You will be with me in paradise

[Brain Damage]

Jesus said that to one of the men being crucified along side him , hence it was a prophecy.

But before we get into our conversation about "paradise" and what the man meant when he said to Jesus , "remember me when you come into your kingdom" , i need to lay a few facts down .

In the original writings of scripture , the Hebrew and greek languages have no chapter divisions nor do they use punctuation marks , and so it is recognized by many today that the commer belongs here :And Jesus said to him, "Assuredly, I say to you today, you will be with Me in Paradise."

And not here : And Jesus said to him, "Assuredly, I say to you, today you will be with Me in Paradise."

Now if you are in doubt about this then you also need to recognize that Jesus died and was dead for 3 days , after which he was still here another 40 days before he actualy went anywhere , so the thief could not have been in paradise "that day".

Ok now that we have that out of the way , notice the thief said , "remember me when you come into your kingdom", and Jesus replied by saying ,"you will be with me in paradise".

So come on guys , what is this a prophecy of ?....where and what is paradise ?

 

[Ginny]

Now if you are in doubt about this then you also need to recognize that Jesus died and was dead for 3 days , after which he was still here another 40 days before he actualy went anywhere , so the thief could not have been in paradise "that day".

Just a thought, but if Jesus (also God- KEYWORDS) is omnipresent, it is a possibility He could have very well been with that man that day...just as He could have been listening to and talking to others perhaps any where else on the earth at that same time that same day...just as he does today when millions of people are praying to Him. I confidently can say that at the precise time I am speaking with God, He is also everywhere else with everybody else around this entire planet speaking to them, consoling them, guiding them, etc. Good thing that God can do that, otherwise a lot of people would be "on hold". On the contrary, I cannot confidently say that the thief was not with Jesus/God b/c He (Jesus) was dead 3 days. If we want to take that route, then we could also say that God was not available for three days if someone needed Him b/c they are one in the same.
Now my brain hurts!

If Jesus is God, and I believe that He is, then I do believe he could have been with God that same day. Perhaps, God (Jesus) was with the thief when Jesus (God) was awaiting resurrection.

It is a possibility and I would not outrule it b/c of a few commas. Many things remain a mystery...as they should be........

Just a thought that occurred to me...not a comment to debate, etc. What do yall think? See why I titled my message this?

 

[Ginny]

Now if you are in doubt about this then you also need to recognize that Jesus died and was dead for 3 days , after which he was still here another 40 days before he actualy went anywhere , so the thief could not have been in paradise "that day".

Just a thought, but if Jesus (also God- KEYWORDS) is omnipresent, it is a possibility He could have very well been with that man that day...just as He could have been listening to and talking to others perhaps any where else on the earth at that same time that same day...just as he does today when millions of people are praying to Him. I confidently can say that at the precise time I am speaking with God, He is also everywhere else with everybody else around this entire planet speaking to them, consoling them, guiding them, etc. Good thing that God can do that, otherwise a lot of people would be "on hold". On the contrary, I cannot confidently say that the thief was not with Jesus/God b/c He (Jesus) was dead 3 days. If we want to take that route, then we could also say that God was not available for three days if someone needed Him b/c they are one in the same.
Now my brain hurts!

If Jesus is God, and I believe that He is, then I do believe he could have been with God that same day. Perhaps, God (Jesus) was with the thief when Jesus (God) was awaiting resurrection.

It is a possibility and I would not outrule it b/c of a few commas. Many things remain a mystery...as they should be........

Just a thought that occurred to me...not a comment to debate, etc. What do yall think? See why I titled my message this?

 

[BarbB]

Now my brain hurts!

Brain Damage can not only make your head ache, but make it explode - but his brain is awesome!

Your response sounds pretty good to me. I don't care whether whether the thief was in paradise in minutes or 40 days as long as he was in paradise.

 

[icxn]

Paradise is being with Christ.

 

[Duke Nukem]

The word translated "paradise" is used only two other times in the New Testament. In both cases it refers to the place of God's presence.

