The gospel is "believe in/on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved"...?

[Aldrin25]

Hello guys, I think we need to discern sometimes if the question is really a question or a debate. Let's stop wasting time explaining for the wrong people and just pray. =)

Matthew 7:6

6 Don’t give to dogs what belongs to God. They will only turn and attack you. Don’t throw pearls down in front of pigs. They will trample all over them

 

[d taylor]

Simply the best source a believer can use in witnessing to unbelievers is The Gospel of John.

The Gospel of John presents the 8 miracles (signs 20:30,31) preformed by Jesus. Which testifies to Jesus being who He stated He was, The promised Messiah from Old Testament prophecies.

The Gospel of John, then directs the person to place their faith,belief,trust in the Messiah for eternal life.

That is it, the way to eternal life / salvation.

LivingWater

 

[Guojing]

Simply the best source a believer can use in witnessing to unbelievers is The Gospel of John.

The Gospel of John presents the 8 miracles (signs 20:30,31) preformed by Jesus. Which testifies to Jesus being who He stated He was, The promised Messiah from Old Testament prophecies.

The Gospel of John, then directs the person to place their faith,belief,trust in the Messiah for eternal life.

That is it, the way to eternal life / salvation.

LivingWater

Actually, no, the promise of Jesus as the Messiah was only for the Jews during Jesus days. It was never meant for the Gentiles.

For us now, we are to believe in the death burial and resurrection of Jesus, as Paul stated in 1 Cor 15.

 

[timewerx]

I haven't looked through all the pages.

But hard to believe if nobody knew this verse!

John 14:12
12 Very truly I tell you, whoever believes in me will do the works I have been doing, and they will do even greater things than these, because I am going to the Father.

 

[Mathetes66]

Rom 1:1-5,16,17 Paul, a servant of Christ Jesus, called to be an apostle & set apart for the GOSPEL of God, which He promised beforehand through His prophets in the Holy Scriptures, REGARDING HIS SON, who was a descendant of David according to the flesh & who through the Spirit of holiness was declared with power to be the Son of God by His resurrection from the dead: Jesus Christ our Lord.

Through Him & on behalf of His Name, we received grace & apostleship to call all those among the Gentiles TO THE OBEDIENCE THAT COMES FROM FAITH. I am not ashamed of the gospel, because IT IS THE POWER OF GOD FOR SALVATION TO EVERYONE WHO BELIEVES, first to the Jew, then to the Greek. 17For the gospel REVEALS THE RIGHTEOUSNESS OF GOD THAT COMES BY FAITH FROM START TO FINISH, just as it is written: “The righteous will LIVE by faith.”

I Tim 1:5-8 The goal of our instruction is the love that comes from a pure heart, a clear conscience, and a sincere faith. But some people have missed this whole point. They have turned away from these things and spend their time in meaningless discussions.

2 Tim 2:14,15 Don't let anyone forget these things. And with God as your witness, you must warn them not to argue about words to no profit. These arguments don't help anyone. In fact, they ruin everyone who listens to them. Make every effort to present yourself approved to God, an unashamed workman who accurately handles (rightly divides) the word of truth.

2 Tim 2:22-24 Flee from youthful passions and pursue righteousness, faith, love, and peace, along with those who call on the Lord out of a pure heart. But avoid foolish and ignorant questionings, because you know that they produce contentions.

Titus 3:9 But avoid foolish controversies, genealogies, arguments, and quarrels about the Law, because these things are pointless and worthless.

I Tim 6:3-5 If anyone teaches another doctrine and disagrees with the sound words of our Lord Jesus Christ and with godly teaching, he is conceited and understands nothing, but has an unhealthy interest in controversies and verbal disputes. This gives rise to envy, dissension, slanders, evil suspicions, and constant friction between men of depraved mind who are devoid of the truth.

Titus 1:15 To the pure, all things are pure; but to the defiled and unbelieving, nothing is pure. Indeed, both their minds and their consciences are defiled.

I Cor 11:16 But if any man seem to be contentious, we have no such custom, neither the churches of God.

Rom 16:17,18 Now I beseech you, brethren, mark them which cause divisions and offenses contrary to the doctrine which ye have learned; and avoid them.

 

[bcbsr]

Your quotation is from a letter John wrote to believers, this thread concerns what we preach to unbelievers.

