I know, but I think it would be good for him to learn to defend his beliefs.W2L is deflecting you from the primary issue, Deborah D.
Its pretty common knowledge. I suggest you do the research. You are the one who is defending the WOF movement but you dont even know what they teach.
I have heard that same line from other WOF posters. Its like they cant refute what you say so they ask the question "do you understand WOF?"Have a nice day friend. In done.W2L, I said that I'm not defending WOL! I haven't defended them in any of my posts. You're the one who is criticizing them, but you can't even give specifics. I feel like I'm going round and round with you. You need to be able to defend what you believe!
I have heard that same line from other WOF posters. Its like they cant refute what you say so they ask the question "do you understand WOF?"Have a nice day friend. In done.
Sir, that verse you are quoting is talking about how we judge others. Its not about getting money from God.
Nope, that's not what I'm doing. I'm only asking for specifics, which you have not supplied.
As Christians, we need to know specifically what we believe, and we need to be able to defend our beliefs. I urge you to learn to do this! Christians who cannot defend what we believe can become sitting ducks for false teachers.
Judging you? Well I suppose I did. But, IF what I said was true, then what are you complaining about? After all I included myself in the rich 'church of America' just in case you missed that point.You are accusing others of judging because you have no case it seems. Thats all you have left to argue with. The scriptures praise those who test apostles to see if they are false but you guys say no thats judging? Sorry friend but i have scripture on my side. Im allowed to judge whether someone is a true or false apostle.
My posts almost always have scripture. And my last one, which you never addressed at all, quoted three. So if I twisted 'anything', then this post of yours should be a written rebuttal instead of just sounding like a cheap bottle of whine.And your twisting of scripture cannot change that fact. No wonder you all follow bad teaching, you dont judge your teachers.
This first verse is just showing the difference between the 'unknown tongue' of a Christian's spirit. Even the translators correctly did not capitalize spirit here.I’ve shown SM at least a couple of times, with no rebuttal, that the apostles didn’t ‘first’ speak in the tongues of men. And neither were they celebrating Pentecost at somebodies house. They were celebrating at the house of the Lord. Just like the foreigner Jews who heard ‘unknown tongues’ first, which according to scripture “no man understandeth”.
And Acts 2:6 also uses an interesting word to describe this unknown “gibberish and babble” which the“ungifted” or “unlearned “ call our spirit's prayer tongues even to this day.
So, you give me a video of one WOF teacher. You're still not telling me your specific objections.
Both Matthew and Luke are recording the sermon on the mount. If we compare them we see that The Lord is talking about how we judge.how can judgement be shaken together pressed down and running over? "the measure you give will be the measure which is meted out again.
Paul teaches the same doctrine..."he who gives bounteously will also reap bounteously, he who gives sparingly will also reap sparingly"
Word of faith teaches that we can name it and claim it, as there is power in the spoken word, as just as God spoke something out of nothing, we have the same meand and ability to do that as he did! They also hold to things such as visualization, we receive what we confess for good/bad, many also teach that Jesus died a sinner and so needed to get reborn again in Hell, and so as a Born again man he defeated satan, and so we can do that because we too are now born again! Much of their theology is heretical and not of from God!OK, for those who aren't familiar with WOF, please explain specifically what WOF teaching you object to. But make sure that what you share is what they actually teach.
made me laugh how you listed none of the things i said .. you don't believe the gifts are for today .. that is why you dont believe peoples testimonies -you choose to call them liars .Repent of our unbelief?!!
Unbelief in the claims that people are speaking in tongues when it doesn't match the biblical description?
Unbelief in the claims that thoughts popping into people's heads is prophecy?
Unbelief in the claims that apostles exist today, when nobody can meet the biblical qualifications?
Unbelief in the claims that the leg lengthening parlor trick is really a faith healer growing a limb?
Unbelief in the claims that someone is miraculously healed when it takes 3 months to get better?
Unbelief in the claim that being 'slain in the Spirit' is really a work of the Holy Spirit?
Unbelief that of claims of someone's back pain easing during an adrenaline flowing faith healing spectacle is really a healing when it returns the next day?
Unbelief in the fanciful unsubstantiated 2nd hand stories from internet strangers that are offered as proof of miracles?
Unbelief in the health and wealth gospel?
I'm afraid will not be repenting of my unbelief in the above any time soon.
I just wanted to point this out so charismatics know they have places to post free from the Cessationists' jive that the Gifts have ceased.
wof is only a section of a section of charismatic circles .. im not WOF i'm of the faith of Jesus .and IN the faith of Jesus - i test myself on this often. -the lord showed me after 30 years in the church that i was not IN the faith (being in Church does not equate to being in the faith .)Word of faith teaches that we can name it and claim it, as there is power in the spoken word, as just as God spoke something out of nothing, we have the same means and ability to do that as he did! They also hold to things such as visualization, we receive what we confess for good/bad, many also teach that Jesus died a sinner and so needed to get reborn again in Hell, and so as a Born again man he defeated satan, and so we can do that because we too are now born again! Much of their theology is heretical and not of from God!
The word "charismatics" has gotten an unfortunate wrap by many mainline churches.
Nope. The scripture writers got it right, but your distortion of scripture gets it wrong.
According to scripture, and as I said last time,- "Even today, all ministers are frauds, unless appointed by Christ and moving in His anointing,"
Which is what Paul said.-
Romans12v6And we are having different gifts according to the grace having been given to us: if prophecy, according to the proportion of the faith; 7or service, in the service; or teaching, in the teaching; 8or exhorting, in the exhortation; giving, in generosity; leading, in diligence; showing mercy, in cheerfulness.
