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FreeGrace2 said: ↑
The point remains that "have not believed" means "have NEVER believed" whether or not you grasp that concept
The present tense is a bogus deal. People argue that the present means ongoing action is required for ongoing salvation. iow, loss of faith equals loss of salvation.
If that were true, then what Jesus said IS a LIE. Why don't you see that?
Too many people have agendas to protect, rather than just letting Scripture speak.
Both John 3:18 and 2 Thess 2:12 say that.
Using a verse with a list of sins to try to prove that salvation can be lost only reveals your own agenda.
What you do not understand is that sin isn't the issue in salvation. Yes, all men are sinners. But some sinners will go to heaven. Why? Because Jesus gave them the gift of eternal life and therefore, they shall never perish.
Those who "have not believed", which means "have NEVER believed" do NOT receive eternal life, and therefore will perish. You can bet on it.
When Jesus said that recipients of eternal life shall never perish, He meant every word.
We know WHEN a person receives eternal life; when they believe. John 5:24.
So, from the MOMENT of saving faith in Christ, that person shall never perish.
You cannot show ANY verse that refutes what Jesus said. So quit trying to.
Those who reject eternal security and refuse to believe the clear words of Jesus simply don't have a grip on "grace". None whatsoever.
Even the goody two shoes who believe in Christ and live a quite and obedient life STILL do NOT deserve heaven. Don't you see that? No more than Charles Templeton, the evangelist who mentored Billy Graham, but eventually left the faith over a faulty teaching that he couldn't reconcile with the Bible. So he concluded that God wasn't real.
Arminians (anti-OSAS) always emphasize lifestyle as the key issue in whether one goes to heaven or not. They just completely miss grace. They don't understand it.
The point remains that "have not believed" means "have NEVER believed" whether or not you grasp that concept
The Bible isn't a collection of unrelated verses.Yet there's plenty of verse saying if you don't believe ( present tense) you don't have eternal life.
The present tense is a bogus deal. People argue that the present means ongoing action is required for ongoing salvation. iow, loss of faith equals loss of salvation.
If that were true, then what Jesus said IS a LIE. Why don't you see that?
Too many people have agendas to protect, rather than just letting Scripture speak.
The "second death" is for those who "have not believed". They WILL BE condemned."But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars—they will be consigned to the fiery lake of burning sulfur. This is the second death.”
Both John 3:18 and 2 Thess 2:12 say that.
Using a verse with a list of sins to try to prove that salvation can be lost only reveals your own agenda.
What you do not understand is that sin isn't the issue in salvation. Yes, all men are sinners. But some sinners will go to heaven. Why? Because Jesus gave them the gift of eternal life and therefore, they shall never perish.
Those who "have not believed", which means "have NEVER believed" do NOT receive eternal life, and therefore will perish. You can bet on it.
Scripture isn't bound to say only what you seem to demand it say. Please be rational and reasonable.Again, it says nothing about those who once believed back in grade school but now are atheists.
When Jesus said that recipients of eternal life shall never perish, He meant every word.
We know WHEN a person receives eternal life; when they believe. John 5:24.
So, from the MOMENT of saving faith in Christ, that person shall never perish.
You cannot show ANY verse that refutes what Jesus said. So quit trying to.
Those who reject eternal security and refuse to believe the clear words of Jesus simply don't have a grip on "grace". None whatsoever.
Even the goody two shoes who believe in Christ and live a quite and obedient life STILL do NOT deserve heaven. Don't you see that? No more than Charles Templeton, the evangelist who mentored Billy Graham, but eventually left the faith over a faulty teaching that he couldn't reconcile with the Bible. So he concluded that God wasn't real.
Arminians (anti-OSAS) always emphasize lifestyle as the key issue in whether one goes to heaven or not. They just completely miss grace. They don't understand it.
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