How Do you Define Sola Fide (Faith Alone) and is it Biblical?

[BBAS 64]

It's just that Sanctification (Holy Living) is not on that list and it should be. This to me is very suspicious because the Bible talks clearly about Sanctification (Holy living).

Good day, Jason

Nor should it be as it is tied to our Justification and is dependent upon it, the unjustified can not and will not be sanctified. But the Justified is sanctified give Definitive sanctification by Murray a read.

In a nut shell Justification is something said about you, where as Sanctification is something done to you.

You see it as well here: Christ is the cause of our (his Church) by giving himself for her to present her as spotless, and without blemish ( having cleansed her).

Do you suppose he is unable to do so, that which he has taken responsibility for?

EPH 5 Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit in everything to their husbands. Husbands, love your wives, as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her, that he might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word, so that he might present the church to himself in splendor, without spot or wrinkle or any such thing, that she might be holy and without blemish. In the same way husbands should love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. For no one ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, just as Christ does the church, because we are members of his body. "Therefore a man shall leave his father and mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh." This mystery is profound, and I am saying that it refers to Christ and the church.

In Him,

Bill

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Good day, Jason

Nor should it be as it is tied to our Justification and is dependent upon it, the unjustified can not and will not be sanctified. But the Justified is sanctified give Definitive sanctification by Murray a read.

In a nut shell Justification is something said about you, where as Sanctification is something done to you.

You see it as well here: Christ is the cause of our (his Church) by giving himself for her to present her as spotless, and without blemish ( having cleansed her).

Do you suppose he is unable to do so, that which he has taken responsibility for?

EPH 5 Now as the church submits to Christ, so also wives should submit in everything to their husbands. Husbands, love your wives, as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her, that he might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word, so that he might present the church to himself in splendor, without spot or wrinkle or any such thing, that she might be holy and without blemish. In the same way husbands should love their wives as their own bodies. He who loves his wife loves himself. For no one ever hated his own flesh, but nourishes and cherishes it, just as Christ does the church, because we are members of his body. "Therefore a man shall leave his father and mother and hold fast to his wife, and the two shall become one flesh." This mystery is profound, and I am saying that it refers to Christ and the church.

In Him,

Bill

No, Sanctification is something that you have to choose to participate in by the Spirit. God is not going to force you into the Sanctification process.

"That every one of you should know how to possess his vessel in sanctification and honour;" (1 Thessalonians 4:4).

"Wherewithal shall a young man cleanse his way? by taking heed thereto according to thy word."
(Psalms 119:9).

"1 Thessalonians 4:3
"For this is the will of God, even your sanctification, that ye should abstain from fornication:"

"Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God." (2 Corinthians 7:1).

 

[BNR32FAN]

That was what my porch chair example is all about. If you have a belief, your actions are going to back up that belief. It is the same with Jesus. If we believe Jesus is our Lord, then we will do what He says. For Jesus says why do you call me Lord, Lord and do not what I say? (Luke 6:46).

Think. If Jesus is not a person's Lord, then somebody else is.

Yes brother works are necessary for having a saving faith which it is this saving faith by which we receive grace. Our works do not attribute to receiving grace otherwise it is no longer grace. It’s all about our faith.

 

[BBAS 64]

No, Sanctification is something that you have to choose to participate in by the Spirit. God is not going to force you into the Sanctification process.

"That every one of you should know how to possess his vessel in sanctification and honour;" (1 Thessalonians 4:4).

"Wherewithal shall a young man cleanse his way? by taking heed thereto according to thy word."
(Psalms 119:9).

"1 Thessalonians 4:3
"For this is the will of God, even your sanctification, that ye should abstain from fornication:"

"Having therefore these promises, dearly beloved, let us cleanse ourselves from all filthiness of the flesh and spirit, perfecting holiness in the fear of God." (2 Corinthians 7:1).

Good day, Jason

Umm.. you say No,... could you please address Paul in EPH 5 as it relates to Christ cleansing his Bride to ensure her being with out blemish.... I do not recall saying any thing about participation either positively or not.

Do you deny scripture on that point?

That would be a whole other topic (participation), and I think on that we would agree..

In Him,

Bill

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Yes brother works are necessary for having a saving faith which it is this saving faith by which we receive grace. Our works do not attribute to receiving grace otherwise it is no longer grace. It’s all about our faith.

Works of faith attribute to receiving grace. For works of faith are a part of our faith; And we are saved by God's grace through faith. No works of faith, and we do not have a true faith. It's why faith without works is dead (James 2:17).

1 John 1:7 essentially says that if we walk in the light as He is in the light, the blood of Jesus Christ cleanses us from all sin.