In 2 Corinthians 12:2-4 Paul describes a vision in which he "was caught up into Paradise" (verse 4). Paul says this paradise was in "the third heaven" (verse 2) the dwelling place of God.

Jesus tells us that "the tree of life" is located "in the midst of the Paradise of God" (Revelation 2:7). Revelation 22:2 explains that the tree of life is to be in the New Jerusalem. God will come from heaven to dwell in this New Jerusalem (Revelation 21:2-3) after the resurrections mentioned in Revelation 20. Only at that time will men dwell with God in this paradise. Putting together these scriptures, we can see that the paradise Christ mentioned, in which men will dwell with God, is to be at a future time.

The repentant robber had come to his senses while being crucified alongside Jesus . He said to Christ, "Lord, remember me when You come into Your kingdom".
The thief, like anyone facing imminent death, sought comfort and assurance. Jesus provided it.
His reply, "Assuredly I say to you today" was "a common Hebrew idiom ... which is constantly used for very solemn emphasis" (The Companion Bible, 1990, Appendix 173, p. 192).

Much of the misunderstanding that arises from Christ's statement comes about because the Bible originally included no punctuation. It wasn't until many centuries later that the punctuation marks that we see in our English versions were inserted. When commas were added, Jesus' meaning was distorted and this Hebrew figure of speech obscured.

Jesus never said nor implied that the dying man would be in paradise on that very day. Christ was encouraging him by solemnly assuring him that a time would come, in God's future kingdom on earth, when the man would be resurrected and would see Jesus again.

 

[mythbuster]

See

http://www.christianforums.com/t1278854-are-people-in-heaven-and-hell-now.html

 

[brotherjim]

Paradise is being with Christ.

Oh, my, how very profound. Kinda' like NT "Israel" being "with" the souls of born-again children of God, huh?? Kinda', perhaps. I'm going to have to keep an eye on this guy.

Btw, whoever, this same thread was started over on the Theology, General Theology channel, and I posted at some length there. Glad I also stopped by here, though.

brotherjim

 

[Barraco]

Jesus said that to one of the men being crucified along side him , hence it was a prophecy.

But before we get into our conversation about "paradise" and what the man meant when he said to Jesus , "remember me when you come into your kingdom" , i need to lay a few facts down .

In the original writings of scripture , the Hebrew and greek languages have no chapter divisions nor do they use punctuation marks , and so it is recognized by many today that the commer belongs here :And Jesus said to him, "Assuredly, I say to you today, you will be with Me in Paradise."

And not here : And Jesus said to him, "Assuredly, I say to you, today you will be with Me in Paradise."

Now if you are in doubt about this then you also need to recognize that Jesus died and was dead for 3 days , after which he was still here another 40 days before he actualy went anywhere , so the thief could not have been in paradise "that day".

Ok now that we have that out of the way , notice the thief said , "remember me when you come into your kingdom", and Jesus replied by saying ,"you will be with me in paradise".

So come on guys , what is this a prophecy of ?....where and what is paradise ?

Impressive! I never thought of that. God has shown you great truth and blessings. Thankyou, for now I look at intepretation in a whole new light. God bless in your life and studies!

 

[Brain Damage]

Jesus never said nor implied that the dying man would be in paradise on that very day. Christ was encouraging him by solemnly assuring him that a time would come, in God's future kingdom on earth, when the man would be resurrected and would see Jesus again.

...That's exactly how i see it!...when Jesus comes into his kingdom at the time of the end.

Daniel 7 - "I was watching in the night visions, And behold, One like the Son of Man, Coming with the clouds of heaven! He came to the Ancient of Days, And they brought Him near before Him. 14 Then to Him was given dominion and glory and a kingdom, That all peoples, nations, and languages should serve Him. His dominion is an everlasting dominion, Which shall not pass away, And His kingdom the one Which shall not be destroyed.

I was watching; and the same horn was making war against the saints, and prevailing against them, 22 until the Ancient of Days came, and a judgment was made in favor of the saints of the Most High, and the time came for the saints to possess the kingdom.

