Your problem with Islam.

[muslimsoldier4life]

Speaking truth is degrading your religion? Mohammad was self proclaimed, he had no eyewitnesses of his meeting with an "angel". It is simply Mohammad's word.

Any witnesses of Moses PBUH and the burning bush? How about witnesses to Jonah PBUH and being swallowed by a whale and spat out?

 

[Jane_the_Bane]

Are we really going there? Most Muslims I know, to include myself, don't force my idealogy on others. Rather, those who abscribe to no religion, tend to impose their ideology onto society today.

I've heard conservatives (religious or otherwise) make that claim before - yet here's the rub:
in most cases, we are talking about being MORE permissive WRT certain random taboos - and in that scenario, people like you are still perfectly free to live by their standards, restricting yourself in whatever way you find necessary.

If, on the other hand, you legislate the taboos of your religion, people who disagree have NO way of escaping your particular religious rules - they've become binding law for everyone, regardless of whether they share your beliefs or not.

 

[WoodrowX2]

Are we really going there? Most Muslims I know, to include myself, don't force my idealogy on others. Rather, those who abscribe to no religion, tend to impose their ideology onto society today.

I agree.

But we can only speak for our own actions.

However, I have personally never seen a Muslim try to impose Islam upon others.

Every Muslim I know will not discuss religion, unless asked, or to try to clear up misconceptions.

 

[Jane_the_Bane]

I agree.

As I said before, I consider this a red herring.
What we are talking about here is usually NOT a case of "those ascribing to no religion imposing their ideology on everybody else", but a case of people trying to NOT live by random religious rules that are being imposed upon them. This doesn't keep religious people from sticking to their taboos on their own, though.

 

[Rationalt]

Are we really going there? Most Muslims I know, to include myself, don't force my idealogy on others.

Most muslims want to force their ideology on others.Perusal of threads started by muslims in this forum (christian forum ) attests to that fact.

Rather, those who abscribe to no religion, tend to impose their ideology onto society today.

I agree.There are a good lot of Atheists who fall under that category.

BUT, they wouldn't touch Islam for a variety of reasons.

 

[Forest Wolf]

I have no problem with Islam. I think the Adhan is beautiful. Even evoking emotions that surprise me at times when I hear it.

What I object to are radical extremists who are spurred on by their faith, any faith, to terrorize the world in the name of that faith.

There's something about espousing the belief that the great power responsible for all that exists eternally, is predisposed to exclusive affection for one group of egoistic bipedal upright carbon life forms.

This gives me cause for concern. Followed by a slight chuckle at the absurdity of it all and just to take the edge off the whole visual.

 

[steve_bakr]

Most muslims want to force their ideology on others.Perusal of threads started by muslims in this forum (christian forum ) attests to that fact.

I agree.There are a good lot of Atheists who fall under that category.

BUT, they wouldn't touch Islam for a variety of reasons.

As far as manners and observance of the rules--i.e. not flaming another person's faith--I am not a little embarrassed to say that the Muslims and Baha'i in these forums outshine many of my Christian brethren.

I have recently seen two threads on the Qur'an and Islam closed by Moderators because of blatant disregard for the rules. That disregard was shown by Christians, not Muslims.

So, I think that we have to take care of our own backyard before criticizing Muslims. If all we can do is polemics, what does that say about our own witness for Christ? How is that going to create good will?

 

[Rationalt]

I have no problem with Islam. I think the Adhan is beautiful. Even evoking emotions that surprise me at times when I hear it.

...

Any idea about the emotions going through Muslim mind when they read quranic verses denouncing the basis of christianity ?.

 

[Forest Wolf]

Rather than excerpt and quote me, not a Muslim, you should ask a Muslim.

Do you know anything about the Qur'an?

 

[Forest Wolf]

Muslim call to prayer makes christian cry - YouTube

 

[Rationalt]

Rather than excerpt and quote me, not a Muslim, you should ask a Muslim.

There is no need for me to ask a muslim.I was asking you in response to your post.

Do you know anything about the Qur'an?

I know plenty.You can verify my responses to threads started by muslims,among other things, regarding why muslims feel Christianity is a false religion.

 

[Forest Wolf]

There is no need for me to ask a muslim.I was asking you in response to your post.



I know plenty.You can verify my responses to threads started by muslims,among other things, regarding why muslims feel Christianity is a false religion.

Then your former question is unnecessary for your edification. I can not speak for what Muslims think of verses you claim are in their holy book.

How about your holy book? And its scriptures that command islam?

 

[Rationalt]

I can not speak for what Muslims think of verses you claim are in their holy book.

I didn't ask you to speak for muslims.Regarding my claim you can read muslim responses to my posts starting from here and here

 

[Supreme]

There is no need for me to ask a muslim.I was asking you in response to your post.