1 John 2:9-10 tells us that walking in the light is loving our brother and Paul says that one of the ways of loving our neighbor is to keep the Moral Law (like: Do not murder, do not covet, etc.) (See Romans 13:8-10) (Note: Not loving your brother = no eternal life abiding in a person - See 1 John 3:15).

Hebrews 5:9 essentially says that Jesus is the author of eternal salvation to all who OBEY Him.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Good day, Jason

Umm.. you say No,... could you please address Paul in EPH 5 as it relates to Christ cleansing his Bride to ensure her being with out blemish.... I do not recall saying any thing about participation either positively or not.

Do you deny scripture on that point?

That would be a whole other topic (participation), and I think on that we would agree..

In Him,

Bill

Christ died for the purpose of washing us by the WATER of the WORD (the Bible) so as to make us holy, and blameless (Ephesians 5:25-27). Titus 2:14 says a similar thing. But it says Christ gave Himself for us so that he might redeem us from all iniquity and purify unto Himself a peculiar people who are zealous of good works.

"Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works." (Titus 2:14).

Notice the word "might" in there.
It's not a guarantee.
For if I said I "might" be over your house today, you would take that as a possibility and not as a guarantee.

 

[BBAS 64]

Christ died for the purpose of washing us by the WATER of the WORD (the Bible) so as to make us holy, and blameless (Ephesians 5:25-27). Titus 2:14 says a similar thing. But it says Christ gave Himself for us so that he might redeem us from all iniquity and purify unto Himself a peculiar people who are zealous of good works.

"Who gave himself for us, that he might redeem us from all iniquity, and purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works." (Titus 2:14).

Notice the word "might" in there.
It's not a guarantee.
For if I said I "might" be over your house today, you would take that as a possibility and not as a guarantee.

Good day, Jason

There is no "mightness"this is a Verbal Phrase "he might redeem".

(KJV)

It may be best to lookup the tenses of the grammatical construction...

He did redeem us from all iniquity by the work on our behalf at the cross (gave himself for us).. are you suggesting that redemption on his part was not real or sufficient work for our definitive redemption?

This verse is dealing with the certainty of our redemption primary, and in the same way he purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works. That is the purpose of his work on the cross, and he was successful.

Or did he just try (might) and can fail to wash and redeem his people?

In Him,

Bill

 

[Ken Rank]

Well, you are not offering an explanation for 1 Corinthians 10:13. Besides, it's not the only verse, either.

"But put ye on the Lord Jesus Christ, and make not provision for the flesh, to fulfil the lusts thereof." (Romans 13:14).​

The above verse doesn't say you are incapable of messing up, it simply states we are to make no provision for sin (my word). I don't, you don't... we strive for righteousness... but are you seriously going to maintain you haven't crossed a line with anger, lust, pride, at ANY TIME since walking with the Lord?

"And they that are Christ's have crucified the flesh with the affections and lusts." (Galatians 5:24).

Amen but again... this doesn't say you are incapable of messing up nor that you will never mess up, it simply tells us what we should have done, and I would add, continue doing, when we come in faith to Christ.

1 "Forasmuch then as Christ hath suffered for us in the flesh, arm yourselves likewise with the same mind: for he that hath suffered in the flesh hath ceased from sin;
2 That he no longer should live the rest of his time in the flesh to the lusts of men, but to the will of God." (1 Peter 4:1-2).

My answer will be the same from here on out. Not one of these verses says you are not capable or that you won't slip. We are called to seek, strive for, and walk in righteousness but until the work of perfection is completed which it hasn't been... we can still unknowingly or unintentionally miss the mark. To deny that is a symptom of pride, Jason... because you are elevating yourself to a level nobody will reach until the return of Messiah.

Be blessed.
Ken​

 

[Bible Highlighter]

The above verse doesn't say you are incapable of messing up, it simply states we are to make no provision for sin (my word). I don't, you don't... we strive for righteousness... but are you seriously going to maintain you haven't crossed a line with anger, lust, pride, at ANY TIME since walking with the Lord?

1 Corinthians 10:13 says that God provides a way of escape so that you might be able to endure (or bear) the temptation.

Romans 13:14 says that putting on the Lord Jesus Christ is a part of not fulfilling the lusts of the flesh. It's a command. Paul is telling us to do this. It's not a suggestion.

If a person has crucified the affections and lusts by being of Christ means one has put to death those lusts.

Crucifixion leads to death.
Do you believe you can resurrect yourself to sin again?

