Reformed Theology - Question "How Does God Choose?"

[Albion]

Chapt. 3, Art. VII. The rest of mankind God was pleased, according to the unsearchable counsel of His own will, whereby He extendeth or withholdeth mercy, as He pleaseth, for the glory of His sovereign power over His creatures, to pass by; and to ordain them to dishonour and wrath for their sin, to the praise of His glorious justice.

 

[Major1]

Westminster confession. Chapter III, article III. By the decree of God, for the manifestation of His glory, some men and angels[6] are predestinated unto everlasting life; and others foreordained to everlasting death.[7]

IV. These angels and men, thus predestinated, and foreordained, are particularly and unchangeably designed, and their number so certain and definite, that it cannot be either increased or diminished.[8]

It sounds like double predestination to me.

Also if Calvin denied that God fore-ordains the reprobate what is he arguing regarding them in this?

http://www.chapellibrary.org/files/8014/9220/2239/copa.pdf

I am sure and can see that you would argue that if the doctrine of predestination was taken to its logical end, then it could be argued that one cannot deny the doctrine of double predestination.

That may be true but since Scriptures are silent on this issue and many other Scriptures contradict its message, it must then be denied.

The Scriptures say that the wages of sin is death and that is the can a just and holy of because man has willfully rebelled against Him.

You see brother, man has not been coerced or forced in any way to sin or act wickedly. It comes naturally to him. When God chose to display His love and grace to a group of His elect, He passed over many who would inherit the just rewards of their wickedness. That my friend is Biblical predestination.

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

Chapt. 3, Art. VII. The rest of mankind God was pleased, according to the unsearchable counsel of His own will, whereby He extendeth or withholdeth mercy, as He pleaseth, for the glory of His sovereign power over His creatures, to pass by; and to ordain them to dishonour and wrath for their sin, to the praise of His glorious justice.

Given the article I referred to the question still remains. God might very well condemn them for their sin but that is not the initial reason why they were damned, it was because he condemned them before time that they are handed over to sin and death, not that God saw their sin and then judged them accordingly.

By the decree of God, for the manifestation of His glory, some men and angels[6] are predestinated unto everlasting life; and others foreordained to everlasting death.

If your reading of the confession or Calvin is correct, then there seemingly wouldn't be such a great gulf between Calvinism and Arminianism.

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

I am sure and can see that you would argue that if the doctrine of predestination was taken to its logical end, then it could be argued that one cannot deny the doctrine of double predestination.

That may be true but since Scriptures This may be true, but since the Scriptures are silent on this issue and many other Scriptures contradict its message, it must then be denied.

The Scriptures say that the wages of sin is death and that is the can a just and holy of because man has willfully rebelled against Him.

You see brother, man has not been coerced or forced in any way to sin or act wickedly. It comes naturally to him. When God chose to display His love and grace to a group of His elect, He passed over many who would inherit the just rewards of their wickedness. That my friend is Biblical predestination.

Many have and continue to disagree with double predestination, it is not necessary to become Calvinist.

If you were content to say God merely passed over people I would agree, but the Calvinist add the additional clause God has condemned a person before they existed. That's when the language I have put in the bold looses it's reassurances and the Reformed Position is still as I have defined it.

 

[Albion]

Given the article I referred to the question still remains. God might very well condemn them for their sin but that is not the initial reason why they were damned, it was because he condemned them before time that they are handed over to sin and death, not that God saw their sin and then judged them accordingly.

Well, what I quoted to you directly rejected that POV, so I don't know what more to add.

If your reading of the confession or Calvin is correct, then there seemingly wouldn't be such a great gulf between Calvinism and Arminianism.

Oh, certainly there would be. Arminianism is virtually a reassertion of the older theology but dressed up in Calvinistic wording. This matter of single predestination or double is only a portion of it.

 

[FIRESTORM314]

Choose Me

 

[roman2819]

Thank you for asking. I am Reformed, to help in your quest for an answer, I searched and found an article from Pastor Sam Storms on crossway.org that I recommend HERE. If I get more time, I may attempt a personalized, but partial answer.

