jgr said in post #153:
The RCC has never repudiated the claim, therefore it is still doctrine.
Note that it isn't. For ask the pope today or any other Catholic if it's the doctrine of the RCC that the pope is Jesus Christ Himself. They will all reject that idea as false doctrine.
jgr said in post #153:
To claim to be another Christ is to deny the one and only Christ.
Note that no pope ever claimed to be "another" Christ, just as no pope ever denied that Jesus is the Christ, as the future Antichrist will do (1 John 2:22), and without ever claiming to be Christ himself.
Also, note that no pope ever denied YHWH God the Father, as the future (Gnostic) Antichrist will do (1 John 2:22b).
jgr said in post #153:
He concluded by saying that he was God on the earth . . .
But the preceding context showed that he meant he had God's authority on the earth.
jgr said in post #153:
Never repudiated by the RCC, therefore not considered mistaken.
The RCC idea of the Immaculate Conception is mistaken because it's not Biblical. Also, that RCC idea doesn't claim that Christ isn't in the flesh, as the future (Gnostic) Antichrist will claim (1 John 4:3).
jgr said in post #153:
2 Thessalonians 2:4 is fulfilled by the papal man of sin who sits in spiritual authority within the Church and proclaims himself God (as seen in the above quotes).
Note that 2 Thessalonians 2:4 makes no reference to the Church, but to a future, 3rd Jewish temple in Jerusalem.
For Revelation 11:1-2, Matthew 24:15, Daniel 11:31,36 and 2 Thessalonians 2:4 require there will be a 3rd Jewish temple in the earthly Jerusalem during the future Tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24. This 3rd temple will coexist with the Church like the 2nd temple did (Luke 24:53, Acts 2:46, Acts 22:17), and like the temple building in heaven does (Revelation 11:19). The 3rd temple could be built on Jerusalem's Temple Mount by the ultra-Orthodox Jews, after they (or great earthquakes) clear the site by destroying the Muslim Dome of the Rock and the Al Aqsa Mosque. Shortly after they build the temple, the future Antichrist could attack and defeat them, and a false Messiah leading them (Daniel 11:22).
Then the Antichrist could "cut" a peace treaty with them and their false "Messiah" (Daniel 9:26a, Daniel 11:23a), permitting them to keep the temple, and to continue to (mistakenly) perform the daily Mosaic animal sacrifices in front of it, for at least 7 years (Daniel 9:27a), so long as they give up the outer court of the temple (Revelation 11:2a) to the Muslims, so the Muslims can rebuild the Al Aqsa Mosque on the southern end of the Temple Mount and resume worship there. The ultra-Orthodox Jews could grudgingly agree to this, if the only other option is for them to lose the temple entirely. They could then build a high wall between the temple and the mosque to keep the temple from being "defiled".
But then, only some 3.5 years after making the peace treaty, the Antichrist will break the treaty, attack the temple, stop the daily Mosaic animal sacrifices, place the abomination of desolation (possibly a standing, android image of the Antichrist) in the holy place (the inner sanctum) of the temple (Daniel 9:27b, Daniel 11:31, Matthew 24:15), and then sit himself (at least one time) in the temple and proclaim himself God (2 Thessalonians 2:4, Daniel 11:36). Thus could begin the Antichrist's literal, 3.5-year Luciferian (Satanic) worldwide reign of terror (Revelation 13:4-18, Revelation 12:9; 2 Thessalonians 2:9).
