What is Christ's rest?

[Bob S]

It is a sin to disobey God's message about the Sabbath in the following passage. I believe the reason people disobey this message is because they don't understand it.

Israel never entered God's rest. They must have kept the Sabbath, though, because the only one God ordered killed for profaning it was the man who was out picking up sticks. I guess later on, God must have lifted the ban because much of Israel profaned the Sabbath at various times, and there is no history of any of them being stoned. Kind of like when God ordered the Israelites to remain in their dwellings on the Sabbath, and later they roamed wherever they pleased. Figure that one out.

Yet God, through Hebrews, tells us there is still a rest remaining, and it isn't the Sabbath. Israel was given the Sabbath rest. It is TODAY that Jesus gave all mankind His rest. TODAY could be Wednesday or any day. The only way man can find real rest is by believing in Jesus. He is our eternal REST.

 

[Leaf473]

Israel never entered God's rest. They must have kept the Sabbath, though, because the only one God ordered killed for profaning it was the man who was out picking up sticks.

Interesting observation

Praise the Lord, his ways are always right!

I guess later on, God must have lifted the ban because much of Israel profaned the Sabbath at various times, and there is no history of any of them being stoned. Kind of like when God ordered the Israelites to remain in their dwellings on the Sabbath, and later they roamed wherever they pleased. Figure that one out.

Yet God, through Hebrews, tells us there is still a rest remaining, and it isn't the Sabbath. Israel was given the Sabbath rest. It is TODAY that Jesus gave all mankind His rest. TODAY could be Wednesday or any day. The only way man can find real rest is by believing in Jesus. He is our eternal REST.

 

[guevaraj]

Israel never entered God's rest. They must have kept the Sabbath, though, because the only one God ordered killed for profaning it was the man who was out picking up sticks.

Interesting observation

Brothers, the message tells us the duration of the "oath," 40 years, confirmed by those punished: those whose "corpses" lay in the wilderness in the following passage. Joshua survived this punishment, as he was unable to enter the Sabbath during the 40 years of manna near Jerusalem, but he was allowed to enter the Sabbath once the manna ceased, and they implemented God's instructions given before the manna for the Promised Land in Jerusalem.

And who made God angry for forty years? Wasn’t it the people who sinned, whose corpses lay in the wilderness? (Hebrews 3:17 NLT)​

The following instructions for a Sabbath before the seventh day of the week were given before the manna, to be implemented in Jerusalem before they kept the seventh day of the week by "oath" with manna for 40 years, when they were not allowed to enter the Sabbath for being too late by half a day as punishment by "oath."

Then the LORD said to Moses, “Be careful to celebrate the Day of Atonement on the tenth day of that same month—nine days after the Festival of Trumpets. You must observe it as an official day for holy assembly, a day to deny yourselves and present special gifts to the LORD. Do no work during that entire day because it is the Day of Atonement, when offerings of purification are made for you, making you right with the LORD your God. All who do not deny themselves that day will be cut off from God’s people. And I will destroy anyone among you who does any work on that day. You must not do any work at all! This is a permanent law for you, and it must be observed from generation to generation wherever you live. This will be a Sabbath day of complete rest for you, and on that day you must deny yourselves. This day of rest will begin at sundown on the ninth day of the month and extend until sundown on the tenth day.” (Leviticus 23:26-32 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[JulieB67]

It is TODAY that Jesus gave all mankind His rest. TODAY could be Wednesday or any day. The only way man can find real rest is by believing in Jesus. He is our eternal REST.

Exactly right. Sabbatimos remains (in Christ). That's the Sabbath we keep, not Sabbaton which was the weekly Sabbath and a shadow of what was to become that continual rest in Christ that we find today.

Hebrews 4:3 "For we which have believed do enter into rest, as He said, "As I have sworn in My wrath, if they shall enter into My rest:" although the works were finished from the foundation of the world."

 

[Leaf473]

Brothers, the message tells us the duration of the "oath," 40 years, confirmed by those punished: those whose "corpses" lay in the wilderness...

