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Yes.Once saved asking for forgivness then has nothing to do with salvation, but to do with keeping a good relationship?
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Yes.Once saved asking for forgivness then has nothing to do with salvation, but to do with keeping a good relationship?
....I reject Penal Substitutionary Theory. It’s simply illogical.
Satisfaction Theory is a far more persuasive model.....
Cool story, bro.....
No persuasion, no model needed. Simply turn to Yahuweh (God) for His Kingdom is here, (at hand), and listen to the Father in heaven, believe His Word, and trust Him.
That's a question I have. I mean if everything is allready forgiven on the cross, why do I need to ask for forgiveness when I have sinned?
You just did. See bold and underlined.As a general statement, I’ll say that I never figured out how penal substitutionary atonement qualifies as forgiveness. Nobody seems capable of explaining that.
universal salvation
Jesus Christ is the substitute. We are saved by Grace through faith.
Meaning how we 'access' the Finished Work of Christ is through faith.
You agree with the Bible, with our Father in heaven, and with our Shepherd Jesus -I believe Universal Salvationism is not biblical. One example is the two thieves on the cross. Jesus did not accept the thief on the cross who rejected Him. Jesus only accepted the thief who defended Him. One thief showed loyalty the other showed disloyalty. God favors those who are loyal to Him.
Here we have the root of the problem you have with P.S.
Everything was not already forgiven on the cross according to P,S.
I don't know anyone but universal salvation types who believe that it was.
That goes for Calvinist as well as Arminians and pretty much all other groups as well.
Not intending to turn this into a thread dwelling on Calvinism. But with regard to Calvinism related to their doctrine of election - they are often charged with something along the lines of "The elect are forgiven already - so why preach the gospel at all since everyone of the elect is forgiven already?"
As with your conception of P.S. in general - this is simply not true.
All men are considered by God as enemies of God and children of wrath up until the moment they have exercised saving faith and are justified before God. Even hard line 5-point Calvinists rightly believe and teach that.
Maybe... I understand the idea of comparing penal substitution to the situation in a marriage. But I believe the comparison is faulty, since there is no "pre-forgivness" in a marriage, which penal substitution teaches.
What happened in that case?Grave sin like David Bathsheba.
My Lutheran friend who is a priest told me forgivness allready happened to mankind. All we have to do is receive that forgiveness through faith.
What happened in that case?
What happened in that case?
People do have an issue with using 'punished' as if the Father is some vindictive sadist. That seems to be the straw man.I think this comes close to my belief. Though, I don't believe the Father punished Jesus, but that Jesus took the consequence of sin.
There is even a bigger question:That's a question I have. I mean if everything is allready forgiven on the cross, why do I need to ask for forgiveness when I have sinned?
Prove it.I reject Penal Substitutionary Theory. It’s simply illogical.
That may be, but not the point. Answering his question: we have to take own our sins in personal responsibility.There is A LOT MORE that the heresy of universal salvation miss.
Like MOST OF GOD'S WORD, AUTHORITY, POWER and GOSPEL OF SALVATION IN JESUS.
By embracing a lie, a lie of another instead of Yahuweh the One True Creator,
the lie of babylon,
they embrace the enemy , and are found opposed to Jesus.
Forgiveness comes in the Name of our Lord Jesus Christ:
Luke 24:47
And that repentance and forgiveness of sins should be proclaimed in his name to all nations, beginning from Jerusalem.