Masks Are Essentially Worthless

[Isilwen]

One or two anecdotal reports does not prove anything about masks. They certainly don't chip away at the conclusions reached by a dozen scholarly articles.

You keep believing that. I hope nothing happens to you or anyone you love!

 

[NotreDame]

The mandates are not reasonable - there is no proof that cloth masks are effective - the OP has posted plenty of sources showing that cloth masks do not protect from/against diseases/viruses etc

cloth masks being effective is a theory, it’s not a fact, so to think we are protecting each other by wearing them is silly.

a cloth mask cannot block any virus.

To the contrary, the sources in the opening post do not demonstrate "cloth masks do not protect from/against disease/viruses." See Masks Are Essentially Worthless

While you are at it, pay attention the specific "source" in the opening post referring to the study of gauze masks! Oh pray tell how a study concerning gauze masks has anything to do with cloth masks or surgical masks to abate the spread of COVID in 2020.

The OP misused, misrepresented, or mischaracterized the actual studies. They support little to nothing of what you have said or what Redwing is peddling.

 

[NotreDame]

One or two anecdotal reports does not prove anything about masks. They certainly don't chip away at the conclusions reached by a dozen scholarly articles.

What scholarly articles? Certainly not the sources in the opening post are applicable, for reasons already noted in post number 77. Masks Are Essentially Worthless

Oh, wait, you mean the 1918 study of gauze masks? Yeah, that was convincing, I mean, so many of us are running around wearing gauze masks for COVID.

 

[Halbhh]

I just realized by responding to this badly-titled thread, where the title amounts to disinformation, I'm only helping spread that wrong title, the bad wording that will kill people.

We should not.

So, here's a better thread for any that want to discuss, with a title that isn't so misleading --

https://www.christianforums.com/threads/masks-protect-others-but-also-you-yourself.8172064/

 

[Blade]

Just the other day I watched the "famous" doctors saying wearing the mask is more harmful. Then skip a month to two and.. now they help..to some degree. I don't ware a mask.. but if the place I am at helps them makes them feel better.. I am more then happy to ware it

 

[NotreDame]

That's absolute worst case scenario, just like it is with flu. (Heart and lung damage happen with flu too) The overwhelming majority of Corona patients are asymptomatic or have very mild symptoms. The majority of those with severe symptoms which require hospitalization are older with preexisting health problems. 99.4-99.85% recover. Color me unconcerned about the virus.

Your level of concern is not relevant. Edifying information for anyone bored enough at the moment to care to know what your level of concern is in relation to COVID.

What your view ignores, however, is in 4-5 months over 150,000 people have died, more than 3 million have been infected, and those numbers were achieved with shutdowns in various states.

 

[NotreDame]

Just the other day I watched the "famous" doctors saying wearing the mask is more harmful. Then skip a month to two and.. now they help..to some degree. I don't ware a mask.. but if the place I am at helps them makes them feel better.. I am more then happy to ware it

"More harmful"? When was this said? Date and time? By whom? Link to the actual statement? Yes, I am incredulous.

 

[GirdYourLoins]

Whatever you think of masks there is one good reason you should wear them anyway. We as Christians are called to obey the law of the land (unless it directly goes against Gods laws). As this does not go against Gods laws we should comply with it.

 

[dqhall]

The notion that science has determined that masks are going to save us from Chinese Coronavirus (or any other disease) is utter tosh. Anyone telling you science is settled on any issue should raise a red flag. On masks, science isn't close to settled.

The British Journal of Medicine says cloth masks are 97% useless. A cluster randomised trial of cloth masks compared with medical masks in healthcare workers

A study of the more serious 1918 flu pandemic showed masks useless. The American Journal of Public Health (AJPH) from the American Public Health Association (APHA) publications

Another study shows cloth masks useless compared to surgical masks. A cluster randomised trial of cloth masks compared with medical masks in healthcare workers

Other studies show cloth masks useless compared to surgical masks, even the latter are questionable. They include:
https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/bio/23/2/23_61/_pdf/-char/en

Error - Cookies Turned Off
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2493952/pdf/annrcse01509-0009.pdf

https://www.journalofhospitalinfection.com/article/0195-6701(91)90148-2/pdf

Simple Respiratory Protection—Evaluation of the Filtration Performance of Cloth Masks and Common Fabric Materials Against 20–1000 nm Size Particles

Masks are associated with oxygen deprivation and increased rates of infection according to these studies:

