Pagan holidays mixing with Christian ones

prodromos

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All of the Easter celebrations are based on Ishtar including the name of the event..Ishtar= Easter
There is scant information about any celebrations regarding Ishtar, so I have no idea what you are basing this on and only a tiny minority of languages call the celebration of our Lord's death and resurrection, "Easter" neither is there any traceable link between ancient Messopotamia and medieval Germany.

Your claims are all dead in the water, so it is not surprising that you are outta here.
 
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Every once in a while I get why Catholics look at all this non-sense and shake their heads and blame sola scriptura. Of course its precisely an ignoring of sola scriptura that leads a person to read a christmas tree into rant against the impotence of idols. That is called eisegesis. Eisegesis is bad. Let the text speak for itself.
If I gather what you are saying....letting the text speak for itself is bad. Every once in a while I get why the Catholics did everything in Latin. Who can know the truth but the scholar with his hand out.

Every one of these examples are utter rubbish. This is drive-by history. No serious scholar would ever state such a thing. Please cite an authority regarding these examples like a previous post asked.
No serious scientist would say "there is no such thing as evolution". Which means exactly squat as they are wrong. Evolution is bull no matter how many scientist say differently. Same goes for what we are discussing here. I'm not really interested in what a scholar thinks. I'm more interested in the truth.
 
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prodromos

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If I gather what you are saying....letting the text speak for itself is bad.

That is the complete opposite of what he said. I see a pattern forming, and it reflects badly on your reading comprehension.
 
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That is the complete opposite of what he said. I see a pattern forming, and it reflects badly on your reading comprehension.
Well......the pattern that is forming is a bunch of ignorance. If you cats can't figure out the Christmas tree has nothing to do with Jesus the Christ and everything to do with Nimrod and Tammuz well that's your choice.
Jer 10
3 For the customs of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe.

4 They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not.

The next time you decide to go natural and go out to the forest and cut down your Christmas tree, think of Jeremiah 10.
The blindness is hard to comprehend that's for sure.
 
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prodromos

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Well......the pattern that is forming is a bunch of ignorance. If you cats can't figure out the Christmas tree has nothing to do with Jesus the Christ and everything to do with Nimrod and Tammuz well that's your choice.
Jer 10
Funnily enough, Jeremiah 10 makes no mention of Nimrod or Tammuz, and I can't remember the last time a person looked at a decorated pine tree in December and commented on what a lovely Nimrod idol it was. Probably because no one ever decorates a pine tree for Nimrod or Tammuz. A fact that appears to be lost on you.
3 For the customs of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe.
4 They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not.
Clear sign that someone has no argument is when they post the same thing multiple times.
The next time you decide to go natural and go out to the forest and cut down your Christmas tree, think of Jeremiah 10.
The blindness is hard to comprehend that's for sure.
Christmas trees aren't really part of our tradition. We tend to decorate a model boat because all the fishermen would decorate their boats with lights around Christmas, turning the harbor into something spectacular at night.
 
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prodromos

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I have to admit, it is kind of crazy that there are people who insist that something which is almost universally identified as a CHRISTmas tree, absolutely has to be an idol to some long forgotten Middle Eastern mythical god that isn't even mentioned in the smoking gun passage of Jeremiah.
People decorate their homes to celebrate the birth of CHRIST. They buy each other gifts as a remembrance of God's gift to us of His Son. They sing songs celebrating the birth of Christ and the events surrounding His birth. Extended families often make a point of coming together at this time.
Neither Nimrod or Tammuz or any other mythological figure enter the thoughts of anyone at this time, and yet there are some people who appear to have a tenuous grip on reality, who imagine that all these people are unknowingly worshiping false gods simply because thousands of years ago some pagans thought it would be a good idea to decorate a tree.
Seriously, get a clue.
 
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Monna

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But its obvious that you folks prefer your opinions over the Word...So....I'm outta here.

Dear Denadii, it seems from your post that you claim to know what other people prefer and by extension believe. But no where in my post did I say I believe what was written there.

(I do in fact believe the following:
1 Corinthians 15:54
"So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.")

It no doubt would have been better if I had used the expression "One could..." instead of "You could..." but for many people the "One could..." phrase sounds old-fashioned and stuffy. I put out this idea as one way that some people explain what has happened.

