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Acts 16:14

Discussion in 'Salvation (Soteriology)' started by Hammster, Feb 15, 2014.

  1. FreeGrace2

    FreeGrace2 Senior Veteran

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    Her condition was an unregenerate, unsaved woman who "worshiped God". She was seeking Him, and He let her find Him. By grace, of course. :)

    Acts 16:14 - A woman named Lydia, from the city of Thyatira, a seller of purple fabrics, a worshiper of God, was listening; and the Lord opened her heart to respond to the things spoken by Paul.

    How can an unregenerate unsaved person be described as a "worshiper of God"? Many Calvinists on this forum claim that all unregenerate people hate God and want nothing to do with Him.

    Yet, here we have a woman who worshiped God, and listened to what Paul was saying.

    Of course the Calvinist response will be something like "God regenerated her so that she was seeking God. So, where is that found in Scripture? And speciifically about her?

    The answer? It isn't found anywhere in Scripture. But RT must assume that it is true anyway.

    The only issue in Acts 16 regarding Lydia is that she believed the gospel. There is nothing about being regenerated. We know she became regenerated because she believed, and all believers are regenerated. But RT has no claim on this verse as a proof text.

    She was seeking God and God let her find him.

    Quite similar to this verse:

    2 Chron 15:2 - and he went out to meet Asa and said to him, “Listen to me, Asa, and all Judah and Benjamin: the LORD is with you when you are with Him. And if you seek Him, He will let you find Him; but if you forsake Him, He will forsake you.
     
  2. Skala

    Skala I'm a Saint. Not because of me, but because of Him

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    Why do you assume she was unregenerate? It's not mentioned anywhere in scripture. Nor is it said specifically about her. But FG2 theology must assume it.

    See how easy it is to use your arguments against yourself, just by reversing the words back towards you? This demonstrates that your argumentation is shallow, and it also shows that most of your argumentation is nothing but assertions.
     
  3. Hammster

    Hammster Private Status. Do Not Read. Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    Why did God need to open her heart? What was wrong with it?
     
  4. Hammster

    Hammster Private Status. Do Not Read. Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    Well, that went about how I figured it would.
     
  5. FreeGrace2

    FreeGrace2 Senior Veteran

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    She was unsaved, unregenerate, and in need of salvation. And she was seeking God, per her worship. He let her find Him. What's wrong with that?

    When people seek God, God provides what they need to know. What's wrong with that?

    btw, how come neither Lydia nor Cornelius hated God, though unbelievers, unsaved, and unregenerated, given that Calvinists claim that unregenerated people all hate God. How do you explain that? Seems my point has been dodged.
     
  6. Hammster

    Hammster Private Status. Do Not Read. Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    Why did God need to open her heart? That's the question that I asked. You are under no obligation to answer it, but please don't pretend that you have.
     
  7. FreeGrace2

    FreeGrace2 Senior Veteran

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    She was unsaved, unregenerate, and in need of salvation. And she was seeking God, per her worship. He let her find Him. What's wrong with that?

    When people seek God, God provides what they need to know. What's wrong with that?

    btw, how come neither Lydia nor Cornelius hated God, though unbelievers, unsaved, and unregenerated, given that Calvinists claim that unregenerated people all hate God. How do you explain that? Seems my point has been dodged.
     
  8. Hammster

    Hammster Private Status. Do Not Read. Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    Okay, don't answer the question. I'll stop bugging you.
     
  9. shturt678s

    shturt678s Regular Member

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    RT went too far one way and you too too far the other way. Lydia was saved in the sense of Matt.13:3-43, obviously still veiled parabolic language where at Acts.16:14 she was exactly at Matt.13:44 on. :eek:

    Old Jack
     
  10. shturt678s

    shturt678s Regular Member

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    God didn't need to open her heart, ie, was already open. :idea:

    She no longer worshipped the sun god Tyriminas most likely. :eek:

    Old Jack
     
  11. FreeGrace2

    FreeGrace2 Senior Veteran

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    I did, and you should.
     
  12. Hammster

    Hammster Private Status. Do Not Read. Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    Well, you addressed the question. But you didn't answer it.
     
  13. FreeGrace2

    FreeGrace2 Senior Veteran

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    Glad you brought up "veiled". 2 Cor 3:16 - but whenever a person turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away.

    Please don't ignore the sequence here, as do the RTs. ;)

    Lydia had "turned to the Lord" by her worship. And God removed the veil. Very simple and straightforward.
     
  14. FreeGrace2

    FreeGrace2 Senior Veteran

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    I did. I thought there would no further "bugging" posts. Thanks for the heads-up on how to take your comments.
     
  15. shturt678s

    shturt678s Regular Member

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    Hey, I asnwered the question, and am absolutely 'buggable' ;)

    Old Jack where time keeps coming upon me like a windshied on a 'bug'
     
  16. Hammster

    Hammster Private Status. Do Not Read. Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    I'm just not going to keep asking a question that I know you'll not answer.
     
  17. FreeGrace2

    FreeGrace2 Senior Veteran

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    Lovable, huggable, and buggable. My comment was directed at one who continues to bug after saying he wouldn't.

    I guess I should add, "squishable", too. ;)
     
  18. FreeGrace2

    FreeGrace2 Senior Veteran

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    This post was not only completely unnecessary , but quite buggable, which you promised not to do. Good to know.

    Here was the "promise": <wink, wink> (post #88)

    Okay, don't answer the question. I'll stop bugging you.
     
  19. Hammster

    Hammster Private Status. Do Not Read. Staff Member Site Advisor Supporter

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    A woman named Lydia, from the city of Thyatira, a seller of purple fabrics, a worshiper of God, was listening; and the Lord opened her heart to respond to the things spoken by Paul. (Acts 16:14 NASB)

    Why was it necessary for Jesus to open her heart? What was wrong with her in the first place? Did she not have the free will to choose prior to that?




    Just in case anyone wants to actually address the OP.
     
  20. cygnusx1

    cygnusx1 Jacob the twister.....

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    After The Lord opened her heart it was straightforward , prior to that it's was far from simple .

    There is a spectrum of how The Lord saves , if one compares Paul's conversion ordeal with Lydia's there is a vast difference , yet both are a direct result of Gods will not human choice , The Lord opened Lydia's heart to receive ! Divine Grace is powerful. It isn't merely a kind gesture
     
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