Grace Community Church Defies Court With Packed Sunday Service

[Archivist]

Well, if they met like the early church did in the first place, maybe they would be considered one household, which wouldn't need to social distance, huh.

If they all lived together they would be considered one household. If they lived separately and were just meeting to worship that isn’t one household.

 

[Tone]

Our main concern should not be politics

Don't you see that this is all this story has become?

This is what MacArthur's church is doing in my humble opinion.

Well Macarthur isn't a low profile pastor, the guy's got a study bible.

I'm sure, in his humble opinion, he's got a good case for what he and his congregation decided on.

Maybe it's best not to judge before the time.

 

[Tone]

If they all lived together they would be considered one household. If they lived separately and were just meeting to worship that isn’t one household.

Exactly, let this be a lesson to the household of God.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Don't you see that this is all this story has become?

From whose perspective? Jesus said narrow is the way. Followers of Christ will not hang on long to this kind of story and neither will they be overly concerned about politics.

Well Macarthur isn't a low profile pastor, the guy's got a study bible.

John MacArthur is a Calvinist and he teaches that a believer can sin and still be saved.

Some Calvinists will boast in "Lordship Salvation" that is promoted by John MacArthur, but I believe this is a Trojan horse. John MacArthur does not really believe we must live holy exactly (as a part of salvation).

John MacArthur (A Calvinist) also teaches that a believer can commit suicide and still be saved.

He says, I quote: "At the trial, MacArthur, 45, is seeking to clarify his church’s teaching on suicide. “It’s not only a sin, it’s illegal,” he says. “But we teach that even if a believer takes his own life, the Lord will still receive him into His presence.”

Source:
Fundamentalist Clergymen Face Charges of 'Malpractice' When a Parishioner Turns to Suicide

John MacArthur says that a person can take the mark of the beast and they can still be saved afterwards. Listen to this audio clip by him here:

https://www.evangelicaloutreach.org/audio/macarthur-take-mark.mp3

John MacArthur says, ".. sin does not result in spiritual death for the believer ... (The MacArthur Study Bible, p. 1927, comment on James 1:15)"

Also, check out this video on John MacArthur teaching that we can sin and still be saved: (Important Note: Turn down sound at the beginning of the video just in case you may have sensitive hearing like me):

I'm sure, in his humble opinion, he's got a good case for what he and his congregation decided on.

Maybe it's best not to judge before the time.

So they are immune from the virus, and in spreading it to others?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Well Macarthur isn't a low profile pastor, the guy's got a study bible.

He is a Calvinist. If you don't know anything about Calvinism, it basically is saying in their main point of Unconditional Election that some people are chosen by God to be saved, and other people are chosen by God to be damned, and nobody has a free will choice to choose God or reject Him. God decides who is saved and unsaved. So God chooses some to be burned for all eternity alive out of His good will and pleasure. In my humble opinion in reading the Bible, this does not sound like the God I know. The story of Jonah does not depict this kind of God. God changed His mind based on the Ninevite people repenting and it was not God who forced changed them to repent.

 

[Tone]

Whoa, it looks like you already had all this locked n loaded to go!

Are you watching this man as an "Antichrist" candidate?

So they are immune from the virus, and in spreading it to others?

Now I'm gonna play like all the scientists and politicians and ask for the numbers on this.

*Any cases out of this gathering?

**Any increase in the San Fernando Valley?

 

[Tone]

He is a Calvinist. If you don't know anything about Calvinism, it basically is saying in their main point of Unconditional Election that some people are chosen by God to be saved, and other people are chosen by God to be damned, and nobody has a free will choice to choose God or reject Him. God decides who is saved and unsaved. So God chooses some to be burned for all eternity alive out of His good will and pleasure. In my humble opinion in reading the Bible, this does not sound like the God I know. The story of Jonah does not depict this kind of God. God changed His mind based on the Ninevite people repenting and it was not God who forced changed them to repent.

Politics...

 

[Archivist]

Exactly, let this be a lesson to the household of God.

We should all move in together?

 

[Tone]

We should all move in together?

If you don't get it...give it some time.

 

[Archivist]

If you don't get it...give it some time.

It is easy to get. Either you are all living together or you are not.

 

[RDKirk]

It is easy to get. Either you are all living together or you are not.

The 1st century church did not all live together, but they were in constant enough contact with each other--and probably fairly stand-offi-ish with everyone else. It was rather the norm for those days. If one found oneself in the interior of a building with someone else (as opposed to being in an open courtyard or marketplace), that was probably a family member or a close friend.

For instance, we have our daughter and a couple of very close friends who don't mind sharing close space with--having meals together and such--because we take care to come into such contact only with each other to a definite exclusion of others.

It's not impossible for a congregation to do the same. But they'd all have to be very trustworthy that they maintain sufficient distance from everyone else and follow strict protocols everywhere else.

 

[Archivist]

The 1st century church did not all live together, but they were in constant enough contact with each other--and probably fairly stand-offi-ish with everyone else. It was rather the norm for those days. If one found oneself in the interior of a building with someone else (as opposed to being in an open courtyard or marketplace), that was probably a family member or a close friend.

For instance, we have our daughter and a couple of very close friends who don't mind sharing close space with--having meals together and such--because we take care to come into such contact only with each other to a definite exclusion of others.

It's not impossible for a congregation to do the same. But they'd all have to be very trustworthy that they maintain sufficient distance from everyone else and follow strict protocols everywhere else.

And since that can't be proven it wouldn't qualify as one household as was claimed.

 

[Tone]

It is easy to get. Either you are all living together or you are not.

You can live separate, yet meet together daily.

*Instead of just one day a week.

 

[usexpat97]

And who is it that is being lawless? A person going to a church service or a rioter?

It is possible that a bunch of Pharisees defying the government "in God's name" and attending church services are lawless--AND it is possible that rioters are fighting for their own freedom.

 

[Archivist]

You can live separate, yet meet together daily.

*Instead of just one day a week.

And, again, that wouldn't qualify as a household.

 

[RDKirk]

And since that can't be proven it wouldn't qualify as one household as was claimed.

Well, I do believe that some states and localities have gone beyond clinical necessity in the measures they've imposed. There isn't a clinical case for curtailing parking lot tailgate services, for instances. That kind of thing is a case of governmental overreach. Even Dr Fauci has been seen at open-air sports events with his mask below his chin.

How a congregation should respond to that overreach is, however, a separate issue. We should not respond to provocation as the world would respond to provocation.

 

[Tone]

And, again, that wouldn't qualify as a household.

Well then, I guess the lesson involves deciding who/what will define us.

 

[Tone]

Keep in mind I'm not pro

Well then, I guess the lesson involves deciding who/what will define us.

Is this the same government that defines two married men (to each other) as an household?

 

[renniks]

Also, check out this video on John MacArthur teaching that we can sin and still be saved: (

So? Everyone does.

I'm not a calvinist but I don't see how this enters the conversation..

 

[usexpat97]

The only potential discredit I see on John MacArthur right now is the lack of evidence that he tried to work things out with local authorities first. If it's just "California is anti-God, I'm going to stick it to them," then that is not in line with Paul's teaching. There needs to be evidence that they REALLY WERE trying to shut down the church under the pretext of Covid. We've got churches all around the world reaching compromises with the local authorities. Why is Grace not?