Orthodox vs. Protestant belief differences?

[Silmarien]

They're not. And the importance of the difference--along with an appreciation of the difficulty that exists when the two try to understand each other--can possibly be seen in the thread entitled "Sola Scriptura" which is currently active.

This one? Sola Scriptura?

I'm not seeing much about Sola Fide there. I'm not sure what the difference is between saying that justification is by faith alone and if you're justified, good works will follow and tying justification and sanctification together and calling the whole thing salvation. It just seems like a Protestant misunderstanding of Catholicism and Orthodoxy based on crazy things the Catholic church was doing centuries ago.

 

[GingerBeer]

Trying to figure out which one I align more with, Orthodox or Protestant.

If anyone of sufficient knowledge can point out the salient differences.

The Orthodox have bishops, priests, monks, pray for the intercession of the departed saints and Mary and for the dead. The Orthodox teach baptismal regeneration, the real presence in body and blood for the Eucharist, the authority of apostolic Tradition and the authority of Church councils. Many of these things are explicitly rejected by various Protestant denominations.

 

[Albion]

This one? Sola Scriptura?

I'm not seeing much about Sola Fide there.

That's right. I thought, from that post of yours and the one it was replying to, that your interest was in both Sola Scriptura and Sola Fide. Not surprisingly, there have also been a number of Faith vs Works threads here on CF.

I'm not sure what the difference is between saying that justification is by faith alone and if you're justified, good works will follow and tying justification and sanctification together and calling the whole thing salvation.

The latter one says that your own good deeds are at least partially responsible for you being saved or, OTOH if you don't do them, lost. The former holds that Faith Alone is what saves, and it's not from ourselves.

It just seems like a Protestant misunderstanding of Catholicism and Orthodoxy based on crazy things the Catholic church was doing centuries ago.

Not really. It still is one of the main differences between Protestants and Catholics. Perhaps ironically, the Catholic Church has moved in the direction of Works Alone in recent years, but that development doesn't bring the two closer together.

 

[Albion]

GingerBeer is right that comparing one communion, Eastern Orthodoxy, with a broad classification of churches that includes hundreds of different ones, Protestantism, is tricky.

About all that the Protestant churches (or almost all of them) agree on would be the Solas--Sola Scriptura, Sola Fide, and Sola Gratia--and two sacraments/ordinances of the Gospel.

 

[Tolworth John]

Rather than ask questions here find your nearest orthodox church and attend services, talk to those whjo go and the priests.
Do the same with the protestant churches in your area.
Ask how friendly and welcoming are they, what sort of community do they form, how are they reaching out to the lost/nonchurched, how many missionaries do they support ditto charities.
Ask people what is important to you in attending this church?
From the responces form a judgement.

 

[Albion]

I am of the opinion that the OP was written in hopes that it wouldn't be necessary to begin at the very beginning trying to learn every last thing that it would take to be an expert on every Christian denomination, including visiting each and interviewing the pastors.

In other words, what worthwhile overview can we offer?

That said, I still think we could do with some guidance about key doctrines or unacceptable practices and so on that could help to narrow the list of possibilities. There's quite a difference between, say, a Lutheran church and a Quaker church, as we all know, yet both are considered "Protestant."

 

[Dwight55]

Having been reared mostly in the Baptist form of Protestant Christianity, . . . I also had the privilege of being exposed early on to the Catholic faith as my stepfather's family (Italian) are rock solid Catholic from the old school of Catholicity.

I learned early on that the two camps are basically divided by two words: works VS faith.

In the Catholic faith to which I was exposed: church attendance was a must, mandatory, not negotiable, etc. Sin was forgiven only by tasks given the sinner including physical work, physical acts, and/or reciting multiple numbers of memorized prayers / phrases / statements, etc.