Brother, that fits with the idea that the law kills us! And once we are dead, the law is not in effect for us, because the law only applies to living people

When we believe in Jesus, we are made alive again with him. Praise God forever! That's the rest in Christ

Redeemed, and so happy in Jesus,
No language my rapture can tell;
I know that the light of His presence
With me doth continually dwell - Frances J. Crosby

...in the following passage. Joshua survived this punishment, as he was unable to enter the Sabbath during the 40 years of manna near Jerusalem, but he was allowed to enter the Sabbath once the manna ceased, and they implemented God's instructions given before the manna for the Promised Land in Jerusalem.

And who made God angry for forty years? Wasn’t it the people who sinned, whose corpses lay in the wilderness? (Hebrews 3:17 NLT)​

The following instructions for a Sabbath before the seventh day of the week were given before the manna, to be implemented in Jerusalem before they kept the seventh day of the week by "oath" with manna for 40 years, when they were not allowed to enter the Sabbath for being too late by half a day as punishment by "oath."

Then the LORD said to Moses, “Be careful to celebrate the Day of Atonement on the tenth day of that same month—nine days after the Festival of Trumpets. You must observe it as an official day for holy assembly, a day to deny yourselves and present special gifts to the LORD. Do no work during that entire day because it is the Day of Atonement, when offerings of purification are made for you, making you right with the LORD your God. All who do not deny themselves that day will be cut off from God’s people. And I will destroy anyone among you who does any work on that day. You must not do any work at all! This is a permanent law for you, and it must be observed from generation to generation wherever you live. This will be a Sabbath day of complete rest for you, and on that day you must deny yourselves. This day of rest will begin at sundown on the ninth day of the month and extend until sundown on the tenth day.” (Leviticus 23:26-32 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[guevaraj]

It is TODAY that Jesus gave all mankind His rest. TODAY could be Wednesday or any day. The only way man can find real rest is by believing in Jesus. He is our eternal REST.

Exactly right. Sabbatimos remains (in Christ). That's the Sabbath we keep, not Sabbaton which was the weekly Sabbath and a shadow of what was to become that continual rest in Christ that we find today.

Brothers, this defense of the King James Version translator's distortion of the message contradicts the context, where the word "today" applies to the time of David, long before Jesus' birth. The word "today" in "Today, when you hear his voice" was given in the time of David, 1,029 years before Jesus' baptism by John.

God’s promise of entering his rest still stands, so we ought to tremble with fear that some of you might fail to experience it. For this good news—that God has prepared this rest—has been announced to us just as it was to them. But it did them no good because they didn’t share the faith of those who listened to God. For only we who believe can enter his rest. As for the others, God said, “In my anger I took an oath: ‘They will never enter my place of rest,’” even though this rest has been ready since he made the world. We know it is ready because of the place in the Scriptures where it mentions the seventh day: “On the seventh day God rested from all his work.” But in the other passage God said, “They will never enter my place of rest.” So God’s rest is there for people to enter, but those who first heard this good news failed to enter because they disobeyed God. So God set another time for entering his rest, and that time is today. GOD ANNOUNCED THIS THROUGH DAVID MUCH LATER in the words already quoted: “Today when you hear his voice, don’t harden your hearts.” Now IF JOSHUA HAD SUCCEEDED IN GIVING THEM THIS REST, GOD WOULD NOT HAVE SPOKEN ABOUT ANOTHER DAY of rest still to come. So there is a special rest still waiting for the people of God. For all who have entered into God’s rest have rested from their labors, just as God did after creating the world. So let us do our best to enter that rest. But if we disobey God, as the people of Israel did, we will fall. (Hebrews 4:1-11 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[guevaraj]

Brother, that fits with the idea that the law kills us! And once we are dead, the law is not in effect for us, because the law only applies to living people
When we believe in Jesus, we are made alive again with him. Praise God forever! That's the rest in Christ

Brother, that's a different use of the word rest than the one used in the following message. The rest used in this message was established before sin took hold of this world, on the seventh day of creation.