I read the Sam Storm article on the link you provided , and I have to say I disagree with his views. Here is how I interpreted Ephesians 1,2 3 - whoch will help us to understand Romans 8 (predestine) and 1Peter 2 (chosen people) : I will give comments and questions as food for thoughts regarding Predestination in Ephesians:

Eph 1:4,5: "...He chose us in him before the foundation of the world ... he predestined us .. according to the purpose of his will" ==>
-- Does "us" refer to individuals who are predestined or pre-planned to be saved by God from beginning? Does God choose us individually?
-- Or does "predestined us" mean other people? This can be answered from the next 50 verses, until Ephesian chapter 3.

Eph 1:11-14 -- "[11] In him we have obtained an inheritance, having been predestined according to the purpose of him ... we who were the first to hope in Christ ... [13] In him you also, when you heard the truth and believed in him ..." ===>
-- Why did Paul said we and you?
--- Who were the 'we' in "we were first to hope in Christ"? The first people to believe in Jesus were Jews, isn't it?
-- Who are 'you"? Chapter 2:11-3:11 explain it abundantly.

Eph 2:11-14 Therefore remember that formerly you, the Gentiles in the flesh—who are called “uncircumcision”.... you were at that time without the Messiah, alienated from the citizenship of Israel... [13] But now ...you...have been brought near by the blood of Christ. [14] For he ... , the one who made both groups into one ... ==>>
-- NIV and ESV versions said "you, the Gentiles," so 'you' referred to Gentiles. The words " upi who are called "uncircumcision" clearly means the Gentiles
- Paul was saying how Christ has bought TWO peoples. the Jews and Gentiles, together by offering salvation to both groups. This is the main theme of Ephesians.

Notice how Paul continued to emphasize God's will for Jews and Gentiles: The word BOTH appears 3x in the following verses:
2:16-22: to reconcile them BOTH in one body to God through the cross.... [18] so that through him we BOTH have access in one Spirit to the Father ... you are members of the household of God,... being joined together ==>
-- Paul was explaining how God had planned to reach out to both Jews and Gentiles, n reconciled them in Him. Jews and Gentiles are the subjects of discussion here - God had predestined or preplanned to offer redemption to both peoples and if any Jews or Gentiles repented, they would be saved. Paul was NOT writing about individual predestination.


God's will and purpose (Ephesians 1:5,11] is explained in 3:1-11:
[3:1-6] -- In reading this, then, you will be able to understand my insight into the mystery of Christ, [5] which was not made known to people in other generations as it has now been revealed by the Spirit to God’s holy apostles and prophets [6] This mystery is that through the gospel the Gentiles are heirs together with Israel , members together of one body and sharers together in the promise in Christ
- In Ephesians chapter 1 to 3, Paul explained how Christ fulfilled the purpose of God's will, which is to reconcile BOTH Jews and Gentiles. Therefore God's will does NOT refer to His will for individual redemption ie God does not handpick Susan or Jason to be saved.
-- We all know that after Peter's vision of eating unclean food, the apostles preached to the Gentiles, much to the resentment of the Christian Jews, who had shunned the Gentiles for ages. This is what "not known previous generations ... but mow revealed to apostles" mean.
- So what does God's will mean in context? [Eph 3] "He made known to us the mystery of his will according to his good pleasure, which he purposed in Christ, [10] to be put into effect when the times reach their fulfilment —to bring unity to all things in heaven and on earth under Christ.

Back to Ephesians 1:
- So now, going to Eph 1, does predestination mean that God choose individuals OR does it mean God preplanned to offer redemption to both Jews and Gentiles? The entire three chapters support the latter theme.
-- If Paul was referring to individual predestination, why would he immediately changed subjects or topic to reconciliation of both Jews n Gentiles from 2:13 to 3:13 ?
-- Eph 1:4,5,7,11 : God chose or predestined us refer to how He reached out to we the Jews first. Writing as a Jew, Paul used the word "we" and "us" as he referred to Jews [1:4,5,7]: "We" refer to Christian JEWS such as the apostles, the earliest disciples who saw Jesus ascended to heaven, the 3000 Jews who believed during Pentecost, and other Christian Jews during apostles' generation -- broadly speaking. And as Paul referred to the audience of his letter, the Gentiles, he said "you too" or "you were also included" [13]. This explained the words "we" "us" and "you".
- Why did Paul said "chose us before the "foundation of the Earth"? As Jewish Christians resented Gentile Christians, they claimed that Jews were there first, insisting that Gentile believers had to observe Sabbath and circumcision. They would even said God in the beginning never intended to offer redemption to Gentiles, but He suddenly decided to because most of Israel did not turn to Jesus. To reject their arguments, Paul emphasized that way-way back, even before the foundation of the earth, God had already planned to offer redemption to Gentiles. Even before the earth began, God had preplanned His move, that was how EARLY it really started, don't bother arguing that it was conceived lately. "Before the foundation of the earth" is a figure of speech to emphasize that the plan started at the earliest time anyone can think of. This also explain the word "foreknowledge"; God KNEW AHEAD - way, way ahead - that He would reached out to the Jews first, and then the Gentiles -- which together means everyone on earth, on condition that people confess their sins and ask for forgiveness in Christ.

