I need to either find a spouse or learn how to be at peace with being single, how do I do that?

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I know, but Roman Catholics in Vietnam are pretty eager to marry white Christians. Even the non-religious women in Vietnam act more Christian than most whites in America.

This right here. I have no problem with people from that part of the world. But the way it came across was more of a "marry so she can move here" Type situation which is at best similar to prostitution as far as im concerned.





Their are options in college? Have you been to a college recently? They arn't exactly bastions of christian virtue, nor do they promote it.



I don't have a choice, not a real one. If I want to live out the faith and pursue God through the life of the church I need a partner who is 100% on board, otherwise it will be a living hell. Holy week alone is hard and thats when its just me Ive got to get there, it would be even more difficult with a spouse who doesn't see the value in it. IF she isn't orthodox she sure isnt' going to be happy about keeping the kids at church till 2am or 3am a couple times out of the year either.

Its not a "choice" for me and its silly to pretend it is. Pursuing someone who isn't orthodox would only cause pain for both parties.




well, at least there is one out there lol.

----

I think one of my biggest frustrations is that it feels impossible. I'll be blunt, even if religion wasn't an issue i would have trouble finding someone. Ive never been particularly good with dating, when I was younger I wasn't very sociable and while I'm fine at socializing now I missed out on that whole period in the teenage years where you learn the whole song and dance when it comes to dating. I'm fine talking with women its just I don't know HOW to pursue anything more than a friendship (which I do have with some women who have been helpful when I have questions!). So I'm already at a pretty big disadvantage. Now add into the fact that there is no one to be interested IN or to get to know and I'm suddenly left in a situation where I can't really learn because thats very much a "learn by doing" type of thing. you can't learn to date unless you date.

Now add onto that the fact that I don't typically enjoy things that most people bond over. I have no interest in sports or most of pop culture, I don't get references , and most of the music I listen to is not mainstream. Its not that those things are bad i just don't have an interest in them so I don't bond with people over them.

But I think the biggest issue is the one that everyone here seems to be missing. On a fundamental level I am looking for someone who can walk beside me where we both help each other grow in the spiritual life. That is the absolute top priority in the relationship. I'm not looking for someone perfect (I'm not), and I'm not someone who thinks they are a modern saint or that they could become one. I'm not looking for a zealot. I'm looking for someone who wants to know God and wants to shape their life around that. THAT is what I want my relationship to be based on. Not on happiness (Though a relationship should have plenty of happiness) , not on wealth, not on social status or any of the other worthless stuff I hear people in christian communities talking about.

I won't try to give you advice, but will say that I have been where you are. I married my wife at 33 years old. I was 32 when I met her, and she was my first date, my first kiss, and my first girlfriend. I spent my adolescent and college years in an icon studio painting with any free time that I had. In my twenties I had the realization that I was now living alone, working from home where I had no interactions with women, and going to a parish that had very few people, male or female in my age range. I began to despair that I would never find anyone, and that if I did she would almost definitely not be Orthodox, and even if she was, she wouldn't want someone who had no experience dating at all.

I met my wife on the internet in 2008. I had given up on the notion of being married. In fact my first email from her was on the day after deciding that I would pursue a life of celibacy and or monasticism. I was not even enthusiastic about responding to her in the first place because I thought I had a plan for the rest of my life. In ten months time we went from stilted email conversations to long telephone conversations, to occasional trips to visit one another, to me moving across the country and marrying her. It was not always smooth sailing, but God provided in ways to make it all possible. We are coming up on our tenth anniversary, we have three children together, and I was ordained to the priesthood in November.

I have all the things that I had hoped for and more, things that I had given up hope of ever having. In retrospect, I realize that all of the not dating that I did was tremendously successful in keeping me from making big mistakes early in my life. My wife is very glad that she was my first date and my first kiss, which I would not have been if I had dated a lot. I am grateful for how things happened in my life even though I spent a lot of time thinking that I had ruined everything for myself.

