The Lord's Day

[woobadooba]

You don't see it as Sunday because you have an objective based on a false doctrine. The evidence from both the Scripture and historical records indicate Christians worshiped on Sunday from before the turn of the 1st century. It was and still is referred to as the Lord's day. If I were to quote them you'd simply dismiss them.

I am aware of the quotes. The problem, however, is the Bible does not support the idea that Sunday is the Lord's Day. There must be a foundation to test a belief (see 1 John 4:1). I use the Scriptures to test beliefs concerning God (2 Tim. 3:16).

Just because there are quotes outside of the Bible proving Christians called Sunday the Lord's Day and worshiped on Sunday, it doesn't mean they were right. It's not proof that the Sabbath day has been changed or done away with.

I don't base my faith on man made traditions; rather, I test traditions in the light of the Scriptures. If they agree with the Bible, then I accept them; if not, I reject them.

 

[listed]

I am aware of the quotes. The problem, however, is the Bible does not support the idea that Sunday is the Lord's Day. There must be a foundation to test a belief (see 1 John 4:1). I use the Scriptures to test beliefs concerning God (2 Tim. 3:16).

The Bible most certainly does support the idea of Christians worshiping on Sunday and calling it the Lord's day. 1 Corinthians 16 is a great example. Your argument will be specific words aren't found there. Your issue is Christians are being disobedient and sinning by not worshiping on Saturday. There's no foundation in the NT to support that idea. There's no required day to assemble for worship to be found in the NT. There's support to celebrate the resurrection of Jesus. Not 1 single event in the 40 days following the resurrection are mentioned as happening on Saturday. The only day recorded anything happened is Sunday. For you that's no problem, just throw it out.

Just because there are quotes outside of the Bible proving Christians called Sunday the Lord's Day and worshiped on Sunday, that's not proof that the Sabbath day has been changed or done away with.

I don't interpret Scripture through the lens of tradition; I test tradition in the light of the Scriptures.

In-other-words historians are all liars promoting something you refuse to accept.

 

[woobadooba]

Not a single one of your quoted verses speak about a day. All of them are about future events and usually judgement. Nat a single one of them area bout a holy day or day on which worship is a focus point.

For some reason, you just aren't understanding the point I am making. I have tried to explain it multiple times, but you're just not getting it. I'm sorry, but I cannot help you.

 

[listed]

For some reason, you just aren't understanding the point I am making. I have tried to explain it multiple times, but you're just not getting it. I'm sorry, but I cannot help you.

No the point you're trying to make is worshiping on Sunday is sin. In-other-words a person is justified by keeping the law. Romans 4 specifically demonstrates and says no. You're promoting legalism - salvation by works of the law. The Christian (even the Jewish Christian) isn't obligated to the law. See Romans 7:6.

 

[woobadooba]

There's no required day to assemble for worship to be found in the NT.

Why do you limit your study to the NT?

2 Timothy 3:16-17 (NKJV) "All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work."

There was no NT writings as we know them today when Paul made that statement. What writings do you think he was referring to?

 

[woobadooba]

No the point you're trying to make is worshiping on Sunday is sin. In-other-words a person is justified by keeping the law. Romans 4 specifically demonstrates and says no. You're promoting legalism - salvation by works of the law. The Christian (even the Jewish Christian) isn't obligated to the law. See Romans 7:6.

It would do you well to ask questions before jumping to conclusions. I never said worshiping on Sunday is sin. Where did I say that?

But I do believe the Sabbath day has not been done away with or changed. I believe we are still required to keep it holy. It's not legalism but obedience to a command of God. There is a difference.

 

[listed]

Why do you limit your study to the NT?

2 Timothy 3:16-17 (NKJV) "All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness, that the man of God may be complete, thoroughly equipped for every good work."

There was no NT writings as we know them today when Paul made that statement. What writings do you think he was referring to?

For the same reason you refuse to accept the NT as truth. By-the-way I don't limit myself to the NT as you say. Read my posts. They have OT referenced if not quoted in them.

What you're really saying is the NT writings aren't Scripture when Peter puts them on the same level sd the OTcalling them Scripture. See 2 Peter 3:16.

 

[woobadooba]

For the same reason you refuse to accept the NT as truth.

There you go again, jumping to conclusions and making false statements about me. It is very difficult to have a discussion with someone who does these things.

By-the-way I don't limit myself to the NT as you say. Read my posts. They have OT referenced if not quoted in them.

Then you should have no problem accepting the Sabbath. There is plenty of support throughout the Scriptures to show that those who think it has been changed or done away with are in error.

 

[listed]

It would do you well to ask questions before jumping to conclusions. I never said worshiping on Sunday is sin. Where did I say that?