 

[ToBeLoved]

..

 

[Ron Gurley]

The Calvinistic views of election and predestination are false.

1. The elect of God are all of His truly saved children. Matthew 24
2. The true doctrine of “free will” allows Man to accept or reject the calling / drawing of God to ALL men to a spiritual decision.

God ForeKnows All...predestines nothing.

 

[ToBeLoved]

Right, we do not 'need' to know, and I assume we don't have that as a definitive answer in His Word because it is likely part of what we cannot comprehend. As was also stated, it would be impossible for us to determine this based on a person's character traits as we are ..uh...eclectic . But, again, I do not think it is something we aren't supposed to speculate on. Particularly when the implications are eternal.

My basic point is, we know God is fair and just so we know he doesn't flip a coin. Is it in the least bit possible that God's Grace, being "sufficient", could overcome our 'inability' and allow for the acceptance or denial of His Grace? Or is there something else about a person (obviously not their 'goodness' or 'works') that He could look on to make the fair and just decision on?

I think this is the fundamental problem with the Calvinist argument. To
Say that God chooses one over the other. Since Jesus says that He desires ALL to come to Him, I believe the Bible supports God drawing all to Himself. There is a verse in Romans that talks about how everyone is shown God’s glory in creation and the world.

 

[Andy centek]

The Calvinistic views of election and predestination are false.

1. The elect of God are all of His truly saved children. Matthew 24
2. The true doctrine of “free will” allows Man to accept or reject the calling / drawing of God to ALL men to a spiritual decision.

God ForeKnows All...predestines nothing.

HI RON: I thought I would add this:
Isa_45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.
Andy Centek

 

[Ron Gurley]

Response to Post #71

Isaiah 45 (NASB)
6 That men may know from the rising to the setting of the sun
That there is no one besides Me.
I am the Lord, and there is no other,
7 The One forming light and creating darkness,
Causing well-being and creating calamity;
I am the Lord who does all these.

God’s Supreme Power

8 “Drip down, O heavens, from above,
And let the clouds pour down righteousness;
Let the earth open up and salvation bear fruit,
And righteousness spring up with it.
I, the Lord, have created it

KJV = MISS-translation. God is all good and is incapable of "evil" which is simply the absence of good from God.

 

[Andy centek]

Isa_45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Andy Centek

 

[roman2819]

Predestination means pre-planned, that is all. More important is: What is the context and what did HE predestined? In Ephesians 1,2 ,3, Paul was saying :

Way back, even before the foundation of the earth, God foreknew that He would choose the Jews to be His nation and people, and later, He would also offer redemption to the Gentiles. God had pre-planned or predestine all this to unite both Jews and Gentiles in Christ Jesus.

(In the larger context of the Bible, redemption to Jews and Gentiles are conditional upon repentance, in case someone question whether I am taking a universalist view)

The above is explained in 70 verses from Ephesians 1,2,3. Note how Paul used the words BOTH people or BOTH Jews and Gentiles 3 times as he explained how Jesus brought the two peoples together. Note also he said "you Gentiles" which means he was not referring to individual predestination. If one take time to digest the contents and context, you will see that none of this is about single or double predestination at all.

Why did Paul said "before the foundation of the earth"? It was to answer the Jews who claimed that they were there first, and because Israel rejected Christ, then God decided to offer redemption to the Gentiles. The apostle, however, said that God had planned to reach out to Gentiles way, way back, as early as you can think of, even before earth was made -- that is how early God had predestine or preplanned.

Wanting to put the Jews and gentiles on a level playing field, Paul spent much effort to explain that the Gentiles are receiving a great eternal inheritance and the same Holy Spirit from God. The Gentiles' redemption are no less than the Jews.