At the very end of the future Tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24, the Antichrist (Daniel 11:45) and the world's armies will pillage Jerusalem right before Jesus Christ's Second Coming (Zechariah 14:2-21). And at the Second Coming there will be tremendous earth changes in the vicinity of Jerusalem (Zechariah 14:4-5). These events could result in all of Jerusalem's structures, including the 3rd temple and the Wailing Wall (also called the Western Wall), being broken down so not one stone will be left on another (Luke 19:44, Matthew 24:2). Then the returned Jesus (Zechariah 14:4, Acts 1:11-12) will rebuild Jerusalem and make it the capital of the world (Zechariah 14:8-19, Micah 4:1-4). He will also build a 4th temple there (Zechariah 14:20-21, Zechariah 6:12-13). It will serve a similar function for the Church during the future Millennium (of Revelation 20:4-6) as the 2nd temple served for the Church in the 1st century AD (Luke 24:53, Acts 2:46, Acts 22:17), and as the temple building in heaven (Revelation 11:19) serves for those in heaven (Revelation 7:15).
jgr said in post #153:
Daniel 11:36 refers to Herod. Matthew 24:15 refers to the Romans during the destruction of Jerusalem.
Note that they refer to the future Antichrist, just as Daniel 11:31 does. For regarding the "abomination of desolation", Daniel 11:31 was typically fulfilled by the abomination of desolation in 1 Maccabees 1:54 which occurred in the holy place (the inner sanctum) of the 2nd Jewish temple in Jerusalem in the time of Antiochus IV. But per Jesus Christ's statement in Matthew 24:15 the Church will see the abomination of desolation in Daniel 11:31 fulfilled (antitypically) in the future when the Church will see the abomination of desolation stand in the holy place (of a 3rd Jewish temple in Jerusalem). This future abomination of desolation could be a standing, android image of the Antichrist (Revelation 13:15) which his followers ("they") will put in the holy place of the temple (Daniel 11:31) to be worshipped (Revelation 13:15) after they've stopped the daily Mosaic animal sacrifices which the ultra-Orthodox Jews will have restarted in front of the temple (Daniel 11:31). This image will pollute the holy place of the temple (Daniel 11:31).
The Antichrist will then fulfill Daniel 11:36 and 2 Thessalonians 2:4 by sitting himself (at least one time) in the temple and proclaiming himself God. By the power of Satan (the dragon, Revelation 12:9), the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of Revelation's "beast") will then rule and be worshipped by all the nations of the earth for 3.5 literal years (Revelation 13:4-18), and will physically overcome Biblical Christians (not in hiding) in every nation (Revelation 13:7-10, Revelation 14:12-13, Revelation 20:4-6, Matthew 24:9-13).
Also, from the day on which (antitypically) "the daily sacrifice shall be taken away, and the abomination that maketh desolate set up, there shall be 1,290 days. Blessed is he that waiteth, and cometh to the 1,335 days" (Daniel 12:11-12, Revelation 16:15). Also, because the Antichrist will fulfill Daniel 11:31 antitypically (Matthew 24:15) and will fulfill Daniel 11:36 for the 1st and only time (2 Thessalonians 2:4), he will also fulfill all of Daniel 11:21-45 (the 1st part antitypically and the rest for the 1st and only time) when he arises on the world stage. For that passage refers to the career of the same man. And since the Antichrist will fulfill all of Daniel 11:21-45 when he arises on the world stage, then just preceding his arising on the world stage, Daniel 11:13-19 could be fulfilled antitypically by a future, Iraqi Baathist General (the Antichrist's precursor) who will defeat and occupy Israel and Egypt with a huge Iraqi Army (Daniel 11:15-17; in verse 17 the original Hebrew word translated as "daughter" is "bath").
jgr said in post #153:
The apostate papacy was the predominant spiritual and secular authority during its reign. It was never threatened militarily by the saints, yet itself "made war with the saints, and wore them out." (Daniel 7:21,25).
Daniel 7:21,25 refers to the future Antichrist.