If discussions on this forum are going to be constructive and meaningful in any way, I think we need to stick to the subject and not get sidetracked into judging the people giving a thought, a rational argument, a viewpoint.

Denadii, do you by any chance celebrate Christmas, or any other christian memorial event?
 
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Monna

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Why is Easter called Pascha/Resurrection day in most non-English countries?

I don't know if it is. But here is the entymology of the word, according to Easter - Wikipedia: (You can go to the site and look up the numerous references yourselves)

"The modern English term Easter, cognate with modern Dutch ooster and German Ostern, developed from an Old English word that usually appears in the form Ēastrun, -on, or -an; but also as Ēastru, -o; and Ēastre or Ēostre. The most widely accepted theory of the origin of the term is that it is derived from the name of an Old English goddess mentioned by the 7th to 8th-century English monk Bede, who wrote that Ēosturmōnaþ (Old English 'Month of Ēostre', translated in Bede's time as "Paschal month") was an English month, corresponding to April, which he says "was once called after a goddess of theirs named Ēostre, in whose honour feasts were celebrated in that month".

In Latin and Greek, the Christian celebration was, and still is, called Pascha (Greek: Πάσχα), a word derived from Aramaic פסחא (Paskha), cognate to Hebrew פֶּסַח (Pesach). The word originally denoted the Jewish festival known in English as Passover, commemorating the Jewish Exodus from slavery in Egypt. As early as the 50s of the 1st century, Paul, writing from Ephesus to the Christians in Corinth, applied the term to Christ, and it is unlikely that the Ephesian and Corinthian Christians were the first to hear Exodus 12 interpreted as speaking about the death of Jesus, not just about the Jewish Passover ritual. In most of the non-English speaking world, the feast is known by names derived from Greek and Latin Pascha. Pascha is also a name by which Jesus himself is remembered in the Orthodox Church, especially in connection with his resurrection and with the season of its celebration."
 
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GingerBeer

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All of the Easter celebrations are based on Ishtar including the name of the event..Ishtar= Easter
Easter is East-er; the word "east-er" is about the east where the sun rises and the moon and stars rise in the east. The Christian celebration is about Jesus Christ who died and rose again from the dead and will come again from the Father's right hand to judge the living and the dead. There is no pagan link here.
 
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Easter is East-er; the word "east-er" is about the east where the sun rises and the moon and stars rise in the east. The Christian celebration is about Jesus Christ who dies and rose again and will come again. There is no pagan link here.
You might do a little research and find out why the Christian Passover has a different date than the Jewish Passover many times. Why the date difference? Shouldn't Passover be Passover? There is your connection to Ishtar....who is Semiramis
 
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I have to admit, it is kind of crazy that there are people who insist that something which is almost universally identified as a CHRISTmas tree, absolutely has to be an idol to some long forgotten Middle Eastern mythical god that isn't even mentioned in the smoking gun passage of Jeremiah.
People decorate their homes to celebrate the birth of CHRIST. They buy each other gifts as a remembrance of God's gift to us of His Son. They sing songs celebrating the birth of Christ and the events surrounding His birth. Extended families often make a point of coming together at this time.
Neither Nimrod or Tammuz or any other mythological figure enter the thoughts of anyone at this time, and yet there are some people who appear to have a tenuous grip on reality, who imagine that all these people are unknowingly worshiping false gods simply because thousands of years ago some pagans thought it would be a good idea to decorate a tree.
Seriously, get a clue.
With these blind answers..........you have to be in the clergy.

Please show when the Christmas tree came to be, and what it stands for......if you can.
 
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Why is Easter called Pascha/Resurrection day in most non-English countries?
"

I don't know if it is. But here is the entymology of the word, according to Easter - Wikipedia: (You can go to the site and look up the numerous references yourselves)

"The modern English term Easter, cognate with modern Dutch ooster and German Ostern, developed from an Old English word that usually appears in the form Ēastrun, -on, or -an; but also as Ēastru, -o; and Ēastre or Ēostre. The most widely accepted theory of the origin of the term is that it is derived from the name of an Old English goddess mentioned by the 7th to 8th-century English monk Bede, who wrote that Ēosturmōnaþ (Old English 'Month of Ēostre', translated in Bede's time as "Paschal month") was an English month, corresponding to April, which he says "was once called after a goddess of theirs named Ēostre, in whose honour feasts were celebrated in that month".