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29395560/

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/32590322/

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/30169507/

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/15340662/

https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/26579222/

A 2015 British study on surgical masks revealed masks don't really protect patient or surgeon very much. And that's in sterile settings. https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/ar...-KkzpdkmzltnAf-GXp7gMeQkkyeZJ6gEs7G5h8PHln_R0

Finally, one New England Journal of Medicine editorial acknowledged the uselessness of masks but demanded universal masking nonetheless less for its placebo effect. https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMp2006372

There is plenty of evidence out there that masks and mask mandates aren't working and in fact are causing harm. They're a placebo to make you think you're protected and to make politicians look like they're doing something when they're in reality doing nothing.

Do your own research.

You picked only articles supporting your bias. You excluded articles showing the efficacy of wearing surgical masks and N-95 respirators in preventing respiratory viral infections.

This study concluded people who wore surgical masks reduced viral spread. There are others too numerous to list.
https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1477893920302301

Maintaining distance between yourself and others is another tested method of preventing viral transmission. Quarantine has been believed to be effective in reducing disease transmission since before you were born.

 

[RickardoHolmes]

 

[Isilwen]

Thought about using that myself a time or a dozen today!

 

[Redwingfan9]

You picked only articles supporting your bias. You excluded articles showing the efficacy of wearing surgical masks and N-95 respirators in preventing respiratory viral infections.

This study concluded people who wore surgical masks reduced viral spread. There are others too numerous to list.
Efficacy of face mask in preventing respiratory virus transmission: A systematic review and meta-analysis - ScienceDirect

Maintaining distance between yourself and others is another tested method of preventing viral transmission. Quarantine has been believed to be effective in reducing disease transmission since before you were born.

N95 masks are good in sterile settings and if they're properly fitted. Unfortunately walking around the grocery isn't a sterile setting and the overwhelming majority of laymen don't have them properly fitted.

There is a reason why the government in The Netherlands doesn't have a mask mandate. They specifically said there isn't scientific evidence that they're effective and because people wear masks improperly they're actually spreading the virus more.

 

[Toro]

How did Halloween survive with so many people terrified with the thought of covering their face?

Before covid... "I dont mind a mask"

After Covid.... "Masks.... "

Nothing is guaranteed to keep you safe. Even locking in a bubble you can still have a heart attack.

Does a mask guarantee your safety? No.

Does a seat belt guarantee you dont die in a car accident? No.

Its called a precaution, IF you wear a mask (first of all most people dont know how to handle them properly so yes, that will also drastically reduce their effectiveness) however, doing SOMETHING is better than trying to do nothing.

Put it this way.....IF someone were to sneeze directly in your face... would you rather have a fully exposed face... or have on a mask.

Now, would you rather that person have on a mask as well as you... or do you want your face covered in nose goo and mouth spray?

Will it 100% keep everything out of the air? No, probably not... but if you think even the weakest of barriers doesnt stop anything..... why would you rather have a mask and the other person have on a mask if they sneezed in your direction if as you say... masks do absolutely nothing.

Very little, possibly, but still, even if they prevent very little, if everyone cooperates with eachother, that little bit can add up to a huge difference... it is certainly more effective at prevention than whining about covering your face for a time.

If one has a medical condition, that is something all together different than the oerson that considers themselves as too important and selfish to wear a mask.

You're not a patriot, you're not a martyr. You're a child hiding behind those titles so you dont have to be inconvenienced.

The government has little to benefit from covering their peoples faces, it gives their people a level of anonymity. Cell phones can be ditched, so can any other identifying tech.... your face can not.... if you think the government devoted so much to facial recognition, only to have their masses cover their face..... you need to adjust your conspiracies.

Fight the fights worth fighting. Not the ones that are meaningless and benefit the government to return something to the people. Taking of guns, fully benefits the government to keep from the public. Taking the ability to show the lower half of your face... not so much.

 

[tryphena rose]

The way people say the china virus, it is indeed racist. The way Trump says it is racist.

Maybe we should stop calling them by their country of origin as to me it's just racist. Call it by it's actual name. I have never gone around calling the measles German measles, just measles to me.

Yes, so let us also stop calling black people "African Americans" and just call them "Americans".

 

[Redwingfan9]

Your level of concern is not relevant. Edifying information for anyone bored enough at the moment to care to know what your level of concern is in relation to COVID.