The deity of the Christ takes considerable time to establish from the scripture. This topic is not something I would teach to an unbeliever, rather, that Jesus is the promised savior of the world. Eternal life is available to anyone who believes in the death and resurrection of Jesus.

Jesus is the light, the only way, the absolute truth.

Keep it simple for unbelievers.

Most folk would never fully understand the incarnation or the deity of the Christ, especially not these days.

John 1:1-4
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. In him was life, and that life was the light of men.

The deity of Christ is a fundamental part of the gospel one must believe to be saved, as Paul also says, "If you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved." Rom 10:9 He then quotes verses in the Old Testament where "Lord" referred to the Lord God. So incorporated into saving faith is belief in the deity of Christ, the intention to obey him, his resurrection from the dead, along with him being Savior. Don't preach a half-way gospel.

 

[devin553344]

The gospel is "believe in/on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be saved"...?


And that's it, that's the good news, however, questions come up, like "believe how" for one, maybe even "believe what" (about or with Jesus Christ) for another, and do we all have to believe or all believe the exact same thing when it comes to Jesus or God, or in having our Christian beliefs about God or whatever, do they have to be the same, or, can they be different?

Then, some will say if you are truly one of His, that confession and repentance must be involved or is a part of the deal as well, and they would be right, mostly or for the most part. We all pretty much agree and there is not much disagreement about the "confession" and confessing part, but, we get hung up and argue quite a bit and there is a lot of disagreement about the whole repentance and repenting part.

So can we resolve these issues or discuss them maybe....?

Is our salvation dependent upon right (or wrong) believing or not...? Or our (confession and) repentance or our being "repentant" in and throughout our lives, and which one is it, if it is...?

Comments...?

God Bless!

Personally I only believe in some confession theology. Some sins should be confessed, but not all. People tend to be judgmental and massive confession of sins just leads to judgment from people? But there are important sins to confess.

I confess my sins to God, because ultimately he is the judge.

 

[d taylor]

Actually, no, the promise of Jesus as the Messiah was only for the Jews during Jesus days. It was never meant for the Gentiles.

For us now, we are to believe in the death burial and resurrection of Jesus, as Paul stated in 1 Cor 15.

The Gospel of John was written for people (any person) who had not yet believed in the Messiah for life John 20:30,31.
Notice no parables in John, the book is completely about making known who the Messiah is.

Matthew (Mark, Luke) was written for Jewish people and also how to follow The Messiah.

1 Corinthians 15 was written addressing resurrection. There was a group of believers saying there was no resurrection of the dead.

Now if Christ is preached that He has been raised from the dead, how do some among you say that there is no resurrection of the dead? But if there is no resurrection of the dead, then Christ is not risen. And if Christ is not risen, then our preaching is empty and your faith is also empty.

 

[d taylor]

Actually the former is more Biblical by examples:

"Sirs, what must I do to be saved?" They replied, "Believe in the Lord Jesus, and you will be saved" Acts 16:30,31

"If you confess with your mouth, "Jesus is Lord," and believe in your heart that God raised him from the dead, you will be saved. For it is with your heart that you believe and are justified, and it is with your mouth that you confess and are saved. As the Scripture says, "Anyone who trusts in him will never be put to shame." For there is no difference between Jew and Gentile— the same Lord is Lord of all and richly blesses all who call on him, for, "Everyone who calls on the name of the Lord will be saved." Rom 10:9-13

Interesting in that passage because "Lord" is being reference relative to an Old Testament passage which is talking about the Lord God. He's not simply the Messiah, He's the Lord God. This speaks not only of the deity of Christ being something one must believe to be saved, but also acknowledging Jesus as "Lord" means the person is pledging allegiance to do what he says, as Jesus said, "Why do you call me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ and do not do what I say?" Lk 6:46

How about the gospel preached to Cornelius?

