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I have no idea how those two verses you posted are supposed to prove anything."You still haven't shown any evidence that those resurrected at Jesus' death were transformed and transported to heaven."
[John 3:13; 1 Corinthians 15:20-23]
This is still true as we speak
What is your motive to prove your point?
Common sense should have also told you that I said a verse proving Christ returns "before" the 2nd resurrection. Or is this just one of your tactics for avoiding the truth?My 1st thought is that the SECOND RESURRECTION is so named in the Bible because to be a SECOND there must have been a FIRST. Now that is just common sense to me but YOU of course are free to think as you please.
Forgive me for not knowing. I am so shallow.Rev. 20:4-6.....
"Then I saw thrones, and seated on them were those to whom the authority to judge was committed. Also I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for the testimony of Jesus and for the word of God, and those who had not worshiped the beast or its image and had not received its mark on their foreheads or their hands. They came to life and reigned with Christ for a thousand years. The rest of the dead did not come to life until the thousand years were ended. This is the first resurrection.
It seems clear to me that there is a FIRST Resurrection because the Bible says........
THIS IS THE FIRST RESURRECTION!!!
So, if there is a FIRST there certainly must be a seconf!
Then verse 6 says.................
"Blessed and holy is the one who shares in the first resurrection! Over such the second death has no power, but they will be priests of God and of Christ, and they will reign with him for a thousand years."
The word rapture came from the greek harpatzo I think is how you say/spell it. I personally dont believe that there is a "rapture". Noone in the history of the world has been spared any calamity or "tribulation". Some refer to Noah and say that the ark was a forshadowing of this "rapture" however I beg to differ. Noah and his family were not spared "tribulation", they were only spared death. A simple study in Genesis shows how trying their lives were. Anyway, just my thoughts.When people are removed. One person is taken, and the other left. That's the rapture.
Those who speak prophecy know there is a rapture. So, although I have no idea where the word rapture came from, it doesn't seem far from being an imparted bit of knowledge God passed to his people. Shouldn't be against this.
The rapture is different from Christ's return or any resurrections.
The word rapture came from the greek harpatzo I think is how you say/spell it. I personally dont believe that there is a "rapture". Noone in the history of the world has been spared any calamity or "tribulation". Some refer to Noah and say that the ark was a forshadowing of this "rapture" however I beg to differ. Noah and his family were not spared "tribulation", they were only spared death. A simple study in Genesis shows how trying their lives were. Anyway, just my thoughts.
Blessings!
Maybe I misunderstood you. Those two verses you posted prove that those people resurrected at Jesus' death did not get transformed and go to heaven. I thought you were supporting the notion that they did. My mistake. Turns out we are in agreement."I have no idea how those two verses you posted are supposed to prove anything."
This does not surprise me
You obviously have no idea, or you are just ignoring on purpose
I gave you direct scripture on the matter ..... and you ask for scripture
You still haven't shown any evidence that those resurrected at Jesus' death were transformed and transported to heaven.
Billions? My bible says "many". It also says they went into the city, so I'm not sure how you would fit billions of people inside the city.
Post 396 seems to show that you did write it but I think maybe Major1 messed up the quote and made his words appear to be part of your quote.
My motive is to stop people making unsubstantiated claims about scripture. If you can't support it with scripture, you shouldn't claim it to be fact.
I don't think the bible actually says about those persons or Lazarus of Bethany after he came back alive, from being dead four days.Yet you claimed a large number of people stayed on earth as the walking dead after being resurrected 2000 years ago.
If you can't support it with scripture, you shouldn't claim it to be fact.
You never asked for evidence. Why do you expect something you never asked for?
You only questioned how is it possible to fit billions of people into a city. How do you know it's a city on earth? Where do you think people go after getting resurrected, New York city?
You said:
Billions? My bible says "many". It also says they went into the city, so I'm not sure how you would fit billions of people inside the city.
Lastseven,
Why don't you prove those people that were resurrected 2000 years ago in Matthew 27:50-53 roamed the earth as walking deads if you refuse to believe they went to heaven.
Be nice. His words were included in your quote, so it's not my fault.I rest my case. See how you're as blind as a bat?
Rapture will happen so the people of Heaven can have the Holy ones on Earth, to do things with and have fun with.
It's not for escape, it's for fun and joy.
