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Featured Eschatological and Millennial Theories and their problems.

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by Dave L, Jul 3, 2018.

  1. συνείδησις

    συνείδησις ¿uo buıob sı ʇɐɥʍ

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    There's that false dichotomy again - earth and spirit. It was never GOD's plan to have a natural kingdom. Spiritual doesn't preclude the earth, but it does preclude the natural. First the natural, then the spiritual.

    If it's not GOD's plan to have a spiritual kingdom on earth, then why did Jesus instruct his disciples to pray, "Your kingdom come; your will be done on earth as it's done in heaven."?
     
  2. claninja

    claninja Well-Known Member

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    Even though Israel inherited and possessed the land as Stated in Joshua 21:43, They were still sojourners, just like abraham was a sojourner living in the promiseland.

    “The land shall not be sold in perpetuity, for the land is mine. For you are strangers and sojourners with me. And in all the country you possess, you shall allow a redemption of the land.
    Leviticus 25:23-24 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage?search=Leviticus 25:23-24&version=ESV

    For we are strangers before you and sojourners, as all our fathers were. Our days on the earth are like a shadow, and there is no abiding.
    1 Chronicles 29:15 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage?search=1 Chronicles 29:15&version=ESV

    Why? Because the promise land under the old covenant was only a shadow of the better promises of the new covenant in Christ.


    But as it is, they desire a better country, that is, a heavenly one. Therefore God is not ashamed to be called their God, for he has prepared for them a city.
    Hebrews 11:16 - https://www.biblegateway.com/passage?search=Hebrews 11:16&version=ESV
     
  3. συνείδησις

    συνείδησις ¿uo buıob sı ʇɐɥʍ

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    That's not GOD's problem. He fulfilled his promise. The book says so.
     
  4. keras

    keras Writer of studies on Bible prophecy

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    What is the Eternal Promise?
    Psalms 37:29 The righteous will possess the Land and will live there forever.
    After the Millennium reign of Jesus there come the Judgement and those whose names are in the Book of Life, will receive immortality and will live with God on earth. Revelation 21:1-7
     
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  5. συνείδησις

    συνείδησις ¿uo buıob sı ʇɐɥʍ

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    The word country is not in the text.
     
  6. συνείδησις

    συνείδησις ¿uo buıob sı ʇɐɥʍ

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    But Abraham didn't even inherit the land at all. That promise is yet unfulfilled.

    And he did not give him an inheritance in it—not even a footstep—and he promised to give it to him for his possession, and to his seed after him, although he did not have a child. Acts 7:5
     
  7. claninja

    claninja Well-Known Member

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    I agree, but it doesn’t change the fact that their true desire was for heaven, as the Greek adjective for heavenly is in the passage.
     
  8. claninja

    claninja Well-Known Member

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    Which clearly shows that the true promiseland is a heavenly one.
     
  9. Thedictator

    Thedictator Retired Coach, Now Missionary to the World

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    Well no it does not, The book of Revelation is mostly symbolic, figurative, and in code that the first Century Christian would understand was coming. Rome was about to persecute the Church like the world had never seen. The Book of Revelation is not literal in most of what is states.
     
  10. συνείδησις

    συνείδησις ¿uo buıob sı ʇɐɥʍ

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    Abraham's desire was for a city made by GOD, the New Jerusalem (same verse), which in another verse is described as descending out of heaven after the millennium to where men are on earth.

    And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared like a bride adorned for her husband. And I heard a loud voice from the throne saying, “Behold, the dwelling of God is with men, and he will take up residence with them, and they will be his people and God himself will be with them as their God. Revelation 21:2-3
     
  11. συνείδησις

    συνείδησις ¿uo buıob sı ʇɐɥʍ

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    That makes a mockery of GOD's promise in Genesis 15.
     
  12. Thedictator

    Thedictator Retired Coach, Now Missionary to the World

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    That is not what I'm saying at all, The Church is God's Spiritual Kingdom on Earth.
     
  13. Erik Nelson

    Erik Nelson Well-Known Member Supporter

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    So, the "full" Second Coming = Revelation 20:10 onwards?

    Second Coming to judge the living and otherwise = Great White Throne Judgement of Revelation 20:10 ?

    The "mini second coming like event" of Rev 19 does involve a partial resurrection of Saints who rise to reign with Christ in the Millennium... all of which I would suggest is in a heavenly spiritual sense...

    but Rev 19 involves no Judgement in its full sense of opening of the books of works & Book of LIfe…

    so Rev 19 cannot be the full Second Coming ?
     
  14. Erik Nelson

    Erik Nelson Well-Known Member Supporter

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    Solomon ruled all of the promised territories
     
  15. jgr

    jgr Well-Known Member Supporter

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    The kingdom came.

    Matthew 6:13
    And lead us not into temptation, but deliver us from evil: For thine is the kingdom, and the power, and the glory, for ever. Amen.
     
  16. Erik Nelson

    Erik Nelson Well-Known Member Supporter

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    The Millennium is a Christian realm steeped in the spiritual presence of Christ and the Saints (Revelation 20:4-6).

    However, the Second Coming to judge the quick & otherwise (2 Timothy 4:1 = Apostles' Creed = Nicene Creed) would "have" to be Revelation 20:10, yes? That is the only place & time when & where the Book of Life (and maybe along with some other "books of works" as it were) is opened
     
  17. Erik Nelson

    Erik Nelson Well-Known Member Supporter

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    What about the "on earth as it [already] is in Heaven" part?

    God and God's realm exists, in heaven... yet believers want that realm to extend to include earth as well
     
  18. Erik Nelson

    Erik Nelson Well-Known Member Supporter

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    could we not identify the "full" Second Coming = Revelation 20:10 onwards?

    If the Second Coming = Judgement of quick & otherwise [2 Tim 4:1 = Apostles' & Nicene Creeds]

    and Judgement of all = Rev 20:10 onwards

    then the full Second Coming = Rev 20:10+

    Rev 19, which you accurately described, would then be some sort of "mini second coming like pre-event", foreshadowing the full event & full onset of God's salvific rule on earth at Judgement
     
  19. Hank77

    Hank77 Well-Known Member Supporter

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    I believe the new earth will be physical. We will have bodies, the Word says we will. But they will be bodies like Jesus, whatever form that is, maybe like His after His resurrection.
     
  20. Erik Nelson

    Erik Nelson Well-Known Member Supporter

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    keyword (one of them) being "throne"

    God has granted Christ the Throne

    the Great White Throne arrival event of Revelation 20:11 = 2nd Coming
     
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