I assume that you don't know what God's plan is for your life and that you are still figuring all of that out. You're at a difficult age when the world seems like it should be wide open in front of you, but seems strangely closed off, especially when you try to live by faith, and not by the way of the world. I think that the best we can do is to live by faith, to seek first the Kingdom of Heaven. When we do this, God provides for us. Not always how we want or when we want, but He provides. He can bring that person into your life, even if it seems impossible. The worries and the concerns you have are your worries and concerns, and not necessarily the concerns of the woman you will meet. And even if a woman never makes it into your life, God can provide the strength, and the consolation that you may require to persevere in the absence of that.

I pray that God will give you some peace of mind in the present, and that in His time, He will fulfill your requests for your salvation.
 
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Coolbutclueless

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“Every dog has his day”.
I heard that as a lonely single guy in 1984 in the movie “Gotcha!”.
I met my wife in 1991 (now going on 28 years together). It turned out to be true. Patience, and stick to your guns.

I live in Russia, and I can tell you that there are more lonely single women than men over here. But I think it’s fine that you are culturally rooted. Marrying a foreigner is not for everyone.

Its not so much that I'm rooted in my culture, to be honest I don't really care much for my culture either, I don't really care much for any culture. I'm not sure of thats to my benefit or a character flaw, but it is what it is.

I assume that you don't know what God's plan is for your life and that you are still figuring all of that out. You're at a difficult age when the world seems like it should be wide open in front of you, but seems strangely closed off, especially when you try to live by faith, and not by the way of the world. I think that the best we can do is to live by faith, to seek first the Kingdom of Heaven. When we do this, God provides for us. Not always how we want or when we want, but He provides. He can bring that person into your life, even if it seems impossible. The worries and the concerns you have are your worries and concerns, and not necessarily the concerns of the woman you will meet. And even if a woman never makes it into your life, God can provide the strength, and the consolation that you may require to persevere in the absence of that.

I pray that God will give you some peace of mind in the present, and that in His time, He will fulfill your requests for your salvation.

I really need the peace. If you were to just happen upon me in real life you wouldn't know it, but my life has been pretty different from others. When I was younger I had some health issues and so that caused me quite a bit of isolation, at one point in my life I had very little food and started to starve (generally had about 1 sandwich a week to eat and lost over 60lb in 2 weeks and the food situation took months to resolve), Later in life I ended up sick unable to leave my home for several years (dropped out of college due to it though I'm back finishing it up now). I say all that because its the only thing I can compare my current situation to. It really is like when I was starving. When I was starving it was always there, there was no way to distract from it. After a time the pain would fade and I would be able to function but there was always a dull ache in the back of my mind reminding me I needed food, and anything even minor could trigger all the hunger pains to come back. Thats the only experience in my life I can compare this loneliness to. I think im doing ok with it, Ive got it managed, It sucks but I can survive it. Then I see a happy couple holding hands, or a guy holding his girlfriends purse, or I meet someone new and notice a wedding band on their hand. Suddenly it all floods in. Honestly, I think I preferred the starvation to this type of pain.
 
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ilovejcsog

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This kind of question always amazes me because there are so many singles out there. I am glad mine is over. Try to have peace where ever you are in life. God knows your needs and you are still very young. Put it in his hands and let it go and live your life without worries about it and all of the sudden there she is:) There are so many places to meet women in your case. i would think your activities and hobbies would offer opportunities.
God bless you and give you peace in this area so you can devote your time with him.
 
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ArmyMatt

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I just want to apologize if my postings seem overly negative. This has been an incredibly frustrating thing for me to deal with and i don't have much hope of it ever getting better. Thats just how I feel about it and I don't know how to change that.

you're good. I think a lot of us can relate. I didn't get married until I was 30, and a number of my closest friends were already married. it was rough.
 
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Coolbutclueless

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This kind of question always amazes me because there are so many singles out there........There are so many places to meet women in your case. i would think your activities and hobbies would offer opportunities.
God bless you and give you peace in this area so you can devote your time with him.

The thing is , this is objectively false. As someone orthodox looking for a spouse who is orthodox there are NOT many people out there. Lets look at the numbers. Someone else did the work so I'm just going to copy and past.
---------------
Most states are 1% Orthodox, and according to Pew only 31% of Orthodox are single. Taking into account gender ratios (also from Pew), that means I'm allowed to marry (ignoring any issues related compatibility and personality) 1 in 733 people.

