him.
4 And when he had gathered all the chief priests and scribes of the people together, he demanded of them where Christ should be born.
5 And they said unto him, In Bethlehem of Judaea: for thus it is written by the prophet,
6 And thou Bethlehem, in the land of Juda, art not the least among the princes of Juda: for out of thee shall come a Governor, that shall rule my people Israel.
7 Then Herod, when he had privily called the wise men, enquired of them diligently what time the star appeared.
8 And he sent them to Bethlehem, and said, Go and search diligently for the young child; and when ye have found him, bring me word again, that I may come and worship him also.

They knew EXACTLY where to go to ask for the King of the JEWS. They knew they were travelling to find the Jewish messiah. They knew the expected time and the expected place. Once they saw the sign in the sky, they made their trek.

 

[Douggg]

I can't possibly explain it all in a comment section. That's why I have a 7 part video series and a book. If you have an open mind, you can get all your questions answered there. This thread was to "prove him wrong". I have.

What begins the 70th week ?

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

Read Matthew 2:1-8. The magi did not know what city at the start of their journey. They saw the star and followed it west, from the east, heading to Jerusalem, the center of activity for the Jews.


Matthew 2:
1 Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem,
2 Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.
3 When Herod the king had heard these things, he was troubled, and all Jerusalem with him.
4 And when he had gathered all the chief priests and scribes of the people together, he demanded of them where Christ should be born.
5 And they said unto him, In Bethlehem of Judaea: for thus it is written by the prophet,
6 And thou Bethlehem, in the land of Juda, art not the least among the princes of Juda: for out of thee shall come a Governor, that shall rule my people Israel.
7 Then Herod, when he had privily called the wise men, enquired of them diligently what time the star appeared.
8 And he sent them to Bethlehem, and said, Go and search diligently for the young child; and when ye have found him, bring me word again, that I may come and worship him also.

They did not follow a star. Again, bad mistranslation of the KJV translators. They did not see a star while they were located to the East. They saw the star in the eastern direction of the sky. An eastern star. It had special significance to them as to where it occurred in the heavens in relationship to the other heavenly bodies (ie. Jupiter, Saturn, Aries).

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

Thanks.

 

[Douggg]

That is NOT cool to modify someone else's work. Remove that image or I will put you on "ignore".

Done.

 

[BobRyan]

BobRyan said:

Mark 1:14-15 has Christ confirming at the start of His ministry in 27 AD that the "Time is fulfilled"

Yes, that was definitely the starting year of Christ's ministry with that Mark 1:14-15 announcement, but it was not at AD 27. That announcement was given when John had just been cast into prison in AD 30. "Now after that John was put in prison, Jesus came into Galilee, preaching the gospel of the kingdom of God, and saying, The time is fulfilled..."

John was put in prison for two years then dies about a year before Christ is crucified. Jesus said the time is fulfilled in Mark 1:14-15 -- just as John did at the start of his ministry

Matt 3:1Now in those days John the Baptist *came, preaching in the wilderness of Judea, saying, 2 “Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand.” 3 For this is the one referred to by Isaiah the prophet when he said,

“The voice of one calling out in the wilderness,
‘Prepare the way of the Lord,
Make His paths straight!’”

St. John the Baptist | Biography, Patron Saint, Facts, Feast Day, & Death | Britannica

St. John the Baptist was a Jewish prophet revered in Christianity as the forerunner of Jesus Christ. He preached the imminence of God’s Final Judgment and baptized those who repented in self-preparation for it. After a period of desert solitude, John the Baptist emerged as a prophet in the...

www.britannica.com

"In 27/28 or 28/29 John attained prominence, not as a priest but as a prophet. He was active in the region of the lower Jordan valley, from “Aenon near Salim” (near modern Nāblus) to a point east of Jericho. His austere camel’s hair garment was the traditional garb of the prophets, and his diet of locusts and wild honey represented either strict adherence to Jewish purity laws or the ascetic conduct of a Nazirite (a Jew especially vowed to God’s service)."​

​

John was jailed for about 2 years and then killed about a year before Christ died.

So we still have the possibility of a 27 AD statement for Christ in Mark 1 - and if we combine Matthew 3 "The kingdom of heaven is at hand" with Christ's "The time is fulfilled" in Mark 1 - then both may be a reference to the timeline of Dan 9 - the completed 69 apocalyptic weeks (483 years from 457 BC)

Counting backward from AD 30 the 483 years, the starting year of the 70-week prophecy would have been 454 BC - the decree given in the twentieth year of Artaxerxes I's reign in Nehemiah 2, (which included a co-regency period beginning in 474 BC with his father Xerxes).

The decree is a 3-part decree according to Ezra 6 and the third part is in Ezra 7 since the only thing we get in Nehemiah's time is a 52 day "repair" effort that fixes some damage that had been done after the city and its walls were rebuilt.

 

[Douggg]

They did not follow a star. Again, bad mistranslation of the KJV translators. They did not see a star while they were located to the East. They saw the star in the eastern direction of the sky

They saw the star when they were in the east and they traveled toward it. They saw the star from their own homeland

1 Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem,

2 Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.