Similarly, Daniel 12:7b means at Jesus Christ's future, Second Coming, He will come to a Church which will have been completely defeated physically by the Antichrist. For during the Antichrist's future, literal 3.5-year worldwide reign, he will be allowed to make war against the Church and overcome it physically in every nation (Revelation 13:5-10, Revelation 14:12-13, Revelation 20:4-6, Matthew 24:9-13). It's only when the Antichrist has completely broken all the physical power of the Church that the future Tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24 will end (Daniel 12:7b), and Jesus' Second Coming will immediately occur, at which time He will physically resurrect and rapture (gather together) the Church (Matthew 24:29-31; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8, Revelation 19:7 to 20:6). And at His Second Coming, Jesus Christ will tread the winepress of God's wrath alone (Isaiah 63:3, Revelation 19:15-21), and so He/God will get all the glory for defeating the power of evil on the earth (Deuteronomy 32:39-43). For He/God won't share this glory with the Church (cf. Isaiah 42:8-14, Isaiah 26:18).
jgr said in post #153:
There is no parallel with the US, which was militarily threatened by the Axis coalition.
Note that Protestant armies threatened the pope much more than Axis armies ever threatened the U.S. itself.
Also, Christians are never to respond with violence to any threat, or even outright attack (Matthew 5:39).
jgr said in post #153:
Matthew 24, Mark 13 and Luke 21 have been almost completely fulfilled historically in the destruction of Jerusalem and Judea in the time period of 70 AD.
Note that they haven't. For example, regarding "Judaea" (Matthew 24:16), this doesn't have to mean 1st century AD Judaea. For there are many churches in Judaea (southern Israel) still today. They contain mostly Gentile Christians, not just Jewish Christians. The Church began and has always been in Judaea: "Then had the churches rest throughout all Judaea" (Acts 9:31); "the churches of Judaea" (Galatians 1:22); "the churches... in Judaea" (1 Thessalonians 2:14). Matthew 24:16 refers to those in the Church, whether Gentiles or Jews, who will be living in Judaea at the future point in time when the abomination of desolation (possibly a standing, android image of the Antichrist) is set up in the holy place (the inner sanctum) of a 3rd Jewish temple in Jerusalem (Matthew 24:15, Daniel 11:31).
The future Antichrist's persecution of the Church could begin in Jerusalem and Judaea right after the abomination of desolation is set up and the Antichrist sits in the temple (at least one time) and proclaims himself God (2 Thessalonians 2:4, Daniel 11:36). So to avoid this persecution (cf. Matthew 10:23a), those in the Church living in Judaea should flee immediately after they see the abomination of desolation set up (Matthew 24:15-16), which event could occur at the midpoint of the future Tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24, and which event could mark the start of the Antichrist's literal 3.5-year worldwide reign (Revelation 13:4-18). Eventually, the Antichrist's persecution of the Church (not in hiding) will reach every nation (Revelation 13:7-10, Revelation 14:12-13, Revelation 20:4-6, Matthew 24:9-13). So the basic principle of Matthew 24:16, of fleeing (the Antichrist's persecution), would apply to Christians around the world.
Just as the woman in Revelation 12:6 represents different people in the Church around the world, so the protected wilderness place she flees to represents different, protected wilderness places around the world. When those in the Church living in Judaea see the abomination of desolation set up (Matthew 24:15), they should flee to places in the wilderness east of Judaea, the mountains (Matthew 24:16) of Jordan. And those in the Church who will be living in places other than Judaea should flee to other wilderness places, mountainous places (Ezekiel 7:16), in the regions of the world where they live.
And they should have prepared beforehand hideouts in these wilderness/mountain places, hideouts already fully stocked with all the emergency supplies of canned food, bottled water, warm clothing and bedding, etc., that they and their families and fellow Christians will need to survive (cf. 1 Timothy 5:8, Matthew 24:45-46, cf. Genesis 41:48,36, Genesis 45:7) until Jesus Christ returns, possibly on the 1,335th day after the abomination of desolation is set up (Daniel 12:11-12, Revelation 16:15). For they shouldn't carry any supplies with them when they flee (Matthew 24:17-18). They should flee as unhindered and quickly as possible, knowing that when the abomination of desolation is set up, that could signal the beginning of the future Antichrist's literal 3.5-year Luciferian/Satanic worldwide reign of terror (Revelation 13:4-18, Revelation 12:9), when he will be given power to make war against all Biblical Christians he can get his hands on, and to physically overcome them and kill them (by beheading) in every nation (Revelation 13:7-10, Revelation 14:12-13, Revelation 20:4-6, Matthew 24:9-13).