On the other hand, the Baptist (and most of the other Protestant faiths with which I am conversant) rely on the personal, one-on-one, prayer conversation with God thru Jesus, recounting the shortcoming, and asking for forgiveness. After receiving the forgiveness, by faith the individual continues with his/her life, claiming forgiveness in the name of Jesus.

At least, after 72 years, those are my observations.

May God bless,
Dwight

 

[Ignatius the Kiwi]

Here are some of the main differences I see. I've generalised a bit and have chosen what I see as the major disagreements between the common elements which most Protestants can agree upon.

In terms of Ecclesiology the Orthodox Church differs from most Protestantism in insisting that she is the Church, not a Church, not a cult (in a traditional sense) but the unique visible expression of Christ's communion on earth that has been here since the time Christ established it in his Apostles. The protestant assumes the reality of the invisible Church primarily whereas for the Orthodox the visible Church, with all her flaws and glories is the primary point of focus. To this end, historical continuity of the Church is not merely a nice thing to have, but an absolutely essential thing to have and it it is preserved in our adherence to scripture, liturgy, Patristic teaching and apostolic succession.

Salvation wise, others have noted that the Orthodox do not accept the Protestant doctrine of Sola Fide. The idea of faith alone to my conception of Orthodoxy seems like a wrong emphasis, one which ultimately involves the protestant distinction between Justification and sanctification in the terms of salvation. Salvation within Protestantism is essentially justification of which sanctification is a by product. Salvation in Orthodoxy is our justification and sanctification. Our individual holiness is not an optional thing but must accompany the Christian.

 

[Petros2015]

One good book I found helpful if you are considering

The Orthodox Way Quotes by Kallistos Ware
https://www.goodreads.com/work/quotes/235081-the-orthodox-way
It became one of my favorites. The Orthodox Church by the same Author makes a good companion of that book as well, covering the history and councils and sacraments and meanings of things.

And another area with a pdf catechism of sorts, my priest had me read this as part of preparation for joining

http://www.stgeorgegreenville.org/assets/files/static_files/orthodox_catechism.pdf

One reason for holding such a view; the sacrament of marriage can be invalidated by 1 Corinthians 7:32-35

I'm not sure why the sacrament of marriage would be a problem? The sacraments as we practice them seem to me to be formal and highly structured ways of doing things that were commanded by Christ with traditions preserved from the early Church. I promise you no one will force you to get married lol. But they won't encourage you to live in sin either.

As a former non-denominational protestant, I can tell you it is a more disciplined walk that encourages fasting, morning and evening prayers, meditative prayers. It also opens up a wealth of rich tradition and writing and thought and symbolism and prayer that I had not considered or even been aware of before. It's where God led me to when I came back to the Church.

Check it out and feel free to drop by The Ancient Way forum. The Church that I went to in my community did not have much outreach, I had to "knock on the door" a little to get it to open. But it was eventually opened, and I found what I needed inside.

 

[Thursday]

Trying to figure out which one I align more with, Orthodox or Protestant.

If anyone of sufficient knowledge can point out the salient differences.

Much obliged!

God bless~

I would recommend you try to find out which Church is true and align your beliefs with that Church rather than picking a Church that agrees with you. Just a thought!

 

[Silmarien]

The latter one says that your own good deeds are at least partially responsible for you being saved or, OTOH if you don't do them, lost. The former holds that Faith Alone is what saves, and it's not from ourselves.

But if you claim to have faith and then turn around and are an absolutely hateful human being, what type of faith do you really have? I do see Protestants admit that there needs to be some sort of transformation involved, so it's hard to remove works from the equation entirely. Does the difference come down to whether or not there's any active participation on your part?

To me it seems like something that's at best, much ado about nothing, and at worst, total abandonment of any sense of responsibility. Reformed theology tends to make my eyes glaze over, though.

Not really. It still is one of the main differences between Protestants and Catholics. Perhaps ironically, the Catholic Church has moved in the direction of Works Alone in recent years, but that development doesn't bring the two closer together.