Acts 10:36-43
You know the message God sent to the people of Israel, telling the good news of peace through Jesus Christ, who is Lord of all. You know what has happened throughout Judea, beginning in Galilee after the baptism that John preached— how God anointed Jesus of Nazareth with the Holy Spirit and power, and how he went around doing good and healing all who were under the power of the devil, because God was with him. We are witnesses of everything he did in the country of the Jews and in Jerusalem. They killed him by hanging him on a tree, but God raised him from the dead on the third day and caused him to be seen. He was not seen by all the people, but by witnesses whom God had already chosen— by us who ate and drank with him after he rose from the dead. He commanded us to preach to the people and to testify that he is the one whom God appointed as judge of the living and the dead.All the prophets testify about him that everyone who believes in him receives forgiveness of sins through his name."

So again, Jesus is Lord is typically mention in gospel presentations in the Bible, as well as his resurrection from the dead.

When a person uses two passages from the Bible that are out of different books and context, like using Acts and Romans.

Then i see that as creating/manufacturing a gospel.

Because take a look in Acts, what is required belief but in Romans, what is required confession.

I will stick with the Gospel of John, the message is clear and to the point.

Most assuredly, I say to you, he who believes in Me has everlasting life.

 

[FineLinen]

The gospel is "believe in/on the Lord Jesus Christ and you will be
saved"...?

And that's it, that's the good news, however,

The remainder of this passage=

"And your household"

Acts 16:31 They replied, "Believe in the Lord Jesus and you will be saved, you and your household."

 

[RaymondG]

If a person ask how to have eternal life and i tell to have eternal life. The Bible say to believe that Jesus is the promised Messiah and trust in Him for the gift of eterna life.

If they, then do not trust in Jesus, i see that as not wanting eternal life. Now if at some other time they do trust in Jesus. That is a possibility.

So trust is Jesus = trust and believe what you say about the bible? It would be unwise to try and convince one that, just because they believe what you say, they are saved and on the right track.

It would be better to simply invite them to read the bible and get in contact with the the spirit who can lead and guide into all truth.

One should not be discouraged or made to feel like they dont want to be saved because your explanation is questioned.

I am not concerned about other religions.

Expect that others will have no concern for your religion as well.

I do not go into a lot of what ifs, I just try and present clear evidence if or when asked about eternal life/salvation.

Nice......THis is more like it.... For the Disciples followed their speeches with signs and displays of the power of God. What kinds of clear evidence do you give?

 

[Kenny'sID]

Actions speak louder than words.

So what are we to do, "say" we believe, or take action and show it?

If faith without works is dead, then belief without works is dead, and dead means nonexistent, or no Faith/Belief at all.

Works/action follows faith? That's not what some say, they claim we need not do anything. After salvation, no actions are necessary.

James 2:14-26 King (KJV)

14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?

15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,

16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?

17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?

22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?

23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.

24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

25 Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?

26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

 

[klutedavid]

Actions speak louder than words.

So what are we to do, "say" we believe, or take action and show it?

If faith without works is dead, then belief without works is dead, and dead means nonexistent, or no Faith/Belief at all.

Works/action follows faith? That's not what some say, they claim we need not do anything. After salvation, no actions are necessary.

James 2:14-26 King (KJV)

14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?

15 If a brother or sister be naked, and destitute of daily food,

16 And one of you say unto them, Depart in peace, be ye warmed and filled; notwithstanding ye give them not those things which are needful to the body; what doth it profit?

17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?

22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?

23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.

24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

25 Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?

26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

If I was in church and someone came into the church naked and starving. I think most people would lend a hand to that person.

If no one assisted that naked and starving person, then I would be preaching faith and works also.

The Christian faith is not an idle faith but a loving and caring faith.

The point remains that we are saved by grace through faith.

 

[Kenny'sID]

If I was in church and someone came into the church naked and starving. I think most people would lend a hand to that person.

If no one assisted that naked and starving person, then I would be preaching faith and works also.

The Christian faith is not an idle faith but a loving and caring faith.

The point remains that we are saved by grace through faith.

And my point remains, a point I was very clear on, some teach we don't have that "loving and caring faith" or have to do anything but say we have faith, and that's what i speak against. I already showed that is not faith, it's nothing, or dead faith. The bible says it right there...how could I be more clear?

On helping someone who came into your church, I'm thinking because of what happened to the Goats in the scripture on the Sheep and the Goats, at least to me, that says make a practice of helping others. Some churches go look for those who need help or advertise this is where you come for help, the people make that possible with donations an there we have it, the things God told us we must do. I hope most churches do that., and tha's just one way of taking care of people.