jgr said in post #153:
The ten kingdoms emerging from the pagan Roman empire were the Heruli, Suevi, Burgundians, Huns, Ostrogoths, Visigoths, Vandals, Lombards, Franks, and Anglo-Saxons.
Note that they weren't. For the Roman empire consisted not only of parts of Europe, but also included the Middle East and North Africa. So the 10 nations emerging from the former territory of the Roman empire could be the present-day nations of Germany, the U.K., France, Italy, Spain, Turkey, Egypt, Iraq, Algeria and Syria. Also, the 10 part-iron/part-clay toes of Daniel 2:42 could represent the same thing as the 10 horns of Daniel 7:7. And the Europeans could be the iron and the Arabs and Turks could be the clay. In Daniel 2:43 the inability of the iron to mix with the clay could represent how, for example, there are many Turks living in Germany but they remain separated in ghettoes within German cities. Similarly, there are many Arab Algerians living in France but they remain separated in ghettoes within French cities.
jgr said in post #153:
The historical papacy reigned from 538 AD to 1798 AD, a period of 1260 years corresponding to the time period of 3.5 years when the day-year prophetic correlation is applied.
Note that there is no such thing (yet) as "The historical papacy", in the sense that the papacy never ceased to exist, and it continues on today.
Also, Revelation chapters 11 to 14 show from 4 different angles the same,
literal, and never-fulfilled, 3.5 years (Revelation 11:2-3, Revelation 12:6,14, Revelation 13:5-18, Revelation 14:9-13) of the future Antichrist's worldwide reign (Revelation 13:4-18), which will occur after the never-fulfilled Revelation chapters 6 to 10 and before the never-fulfilled Revelation chapters 15 to 21, and which reign will legally end at the future Tribulation's 7th trumpet (Revelation 11:15).
[Similarly, the 70 years in the fulfilled prophecy of Jeremiah 29:10 (Daniel 9:2) were literal years (Zechariah 7:5), and the 400 years in the fulfilled prophecy of Genesis 15:13 were literal years.]
Also, just as Revelation chapters 12 to 14 have never been fulfilled, neither has Revelation 11.
For example, in the never-fulfilled Revelation 11:3-12, the Two Witnesses could be literally Moses and Elijah. For the 2 men seen "standing before the God of the earth" (Revelation 11:4) at the Transfiguration were Moses and Elijah (Matthew 17:3). And in Revelation 11:4 the 2 "olive trees" refer back to the 2 men who were already standing by the Lord by the time of the prophet Zechariah (Zechariah 4:11,14), which was subsequent to the times of Moses and Elijah.
Moses and Elijah could come down from heaven in their mortal bodies at the midpoint of the future Tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24, just as they came down at the Transfiguration. Also, the plagues which the Two Witnesses will cause (Revelation 11:6,5) will match plagues which Moses and Elijah caused in Old Testament times (James 5:17, Exodus 7:20; 2 Kings 1:10-14).
Elijah never died, but was taken physically into heaven (2 Kings 2:11b). And the archangel Michael retrieved Moses' dead body from Satan (Jude 1:9). Michael could have then taken Moses' recently-dead body into heaven, where it could have been resuscitated by God back to mortal life, like how, for example, Lazarus' recently-dead body was resuscitated by God back to mortal life (John 12:1). This would explain how both Moses and Elijah could be alive at the Transfiguration (Matthew 17:3).