He shall speak pompous words against the Most High, Shall persecute the saints of the Most High, And shall intend to change times and law. Then the saints shall be given into his hand For a time and times and half a time. 26 'But the court shall be seated, And they shall take away his dominion, To consume and destroy it forever. 27 Then the kingdom and dominion, And the greatness of the kingdoms under the whole heaven, Shall be given to the people, the saints of the Most High. His kingdom is an everlasting kingdom, And all dominions shall serve and obey Him.'

 

[Brain Damage]

Now my brain hurts!

lol....Good!!....

 

[Brain Damage]

Paradise is being with Christ.

lol...We would never had guessed , especialy considering the fact that Jesus said to the man , "you will be with me in paradise"...

You must be one of them highly educated folk....lol

 

[icxn]

lol...We would never had guessed , especialy considering the fact that Jesus said to the man , "you will be with me in paradise"...

And even more so, if "... you do not realize that Jesus Christ is in you..." (cf. 2 Cor. 13:5)? and, "... that the the kingdom of God is in you." (cf. Lk. 17:21)

icxn

 

[PaladinValer]

http://www.kencollins.com/question-45.htm

That will tell you what and where paradise is.

 

[icxn]

From the link given above:

The New Heavens and the New Earth
The New Heavens and the New Earth is the eternal destination of righteous people. In Scripture it is called “The New Heavens and the New Earth” in Revelation 21:1, or “The New Jerusalem” in Revelation 21:2. Since it is a physical place, we can’t go there until we have been resurrected in our bodies. At the moment we can’t go there anyway because it doesn’t exist yet...

But...
31: "When the Son of man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit on his glorious throne. 32: Before him will be gathered all the nations, and he will separate them one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats, 33: and he will place the sheep at his right hand, but the goats at the left. 34: Then the King will say to those at his right hand, `Come, O blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world; (Mat. 25)

icxn

 

[brotherjim]

:And Jesus said to him,"Assuredly, I say to you today, you will be with Me in Paradise."

Whoever,

Yep, right: Jesus wanted to make certain everyone knew He was talking to the thief that day, i.e., "today," because otherwise people would be confused, not knowing if Jesus was speaking to them the day before (yesterday) or the day after (tomorrow). (Satirical, of course.**)

bj



**satir. not to be in any way nasty or such, but used strictly as a powerful literary tool to show utter absurdity.

"Be not wise in your own conceits," and "let anyone who thinks they know anything, now be of the mind that they know nothing as they should" (para. and ampl.). The reason: "[so] that no flesh should glory in His Sight/Presence."

 

[PaladinValer]

From the link given above:

But...
31: "When the Son of man comes in his glory, and all the angels with him, then he will sit on his glorious throne. 32: Before him will be gathered all the nations, and he will separate them one from another as a shepherd separates the sheep from the goats, 33: and he will place the sheep at his right hand, but the goats at the left. 34: Then the King will say to those at his right hand, `Come, O blessed of my Father, inherit the kingdom prepared for you from the foundation of the world; (Mat. 25)

icxn

1. You realize that his opinion is the same as that of your own Eastern Orthodox Church, right?
2. You've forgotten that the Church exists on Earth too, and it is the same Church that is in Sheol (both Paradise and Hades) and in Heaven.

 

[icxn]

1. You realize that his opinion is the same as that of your own Eastern Orthodox Church, right?
2. You've forgotten that the Church exists on Earth too, and it is the same Church that is in Sheol (both Paradise and Hades) and in Heaven.

The part that I quoted is NOT what EOC teaches.

See:

- http://www.christianforums.com/t1179346-what-is-the-kingdom-of-god.html
- http://www.christianforums.com/t1178701-millenialism-and-preterism.html&page=2

icxn

 

[PaladinValer]

That doesn't change the fact that we are not in heaven yet.

Does Baptism make us a New Creation? Absolutely. But God's Kingdom on Earth (the Visible Church) is not heaven, though it is ruled in heaven.