God’s promise of entering his rest still stands, so we ought to tremble with fear that some of you might fail to experience it. For this good news—that God has prepared this rest—has been announced to us just as it was to them. But it did them no good because they didn’t share the faith of those who listened to God. For only we who believe can enter his rest. As for the others, God said, “In my anger I took an oath: ‘They will never enter my place of rest,’” even though this rest has been ready since he made the world. We know it is ready because of the place in the Scriptures where it mentions the seventh day: “On the seventh day God rested from all his work.” But in the other passage God said, “They will never enter my place of rest.” So God’s rest is there for people to enter, but those who first heard this good news failed to enter because they disobeyed God. So God set another time for entering his rest, and that time is today. GOD ANNOUNCED THIS THROUGH DAVID MUCH LATER in the words already quoted: “Today when you hear his voice, don’t harden your hearts.” Now IF JOSHUA HAD SUCCEEDED IN GIVING THEM THIS REST, GOD WOULD NOT HAVE SPOKEN ABOUT ANOTHER DAY of rest still to come. So there is a special rest still waiting for the people of God. For all who have entered into God’s rest have rested from their labors, just as God did after creating the world. So let us do our best to enter that rest. But if we disobey God, as the people of Israel did, we will fall. (Hebrews 4:1-11 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[Leaf473]

Brother, that's a different use of the word rest than the one used in the following message.

I was thinking of this use of the word rest
Come to me, all you who labor and are heavily burdened, and I will give you rest

I know I shall see in His beauty
The King in whose law I delight;
Whose lovingly guarding my footsteps,
And giving me songs in the night

The rest used in this message was established before sin took hold of this world, on the seventh day of creation.

God’s promise of entering his rest still stands, so we ought to tremble with fear that some of you might fail to experience it. For this good news—that God has prepared this rest—has been announced to us just as it was to them. But it did them no good because they didn’t share the faith of those who listened to God. For only we who believe can enter his rest. As for the others, God said, “In my anger I took an oath: ‘They will never enter my place of rest,’” even though this rest has been ready since he made the world. We know it is ready because of the place in the Scriptures where it mentions the seventh day: “On the seventh day God rested from all his work.” But in the other passage God said, “They will never enter my place of rest.” So God’s rest is there for people to enter, but those who first heard this good news failed to enter because they disobeyed God. So God set another time for entering his rest, and that time is today. GOD ANNOUNCED THIS THROUGH DAVID MUCH LATER in the words already quoted: “Today when you hear his voice, don’t harden your hearts.” Now IF JOSHUA HAD SUCCEEDED IN GIVING THEM THIS REST, GOD WOULD NOT HAVE SPOKEN ABOUT ANOTHER DAY of rest still to come. So there is a special rest still waiting for the people of God. For all who have entered into God’s rest have rested from their labors, just as God did after creating the world. So let us do our best to enter that rest. But if we disobey God, as the people of Israel did, we will fall. (Hebrews 4:1-11 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[guevaraj]

I was thinking of this use of the word rest
Come to me, all you who labor and are heavily burdened, and I will give you rest

Brother, that other rest is not the Sabbath "day", which has been misinterpreted since Joshua as the seventh day of the week everywhere, when it is fixed at the place of creation in Eden and moves as you go around the earth from Saturday to Friday. Its location between Friday and Saturday depends on the distance from the place of creation. In Jerusalem, for example, it falls between both days. The Sabbath in Jerusalem falls half a day before the seventh day of the week, being exactly on the other side of the site of creation.

Now if Joshua had succeeded in giving them this rest, God would not have spoken about another day of rest still to come. (Hebrews 4:8 NLT)​

Here is an animation of how the Sabbath moves as you go around the earth.

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[Leaf473]

Brother, that other rest is not the Sabbath "day", which has been misinterpreted since Joshua as the seventh day of the week everywhere, when it is fixed at the place of creation in Eden and moves as you go around the earth from Saturday to Friday. Its location between Friday and Saturday depends on the distance from the place of creation. In Jerusalem, for example, it falls between both days. The Sabbath in Jerusalem falls half a day before the seventh day of the week, being exactly on the other side of the site of creation.

Now if Joshua had succeeded in giving them this rest, God would not have spoken about another day of rest still to come. (Hebrews 4:8 NLT)​

Here is an animation of how the Sabbath moves as you go around the earth.