As there is nowhere in the Bible that says living people will be taken to heaven, then your hope for a rapture before anything bad happens, will not be realized.I truely hope that Pre-trib is correct however I am just focusing on our LORD and trusting regardless of what happens.
You are arguing over a contradiction, over a verse that shouldn't be in the scriptures.Maybe I misunderstood you. Those two verses you posted prove that those people resurrected at Jesus' death did not get transformed and go to heaven. I thought you were supporting the notion that they did. My mistake. Turns out we are in agreement.
Alright, you want me to support it with scripture? All we have to do is look at the scripture in question and put on our critical thinking caps. It's not hard.Yet you claimed a large number of people stayed on earth as the walking dead after being resurrected 2000 years ago.
If you can't support it with scripture, you shouldn't claim it to be fact.
Which verse shouldn't be in scripture?You are arguing over a contradiction, over a verse that shouldn't be in the scriptures.
In the meantime, the fact that they went into the city proves that it was a local event, and the fact that the bible says "many" not "all the dead" proves that not everybody was resurrected. Furthermore, if they had been transformed and taken to heaven it would've been a big deal and it would've said so.
Be nice. His words were included in your quote, so it's not my fault.
The one you're arguing about. No one is resurrected until the 1st resurrection but Christ. The 4 Gospels contradict each other because the book isn't without faultWhich verse shouldn't be in scripture?
Alright, you want me to support it with scripture? All we have to do is look at the scripture in question and put on our critical thinking caps. It's not hard.
Matthew 27
51 At that moment the curtain of the temple was torn in two from top to bottom. The earth shook, the rocks split 52 and the tombs broke open. The bodies of many holy people who had died were raised to life. 53 They came out of the tombs after Jesus’ resurrection and[e] went into the holy city and appeared to many people.
54 When the centurion and those with him who were guarding Jesus saw the earthquake and all that had happened, they were terrified, and exclaimed, “Surely he was the Son of God!”
Nowhere does it say these people were transformed and went to heaven, so we can't assume that's what happened. Let's see what it actually does say.
1. It says they "appeared to many people", which means they stayed on earth after they came to life.
2. It says that "their bodies were raised to life", which means they did not get new spiritual bodies as would be required for them to go to heaven.
3. It says that the centurion and those guarding Jesus "saw all that had happened" which means they witnessed these resurrected people go into the city, which means it was the city on earth, not in heaven.
So there you have three very strong clues to indicate that they stayed on earth and not a single clue that they went to heaven, so please stop using this event as any kind of proof for some supposed future rapture because this proves nothing of the sort.
Alright, you want me to support it with scripture?
Lastseven,
Why don't you prove those people that were resurrected 2000 years ago in Matthew 27:50-53 roamed the earth as walking deads if you refuse to believe they went to heaven.
Why don't you prove those people that were resurrected 2000 years ago in Matthew 27:50-53 roamed the earth as walking deads if you refuse to believe they went to heaven.
Why don't you prove those people that were resurrected 2000 years ago in Matthew 27:50-53 roamed the earth as walking deads if you refuse to believe they went to heaven.
Why don't you prove those people that were resurrected 2000 years ago in Matthew 27:50-53 roamed the earth as walking deads if you refuse to believe they went to heaven.
Why don't you prove those people that were resurrected 2000 years ago in Matthew 27:50-53 roamed the earth as walking deads if you refuse to believe they went to heaven.
1. It says they "appeared to many people", which means they stayed on earth after they came to life.
2. It says that "their bodies were raised to life", which means they did not get new spiritual bodies as would be required for them to go to heaven.
3. It says that the centurion and those guarding Jesus "saw all that had happened" which means they witnessed these resurrected people go into the city, which means it was the city on earth, not in heaven.
I don't think the bible actually says about those persons or Lazarus of Bethany after he came back alive, from being dead four days.
Note the words Jesus spoke to Lazarus are similar (but not exact because there is no "up hither") to the words John heard in Revelation 4:1 as he suddenly found himself in heaven and the two witnesses called up in Revelation 11:12 Come up hither. consider.... My sheep hear my voice...
John 11:
43 And when he thus had spoken, he cried with a loud voice, Lazarus, come forth.
44 And he that was dead came forth, bound hand and foot with graveclothes: and his face was bound about with a napkin. Jesus saith unto them, Loose him, and let him go.
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