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eclipsenow · Thursday at 7:44 PM

ozso said:
Nice rant.

Again - when you can address anything substantive, with real world data, I'm all ears.
I like being pushed and learning new things. If they're real.

Hentenza · Thursday at 7:40 PM

concretecamper said:
You hit the nail on the head. Subjective truth instead of objective truth.

Oh no it is objective truth. Next time don’t mine quote my post. I’m done talking to you.

concretecamper · Thursday at 7:39 PM

2PhiloVoid said:
I'm already a Christian, so I'm sure there are, and will be, ZERO consequences for my deviance of not fully subscribing to everything that comes from the Roman Catholic Church proper.

Don't like that I said that? TOO BAD !!! Keep pushing me.

A second example of subjective truth.

Hentenza · Thursday at 7:39 PM

RileyG said:
The Catholic response is yes, sort of.

The RCC does recognize the validity of the sacraments of the EO, OO, and Assyrian Church of the East because they are ancient and apostolic with valid bishops.

The Church just views them as in schism because they aren’t in union with the Bishop of Rome.

But those churches are as valid as yours and so are post reformation churches. All encompass the body of believers in the church universal.

concretecamper · Thursday at 7:38 PM

Hentenza said:
valid to me

You hit the nail on the head. Subjective truth instead of objective truth.

concretecamper · Thursday at 7:37 PM

Hentenza said:
Just not THA Catholic Church. Your church was merely one among many that the apostles planted.

Not the Roman Catholic Church, and now not the Catholic Church, please make up your mind what to call His Church.

Hentenza · Thursday at 7:36 PM

Xeno.of.athens said:
I have replied to your claims. I took the trouble to cite my references. You evidently reject the references because they are from Catholic Dogmatic sources. You say "they do not resonate" with you. I wonder if you think I ought to be worried that they do not resonate with you.

But your OP and the title of your thread IS about having a conversation about unity. What chance did this thread had to actually have a conversation about unity if only what your church teaches is valid? Oh, the arrogance. The many other Christian churches in the world do not follow Catholic dogma or teachings. We do have teachings in common but the teachings of my church are as valid to me as those of your church are to you. Unity with your church is impossible. It reminds me of the borg lol.

RileyG · Thursday at 7:36 PM

Mega Churches tend to be more Protestant in nature. Their style of worship is not liturgical, they also don’t tend to have much icons or statues you would see in liturgical Churches.

RileyG · Thursday at 7:34 PM

public hermit said:
As a Buddhist did you meditate? There is a rich tradition within Christianity of contemplative prayer, and you wouldn't have to approach it with a particular theology in hand. That can come later if that is God's will. The practice itself is fairly simply, and I will use The Cloud of Unknowing as an example of how one's practice might go. Ultimately, God is inscrutable, but God is always present and attentive to us. In that sense, there is a cloud between God and us that cannot be penetrated with our minds, i.e., a cloud of unknowing, but that cloud can be penetrated with the love of our hearts, i.e., our good desire. The practice is to place all "creatures" (mental images, ideas, forms) beneath a "cloud of forgetting," and penetrate the cloud of unknowing with the desire of our hearts. If you become distracted, you can use a simple word like "love," or "Jesus," or "Light," or whatever works for you, to bring your awareness back to the divine, Who cannot be conceptualized but is ever-present, loves us, and can be loved.

As one who has kept up this practice for several years, I can vouch for its efficacy. I would also concur with @Lukaris that it would help to begin reading scripture, and the Gospel of John is a very good place to start. To that end, you might practice lectio divina, which involves lectio (reading a short passage), meditatio (reflecting on a word or phrase), oratio (simple prayer related to your reflection), and contemplatio (contemplative prayer as I described above). Contemplative prayer in the western tradition comes out of the practice of lectio divina.

The Spirit is probably leading you, and these practices might help. If you have kept up a practice already, it should be a fairly smooth transition.

The Cloud of Unknowing - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Lectio Divina - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Yes! This is a wonderful spiritual practice I recommend! It has helped me immensely!

Very well written post @public hermit

RileyG · Thursday at 7:33 PM

Lukaris said:
I would consider reading the Gospel of John in your current mindset. It is the most theological Gospel for realization of God from God ( Jesus Christ per John 1:1-18 etc.). If possible, find another thoughtful Christian for one on one discussion.

Agreed. The Gospel of John is almost the most spiritual of the Gospels with a high Christology.

Blessings!

RileyG · Thursday at 7:31 PM

Xeno.of.athens said:
It is The Catholic Church. That is understood in the OP.

Amen!

RileyG · Thursday at 7:31 PM

Hentenza said:
Just not THA Catholic Church. Your church was merely one among many that the apostles planted.

The Catholic response is yes, sort of.

The RCC does recognize the validity of the sacraments of the EO, OO, and Assyrian Church of the East because they are ancient and apostolic with valid bishops.

The Church just views them as in schism because they aren’t in union with the Bishop of Rome.

eclipsenow · Thursday at 7:29 PM

ozso said:
Yes, that hyperbolic hysteria comes off as weird.

If you have a legitimate answer to any of my substantive points, I'm willing to listen.

But so far you've just "asserted and diverted". (Where have I seen that tactic before? :oldthumbsup:

) Our ABC calls Trump's tweets "WMD's" - Weapons of Mass Distraction.