But I do believe the Sabbath day has not been done away with or changed. I believe we are still required to keep it holy. It's not legalism but obedience to a command of God. There is a difference.

Ok I'm stupid beyond belief. There's plenty of question in my posts. They remain unanswered by you.

You refuse to accept the NT based on better promises and demand allegiance to the law for salvation. As buggy would say - no deal. My righteousness is the substitionary righteous provided by Jesus. The righteousness required by God can't be achieved by the law.

 

[listed]

There you go again, jumping to conclusions and making false statements about me. It is very difficult to have a discussion with someone who does these things.


Then you should have no problem accepting the Sabbath. There is plenty of support throughout the Scriptures to show that those who think it has been changed or done away with are in error.

Where does the NT require the keeping of the sabbath?

What does Jesus offer to those keeping the 7th day sabbath in Mat 11:28-30? It's obvious they didn't already have what Jesus offered. Jesus is my (sabbath) rest the Israeli were told they would never enter.

 

[woobadooba]

You refuse to accept the NT based on better promises and demand allegiance to the law for salvation.

More false statements. I am tired of this.

You aren't listening.

Goodbye.

 

[listed]

There you go again, jumping to conclusions and making false statements about me. It is very difficult to have a discussion with someone who does these things.


Then you should have no problem accepting the Sabbath. There is plenty of support throughout the Scriptures to show that those who think it has been changed or done away with are in error.

All I have to say is found in Jeremiah 31:31-33.

 

[listed]

More false statements. I am tired of this.

You aren't listening.

Goodbye.

Ah no convert. What a shame. I think you're really tired of the truth. You really prove without doubt the OP is an attempt to prove the Lord's day is the sabbath.

 

[WailingWall]

Where does the NT require the keeping of the sabbath?

DO YOU WANT ETERNAL LIFE
MATT.19 [16] And, behold, one came and said unto him, GOOD MASTER, WHAT GOOD THING SHALL I DO, THAT I MAY HAVE ETERNAL LIFE?[17] And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS.[18] He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,

DO YOU KNOW GOD
1 JOHN 2 [1] My little children, these things write I unto you, that ye sin not. And if any man sin, we have an advocate with the Father, Jesus Christ the righteous: [2] And he is the propitiation for our sins: and not for ours only, but also for the sins of the whole world. [3] AND HEREBY WE DO KNOW THAT WE KNOW HIM, IF WE KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS. [4] He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

HAVE YOU BEEN TAUGHT “JUST BELIEVE” AND YOU WILL BE SAVED
JAMES 2 [19] Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: THE DEVILS ALSO BELIEVE, and tremble.

DO YOU LOVE GOD
1 JOHN 5 [1] Whosoever believeth that Jesus is the Christ is born of God: and every one that loveth him that begat loveth him also that is begotten of him. [2] BY THIS WE KNOW THAT WE LOVE THE CHILDREN OF GOD, WHEN WE LOVE GOD, AND KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS. [3] For this is the love of God, that we keep his commandments: and his commandments are not grievous.

DO YOU WANT GODS HOLY SPIRIT
JOHN 14 [15] If ye love me, KEEP MY COMMANDMENTS.[16] And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;[17] Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

HAS HEAVEN AND EARTH PASSED – YIKES! WHAT AM I STANDING ON?
MATT.5 [17] Think not that I am come to destroy the law, or the prophets: I am not come to destroy, but to fulfil.[18] For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

WANT TO BE ONE OF GODS SAINTS
REV.14 [12] Here is the patience of the saints: here are they that KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS of God, and the faith of Jesus

BEEN TAUGHT DUE TO FAITH WE NEED NOT KEEP GODS COMMANDMENTS
ROMANS 3 [31] Do we then make void the law through faith? God forbid: yea, we establish the law.

WANT TO ENTER THE CITY - THE 1000yr PERIOD OF REST
REV.22 [14] Blessed are they that DO HIS COMMANDMENTS, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city

FROM THE WRITINGS OF PAUL
1 COR. 7 [19] Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the KEEPING OF THE COMMANDMENTS of God.

Well, you see all these scriptures from the new testament about keeping Gods 10 commandments. Go read the 4th one

 

[Bob S]

Hi WailingWall, keeping "the" commandments didn't save Israel and keeping the 10 will not save us either. The 10 commandments are mum about loving. On the other hand Jesus new command is all about love. You, I believe, have taken the liberty to try to use the word commandments to refer it the 10 commandments and of course the 4th command to keep the Sabbath. You have absolutely no basis for doing that. God has given many commands throughout scripture. The 10 He gave exclusively to Israel, not for salvation but for the way to live in the land of Canaan. Most of them deal with how we are to treat God and our fellow man. They are just a few of the most important but there are hundreds of other ways we can be offensive to our fellow man. As I stated the most important way to treat our fellow man is to love him.