In Latin and Greek, the Christian celebration was, and still is, called Pascha (Greek: Πάσχα), a word derived from Aramaic פסחא (Paskha), cognate to Hebrew פֶּסַח (Pesach). The word originally denoted the Jewish festival known in English as Passover, commemorating the Jewish Exodus from slavery in Egypt. As early as the 50s of the 1st century, Paul, writing from Ephesus to the Christians in Corinth, applied the term to Christ, and it is unlikely that the Ephesian and Corinthian Christians were the first to hear Exodus 12 interpreted as speaking about the death of Jesus, not just about the Jewish Passover ritual. In most of the non-English speaking world, the feast is known by names derived from Greek and Latin Pascha. Pascha is also a name by which Jesus himself is remembered in the Orthodox Church, especially in connection with his resurrection and with the season of its celebration."

You are correct ... the name Pascha which we refer to the celebration of the Resurrectuon comes from the Jewish Passover - Christ is after all our Passover Lamb and the connections are manifold.

It has been called Pascha since the days of the early Church.
 
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Ken Rank

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Hint: All Hallow e(v)en is not and has never been a Christian holiday, holy day etc. And OBTW before you go there neither is Christmas or Easter.
Easter as in the use of eggs and a bunny, of course not. But as the day of celebration of the resurrection... it sure has and should be. The internet is full of a bunch of nonsense (and I am not directing this at or even to you) as related to this day. Easter as a word tied to Ishtar...nonsense, at least as taught by so many. Easter as a word was created to denote the resurrection, a concept and word the Anglo-Saxons lacked because they had never heard of anyone resurrecting before. They used the word in their language that was tied to the idea of rising (east, the direction the sun rises) and they added an 'er' which created a word that literally means "riser." But, I guess it is too easy for the unlearned to lay blame on others for things they didn't do.
 
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GingerBeer

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You might do a little research and find out why the Christian Passover has a different date than the Jewish Passover many times. Why the date difference? Shouldn't Passover be Passover? There is your connection to Ishtar....who is Semiramis
Christians celebrate Jesus Christ's atoning death, saving resurrection, and his ascension to heaven and the day when Jesus sent the Holy Spirit upon the disciples on the 50th day after his resurrection. He died on Friday, he rose again from the dead on Sunday, and he will come again from heaven to save his people, judge the world, and raise the dead. The reason for the date differing from passover is because the days of the week Friday, Saturday, Sunday are the significant days related to the death, burial, and resurrection of Jesus Christ. While Jewish passover was to celebrate the exodus from Egypt on the 15th day of the Lunar month Nisan in the Jewish religious calendar. Neither Passover nor Christ's death & Resurrection have anything to do with Ishtar - who by the way has nothing whatever to do with Semiramis.
 
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prodromos

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With these blind answers..........you have to be in the clergy.
You are making a habit of being wrong. Am not, never have been and likely never will be clergy.
Please show when the Christmas tree came to be, and what it stands for......if you can.
From what I remember, the Christmas tree tradition originated in 16th century Germany. If I have the time I will try and dig up some references.
 
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"

I don't know if it is. But here is the entymology of the word, according to Easter - Wikipedia: (You can go to the site and look up the numerous references yourselves)

"The modern English term Easter, cognate with modern Dutch ooster and German Ostern, developed from an Old English word that usually appears in the form Ēastrun, -on, or -an; but also as Ēastru, -o; and Ēastre or Ēostre. The most widely accepted theory of the origin of the term is that it is derived from the name of an Old English goddess mentioned by the 7th to 8th-century English monk Bede, who wrote that Ēosturmōnaþ (Old English 'Month of Ēostre', translated in Bede's time as "Paschal month") was an English month, corresponding to April, which he says "was once called after a goddess of theirs named Ēostre, in whose honour feasts were celebrated in that month".