And oh look! It seems we're not talking about the Epstein files!
At his age, he'll probably be dead before the truth comes out.
Exactly as he wants it.

RileyG · Thursday at 7:29 PM

Xeno.of.athens said:
And not one of those is the Catholic Church that is referred to in the OP - I ought to know because I wrote the OP.

And yes, when I say Catholic Church I refer to the RCC and all rites in communion with the Bishop of Rome.

Hentenza · Thursday at 7:28 PM

concretecamper said:
Precisely, it is His Church

Just not THA Catholic Church. Your church was merely one among many that the apostles planted.

RileyG · Thursday at 7:28 PM

Xeno.of.athens said:
And not one of those is the Catholic Church that is referred to in the OP - I ought to know because I wrote the OP.

I’m aware. I was just responding to a post that there is more than one Church that has its word in its official title.

My apologies!

Tuur · Thursday at 7:26 PM

AV1611VET said:
But when someone -- anyone -- starts talking about how the History Channel -- or any channel -- is so inaccurate, I have to wonder how they would know that.

Let's see what's on the History Channel!

Alone (a series about being alone in the wild, not Bryd's solo experience in Antarctica).

Hazardous History. Having given it a peek, it's more like a bunch of Middle Grade boys snickering at the name of the 7th planet.

History's Greatest Mysteries. Starts off with DB Cooper, "lost" evidence about the sinking of the Titanic, the hunt for John Wilkes Booth, and then three -count 'em - three episodes about Roswell, New Mexico.

Life After People. On a channel about history? Okaaay.

The Proof is Out There. Aliens.

The West. Okay, that looks interesting.

The Curse of Oak Island. Need I say more?

The Secret of Skinwalker Ranch. "Paranormal strikes deep. Into your life it will creep." Wait: the song doesn't go like that, does it?

Holy Marvels. Depends.

Forged in Fire. One of my favorite shows, even if it's a bit contrived. And why is everything Damasked? `

The Unexplained. With. William. Shatner. Looks questionable. The crystal skull in one episode list turned out to have modern tool marks.

.Mysteries from Above. They go to places and get aerial views. Has possibilities.

Ancient Aliens. The reason I seldom watch The History Channel.

I count four history shows in that list, and one of them I don't recommend and another looks questionable.

Hentenza · Thursday at 7:26 PM

Xeno.of.athens said:
Absolutely and positively not. It is not I who raised the alleged errors either of others or of the Catholic Church.

It was me who raised the point about closed communion to address the unity issue among some churches including yours. This was on topic to the thread. However you’ve been tooting your horn since the OP so any comment not consistent with your opinion has been met with hostility. So as long as we toe the line all is well. (Not).

Richard T · Thursday at 7:24 PM

While anyone can read the gospel, the Christian reads it with the Holy Spirit who is said to be a helper, comforter and guide. This does not mean the Holy Spirit will not be at work in your life. H is the one that will draw you to Jesus, and to convict you of sin. That sin is not just your individual sin, but the sin nature that man brought on himself. The fix, is the free gift of Jesus and I pray you can find that way. Everyone's path is a bit different. Many of course reject God on the way. So what can you do that would be practical?

You actually have taken the first step. You have become a greater seeker of the truth. No doubt, like many, you are apprehensive. In part perhaps because you are maybe looking for a intellectual system to find God? I think too that you are capable of searching with your heart. I'd even go so far as to tell him what is on your heart and that you want to be corrected for any thinking that really is not based on truth. Every Christian has a story of how they heard and still hear and follow God. I am saying too that you can have one as well.

In other words, you need an encounter with God. So I encourage you to keep seeking, to be aware too that some encounters are counterfeit. That the world of darkness does indeed try to suggest it is light.

Is it possible that God is far more real than you have imagined or ever seen? Yes, and again, he does desire to meet you. God bless your path always.

RileyG · Thursday at 7:24 PM

concretecamper said:
According to His Church's teaching

Yes. I’m in agreement with you because I accept what the RCC teaches.

concretecamper · Thursday at 7:24 PM

RileyG said:
I’m aware, according to our Catholic beliefs.

According to His Church's teaching

RandyPNW · Thursday at 7:24 PM

The Origins of the Pentecostal Movement

The Pentecostal movement is the largest & most important religious movement to originate in the United States. It began in 1901 in a Bible School in Kansas…

www.hopefaithprayer.com

This can help a search into Pentecostal origins in Methodism and the Holiness Movement. It doesn't appear that the "charisms" were predominant in the earlier times of Methodism and the Holiness churches.

There was an emphasis on the gift of Healing, particularly with AB Simpson. But the main emphasis was on *experiential Christianity,* distinguishing itself from nominal, national Christianity, in which Christian practice was moral, but less spiritual. A moral lifestyle does not necessarily reflect a completely committed lifestyle.

Luther's "warm" experience, developed into Lutheran Pietism, which in turn impacted Wesley. And his Sanctification became a synonym for "true experiential conversion." Others, later, wanted to emphasize this experience even more by emphasizing the "fire" of the Holy Spirit, or the "Baptism of the Holy Spirit."

When Pentecostalism emerged, it came to be focused on the charisms, led by the "initial evidence" of speaking in tongues. But true experiential conversion remained at the center, or what it terms "the Baptism of the Holy Spirit."

concretecamper · Thursday at 7:23 PM

Hentenza said:
Comprehension? Hint: It is not your church.

Precisely, it is His Church :oldthumbsup:

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