None of this even takes into account age. Assuming a range of 10 years is appropriate (and that each generation has equal numbers, which isn't true) 1/8 of the total population is of reasonable age. This means I am allowed to marry (once again ignoring any combatability issues) 1 in 5864 people. Or, in the entire United States, a whopping 55,800 people, meaning there are around 1000 viable marriage partners per state, probably fewer in Western/more rural states.

----------


So yes, please keep saying that there are plenty of singles out there (Despite the fact that in 3 years Ive encountered a grand total of 3 women who were both orthodox and unmarried.
 
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My wife and I joined Orthodox my together. Funny thing is, my wife was far more gung-ho about joining the church than me!

Thats how I felt reading it. Made me feel queasy.
 
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When I was looking for a girl, I got a couple of ladies who I thought turned out fairly cookoo. When I quit caring and searching, I found my wife. God sometimes likes to test us and just let us lay things in front of his throne.

My advice to the OP—-you’re still young. Relax and pray for God’s will to be done, and let Him know your desire. Then realize He is a good God who loves mankind. It might be six months, a year, two years, whatever...she’ll come.

And she might not be Orthodox. She might not be American!? Who knows!? But if she is open to your faith and sees what joy and amazing impact Orthodoxy has on your life, you might be surprised how she’ll want to join up!
 
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slav22

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Definition of what is the meaning of your life can help with that. Do you need a spouse to fulfill your meaning?

Having a spouse can be helpful for it, but can be also harmful (for travellers, for scientists, for apostles etc.)

So, after you will find your place in life, you will know what you need to be effective and happy.
 
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Coolbutclueless

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Why? Just because your wife is middle to upper class doesn't mean the lower class wouldn't be eager for a Christian husband with more money.
There's nothing wrong with women wanting a man who can provide for them. It's natural.

Because a woman is suppose to be a partner, not an accessory. I'm not looking for someone I have to provide for, but someone who I can mutually build a life together WITH. There is a difference. I have no problem with marrying someone from a different social/economic class, in fact I Think money really isn't something that should be considered when looking for a spouse (though looking for someone who knows how to budge and maturely handle the money they have is important).

Why would you be grossed out by the idea of marrying a poor woman of a different race? I honestly don't see what's so gross about it.

Prostitution?!? So a poor woman wanting to marry a man who can provide for her and her future children is prostitution to you? You do realize that nearly 100% of women in most of human history married exactly for that reason, right?

I'm not grossed out by the idea of someone of a different race, my Ex was African American where I am white. It was a non-issue for us. I'm disgusted by the concept of what was said. That I should look into meeting a poor women for another country who is wanting to find a good man to marry and move over here with. THATS messed up. Its messed up because its not Godly, its a "prid pro quo" situation. Its finding someone in a bad situation and offering them a away out, but only if they give you what you want. ITs not an honest relationship its a business transaction. So yes, I would consider that to be pretty close to prostitution since your giving her a better life in a better country(which if we really wanted to we could probably assign an equivalent monetary value to)in exchange for her marrying you (which includes a sexual component, though obviously marriage is MUCH MORE than just sex). That type of exchange isn't ethical and what the majority of the world does is irrelevant to what is ethical and what isn't.

I should add though, if someone naturally met and feel in love with someone from one of these countries there is nothing inherently unethical about them getting married and moving to America and him supporting her financially. There is a worlds difference between that and purposefully seeking out someone in another country and offering them a better life in order to get married to them. THAT is slimey and unethical.
 
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Because a woman is suppose to be a partner, not an accessory. I'm not looking for someone I have to provide for, but someone who I can mutually build a life together WITH. There is a difference. I have no problem with marrying someone from a different social/economic class, in fact I Think money really isn't something that should be considered when looking for a spouse (though looking for someone who knows how to budge and maturely handle the money they have is important).