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

I'm fine with the Sabbath day being fixed to a certain place

"you will find rest for your souls" that's the rest I was talking about

Marvelous grace of our loving Lord,
Grace that exceeds our sin and our guilt!
Yonder on Calvary’s mount outpoured,
There where the blood of the Lamb was spilled
Julia H. Johnston

 

[guevaraj]

I'm fine with the Sabbath day being fixed to a certain place

Brother, how can you find rest in Jesus if you don't listen to God's instructions about obeying the Sabbath in Hebrews chapter 4?

“Not everyone who calls out to me, ‘Lord! Lord!’ will enter the Kingdom of Heaven. Only those who actually do the will of my Father in heaven will enter. On judgment day many will say to me, ‘Lord! Lord! We prophesied in your name and cast out demons in your name and performed many miracles in your name.’ But I will reply, ‘I never knew you. Get away from me, you who break God’s laws.’ (Matthew 7:21-23 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[Leaf473]

Brother, how can you find rest in Jesus if you don't listen to God's instructions about obeying the Sabbath in Hebrews chapter 4?

The best answer I can think of is that your interpretation of Hebrews 4 is incorrect

“Not everyone who calls out to me, ‘Lord! Lord!’ will enter the Kingdom of Heaven. Only those who actually do the will of my Father in heaven will enter. On judgment day many will say to me, ‘Lord! Lord! We prophesied in your name and cast out demons in your name and performed many miracles in your name.’​

But I will reply, ‘I never knew you.​

Jesus already knows me, my brother

You received the Spirit of adoption, by whom we cry, “Abba! Father!” The Spirit himself testifies with our spirit that we are children of God

Get away from me, you who break God’s laws.’ (Matthew 7:21-23 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

Marvelous, infinite, matchless grace,
Freely bestowed on all who believe!
You that are longing to see His face,
Will you this moment His grace receive?

 

[guevaraj]

The best answer I can think of is that your interpretation of Hebrews 4 is incorrect

Brother, that's not possible! No other biblical truth has greater confirmation in all Scripture without contradiction. This truth destroys your conviction that we don't have to obey the Ten Commandments, an error which forces you to distort many scriptures that contradict that belief in order for you to hold on to it. I learned when days begin and end from the creation account in Genesis, but others have come to the same conclusion from the manna story, where the days of the week in the Bible are from morning to morning and not from evening to evening, as Judaism assumed since Joshua, due to the earlier Sabbath given in Jerusalem, which Joshua must have concluded was a new seventh day of the week different from the one God taught with the manna, as understood in the following video. The video demonstrates that I am not the only one capable of seeing this truth throughout Scripture. Some of us are actually looking for truth and not loopholes to contradict God's will for us to obey the Ten Commandments.

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[Leaf473]

Brother, that's not possible!

Brother, it is a miracle! I have rest in Jesus †

Looking at them, Jesus said, “With men this is impossible, but with God all things are possible.” Matthew 19

Then I will teach transgressors your ways.
Sinners will be converted to you
Deliver me from the guilt of bloodshed, O God, the God of my salvation.
My tongue will sing aloud of your righteousness.
Lord, open my lips.
My mouth will declare your praise Psalm 51 (not saying anyone here is a transgressor/sinner )

No other biblical truth has greater confirmation in all Scripture without contradiction. This truth destroys your conviction that we don't have to obey the Ten Commandments, an error which forces you to distort many scriptures that contradict that belief in order for you to hold on to it. I learned when days begin and end from the creation account in Genesis, but others have come to the same conclusion from the manna story, where the days of the week in the Bible are from morning to morning and not from evening to evening, as Judaism assumed since Joshua, due to the earlier Sabbath given in Jerusalem, which Joshua must have concluded was a new seventh day of the week different from the one God taught with the manna, as understood in the following video. The video demonstrates that I am not the only one capable of seeing this truth throughout Scripture. Some of us are actually looking for truth and not loopholes to contradict God's will for us to obey the Ten Commandments.