In Latin and Greek, the Christian celebration was, and still is, called Pascha (Greek: Πάσχα), a word derived from Aramaic פסחא (Paskha), cognate to Hebrew פֶּסַח (Pesach). The word originally denoted the Jewish festival known in English as Passover, commemorating the Jewish Exodus from slavery in Egypt. As early as the 50s of the 1st century, Paul, writing from Ephesus to the Christians in Corinth, applied the term to Christ, and it is unlikely that the Ephesian and Corinthian Christians were the first to hear Exodus 12 interpreted as speaking about the death of Jesus, not just about the Jewish Passover ritual. In most of the non-English speaking world, the feast is known by names derived from Greek and Latin Pascha. Pascha is also a name by which Jesus himself is remembered in the Orthodox Church, especially in connection with his resurrection and with the season of its celebration."

I'm not asking because I don't know, but to get the person who made the claim regarding the feast's Pagan origins to explain why the feast wasn't called Ishtar in areas of the world that would have made much more sense. You basically have to skip two continents to get to England where we see evidence of it first being called Easter and before then, everyone in the Greco-Roman world and even beyond called it some form of Pascha.

The people who insist Easter is Pagan, do not think, they simply buy into the popular myth.
 
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Denadii

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Dear Denadii, it seems from your post that you claim to know what other people prefer and by extension believe. But no where in my post did I say I believe what was written there.

(I do in fact believe the following:
1 Corinthians 15:54
"So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory.")

It no doubt would have been better if I had used the expression "One could..." instead of "You could..." but for many people the "One could..." phrase sounds old-fashioned and stuffy. I put out this idea as one way that some people explain what has happened.

If discussions on this forum are going to be constructive and meaningful in any way, I think we need to stick to the subject and not get sidetracked into judging the people giving a thought, a rational argument, a viewpoint.

Denadii, do you by any chance celebrate Christmas, or any other christian memorial event?
Continually spouting stuff that contradicts the Word does say a lot about what a person believes....And NO I do not celebrate those events any more than Jesus did. There are no truly Christian events...Only renovated pagan ones.
 
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Ignatius the Kiwi

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Continually spouting stuff that contradicts the Word does say a lot about what a person believes....And NO I do not celebrate those events any more than Jesus did. There are no truly Christian events...Only renovated pagan ones.

Others have given a demonstrated why this is not the case. Insisting you are correct when you have been shown to be wrong and worse than that, not even providing a good counter argument to the points made against you shows an immense pride on your part.

Instead of looking to Paganism to explain the feast of Easter, why not look to the Jewish Passover? Would that not make more sense given the moveable nature of it? Were there pagans that ever celebrated a feast called Easter on the first Sunday after the Spring Equinox? Were there ever Pagans who celebrated the Easter feast on the 14th of Nissan or on the Sunday following it?

Why did the early Christians call this celebration Pascha? Which is the exact same word used in the New Testament to describe the Jewish Passover? Is it possible that Easter has more Jewish origins than Pagan? Perhaps being a reworking of the Jewish Passover to focus on Christ more than old Exodus?

It would perhaps benefit you to read Melito's Peri Pascha, one of the earliest Easter sermons. Read it and explain to me how the feast he is referring to is Pagan in origin instead of arising out of Judaism and seeking to pronounce Christ first and foremost?

You can ignore all this and say "but muh paganism" but it's intellectually and spiritually hollow.
 
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Hint: All Hallow e(v)en is not and has never been a Christian holiday, holy day etc. And OBTW before you go there neither is Christmas or Easter.

Begin quote
Easter as in the use of eggs and a bunny, of course not. But as the day of celebration of the resurrection... it sure has and should be. The internet is full of a bunch of nonsense (and I am not directing this at or even to you) as related to this day. Easter as a word tied to Ishtar...nonsense, at least as taught by so many. Easter as a word was created to denote the resurrection, a concept and word the Anglo-Saxons lacked because they had never heard of anyone resurrecting before. They used the word in their language that was tied to the idea of rising (east, the direction the sun rises) and they added an 'er' which created a word that literally means "riser." But, I guess it is too easy for the unlearned to lay blame on others for things they didn't do.
Ooops I worded that wrong. I plead senility and late hour. I should have said that Easter and Christmas are not associated with any pagan events or practices.
 
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