I'm not grossed out by the idea of someone of a different race, my Ex was African American where I am white. It was a non-issue for us. I'm disgusted by the concept of what was said. That I should look into meeting a poor women for another country who is wanting to find a good man to marry and move over here with. THATS messed up. Its messed up because its not Godly, its a "prid pro quo" situation. Its finding someone in a bad situation and offering them a away out, but only if they give you what you want. ITs not an honest relationship its a business transaction. So yes, I would consider that to be pretty close to prostitution since your giving her a better life in a better country(which if we really wanted to we could probably assign an equivalent monetary value to)in exchange for her marrying you (which includes a sexual component, though obviously marriage is MUCH MORE than just sex). That type of exchange isn't ethical and what the majority of the world does is irrelevant to what is ethical and what isn't.

I should add though, if someone naturally met and feel in love with someone from one of these countries there is nothing inherently unethical about them getting married and moving to America and him supporting her financially. There is a worlds difference between that and purposefully seeking out someone in another country and offering them a better life in order to get married to them. THAT is slimey and unethical.
So would it be bad to look into other countries?
 
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AMM

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Why? Just because your wife is middle to upper class doesn't mean the lower class wouldn't be eager for a Christian husband with more money.
There's nothing wrong with women wanting a man who can provide for them. It's natural.
Dude... really? Come on. It's not your place to be making assumptions about other people's socioeconomic status or their reasons for marrying someone.

And stop with the generalizations about lower class Asian women wanting a Christian husband with money. Like Coolbutclueless said (he seems to have more of a clue than his name indicates), you're turning this into a business transaction.

Why would you be grossed out by the idea of marrying a poor woman of a different race? I honestly don't see what's so gross about it.
He's not - he's grossed out by the way you're presenting it. You're making these huge sweeping generalizations about different ethnic and class groups - that's gross.

Prostitution?!? So a poor woman wanting to marry a man who can provide for her and her future children is prostitution to you?
That's not what he's saying. Don't make a straw man of your opponent's argument.
You do realize that nearly 100% of women in most of human history married exactly for that reason, right?
Can I have a citation for that? Doesn't need to be scholarly or anything (I'm not a professor), but I'd like to see where you're getting your numbers.

Stereotypes are usually true. Why else would the stereotype exist?
Stereotypes are, by definition, false. In fact, Merriam Webster defines it as "a standardized mental picture that is held in common by members of a group and that represents an oversimplified opinion, prejudiced attitude, or uncritical judgment" (emphasis added)

An archetype, on the other hand, is the thing that's usually (technically, always) true. Perhaps that's what you're thinking of.
 
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buzuxi02

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There is a worlds difference between that and purposefully seeking out someone in another country and offering them a better life in order to get married to them. THAT is slimey and unethical.

Actually the opposite is unethical, when these "poor foreign village girls" attempt to hook rich foreigners and use them as stepping stones or as an ATM machine. Alot of men from the developed world vary from narcissists who think their American citizenship makes them adonis's to naive hopeless romantics getting scammed. I've had not only poor third world girls try to entice me on how I need to marry [them], but their mother's are even worse telling them to do whatever it takes to snare the prize.
Generally a well to do guy should indeed seek out a woman in a lower socio-economic background as the man is the head of the house. Its college educated women who have the arrogant attitude that they need a man equal or better in socio-economic status than them. Rich woman heiresses think income inequality means not to marry someone who isnt as rich as them, they discriminate against blue collar suitors.
At the same time dont think poor third world girls are some naive air heads, they know how the game is played just as well.
 
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Not David

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Actually the opposite is unethical, when these "poor foreign village girls" attempt to hook rich foreigners and use them as stepping stones or as an ATM machine. Alot of men from the developed world vary from narcissists who think their American citizenship makes them adonis's to naive hopeless romantics getting scammed. I've had not only poor third world girls try to entice me on how I need to marry [them], but their mother's are even worse telling them to do whatever it takes to snare the prize.
Generally a well to do guy should indeed seek out a woman in a lower socio-economic background as the man is the head of the house. Its college educated women who have the arrogant attitude that they need a man equal or better in socio-economic status than them. Rich woman heiresses think income inequality means not to marry someone who isnt as rich as them, they discriminate against blue collar suitors.
At the same time dont think poor third world girls are some naive air heads, they know how the game is played just as well.
That's why Taylor Swift breaks up with a lot of people. :(
 