Amen but again... this doesn't say you are incapable of messing up nor that you will never mess up, it simply tells us what we should have done, and I would add, continue doing, when we come in faith to Christ. My answer will be the same from here on out. Not one of these verses says you are not capable or that you won't slip. We are called to seek, strive for, and walk in righteousness but until the work of perfection is completed which it hasn't been... we can still unknowingly or unintentionally miss the mark. To deny that is a symptom of pride, Jason... because you are elevating yourself to a level nobody will reach until the return of Messiah.

Be blessed.

Ken

It says that person who has suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin. It then says that we should live the REST of our time (HERE on Earth obviously) to the will of God and not to the lusts of the flesh. If we are living the rest of our time to the will of God, then how can we sin?

As for statement that we cannot reach a level of overcoming sin:
Jesus says,
"The disciple is not above his master: but every one that is perfect shall be as his master." (Luke 6:40).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Good day, Jason

There is no "mightness"this is a Verbal Phrase "he might redeem".

(KJV)

It may be best to lookup the tenses of the grammatical construction...

He did redeem us from all iniquity by the work on our behalf at the cross (gave himself for us).. are you suggesting that redemption on his part was not real or sufficient work for our definitive redemption?

This verse is dealing with the certainty of our redemption primary, and in the same way he purify unto himself a peculiar people, zealous of good works. That is the purpose of his work on the cross, and he was successful.

Or did he just try (might) and can fail to wash and redeem his people?

In Him,

Bill

Unless you believe in Universalism, Jesus died on the cross to pay the price for man's sins so as to offer him the free gift of salvation with them being responsible with that gift. This salvation or free gift is accessed by man by him exercising a thing known as faith. But what is that faith look like? Is it just a belief alone or does it also require works of faith? I propose that James says faith without works is dead (James 2:17). So one needs both faith and works of faith as a part of salvation.

 

[Ken Rank]

1 Corinthians 10:13 says that God provides a way of escape so that you might be able to endure (or bear) the temptation.

Romans 13:14 says that putting on the Lord Jesus Christ is a part of not fulfilling the lusts of the flesh. It's a command. Paul is telling us to do this. It's not a suggestion.

If a person has crucified the affections and lusts by being of Christ means one has put to death those lusts.

Crucifixion leads to death.
Do you believe you can resurrect yourself to sin again?


It says that person who has suffered in the flesh has ceased from sin. It then says that we should live the REST of our time (HERE on Earth obviously) to the will of God and not to the lusts of the flesh. If we are living the rest of our time to the will of God, then how can we sin?

As for statement that we cannot reach a level of overcoming sin:
Jesus says,
"The disciple is not above his master: but every one that is perfect shall be as his master." (Luke 6:40).

Like I said, you have not been perfected, you can't even admit that you are capable of even accidentally missing the mark. That has you elevating yourself to perfected status if not God Himself. I am outta here.

 

[BBAS 64]

Unless you believe in Universalism, Jesus died on the cross to pay the price for man's sins so as to offer him the free gift of salvation with them being responsible with that gift. This salvation or free gift is accessed by man by him exercising a thing known as faith. But what is that faith look like? Is it just a belief alone or does it also require works of faith? I propose that James says faith without works is dead (James 2:17). So one needs both faith and works of faith as a part of salvation.

Good Day, Jason

Not sure how this is directly connected to sanctification, you may have Justification and Sanctification confused a bit.. we tend to do that.

Jesus died to redeem for himself a peculiar people Titus 2 as we covered... there was no offer there was real redemption he died he did not offer to die.

What Faith much like repentance faith is granted by the hand of the Father to his adopted sons's. That Faith once gifted by the Father finds it's object in the Son only by it's very nature.

That faith (cause) results in the doing of good works that he ordained that we should walk in, that is the effects of the faith granted for purpose and glorification of God. So one needs the gift of Faith and Repentance from God in order to be saved, those gifts are given in accordance to His will and by the instrument of His Grace for His Glory alone!

Consider:

James 2 | Resources from Ligonier Ministries


I would be more than happy to walk the whole chapter with you from vs 1- 26, in is own context.

In Him,

Bill

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Good Day, Jason

Not sure how this is directly connected to sanctification, you may have Justification and Sanctification confused a bit.. we tend to do that.

I am not confused. I have studied the Bible on this matter for a very long time now.

#1. The process of Justification is a belief in the Savior that is not of works (Romans 5:1) (Galatians 3:11) (Galatians 3:24).
#2. The process of Sanctification is living holy (works) by the power of the Holy Spirit in accordance to Scripture (Ephesians 5:25) (1 Peter 1:22 cf. John 17:17) (1 Thessalonians 4:3-4).​

A person first has Justification and then it is followed by Sanctification. The words "justified" or "sanctify" can refer to either process. The word "justified" means declared just. The word "sanctify" means to make clean or to make holy.