As far as dead faith, or faith without action getting us to heaven goes, go tell the goats that and see how they respond. The goats did precisely what they are talking about in the "dead faith" scripture just posted, they said they did things, but the things they did were all talk, yet they were convinced they were just fine the way they argued with Jesus, yet....

I'm not imaging what I read in that parable....it's clear as a bell.

 

[d taylor]

Peters faith was dead, and he began to sink. But he did not lose his salvation.

Faith and works, work together in the believers life for good works.

No faith no works, God does not allow the believer to do works outside of the Holy Spirit and by the believers on power.
If the believer does works outside of faith and the power of Holy Spirit, they are dead works, and will be judged.

See, 1 Corinthians 3:9-15
also:
For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ, that each one may receive the things done in the body, according to what he has done, whether good or bad.

Faith works, in the unbelievers life to give the unbeliever eternal life.

 

[Kenny'sID]

Peters faith was dead, and he began to sink. But he did not lose his salvation.

What kind of logic is that? His faith was not dead, that's not what it says at all. First we don't lose faith in a matter of seconds and lose salvation. But mainly, he lost his super human faith that most of us never even come close to reaching, and for a short time, just long enough to sink.

That had nothing to do with his general faith. IOW, you're deceptively (probably not on purpose, it's just what y'all do) trying to say I'm talking about super human type faith that saves us, and if it goes dead, that's it, but you know better.

 

[klutedavid]

And my point remains, a point I was very clear on, some teach we don't have that "loving and caring faith" or have to do anything but say we have faith, and that's what i speak against. I already showed that is not faith, it's nothing, or dead faith. The bible says it right there...how could I be more clear?

I have never, ever, heard anyone claim that works are not a necessary part of the Christian life.

You are making a claim that cannot be supported.

The critical point is we are saved by grace through faith. The works are the result of that reconciliation not the cause of the reconciliation.

On helping someone who came into your church, I'm thinking because of what happened to the Goats in the scripture on the Sheep and the Goats, at least to me, that says make a practice of helping others.

The sheep are those that believe and follow Jesus. The goats are those trying to climb into heaven some other way.

Some churches go look for those who need help or advertise this is where you come for help, the people make that possible with donations an there we have it, the things God told us we must do. I hope most churches do that., and tha's just one way of taking care of people.

Love is a gift of the Holy Spirit and love for the brethren is only possible, after a person has received the Holy Spirit.

The reception of the Holy Spirit is the guarantee of salvation.

As far as dead faith, or faith without action getting us to heaven goes, go tell the goats that and see how they respond. The goats did precisely what they are talking about in the "dead faith" scripture just posted, they said they did things, but the things they did were all talk, yet they were convinced they were just fine the way they argued with Jesus, yet....

I have never heard of an idle faith being taught. Many people make that claim but I need to know which church teaches that a faith must be idle.

 

[Kenny'sID]

You are making a claim that cannot be supported.

I know people personally that say that. And I've asked on CF a few times and that's exactly what they said. So it can be supported. you'll just have to wait till it comes around again, and if I run across it again, I'll let you know.

The critical point is we are saved by grace through faith. The works are the result of that reconciliation not the cause of the reconciliation.

Can they lose faith and fall away or are they saved no matter what??

 

[Kenny'sID]

The goats are those trying to climb into heaven some other way.

Where do you get this stuff from? The goats are the ones that didn't do as Jesus said they had to do right there in the scripture so he sent them to hell.. So you see, you cannot substantiate what you just claimed with scripture, you can only say it's so, or read it into scripture, I can substantiate just exacly what I said, and easily at that.

IOW, you made that "some other way" up.

 

[klutedavid]

I know people personally that say that. And I've asked on CF a few times and that's exactly what they said. So it can be supported. you'll just have to wait till it comes around again, and if I run across it again, I'll let you know.



Can they lose faith and fall away or are they saved no matter what??

It a simple concept to understand.

One cannot exert love towards others unless one first receives the Holy Spirit. A person cannot receive that Holy Spirit until they believe in Jesus Christ.

Faith before works and works perfect the faith.

I believe a person can fall away from the faith in Jesus Christ.

Make sure that you advise me when you actually discover someone preaching, that we don't need to love others as Christians.

I seriously doubt that anyone has ever taught that because I have never seen it.