The Two Witnesses will prophesy and bring plagues on the world during the literal 3.5 years (Revelation 11:2b-3,6) of the future Antichrist's worldwide reign (Revelation 13:5,7, Revelation 12:6,14), which will be in the latter half of the future Tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24. That's why the Antichrist's reign will legally end (Revelation 11:15) right after the time of the Two Witnesses on the earth will end (Revelation 11:12-15). The plagues they will bring (Revelation 11:6) will be part of the Tribulation's 2nd woe/6th trumpet (Revelation 11:14, Revelation 9:12-13). The Two Witnesses will be taken up to heaven before the Tribulation's 7th trumpet sounds (Revelation 11:12,15).
They may not be witnesses in the sense of evangelizing the world (Acts 1:8). For the original Greek word (martus: G3144) translated as "witnesses" (Revelation 11:3) can also refer to those who witness against people and bring punishment against them (Acts 7:58). The reason there will be 2 witnesses (Revelation 11:3) who will bring plagues to torment the unrepentant world (Revelation 11:6,10b) would be because 2 witnesses are required to bring judgment against people (1 Timothy 5:19). At the same time, the 2 "witnesses" could be called that because both of them will be martyred (Revelation 11:7-9). For the same original Greek word translated as "witnesses" (Revelation 11:3) can refer to "martyrs" (Revelation 17:6).
jgr said in post #153:
Daniel 7:25 refers to the papacy changing the sabbath and alteration of the Ten Commandments, as well as instituting unscriptural rituals, practices, times, and observances e.g. "holy days".
Note that nothing requires that. Instead, Daniel 7:25 can refer to the future Antichrist making radical changes to our calendar and system of time-keeping.
jgr said in post #153:
All applicable prophecies in Daniel 7, 2 Thessalonians 2, John's epistles, and Revelation 13 are fulfilled by the papal antichrist.
Note that they aren't. For example, the papacy never fulfilled Revelation 13's "image of the beast" (Revelation 13:14-15).
jgr said in post #153:
The mark of the beast is fulfilled in VICARIVS FILII DEI.
Note that it isn't. For "Vicarius Filii Dei", a title of the pope, was never placed as a mark on the hand or forehead of people (Revelation 13:16). Also, no one was ever unable to buy or sell (Revelation 13:17) without receiving a mark of the pope.
Also, instead of "The
mark of the beast", did you mean the "
number" of the beast, 666 (Revelation 13:18)?
If so, note that "Vicarius Filii Dei" only equals 666 when by mistake people use the Roman-numeral method of counting the number of a name:
V = 5
I = 1
C = 100
A
R
I = 1
U = 5 (because under this method U is the same as V)
S
F
I = 1
L = 50
I = 1
I = 1
D = 500
E
I = 1
Total = 666
This doesn't mean the pope is the Antichrist. It just means the Roman-numeral method gives false positives. For example:
E
L = 50
L = 50
E
N
G
O
U = 5
L = 50
D = 500
W = 10 (because W = double U = UU = VV)
H
I = 1
T
E
Total = 666
This doesn't mean the most important early leader of the SDA view is the Antichrist. It just means the SDA view (or any other view) shouldn't employ the Roman-numeral method of counting the number of a name, instead of the Bible's own method, which is gematria.
jgr said in post #153:
No pope or any other Catholic has ever officially repudiated the historic claims.
That doesn't mean that Catholics or any sane pope has ever believed that the pope is God Himself or Jesus Christ Himself.
jgr said in post #153:
The papacy is still with us; it has not gone.
Then are you claiming that the papacy is still the Antichrist, so that the Antichrist hasn't "come and gone"?
jgr said in post #153:
The papacy is still with us; it has not gone.
That's right, which contradicts the mistaken, SDA, "538 AD to 1798 AD" idea.
Are you SDA?
Also, are you aware that SDA doctrine is in many respects different than Reformed doctrine?
Also, which of the Reformers ever referred to the "538 AD to 1798 AD" idea?
And how could the Reformers have referred to it, when they lived hundreds of years before 1798?