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Brother, that's not possible! No other biblical truth has greater confirmation in all Scripture without contradiction. This truth destroys your conviction that we don't have to obey the Ten Commandments, an error which forces you to distort many scriptures that contradict that belief in order for you to hold on to it. I learned when days begin and end from the creation account in Genesis, but others have come to the same conclusion from the manna story, where the days of the week in the Bible are from morning to morning and not from evening to evening, as Judaism assumed since Joshua, due to the earlier Sabbath given in Jerusalem, which Joshua must have concluded was a new seventh day of the week different from the one God taught with the manna, as understood in the following video. The video demonstrates that I am not the only one capable of seeing this truth throughout Scripture. Some of us are actually looking for truth and not loopholes to contradict God's will for us to obey the Ten Commandments.

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

Please stop with this off topic video you post in every Sabbath thread, that all its doing is confusing people and leading people away from God's Sabbath Truth.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Exactly right. Sabbatimos remains (in Christ).

Do you have a reference for this? I think you mean sabbatismos

Which means according to the literal Greek word that was used a keeping of the Sabbath, that is what remains for the people of God Heb 4:9NIV. If we remain in Christ it means we are abiding in His commandments John 15:10, the following His example 1 John 2:6


sabbatismos: Sabbath rest
Original Word: σαββατισμός
Part of Speech: Noun, Masculine
Transliteration: sabbatismos
Pronunciation: sab-bat-is-mos'
Phonetic Spelling: (sab-bat-is-mos')
Definition: Sabbath rest
Meaning: a keeping of the Sabbath, a Sabbath rest.

There is only one "the Sabbath" and it was both written and spoken by God to be on the seventh day Exo 20:8-11

That's the Sabbath we keep, not Sabbaton which was the weekly Sabbath and a shadow of what was to become that continual rest in Christ that we find today.

I am not sure how we find rest in Christ, by disobeying God's commandments. That is called unrest. We do have continual rest in God when we obey His commandments the way He said Isa 48:18 because in His rest there is no rebellion, we allow Him to be God since we are just the creation. Why the Holy Spirit says if we hear His voice calling us Today not not harden our hearts in rebellion Heb 3:7-8

The weekly Sabbath is not a shadow of anything, because it started at Creation according to God Exo 20:11, when He made everything according to His perfect will and plan before the fall of man. The shadow sabbath(s) or yearly feast days has nothing to do with the weekly Sabbath that started at Creation, they came after the fall pointing forward, the weekly Sabbath points us to Creation, so we never forget Who made us and where we came from Exo 20:11, it is the Holy Day of the Lord, thus saith the Lord Isa 58:13, so who are we to teach we do not have the keep the holy day of the Lord Isa 58:13 when God in His own Words said He would not alter His covenant Psa 89:34 and it is His personal Testimony Exo 31:18 not a jot or tittle Mat 5:18, who is greater than God to re-write what He wrote with His own finger which is the Holy Spirit of Truth. I know of no one greater

Hebrews 4:3 "For we which have believed do enter into rest, as He said, "As I have sworn in My wrath, if they shall enter into My rest:" although the works were finished from the foundation of the world."

The rest in this verse is not the Sabbath rest

katapausis: Rest
Original Word: κατάπαυσις
Part of Speech: Noun, Feminine
Transliteration: katapausis
Pronunciation: kah-tah'-pow-sis
Phonetic Spelling: (kat-ap'-ow-sis)
Definition: Rest
Meaning: (in the Old Testament of the rest attained by the settlement in Canaan), resting, rest, dwelling, habitation.

And many of the Israelites never entered their rest into Canaan and many broke the Sabbath commandment Eze 20:13 during their trial in the wilderness and disobedience caused them not to enter Heb 4:6

Moses 40 years after God gave His personal and written eternal Testimony Exo 31:18 Deut 4:13 that He said He would not alter Psa 89:34, not a jot or tittle Mat 5:18 Moses repeated the Ten Commandments to the children of Israel before Joshua led the people to their promised rest of Canaan Jos 1:15 and this included the Sabbath commandment, just the way God said and told them to diligently keep and teach their children and children's children to diligently keep, he quoted this and than summarized it as the greatest commandment to love God with all our heart, soul and might that Jesus later quoted from Deut 6:5 and we are told to hear His voice today to come out of our rebellion Heb 3:7-8, just like many of the Israelites did Eze 20:13 and not follow their same path of disobedience Heb 4:11 because those who enter into Christ rest ALSO cease from their works as God did Heb 4:10 on the seventh day Heb 4:4 Exo 20:11, which God said is the Sabbath Exo 20:10 thus saith the Lord. So we can believe human words, but I believe God keeps His promises when He writes something with the Holy Spirit of Truth and said He would not alter, not a jot or tittle, us humans thinking we know better than God, seems like a terrible idea to me but we have free will.