Its hardly surprising the first century apostles and prophets died 2000 years ago, but so did the evangelists pastors and teachers.
But thankfully those ministries have never been revoked, which is why we still see pastors and teachers and evangelists. The fact that apostles and prophets are persecuted out of the church today is entirely down to the doctrines of demons taught in many churches.
As I said, Barnabas was an apostle, which disproves your argument.
Wrong again.
Paul counted Apollos as an apostle alongside himself in these passages.-
1Cor4v6Now I have applied these things, brothers, to myself and Apollos, on account of you, so that in us you may learn,..................….9For I think God has exhibited us, the apostles, last, as appointed to death, ……………
Paul also counted Sylvanus and Timothy as fellow apostles when he wrote to the Thessalonians.
1Thes1v1Paul and Silvanus and Timothy, To the church of the Thessalonians....
1Thes2v3For our exhortation was not of error, nor of impurity, nor in trickery; 4but just as we have been approved by God to be entrusted with the gospel, so we speak, not as pleasing men, but God, the One examining our hearts. 5For never at any time were we with word of flattery, just as you know, nor with a pretext for greed—God is witness— 6nor seeking glory from men, nor from you, nor from others, though having authority with weight to be, as apostles of Christ.
Paul also calls Epaphroditus a fellow apostle
Phil2v25And I thought it necessary Epaphroditus -- my brother, and fellow-workman, and fellow-soldier, and your apostle and servant to my need -- to send unto you,
Word of faith teaches that we can name it and claim it, as there is power in the spoken word, as just as God spoke something out of nothing, we have the same meand and ability to do that as he did! They also hold to things such as visualization, we receive what we confess for good/bad, many also teach that Jesus died a sinner and so needed to get reborn again in Hell, and so as a Born again man he defeated satan, and so we can do that because we too are now born again! Much of their theology is heretical and not of from God!
This first verse is just showing the difference between the 'unknown tongue' of a Christian's spirit. Even the translators correctly did not capitalize spirit here.
1CO 14:2 For he that speaketh in an unknown tongue speaketh not unto men, but unto God: for no man understandeth him; howbeit in the spirit he speaketh mysteries.
And as for this next verse I share two different translations. It is a verse which your side understandably hates to have quoted, because it clearly points out THREE different groups. Charismatic Christians, NON Charismatic Christians and complete heathens.
KJV 1CO 14:23 If therefore the whole church be come together into one place, and all speak with tongues (Charismatics), and there come in those that are unlearned/idiotes, or unbelievers/apistos, will they not say that ye are mad?
NAS 1CO 14:23 Therefore if the whole church assembles together and all speak in tongues, and ungifted/idiotes men or unbelievers/apistos enter, will they not say that you are mad?
Group ONE is the "whole Church" which is obviously ALL charismatic since Paul even believes If therefore ALL speak in tongues. Now I know that modern "ungifted/unlearned" began to call this statement a hyperbole, a long time ago, and it's no 'wonder why'. Funny thing is, Paul never said that it was hyperbole. So it seems to me that it is your side who is "twisting the scriptures" as far my side is concerned.
Group TWO is the "unlearned" (KJV) and the "ungifted" (NAS) ones. I only see this, as a group of non Charismatic Christians at Corinth which Paul said would have judged the Corinthian Charismatics as speaking like "mad" men, IF they ever showed up in a Charismatic church. So, I see no twisting here of scripture on our part either. I just see your side not liking the harsh language of what Paul said, and then I see you getting mad at me for pointing it out.
"ungifted" "unlearned"
2399 idiotes: a private person, i.e. (by impl.) an ignoramus (comp. "idiot")
Group THREE is simply those who are non Christian heathens or "unbelievers" even as the Greek below defines them to be;
"unbelievers"
0571 apistos: (act.) disbelieving, i.e. without Christian faith (spec. a heathen); (pass.) untrustworthy (person), or incredible (thing)
ACT 2:6 And at this sound/phone the multitude came together, and they were bewildered, because each one heard them speaking in his own language.
5456 phone fo-nay' probably akin to 5316 through the idea of disclosure; a tone (articulate, bestial or artificial); by implication, an address (for any purpose), saying or language:--noise, sound, voice.
So, according to this verse above the unbelieving Jews heard the disciples in the house of the Lord on the day of Pentecost speaking in a prayer language which sounded like a "bestial" or "artificial" articulation. Sure doesn't sound like 'foreign languages of men' like your side twists the scripture to believe. And it was that "sound/phone" which drew the crowd to THEN hear the manifestated "gift of tongues" from the Holy Spirit (not the disciple's spirit), speaking in tongues of men, which men did understand.
made me laugh how you listed none of the things i said
you don't believe the gifts are for today
.. that is why you dont believe peoples testimonies -you choose to call them liars .
but the new testament is a collection of "testimonies " .
-exactly -you were trying refute what wasnt said .You didn't list anything.
exactly -YOU don not believe (apostle means sent one )No, my position is that I don't believe ALL the NT gifts are for today. The same as most continuists don't believe ALL the NT gifts are for today either. Most continuists believe apostles are not around today, and apostle is listed as a gift.
- you just did it again .I never called the storytellers liars, although some probably are.
and yet .. you do not believe all of it- you just said so .-if its the inerrant word of god then you should believe all of it not cherry pick parts .The New Testament is the inerrant inspired word of God. That is the one source that is guaranteed to be true.