It is meaningful to read and appreciate context.

 

[roman2819]

Response to Post #71

Isaiah 45 (NASB)
6 That men may know from the rising to the setting of the sun
That there is no one besides Me.
I am the Lord, and there is no other,
7 The One forming light and creating darkness,
Causing well-being and creating calamity;
I am the Lord who does all these.

God’s Supreme Power

8 “Drip down, O heavens, from above,
And let the clouds pour down righteousness;
Let the earth open up and salvation bear fruit,
And righteousness spring up with it.
I, the Lord, have created it

KJV = MISS-translation. God is all good and is incapable of "evil" which is simply the absence of good from God.

Words such as "causing well-being and creating calamity" do not mean that God literally cause them everytime. Words such as these assert God's sovereignty. The Bible assert God's spovereignty.

Predestination means pre-planned, that is all. More important is: What is the context and what did HE predestined? In Ephesians 1,2 ,3, Paul was saying :

Way back, even before the foundation of the earth, God foreknew that He would choose the Jews to be His nation and people, and later, He would also offer redemption to the Gentiles. God had pre-planned or predestine all this to unite both Jews and Gentiles in Christ Jesus.

(In the larger context of the Bible, redemption to Jews and Gentiles are conditional upon repentance, in case someone question whether I am taking a universalist view)

The above is explained in 70 verses from Ephesians 1,2,3. Note how Paul used the words BOTH people or BOTH Jews and Gentiles 3 times as he explained how Jesus brought the two peoples together. Note also he said "you Gentiles" which means he was not referring to individual predestination. If one take time to digest the contents and context, you will see that none of this is about single or double predestination at all.

Why did Paul said "before the foundation of the earth"? It was to answer the Jews who claimed that they were there first, and because Israel rejected Christ, then God decided to offer redemption to the Gentiles. The apostle, however, said that God had planned to reach out to Gentiles way, way back, as early as you can think of, even before earth was made -- that is how early God had predestine or preplanned.

Wanting to put the Jews and gentiles on a level playing field, Paul spent much effort to explain that the Gentiles are receiving a great eternal inheritance and the same Holy Spirit from God. The Gentiles' redemption are no less than the Jews.

It is meaningful to read and appreciate context.

 

[roman2819]

Isa_45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

Andy Centek

Words such as "I made peace and create evil" do not mean that God literally cause them everytime. Words such as these assert God's sovereignty. The Bible assert God's spovereignty.

Predestination means pre-planned, that is all. More important is: What is the context and what did HE predestined? In Ephesians 1,2 ,3, Paul was saying :

Way back, even before the foundation of the earth, God foreknew that He would choose the Jews to be His nation and people, and later, He would also offer redemption to the Gentiles. God had pre-planned or predestine all this to unite both Jews and Gentiles in Christ Jesus.

(In the larger context of the Bible, redemption to Jews and Gentiles are conditional upon repentance, in case someone question whether I am taking a universalist view)

The above is explained in 70 verses from Ephesians 1,2,3. Note how Paul used the words BOTH people or BOTH Jews and Gentiles 3 times as he explained how Jesus brought the two peoples together. Note also he said "you Gentiles" which means he was not referring to individual predestination. If one take time to digest the contents and context, you will see that none of this is about single or double predestination at all.

Why did Paul said "before the foundation of the earth"? It was to answer the Jews who claimed that they were there first, and because Israel rejected Christ, then God decided to offer redemption to the Gentiles. The apostle, however, said that God had planned to reach out to Gentiles way, way back, as early as you can think of, even before earth was made -- that is how early God had predestine or preplanned.

Wanting to put the Jews and gentiles on a level playing field, Paul spent much effort to explain that the Gentiles are receiving a great eternal inheritance and the same Holy Spirit from God. The Gentiles' redemption are no less than the Jews.

It is meaningful to read and appreciate context.

 

[roman2819]

Westminster confession. Chapter III, article III. By the decree of God, for the manifestation of His glory, some men and angels[6] are predestinated unto everlasting life; and others foreordained to everlasting death.[7]

IV. These angels and men, thus predestinated, and foreordained, are particularly and unchangeably designed, and their number so certain and definite, that it cannot be either increased or diminished.[8]

It sounds like double predestination to me.