In the last days, which I believe we are close to, we will either have rest in Christ, which means one is keeping God's commandments Isa 48:18 (His version) or by default if we are not obeying His commandments, it means our master is someone else. Whoever we obey is who we serve Rom 6:16


Rev 14:11 And the smoke of their torment ascends forever and ever; and they have no rest day or night, who worship the beast and his image, and whoever receives the mark of his name.”

God gives us the antidote in the next verse to keep His people safe and it is being faithful to Him the way He said

Rev 14:12 Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God (His version Exo 20:6 Exo 31:18) and the faith of Jesus.

Its not just the faith in Jesus its the faith of Jesus, what did Jesus teach how did He live, that is His faith. He said come to me I will give you rest AND still kept the seventh day Sabbath as a holy convocation Luke 4:16 Lev 23:3 and is our example to follow if we abide in Him 1 John 2:6 John 15:10 never saying one replaced the other, this is a man-made doctrine Jesus warned us about Mat 15:3-14 Mark 7:7-13. Did Jesus tell anyone His weekly Sabbath would end at the Cross? No His faithful followers who followed Him everywhere still kept the Sabbath rest according to the commandment after His death Luke 23:56 Jesus in His own Words said the weekly Sabbath would not end at His Cross as most teach, but would be kept by His faithful 40+ years after the Cross at the destruction of Jerusalem Mat 24:20 and will be kept by His saints as a holy convocation Lev 23:3 in the new heaven and new earth Isa 66:22-23. How do we have faith of Jesus but not faith in His teachings. This is for Jesus to sort out, but the faith we need is to believe Jesus when He said quoting the OT live by His every word that proceeds out of the mouth of God which would include Exo 20:1 Exo 20:8-11

No one receives Christ rest by not listening to His voice and living by it. Its really a deception and if we don't head the warning in Hebrews 3-4 to hear His voice and come our of our rebellion to Him which is sin by breaking God's law, we will not enter our promised rest which is heaven.

Isa 56:1 Thus says the Lord:

“Keep justice, and do righteousness,
For My salvation is about to come,
And My righteousness to be revealed.

Isa 56:2 Blessed is the man who does this,
And the son of man who lays hold on it;
Who keeps from defiling the Sabbath,
And keeps his hand from doing any evil.”

Rev 22:14 Blessed are those who [a]do His commandments, that they may have the right to the tree of life, and may enter through the gates into the city

Once God blesses like He did with the weekly Sabbath and for those who keep, man can't reverse Num 23:20 no matter how hard they try, because man is not God, and whoever we obey, is who we serve Rom 6:16. I pray we all obey God the way God said, because He is God, the Creator of man, the Creator of the Sabbath starting from Creation and He knows whats best for us, because man can't bless themselves or a day Isa 56:2 Exo 20:11 and man can't sanctify themselves Isa 66:17, only God can Eze 20:12

 

[Leaf473]

We can't have rest In Christ when we are disobeying God's commandments. It follows, then, that if someone is having rest in Christ, they are obeying God's commandments

Psalm 119:159
Consider how I love your precepts. Revive me, O Lord, according to your loving kindness

 

[guevaraj]

We can't have rest In Christ when we are disobeying God's commandments. It follows, then, that if someone is having rest in Christ, they are obeying God's commandments

Brother, not so! There is the special case of when you first believed, where you do not have to do any work for your forgiveness, because God attributes your having believed as having worked, without needing to go to the temple. David is an example of this special case where, because he believed in God's correction of his faith through the prophet Nathan, he did not have to go to the temple to receive forgiveness for his sin with Bathsheba. To have "believed" alone is not "faith" until you "obey" as the proper response to having "believed", which God calls "righteous". An example of someone who is not "righteous" is Cain, who refused to do what is right, letting sin control him.