Jesus died to redeem for himself a peculiar people Titus 2 as we covered... there was no offer there was real redemption he died he did not offer to die.

Well, actually Sanctification (holy living or obedience to Christ's commands) plays a part in the Lord's sacrifice being applied to us (See 1 John 1:7 and Hebrews 5:9).

What Faith much like repentance faith is granted by the hand of the Father to his adopted sons's. That Faith once gifted by the Father finds it's object in the Son only by it's very nature.

That faith (cause) results in the doing of good works that he ordained that we should walk in, that is the effects of the faith granted for purpose and glorification of God. So one needs the gift of Faith and Repentance from God in order to be saved, those gifts are given in accordance to His will and by the instrument of His Grace for His Glory alone!

Consider:

James 2 | Resources from Ligonier Ministries


I would be more than happy to walk the whole chapter with you from vs 1- 26, in is own context.

In Him,

Bill

No. Calvinism is false. Prevenient Grace is what is taught in Scripture (John 1:9) (John 12:32) (John 16:8-11) (Titus 2:11) (1 Timothy 2:3-4) (John 3:16) (2 Peter 3:9) (1 John 2:2) (Hebrews 2:9). We are not forced against our will to do anything after coming to Christ. Christians are told to "Continue in the faith" (Colossians 1:23). Christians are told "Let brotherly love continue." (Hebrews 13:1). Christians are told "Continue in the grace of God." (Acts of the Apostles 13:43).

We need to endure in our faith to continue to be saved:

"But exhort one another daily, while it is called To day; lest any of you be hardened through the deceitfulness of sin. For we are made partakers of Christ, if we hold the beginning of our confidence stedfast unto the end;" Hebrews 3:13-14.

"Blessed is the man that endureth temptation: for when he is tried, he shall receive the crown of life, which the Lord hath promised to them that love him." James 1:12.

"But he that shall endure unto the end, the same shall be saved. Matthew 24:13.

"...be thou faithful unto death, and I will give thee a crown of life." Revelation 2:10.

"He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; To him that overcometh will I give to eat of the tree of life, which is in the midst of the paradise of God." Revelation 2:7.

"He that hath an ear, let him hear what the Spirit saith unto the churches; He that overcometh shall not be hurt of the second death." Revelation 2:11.

"He that overcometh, the same shall be clothed in white raiment; and I will not blot out his name out of the book of life, but I will confess his name before my Father, and before his angels." Revelation 3:5.

"Keep yourselves in the love of God, looking for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ unto eternal life." Jude 1:21.​

Obeying God or Being Righteous is a part of eternal life:

"Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city." Revelation 22:14.​

he became the author of eternal salvation unto all them that obey him;" Hebrews 5:9.

"And, behold, a certain lawyer stood up, and tempted him, saying, Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life? He said unto him, What is written in the law?how readest thou? And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself. And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live." Luke 10:25-28.

"Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven." Matthew 7:21.

"Blessed are the pure in heart: for they shall see God." Matthew 5:8.

​

Every man will be given according to what their work shall be:

"And, behold, I come quickly; and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be." Revelation 22:12.​

Sin or Unfaithfulness Can Separate:

"And Jesus said unto him, No man, having put his hand to the plough, and looking back, is fit for the kingdom of God." Luke 9:62.

"For if we sin wilfully after that we have received the knowledge of the truth, there remaineth no more sacrifice for sins." Hebrews 10:26.

"For the time is come that judgment must begin at the house of God: and if it first begin at us, what shall the end be of them that obey not the gospel of God? And if the righteous scarcely be saved, where shall the ungodly and the sinner appear?" 1 Peter 4:17-18.

"For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire. 2 Peter 2:21-22.

"And if any man shall take away from the words of the book of this prophecy, God shall take away his part out of the book of life, and out of the holy city, and from the things which are written in this book." Revelation 22:19.

"Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die." Ezekiel 18:4.​

Source used:
Once Saved Always Saved - Fact or Fiction?

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Like I said, you have not been perfected, you can't even admit that you are capable of even accidentally missing the mark. That has you elevating yourself to perfected status if not God Himself. I am outta here.

Jesus says be ye perfect as the Heavenly Father is perfect.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Good Day, Jason

Not sure how this is directly connected to sanctification, you may have Justification and Sanctification confused a bit.. we tend to do that.

Jesus died to redeem for himself a peculiar people Titus 2 as we covered... there was no offer there was real redemption he died he did not offer to die.