Is the Catholic understanding significantly different from the Orthodox one? All my research has been into Orthodoxy, so I'm a bit backwards and always assuming that the Catholics are like the Orthodox instead of that the Orthodox are like the Catholics.

 

[Albion]

But if you claim to have faith and then turn around and are an absolutely hateful human being, what type of faith do you really have?

In that case, you don't have the Faith and there is no problem with Faith.

I do see Protestants admit that there needs to be some sort of transformation involved, so it's hard to remove works from the equation entirely. Does the difference come down to whether or not there's any active participation on your part?

Yes. A real Faith will change you just as getting rained upon will make you wet. It's not a matter of "Hmm. Will I or won't I? What will I do?"

*But by the way, there are some Protestant denominations that do believe that Faith and also Works are effective in the sanctification process, so I shouldn't generalize too much about this.

To me it seems like something that's at best, much ado about nothing, and at worst, total abandonment of any sense of responsibility. Reformed theology tends to make my eyes glaze over, though.

Well, the "abandonment of any sense of responsibility" sounds a lot more to me like what an opponent of Protestantism would say than what it says itself. It's either a misrepresentation or a misunderstanding.

Is the Catholic understanding significantly different from the Orthodox one?

Not on this matter, no.

All my research has been into Orthodoxy, so I'm a bit backwards and always assuming that the Catholics are like the Orthodox instead of that the Orthodox are like the Catholics.

That's a hard one to sort out, I agree. If we take out the uniquely Roman Catholic beliefs in Papal Supremacy, Papal Infallibility, and all the overly technical approaches to Holy Communion, the afterlife, Marian doctrines, Purgatory, and such, they're quite similar and basically unlike Protestantism in any of its forms. Orthodoxy is more mystical but less legalistic.

 

[Stefo]

Trying to figure out which one I align more with, Orthodox or Protestant.

If anyone of sufficient knowledge can point out the salient differences.

Much obliged!

God bless~

In order to put this matter pretty much beyond all doubt for yourself, please become familiar with the works of Rama P Coomaraswamy, who writes from a pro traditional, if not orthodox, perspective. For free access, you can Google his name and enter the "world wisdom" website, where you'll find some essays of his on the real nature of heresy. You might then expand on this by buying his books. I hope you are given to seeing the truth in what he himself was given to see.

 

[llrprecon]

Trying to figure out which one I align more with, Orthodox or Protestant.

If anyone of sufficient knowledge can point out the salient differences.

Much obliged!

God bless~

I would suggest that you locate an English speaking Eastern Orthodox Church in your area (I might suggest an Antiochian as most use English) and enroll in a Catechism class. I did this. They DO NOT pressure you to join as some Protestant Churches do. You can let them know your interest. One very interesting thing that you will get out of it, if nothing else a good history lesson of the early Church (something that is missing in most Protestant Churches). Look into this, this is the most practical way and of course you may ask questions. That is sometimes not going to happen in some Protestant Churches where the teaching is a sermon. Web and Podcast are good, but I would recommend going there,see the church and all of the visual aspects. Blessings, don

 

[Vicomte13]

Is the Catholic understanding significantly different from the Orthodox one? All my research has been into Orthodoxy, so I'm a bit backwards and always assuming that the Catholics are like the Orthodox instead of that the Orthodox are like the Catholics.

No - the Orthodox Church and the Catholic Church are two lungs, an eastern one and a western one, of the same Church, and the Church is in schism between its two halves over very specific structural issues.

In terms of the fundamental beliefs - they are expressed in the Nicene Creed. Orthodox/Catholics believe in each and every word of the Creed - those are the fundamental and indisputable elements of the religion.

Which is why the primary theological division between the two was the matter of the procession of the Holy Spirit - from Father alone, or from Father and Son both? That was the theological basis for the great schism, and it remains the most important point of difference.