What your view ignores, however, is in 4-5 months over 150,000 people have died, more than 3 million have been infected, and those numbers were achieved with shutdowns in various states.

The CDC has so much as said 6-24 times the number of positive tests have actually had Coronavirus. We're really looking at 25-100 million Americans who have had it. I would guess somewhere in the middle. In the last 4 months, 1 million people died regardless of whether they had Coronavirus or not. Many of the Corona deaths are people who were on their way out anyway, which is perhaps why overall deaths have slowed some in June and July. By the end of the year I would bet overall deaths are up 6%.

 

[NotreDame]

N95 masks are good in sterile settings and if they're properly fitted. Unfortunately walking around the grocery isn't a sterile setting and the overwhelming majority of laymen don't have them properly fitted.

There is a reason why the government in The Netherlands doesn't have a mask mandate. They specifically said there isn't scientific evidence that they're effective and because people wear masks improperly they're actually spreading the virus more.

Oh, well, if the Netherlands said it then it has to be true! They couldn’t be wrong. Throw out the science, the scientists, the researchers, and just ask the Netherlands.

 

[Akita Suggagaki]

“We are not defenseless against COVID-19,” said CDC Director Dr. Robert R. Redfield. “Cloth face coverings are one of the most powerful weapons we have to slow and stop the spread of the virus – particularly when used universally within a community setting. All Americans have a responsibility to protect themselves, their families, and their communities.”

Coronavirus Disease 2019

 

[parousia70]

The government has little to benefit from covering their peoples faces, it gives their people a level of anonymity. Cell phones can be ditched, so can any other identifying tech.... your face can not.... if you think the government devoted so much to facial recognition, only to have their masses cover their face..... you need to adjust your conspiracies.

Ding! Ding! Ding!

 

[Theodiskaz]

That depends very much on what kind of mask it is; and "moisture droplets" exhaled by others are not a major disease risk.

Agreed, moisture droplets per see are not a major disease risk. However in cases of viral disease, the moisture droplets carry the virus within them, and if they come in contact with a mucus membrane, say the nose, mouth or eyes of a healthy person, then that person may contract the disease caused by the virus.

 

[Tropical Wilds]

The notion that science has determined that masks are going to save us from Chinese Coronavirus (or any other disease) is utter tosh. Anyone telling you science is settled on any issue should raise a red flag. On masks, science isn't close to settled.

The British Journal of Medicine says cloth masks are 97% useless. A cluster randomised trial of cloth masks compared with medical masks in healthcare workers

A study of the more serious 1918 flu pandemic showed masks useless. The American Journal of Public Health (AJPH) from the American Public Health Association (APHA) publications

Another study shows cloth masks useless compared to surgical masks. A cluster randomised trial of cloth masks compared with medical masks in healthcare workers

Other studies show cloth masks useless compared to surgical masks, even the latter are questionable. They include:
https://www.jstage.jst.go.jp/article/bio/23/2/23_61/_pdf/-char/en

Error - Cookies Turned Off
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2493952/pdf/annrcse01509-0009.pdf

https://www.journalofhospitalinfection.com/article/0195-6701(91)90148-2/pdf

Simple Respiratory Protection—Evaluation of the Filtration Performance of Cloth Masks and Common Fabric Materials Against 20–1000 nm Size Particles

Masks are associated with oxygen deprivation and increased rates of infection according to these studies:

[Effect of a surgical mask on six minute walking distance] - PubMed

"Exercise with facemask; Are we handling a devil's sword?" - A physiological hypothesis - PubMed

Healthcare personnel exposure in an emergency department during influenza season - PubMed

The physiological impact of wearing an N95 mask during hemodialysis as a precaution against SARS in patients with end-stage renal disease - PubMed

Respiratory consequences of N95-type Mask usage in pregnant healthcare workers-a controlled clinical study - PubMed

A 2015 British study on surgical masks revealed masks don't really protect patient or surgeon very much. And that's in sterile settings. Unmasking the surgeons: the evidence base behind the use of facemasks in surgery

Finally, one New England Journal of Medicine editorial acknowledged the uselessness of masks but demanded universal masking nonetheless less for its placebo effect. https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMp2006372

There is plenty of evidence out there that masks and mask mandates aren't working and in fact are causing harm. They're a placebo to make you think you're protected and to make politicians look like they're doing something when they're in reality doing nothing.

Do your own research.

We have to wait until November to pursue the most effective solution, so wear your mask.