“Why are you so angry?” the LORD asked Cain. “Why do you look so dejected? You will be accepted if you do what is right. But if you refuse to do what is right, then watch out! Sin is crouching at the door, eager to control you. But you must subdue it and be its master.” (Genesis 4:6-7 NLT)​

Under the new covenant, Abraham's "faith" that makes us right with God, unlike that of Cain equals faith that begins with "believed" God's promise to help us overcome sin plus the "righteous" action of obedience to God's instructions to complete our "faith" as God helps us to overcome sin's eager control of us. "Faith" is composed of the two parts God mentions Abraham has: Abraham "believed" God's promise & the "righteous" action of obedience to God that he later showed he had to achieve the promise.

FAITH = BELIEVED + RIGHTEOUS​

God, Instead of saying of Abraham that he has the right "faith" in Genesis 15:6, God mentions the two equivalent parts that make up "faith": "believed" and "righteous". To be "righteous" emphasizes the second part of Abraham's proper "faith". It is written in the following passage that the demons "believed" God, trembling in terror, but like Cain above, do not obey God to have "faith", as Abraham was shown to be "righteous" in his obeying God to help him to father many nations. Abraham's "faith" would obey God's instructions as God helps him to overcome sin, as he helped him to father many nations. Jesus' many forgivenesses prevent our past disobedience from defeating our future obedience, which Jesus knows we can obey "all" instructions with practice to mastery. Practice like a child who learns to walk by getting up again and again until he no longer falls. Practice that is evidenced in the many animal sacrifices of the earthly stand-in copy of the true temple in heaven. Where Jesus dispenses His many forgivenesses as our High Priest for our past sins when we pray for forgiveness. Jesus lives forever to complete the mastery through practice of obedience to God's instructions. In the following passage, the translators added the word "faith", not found in the original. By adding the word faith, the translators highlighted God's deliberate act of not mentioning the word "faith", because the equivalent of "faith" is the two parts that God mentioned Abraham had from the beginning, but we humans cannot say that Abraham was "righteous", until his obeying "faith" was shown most clear when he offered his son Isaac on the alter.

You say you have faith, for you believe that there is one God. Good for you! Even the demons believe this, and they tremble in terror. How foolish! Can’t you see that faith without good deeds is useless? Don’t you remember that our ancestor Abraham was shown to be right with God by his actions when he offered his son Isaac on the altar? You see, his faith and his actions worked together. His actions made his faith complete. And so it happened just as the Scriptures say: “Abraham believed God, and God counted him as righteous because of his faith.” He was even called the friend of God. So you see, we are shown to be right with God by what we do, not by faith alone. (James 2:19-24 NLT fixed)​

The "righteous" part of Abraham's "faith" after he "believed" God, was tested in the following passage and showed Abraham's complete "faith" in God, which God knew was there before we humans could say, through the offering of his son Isaac on the altar, that Abraham is "righteous" in him obeying God as his response to having "believed" God's promise. It is only said of Abraham that he had "faith" when he obeyed and not before he obeyed when he first "believed". "Believed" alone is not "faith" until you "obey" God and we are saved by "faith" that acts "righteous", obeying God's instructions that remove sin when obeyed and not by our having believed alone as demons also believed and are lost because they do not "obey" God's instructions that overcome sin when obeyed!

It was by faith that Abraham offered Isaac as a sacrifice when God was testing him. Abraham, who had received God’s promises, was ready to sacrifice his only son, Isaac, even though God had told him, “Isaac is the son through whom your descendants will be counted.” Abraham reasoned that if Isaac died, God was able to bring him back to life again. And in a sense, Abraham did receive his son back from the dead. (Hebrews 11:17-19 NLT)​

United in our hope for the soon return of Jesus, Jorge

 

[Bob S]

I am not sure how we find rest in Christ, by disobeying God's commandments. That is called unrest. We do have continual rest in God when we obey His commandments, Isa 48:18 the way He said because He is God and we are just the creation.