I know plenty.You can verify my responses to threads started by muslims,among other things, regarding why muslims feel Christianity is a false religion.

I'm not sure such threads would be allowed on this forum.

 

[smaneck]

I have recently seen two threads on the Qur'an and Islam closed by Moderators because of blatant disregard for the rules. That disregard was shown by Christians, not Muslims.

I noticed at least one atheist whose disregard for the rules exceeded that of the Christians'.

 

[Rationalt]

I'm not sure such threads would be allowed on this forum.

I have to dig old threads to find several such threads. Here are some latest ones.
http://www.christianforums.com/t7743658/

Is jesus son of god ? .

http://www.christianforums.com/t7791936/

http://www.christianforums.com/t7791934/

 

[wn123455]

In your posts discussing the mass murder and ethnic cleansing of Muslims in Burma and CAR, I have yet to find one word of condemnation for the murders of Muslim civilians. Your condemnation is reserved for violent Muslims, and the media, which to your disgust shares stories of innocent Muslims suffering.

There are people who claim they don't hate Jews, just "the bankers". They claim that the Holocaust was invented or exaggerated by the Jew controlled media, and that the Talmud and Old Testament are evil and racist books that call for Jews to kill non-Jews. They do admit that there are "some good Jews", although whenever the talk about Jews it's almost always to do with banks, communism, and the immorality of Hollywood, as well as bad things that Israel does.

But they will loudly say that they are NOT antisemites and that they have NOTHING against Jews.

I kind of see you the same way I see them. Both you and them claim to have nothing against the people groups you always say negative things about, while ignoring bad things done to them. But your conduct on this forum and their words online and around the family dinner table show something completely different.

To be fair a lot of muslims are getting radicalized into islamists.

Muslim clerics made a supreme effort to educate youth according to the dictates of a fundamentalist version of Islam, as assimilation into modern life was exchanged for a fundamentalist approach.

Following this revolution, which has gained momentum across the world, a movement in both Muslim and non-Muslim countries to impose Sharia law upon societies at large has taken root. Fundamentalist leaders are attempting to influence elected bodies to legislate Sharia law, by applying pressure on elected leaders. The demographic power of the growing fundamentalist communities leaves many elected officials helpless. Direct and indirect terrorism around the world has resulted in political statements which are obviously the result of the pressures of various interest groups around the world.

Source is The Protocols of the Elders of Islam | David Altman | Ops & Blogs | The Times of Israel
The number of islamists get more and more everyday and when I try to criticize islamism you then try to compare me with anti-semites.

 

[smaneck]

To be fair a lot of muslims are getting radicalized into islamists.
Source is The Protocols of the Elders of Islam | David Altman | Ops & Blogs | The Times of Israel

You think a screed like that is going to persuade us?

The number of islamists get more and more everyday and when I try to criticize islamism you then try to compare me with anti-semites.

That is because you do not distinguish between Muslims and Islamists. Seleka is not Islamist. Kemalists are not Islamists. The Ottoman Empire was not Islamists, yet you continue to apply that term to those groups.

 

[Jane_the_Bane]

I was too young to fully understand what was going on at the time, but the events surrounding the publication of Rushdie's "The Satanic Verses" (street riots and destroyed book shops in Britain, the Ayatollah declaring a manhunt and placing a bounty on the author's head, prominent convert Yusuf Islam - formerly known as Cat Stevens - declaring that Rushdie ought to be killed, etc.) pretty much embody my problem with contemporary Islam.

The aftermath of the Jüllandsposten caricatures comes to mind, too, if we need a more recent example.

 

[WoodrowX2]

I was too young to fully understand what was going on at the time, but the events surrounding the publication of Rushdie's "The Satanic Verses" (street riots and destroyed book shops in Britain, the Ayatollah declaring a manhunt and placing a bounty on the author's head, prominent convert Yusuf Islam - formerly known as Cat Stevens - declaring that Rushdie ought to be killed, etc.) pretty much embody my problem with contemporary Islam.

The aftermath of the Jüllandsposten caricatures comes to mind, too, if we need a more recent example.

The cartoons were just a few months after I had accepted Islam. I had not yet found any Islamic Web sites and the only Muslims I knew were the 100 or so in East Texas I had met at the Tyler, TX mosque. Strangly never heard a thing about them except from the Baptist Church that was near the Mosque as they were protesting the Mosque for violence by Muslims in Denmark.

Outside of the the only thing I knew about them was what I saw on television.

I didn't pay much attention to the Ruckus over Rushdie, but I was familiar with Rushdie. That was before I accepted Islam and I was an atheist at the time. I felt it was a publicity stunt by Rushdie to sell his book.

I had read the book, it was not one of Rushdie's better works. Just my opinion.