Also if Calvin denied that God fore-ordains the reprobate what is he arguing regarding them in this?

http://www.chapellibrary.org/files/8014/9220/2239/copa.pdf

Predestination means pre-planned, that is all. More important is: What is the context and what did HE predestined? In Ephesians 1,2 ,3, Paul was saying :

Way back, even before the foundation of the earth, God foreknew that He would choose the Jews to be His nation and people, and later, He would also offer redemption to the Gentiles. God had pre-planned or predestine all this to unite both Jews and Gentiles in Christ Jesus.

(In the larger context of the Bible, redemption to Jews and Gentiles are conditional upon repentance, in case someone question whether I am taking a universalist view)

The above is explained in 70 verses from Ephesians 1,2,3. Note how Paul used the words BOTH people or BOTH Jews and Gentiles 3 times as he explained how Jesus brought the two peoples together. Note also he said "you Gentiles" which means he was not referring to individual predestination. If one take time to digest the contents and context, you will see that none of this is about single or double predestination at all.

Why did Paul said "before the foundation of the earth"? It was to answer the Jews who claimed that they were there first, and because Israel rejected Christ, then God decided to offer redemption to the Gentiles. The apostle, however, said that God had planned to reach out to Gentiles way, way back, as early as you can think of, even before earth was made -- that is how early God had predestine or preplanned.

Wanting to put the Jews and gentiles on a level playing field, Paul spent much effort to explain that the Gentiles are receiving a great eternal inheritance and the same Holy Spirit from God. The Gentiles' redemption are no less than the Jews.

It is meaningful to read and appreciate context.

 

[roman2819]

It seems to me since God in reformed theology has first decreed before the person even existed that they are condemned to damnation that it makes little sense to suggest God simply judging them according to their works. If that were the case, all should be condemned because all are sinners, yet the reformed tradition insists (to it's own detriment) that God has fore-ordained some to salvation and some to damnation. Just as those who are saved not on the basis of their works, but God's eternal decree it seems just the same with those who are damned. Without any respect to the person, who they are or what they are God either saves them or damns them.

Personally I do not see the justice in such a conception.

Words such as "causing well-being and creating calamity" do not mean that God literally cause them everytime. Words such as these assert God's sovereignty. The Bible assert God's sovereignty

Predestination means pre-planned, that is all. More important is: What is the context and what did HE predestined? In Ephesians 1,2 ,3, Paul was saying :

Way back, even before the foundation of the earth, God foreknew that He would choose the Jews to be His nation and people, and later, He would also offer redemption to the Gentiles. God had pre-planned or predestine all this to unite both Jews and Gentiles in Christ Jesus.

(In the larger context of the Bible, redemption to Jews and Gentiles are conditional upon repentance, in case someone question whether I am taking a universalist view)

The above is explained in 70 verses from Ephesians 1,2,3. Note how Paul used the words BOTH people or BOTH Jews and Gentiles 3 times as he explained how Jesus brought the two peoples together. Note also he said "you who are Gentiles by birth" [Ephesians 2:11], which means he was not referring to individual predestination. If one take time to digest the contents and context, you will see that none of this is about single or double predestination at all. Predestination just means that God had pre-planned to offer redemption to the Jews, and later the Gentiles.

Why did Paul said "before the foundation of the earth"? It was to answer the Jews who claimed that they were there first, and because Israel rejected Christ, then God decided to offer redemption to the Gentiles. The apostle, however, said that God had planned to reach out to Gentiles way, way back, as early as you can think of, even before earth was made -- that is how early God had predestine or preplanned.

Wanting to put the Jews and gentiles on a level playing field, Paul spent much effort to explain that the Gentiles are receiving a great eternal inheritance and the same Holy Spirit from God. The Gentiles' redemption are no less than the Jews.

It is meaningful to read and appreciate context.

 

[roman2819]

Look at it this way: God doesn't condemn anyone "not for anything they did." No one is condemned except for the transgressions he committed.

If you are not among the Elect, you cannot take the view that you lived a life completely free of any wrongdoing. And as for God's glory, he is not only Love but he is also Just, so for Him to respond to evil/sin with a celestial wink would not be Just.

Words such as "the Elect" do not mean that God literally choose who to save. "elect" is a humble term. Back then they don't say they choose God, instead they said God chose or elect them -- a humble way of speaking.