You quoted 1Jn 5 in your post and of course you think he meant the 10 commandments and I assure you he DID NOT. In 1jn 3:19-24 John tells us what he meant concerning the word commandment.

19 This is how we know that we belong to the truth and how we set our hearts at rest in his presence: 20 If our hearts condemn us, we know that God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything. 21 Dear friends, if our hearts do not condemn us, we have confidence before God 22 and receive from him anything we ask, because The one who keeps God’s commands lives in him, and he in them. And this is how we know that he lives in us: We know it by the Spirit he gave us.

Adding anything to His Plan of Salvation such as keeping days and doing or not doing certain things is something we should avoid with a passion. I pray this helps.

 

[woobadooba]

keeping "the" commandments didn't save Israel and keeping the 10 will not save us either.

That's true. But saying they no longer matter is false.

 

[Bob S]

That's true. But saying they no longer matter is false.

Wow! I see you do not see the big picture. You are stuck on small potatoes. Jesus command is so much bigger and better than the 10. Jesus command to love others as He loves us is dynamic, huge and supersedes all other commands. Can't you see it, Jesus, God in human flesh, laid down His life for me. Even though I am rotten clear through He was willing to die that I might live. IS THAT IN YOUR 10 COMMANDMENTS? What would it have taken Jesus to do to get you to wake up and see the real truth? Jesus said He kept His Father's commands and has ask us to keep His command. But no, you have been duped into believing that the 10 are the ticket to Heaven. Well brother let me tell you here and now they are not. For one thing the ten do not command or ask us to love one another. There are hundreds of atrocities we can do to our fellow man and God and the nine commands are but a drop in that bucket.

 

[woobadooba]

Jesus command to love others as He loves us is dynamic, huge and supersedes all other commands.

You seem to have forgotten these verses:

John 15:9-10 (NKJV) "As the Father loved Me, I also have loved you; abide in My love. If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father's commandments and abide in His love."

1 John 2:6 (NKJV) "He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked."

Revelation 14:12 (NKJV) "Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus."

Are you beginning to see the big picture yet?

 

[Bob S]

You seem to have forgotten these verses:

John 15:9-10 (NKJV) "As the Father loved Me, I also have loved you; abide in My love. If you keep My commandments, you will abide in My love, just as I have kept My Father's commandments and abide in His love."

I cannot believe you used that verse to try to counter my post to you. It says exactly what I am trying to get you to see. Jesus command is to love others as He loves us. This command supersedes all other commands.

1 John 2:6 (NKJV) "He who says he abides in Him ought himself also to walk just as He walked."

Jesus walked as one under the Law. I walk as He wills me to walk under Grace and led by the power of the Holy Spirit that Jesus left with us when He died on the Cross.

I guess by quoting that verse you believe that I do not walk as Jesus would have me walk. Actually, you know nothing about how I walk and by using that verse you judge me without any proof.

Revelation 14:12 (NKJV) "Here is the patience of the saints; here are those who keep the commandments of God and the faith of Jesus."

I see you are one who uses that verse as if it had a "10" in front of commandments. Well my brother it does not and I, for one, will not add to scripture. John in 1John tells us what commands we are to "keep" and it is not Torah. 19 This is how we know that we belong to the truth and how we set our hearts at rest in his presence: 20 If our hearts condemn us, we know that God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything. 21 Dear friends, if our hearts do not condemn us, we have confidence before God 22 and receive from him anything we ask, because we keep his commands and do what pleases him. 23 And this is his command: to believe in the name of his Son, Jesus Christ, and to love one another as he commanded us. 24 The one who keeps God’s commands lives in him, and he in them. And this is how we know that he lives in us: We know it by the Spirit he gave us.

There it is friend, we know we belong to the truth if we believe in the name of the Son, Jesus Christ and love one another as He commanded us. Does it get any plainer than that?

Are you beginning to see the big picture yet?

Blessed are the cracked, for they are the ones who let in the light.

Loving others as Jesus commanded supersedes the nine commandments a multitude of times. Wonder why I wrote nine instead of ten? It is because one command was not dealing with morality, it was a ritual command dealing with remembering Israels flight out of Egypt. It had nothing to do with how we are to morally treat our fellow man and our God.

 

[Aseyesee]

The day is synomous with a revealing (the day will declare it), along with John having to turn to see who was being revealed as one being in the midst, which I see as a relevant truth in John, as much as it is the relevant truth of the day, or of a tree in a garden (as being something in the midst).