The rest of the difference arises from ecclesiology, not in general, bust specifically related to the role of Peter and his successors in the clergy. Specifically, is the heir of Peter's See, the Pope in Rome, a leader primus inter pares, senior in respect, or is he senior in both respect and authority.

One can find all sorts of differences in praxis all across the Church - Mexican Catholicism looks and feels very different from Swedish Catholicism -and one can find Catholic and Orthodox churches that are difficult to distinguish (Syrian Orthodox and Syriac Catholics, or Greek Orthodox and Byzantine Rite Catholics, for example).

Essentially, all of the fundamental essential doctrinal points of Catholicism that are opposed by Protestantism are also fundamental doctrines of the Orthodox Church. Politically, Protestants generally find Orthodoxy much more congenial, because Orthodoxy does not have the Papacy (though it does have authoritative patriarchs within each national church, each of whom is pope), and because there is no the long history of direct conflict and warfare between Protestantism and Orthodoxy as there is between Protestantism and Catholicism.

For the most part, Protestants who are firm in their Protestantism find Orthodoxy charming at first blush, and then find it to be wrong in all of the Catholic ways.

For the most part, Catholics find Orthodoxy to be the same religion as Catholicism and have little to quarrel about.

For the most part, the Orthodox find Catholicism to be their closest kin, but are keenly aware of each of the points of divergence.

For the most part, very senior Catholic and Greek Orthodox clergy find the differences to be stylistic and more of appearance than substance, but still too difficult to completely bridge at the present time.

For example: Catholics will say that Orthodoxy and Catholicism are essentially the same Church.
The Orthodox will disagree with that.

Protestants tend to be much more sympathetic to the identical doctrines when they come from Orthodox mouths than Catholic ones.

 

[Christina C]

If you have a a bit of spare time, I would recommend having a listen to the series of podcasts, Orthodoxy and Heterodoxy, by Father Andrew Stephen Damick.

Orthodoxy and Heterodoxy | Ancient Faith Ministries

I would second that. They are enlightening.

 

[Christina C]

But if you claim to have faith and then turn around and are an absolutely hateful human being, what type of faith do you really have? I do see Protestants admit that there needs to be some sort of transformation involved, so it's hard to remove works from the equation entirely. Does the difference come down to whether or not there's any active participation on your part?

To me it seems like something that's at best, much ado about nothing, and at worst, total abandonment of any sense of responsibility. Reformed theology tends to make my eyes glaze over, though.



Is the Catholic understanding significantly different from the Orthodox one? All my research has been into Orthodoxy, so I'm a bit backwards and always assuming that the Catholics are like the Orthodox instead of that the Orthodox are like the Catholics.

Does this help answer your last question?

ORTHODOXY AND ROMAN CATHOLICISM

 

[FireDragon76]

But if you claim to have faith and then turn around and are an absolutely hateful human being, what type of faith do you really have? I do see Protestants admit that there needs to be some sort of transformation involved, so it's hard to remove works from the equation entirely. Does the difference come down to whether or not there's any active participation on your part?

There is no difference in substance, only emphasis.

Protestants tend to have more burgeoise values driven by the laity. Many historians have correctly pointed out, that it was often a middle class movement (with the exception perhaps of Lutherans and some Anglicans, who tended to have alot of deference to the nobility). Consequently, Protestantism often sacralizes middle class values.

 

[Petros2015]

For example: Catholics will say that Orthodoxy and Catholicism are essentially the same Church. The Orthodox will disagree with that.

Yep

 

[Vicomte13]

Does this help answer your last question?

ORTHODOXY AND ROMAN CATHOLICISM

That source is quite hostile to the Catholic side of things, and contains some errors about actual Catholic belief and practice, but overall it does serve to rather clearly show that there is a great deal of similarity between Orthodoxy and Catholicism, and also the significant degree of hostility of Orthodoxy to Catholicism ("Roman Catholic temples"? Really?)