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buzuxi02

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That's why Taylor Swift breaks up with a lot of people. :(
Lol. I can assure you the heiress to the Heinz Ketchup empire did not marry John Kerry for his looks but for his political clout and other connections.
On a more basic level I know many attractive women now in their 40's who claim they cant or never have been able to find Mr. Right. They still havent lowered their standards expecting a man with atleast a masters degree, good paying job, must be around their age (if not younger) and is a hot shot on the weekends who can get into the trendiest places in NYC. Of course those guys do exist but are now dating younger women who are still fertile.
 
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dzheremi

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Sooo...basically everybody's a slimeball and/or a wheeler dealer.

Gotcha, thread

Also, I'm a decade older than the OP...still not married...glad I didn't marry any of my earlier (Catholic) girlfriends when I was still in my 20s...could you imagine having the filioque come up in divorce court like that? "No, your honor! I object! The Holy Spirit proceeds from the Father! Even Rome taught that well after Toledo! Please see exhibits A1 through Z∞." If this board is any indication, it could get messy real quick!
 
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Coolbutclueless

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So would it be bad to look into other countries?

No but I think it would be bad to look for in a partner in an impoverished situation so you could take advantage of their situation for your own gain. Marriage should not be a prid pro quo situation.


And stop with the generalizations about lower class Asian women wanting a Christian husband with money. Like Coolbutclueless said (he seems to have more of a clue than his name indicates), you're turning this into a business transaction.

THANK YOU, finally someone who understand why I would find the suggestion in the way that he made it to be distasteful!


Your comment made it sound like you’re telling the OP to go grab some desperate poor chick from Asia....as if they’re desperate and pathetic and will do anything to get out of there.

Ding ding ding, this is why I felt unease.



Lol. I can assure you the heiress to the Heinz Ketchup empire did not marry John Kerry for his looks but for his political clout and other connections.
On a more basic level I know many attractive women now in their 40's who claim they cant or never have been able to find Mr. Right. They still havent lowered their standards expecting a man with atleast a masters degree, good paying job, must be around their age (if not younger) and is a hot shot on the weekends who can get into the trendiest places in NYC. Of course those guys do exist but are now dating younger women who are still fertile.


. Its college educated women who have the arrogant attitude that they need a man equal or better in socio-economic status than them. Rich woman heiresses think income inequality means not to marry someone who isnt as rich as them, they discriminate against blue collar suitors.
At the same time dont think poor third world girls are some naive air heads, they know how the game is played just as well.

I'm sorry but your entire view of women is just horrible. Sexism is not a christian virtue and I'm not sure why some of the people on here hold sexist views that flat out are not true. Women are not arrogant because they want someone educated, and what does them going to college have to do with anything? How on earth are you making a woman getting an education into a BAD thing, thats insane.
 
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buzuxi02

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I'm sorry but your entire view of women is just horrible. Sexism is not a christian virtue and I'm not sure why some of the people on here hold sexist views that flat out are not true. Women are not arrogant because they want someone educated, and what does them going to college have to do with anything? How on earth are you making a woman getting an education into a BAD thing, thats insane.
I guess you didnt understand my comment as it's about how women discriminate against blue collar men. These are NYC women (actually the many 40+ plus year old Greek-Cypriot women I personally know from NY) who refuse to date men with anything less than a masters degree and a 6 figure income salary, but wonder why they are not married while their less attractive friends have been happily married for years.
My comment is also about the myth of the "poor village girl" being taken away from her parents by a rich foreigner. Many of these impoverished girls and their mothers' are quite cunning and clever which I knew from personal experiences.
 
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I think the problem is that people are seeing in the suggestion that one take advantage, somewhat, of a poor woman's desire/need for financial help and support.

There's nothing wrong with marrying a richer or poorer husband or wife. There's nothing wrong with taking care of people. There's nothing wrong with seeking a foreign spouse.

I think people are hearing "take advantage of a poor Asian woman" though. Hopefully that's not what is meant.
 
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