We cannot SB, The problem is and has been since we came on this board is what are the commands we are to keep? You completely deny that P{Paul tells us the ten commandments were temporary, which also means you don't believe we are living in the new covenant era. Covenants do not work the way you teach. I we nullify one covenant to accept another one, then we are in no way responsible for observing the rules of the nullified one.

We can tell for sure what the new covenant has written on our hearts, and it surely is not the ritual weekly Sabbath. If it were written on our hearts, we wouldn't be having this debate and the SDA church wouldn't be spending millions trying to convince mankind of its importance to salvation.

I spent 40 y

Once God blesses like He did with the weekly Sabbath and for those who keep, man can't reverse Num 23:20 no matter how hard they try, because man is not God, and whoever we obey, is who we serve Rom 6:16. I pray we all obey God the way God said, because He is God, the Creator of man, the Creator of the Sabbath starting from Creation and He knows whats best for us, because man can't bless themselves or a day Isa 56:2 Exo 20:11 and man can't sanctify themselves Isa 66:17, only God can Eze 20:12

I guess one can make believe just about anything. Sabbath observance, if a person observes it as required in the Old Covenant, is not a blessing at all. Isaiah 58 told the Israelites how they were to observe the Sabbath. No idle words like how is your garden growing would be permitted. What would you do with the rule not to do your own pleasure? According to Ellen, one would be allowed to wade in the creek so long as one didn't go too deep. That requirement surely would have taken the pleasure out of wading.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

We cannot SB, The problem is and has been since we came on this board is what are the commands we are to keep? You completely deny that P{Paul tells us the ten commandments were temporary, which also means you don't believe we are living in the new covenant era. Covenants do not work the way you teach. I we nullify one covenant to accept another one, then we are in no way responsible for observing the rules of the nullified one.

We can tell for sure what the new covenant has written on our hearts, and it surely is not the ritual weekly Sabbath. If it were written on our hearts, we wouldn't be having this debate and the SDA church wouldn't be spending millions trying to convince mankind of its importance to salvation.

I spent 40 y

I guess one can make believe just about anything. Sabbath observance, if a person observes it as required in the Old Covenant, is not a blessing at all. Isaiah 58 told the Israelites how they were to observe the Sabbath. No idle words like how is your garden growing would be permitted. What would you do with the rule not to do your own pleasure? According to Ellen, one would be allowed to wade in the creek so long as one didn't go too deep. That requirement surely would have taken the pleasure out of wading.

Pauls writings came with this salvation warning

2 Peter 3:16 as also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things, in which are some things hard to understand, which untaught and unstable people twist to their own destruction, as they do also the rest of the Scriptures.

Paul taught in the New Covenant not keeping the Ten Commandments as dishonoring God Rom 2:21-23, sin Rom 7:7 being an enmity to God Rom 8:7-8 and keeping them is what matters 1 Cor 7:19 so obviously Paul did not teach what you are teaching.

My loyalty is to God. Paul can't save us and Paul would never undermined the promises of God Psa 89:34 Mat 5:18-30, so its just twisted out of context scripture just as we are told, just as Jesus warned would lead to destruction Mat 15:3-14 Mark 7:7-13 Mat 5:19-30 Mat 7:21-23Rev 22:15 Heb 10:26-30


I am going to stick with the promises of what He said that worshipping other gods is still a sin just like committing murder or breaking the least of these commandments breaking one we break them all James 2:11-12 and have become a transgressor of God's law 1 John 3:4. We have other options, but it requires to keep the commandments of God and have the faith of Jesus Rev 14:12. What faith did Jesus have, He told us not to break or teach others to break the least of these commandments quoting two from the Ten Commandments so we know which commandments He was referring to, the ones written by the Holy Spirit of Truth spoken by His own voice, His personal Testimony which the entire Bible is about, the testimony of Jesus Christ, yet when it comes to His own Testimony Exo 31:18 people teach to lay it aside for their own rules and traditions. It will all work out in the end, but hopefully people will hear His small still voice today and not harden their hearts in rebellion (sin) Heb 3:7-8