What Faith much like repentance faith is granted by the hand of the Father to his adopted sons's. That Faith once gifted by the Father finds it's object in the Son only by it's very nature.

That faith (cause) results in the doing of good works that he ordained that we should walk in, that is the effects of the faith granted for purpose and glorification of God. So one needs the gift of Faith and Repentance from God in order to be saved, those gifts are given in accordance to His will and by the instrument of His Grace for His Glory alone!

Consider:

James 2 | Resources from Ligonier Ministries


I would be more than happy to walk the whole chapter with you from vs 1- 26, in is own context.

In Him,

Bill

Also it is non-sensical to give us many commands in the New Testament for something that we are all just going to automatically do or fulfill. I have been doing a study on the commands in the New Testament, and many Christians today are clueless as to what these commands even are. They are very specific instructions that we have to know and then obey. But you cannot obey all of them if you do not study them and truly know about them. Jesus said if you love me, keep my commandments (John 14:15). Paul said if any man love not the Lord Jesus Christ, let him be accursed (1 Corinthians 16:22).

 

[Gr8Grace]

Also it is non-sensical to give us many commands in the New Testament for something that we are all just going to automatically do or fulfill.

Because you guys are arguing the same thing. One just says it out of the left side of their mouth and the other says it out of their right.......I don't know how you guys can't see this.

Free grace.......is what the MAJORITY reject. Listen to em closely, they reject free grace just as much as you. They are just subtle about it.

 

[Gr8Grace]

Also it is non-sensical to give us many commands in the New Testament for something that we are all just going to automatically do or fulfill.

They completely agree with you Jason. What they have done is probably worse than what you have done with His Grace.

They claim grace and say, " Now you must_______________." And if you don't do the works that you MUST do.........you really were not saved.

At least your wide open with your works for salvation. These guys that you argue with(that believe what you do) try to hide behind His Grace with a subtle works program........They are in more trouble than you.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

They completely agree with you Jason. What they have done is probably worse than what you have done with His Grace.

They claim grace and say, " Now you must_______________." And if you don't do the works that you MUST do.........you really were not saved.

At least your wide open with your works for salvation. These guys that you argue with(that believe what you do) try to hide behind His Grace with a subtle works program........They are in more trouble than you.

Works are inescapable. You are going to do works regardless. A person who believes they are saved by God's grace with no good works is essentially saying that they are saved by God's grace + evil works (Unless they are in a coma or strapped to a chair and not allowed to do any kind of thinking based on shock treatments). For most I have talked with in the Free Grace crowd will say that one cannot overcome sin in this life, which means they are sinning on some level and which means they are justifying sin an evil under God's grace and saying they can sin and still be saved.

This is proven even more true in the fact they fail the acid test question. Was King David saved while he committed his sins of adultery and murder? Most in the Free Grace crowd will either say: OT saints were not saved (to bury their head in the sand to the issue) or they will say that King David was still saved while he committed his sins of adultery and murder. But if this plan of salvation is true, wouldn't God have to agree with a person's thinking that they can sin and still be saved? Can God agree with sin? Is not God holy? This is where your theology crumbles and is exposed for the illogical silliness that it is. It ignores basic morality or the goodness of God. This is why the Free Grace belief cannot be made into a real world example or parable like other Biblical beliefs or truths illustrated by way of a parable.

 

[Bible Highlighter]

God will render to every man according to his deeds
(See Romans 2:5-6).

 

[Bible Highlighter]

Because you guys are arguing the same thing. One just says it out of the left side of their mouth and the other says it out of their right.......I don't know how you guys can't see this.

Free grace.......is what the MAJORITY reject. Listen to em closely, they reject free grace just as much as you. They are just subtle about it.

That is simply not true and anyone can check the statement of faith on church websites and or contact them by email to find their view of Soteriology on this matter and they will agree with Free Grace or a Belief Alone + No Works. Most I have talked with think it is heresy to do good works as a part of salvation. The majority of Sola Scriptura teaching churches today teach that all you need to be saved is a belief on Jesus and nothing else. This makes sense that they would want to teach this because they do not want to lose any church members giving them money. If they were to really tell them about the commands in the New Testament and in following Jesus, a good majority of them would all leave. The fact of the matter is people like their sin and they want to justify it. This is what Free Grace makes room for. Their sin. Their evil. No need to make Jesus their Lord. They got their free get out of hell ticket and they never need to worry. Read the Bible? Doesn't matter. One is saved by a belief on Jesus. Pray? Why bother. One is saved by a belief on Jesus. Live holy? Why bother. One is saved by a belief on Jesus. See the problem with the Free Grace belief? If you don't see the problem, then I am very afraid for you, friend.