Predestination means pre-planned, that is all. More important is: What is the context and what did HE predestined? In Ephesians 1,2 ,3, Paul was saying :

Way back, even before the foundation of the earth, God foreknew that He would choose the Jews to be His nation and people, and later, He would also offer redemption to the Gentiles. God had pre-planned or predestine all this to unite both Jews and Gentiles in Christ Jesus.

(In the larger context of the Bible, redemption to Jews and Gentiles are conditional upon repentance, in case someone question whether I am taking a universalist view)

The above is explained in 70 verses from Ephesians 1,2,3. Note how Paul used the words BOTH people or BOTH Jews and Gentiles 3 times as he explained how Jesus brought the two peoples together. Note also he said "you who are Gentiles by birth" [Ephesians 2:11], which means he was not referring to individual predestination. If one take time to digest the contents and context, you will see that none of this is about single or double predestination at all. Predestination just means that God had pre-planned to offer redemption to the Jews, and later the Gentiles.

Why did Paul said "before the foundation of the earth"? It was to answer the Jews who claimed that they were there first, and because Israel rejected Christ, then God decided to offer redemption to the Gentiles. The apostle, however, said that God had planned to reach out to Gentiles way, way back, as early as you can think of, even before earth was made -- that is how early God had predestine or preplanned.

Wanting to put the Jews and gentiles on a level playing field, Paul spent much effort to explain that the Gentiles are receiving a great eternal inheritance and the same Holy Spirit from God. The Gentiles' redemption are no less than the Jews.

It is meaningful to read and appreciate context.

 

[roman2819]

the argument i get is on 2peter 3 not willing any should perish ,but all come to repentance..the word all does not mean all. hmmmm if i say ya all come that is a open invite to who ever hears or reads... it does not mean all will come .but my hat is off to pastor sam for his explanation

I believe you are referring to the link for the article by Pastor Sam, who said that God does choose who to save, and it is up to God to do as He likes. I read it and disagree. Although the article explained stuff in detail, but the author is only interpreting words at surface level. More sad is he explained WITHOUT regard for context.

If you read Ephesians 1,2,3 in context, you will see that this is what apostle Paul was saying:

Way back, even before the foundation of the earth, God foreknew that He would choose the Jews to be His nation and people, and later, He would also offer redemption to the Gentiles. God had pre-planned or predestine all this to unite both Jews and Gentiles in Christ Jesus.

The above is explained in 70 verses from Ephesians 1,2,3. Note how Paul used the words BOTH people or BOTH Jews and Gentiles 3 times as he explained how Jesus brought the two peoples together. Note also he said "you who are Gentiles by birth" [Ephesians 2:11], which means he was not referring to individual predestination. If one take time to digest the contents and context, you will see that none of this is about single or double predestination at all. Predestination just means that God had pre-planned to offer redemption to the Jews, and later the Gentiles.

Why did Paul said "before the foundation of the earth"? It was to answer the Jews who claimed that they were there first, and because Israel rejected Christ, then God decided to offer redemption to the Gentiles. The apostle, however, said that God had planned to reach out to Gentiles way, way back, as early as you can think of, even before earth was made -- that is how early God had predestine or preplanned.

Note how Paul spent much effort to explain that the Gentiles are receiving a great eternal inheritance and the same Holy Spirit from God. He was trying to say that the Gentiles' redemption are no less than the Jews.

By interpreting with due respect to context, one can appreciate the Bible so much better. It puzzled me why Christians and even pastors and ministers indulge in out-of-context (mis)interpretation.

(In the larger context of the Bible, redemption to Jews and Gentiles are conditional upon repentance, in case someone question whether I am taking a universalist view that all Jews and Gentiles are saved automatically)


I know you are referring to singular tenses in book of Romans. How would you apply tense explanation to Ephesians: Chptr 2:11: Therefore, remember that formerly you who are Gentiles by birth and called “uncircumcised”

The word "Gentiles" (Ephesians 2:11) is clearly plural. I don't know if "you" is singular or plural, however, but I am guessing it should be plural.

Did Paul use tenses differently in Romans and Ephesians while mentioning "predestination"? Or did Paul refer to predestination of individuals in Romans, and to predestination of people (the Gentiles) in book of Ephesians?