That is not the point anyway. The point is that they were directed to go to Bethlehem, as the messiah was not to be born in Jerusalem.

The Daniel 9 prophecy is for when the messiah arrives in Jerusalem. Which was fulfilled in John 12:12-15.

 

[3 Resurrections]

I think what happened was that the Samaritans were making it hard for the Judeans (the Jews of Jerusalem) to work on the rebuilding of the city and the wall.... that lasted about eighty something years.... which is called troublous times in verse 25.

I believe the "troublous times" during the building of the wall were brought about by Sanballat, Tobiah, the Arabians, the Ammonites, and the Ashdodites who heard about the building of the wall and were angered by this (Nehemiah 4:7-8). These all conspired to come against Jerusalem and to hinder this work. When Nehemiah got wind of this conspiracy, he made defensive plans in preparation for an attack. In the lower places behind the wall and on the higher elevations, he grouped families together, with weapons of swords, spears, and bows for all. Each man wore a sword girded on their side as they built on the wall. One hand worked on building the wall, and the other hand held a weapon. No one stopped even to change clothes, and kept their weapons on them even when going for water. Nehemiah kept a trumpeter beside him continually to sound a warning in case of attack. Every man's servant remained by his master to guard them during the night. Half of Nehemiah's servants worked on the wall, and the other half held the various weapons and battle gear in readiness for a surprise attack.

Even when the wall was finished, but without the gates set up yet, Sanballat and Geshem the Arabian tried to trick Nehemiah by sending five messages to him, requesting that he meet them at an outlying village. When this didn't work, they accused Nehemiah of building the wall in order to start up a rebellion in Jerusalem against the Persian king, with Nehemiah setting himself up as king in Jerusalem.

When Nehemiah called them liars about this, Sanballat and Tobiah hired another man to report personal threats to Nehemiah and to tempt him to hide inside the temple for protection from an attack against himself. This also did not intimidate Nehemiah. Neither did the letters Tobiah sent to Nehemiah put him in fear of completing the work.

This long series of harassment attempts by all of Nehemiah's enemies is described in full in Nehemiah chapters 4-6. "Troublous times" indeed.

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

They saw the star when they were in the east and they traveled toward it. They saw the star from their own homeland

1 Now when Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judaea in the days of Herod the king, behold, there came wise men from the east to Jerusalem,

2 Saying, Where is he that is born King of the Jews? for we have seen his star in the east, and are come to worship him.

That is not the point anyway. The point is that they were directed to go to Bethlehem, as the messiah was not to be born in Jerusalem.

The Daniel 9 prophecy is for when the messiah arrives in Jerusalem. Which was fulfilled in John 12:12-15.

As I said, that is a misunderstanding of what the original text said. The magi were from the east. They saw a star in the eastern sky. They travelled west AFTER they saw it.

 

[Douggg]

As I said, that is a misunderstanding of what the original text said. The magi were from the east. They saw a star in the eastern sky. They travelled west AFTER they saw it.

The magi followed the star which they first saw in the night sky, in their native land in the east, and followed the star west to Jerusalem, where the star at that point appeared in the night sky to them in Jerusalem.

And then after speaking to Herod, the magi continued to follow the star to where Jesus lay in the manger, and the star stood over it.

Matthew 2:9 When they had heard the king, they departed; and, lo, the star, which they saw in the east, went before them, till it came and stood over where the young child was.

10 When they saw the star, they rejoiced with exceeding great joy.

 

[David Kent]

What begins the 70th week ?

The baptism of Jesus.

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

The magi followed the star which they first saw in the night sky, in their native land in the east, and followed the star west to Jerusalem, where the star at that point appeared in the night sky to them in Jerusalem.

And then after speaking to Herod, the magi continued to follow the star to where Jesus lay in the manger, and the star stood over it.

Matthew 2:9 When they had heard the king, they departed; and, lo, the star, which they saw in the east, went before them, till it came and stood over where the young child was.

10 When they saw the star, they rejoiced with exceeding great joy.

EXACTLY! "when they saw the star, they rejoiced". This is because they were NOT following the star as they travelled. It REAPPEARED. It then showed them the place to go in Bethlehem. Otherwise, it would have been over Bethlehem ALREADY when they arrived in Judea. You have to read the details carefully.
The original text specifically says "eastern star". The KJV translators got it wrong.

 

[EclipseEventSigns]

The Ezra 6:14 Challenge! A set of facts about the 70 Weeks Prophecy that ALL interpretations must be weighed against. Only one interpretation - the correct one - can pass this test.

 

[Douggg]

EXACTLY! "when they saw the star, they rejoiced". This is because they were NOT following the star as they travelled. It REAPPEARED. It then showed them the place to go in Bethlehem. Otherwise, it would have been over Bethlehem ALREADY when they arrived in Judea. You have to read the details carefully.
The original text specifically says "eastern star". The KJV translators got it wrong.

They would not have headed west in the first place to Jerusalem if they were not following the star.

They rejoiced because the star they were following stopped and stood over the house, which had the manger, indicated where the new King of the Jews lay.

It did not "reappear". They saw where the star had stopped and were exceedingly happy because they knew they have found the exact house where the new King of the Jews was.