Did all the laws end at the cross- Part 2

[Leaf473]

Obviously.

Okay... The book of Leviticus? Is it Torah but not the law of Moses?

 

[Gary K]

Okay... The book of Leviticus? Is it Torah but not the law of Moses?

It is ceremonial law.

 

[Leaf473]

It is ceremonial law.

That's interesting. Now... what I asked was

Is it Torah but not the law of Moses?

 

[Gary K]

That's interesting. Now... what I asked was

Is it Torah but not the law of Moses?

And your question is? Moses gave the Israelites the ceremonial law according to God's instructions and it is a part of the Torah.

 

[Leaf473]

And your question is? Moses gave the Israelites the ceremonial law according to God's instructions and it is a part of the Torah.

My question is

Is The Book of Leviticus Torah but not the law of Moses?

 

[Gary K]

My question is

Is The Book of Leviticus Torah but not the law of Moses?

Your questions continue to confuse me as I thought we covered this already.

 

[Leaf473]

Your questions continue to confuse me as I thought we covered this already.

Well, I believe we talked about Deuteronomy.

Did you want to say whether the Book of Leviticus is Torah but not the law of Moses?

 

[Gary K]

Well, I believe we talked about Deuteronomy.

Did you want to say whether the Book of Leviticus is Torah but not the law of Moses?

Yeah, you're right; I'm a forgetful old man.

Yes, It is the ceremonial law and a few others like the law of redemption which is the Hebrew concept of ga'al. I spent months doing that study about decade ago. Fascinating study as the concept is found throughout scripture. I was interested in it because it refutes a heresy that was growing in the SDA church at the time and I remembered a sermon I had heard at Friday night vespers in the mid 70s. I finally had all the tools to do a thorough study on it with all the e-Bibles anf downloadable free books available.

I realize that is a confusing answer but it's how I see it. Yes it in in the Torah, but's not all the law of Moses, at least the way you understand the law of Moses.

Are you completely confused yet?

 

[Leaf473]

Yeah, you're right; I'm a forgetful old man.

Yes, It is the ceremonial law and a few others like the law of redemption which is the Hebrew concept of ga'al. I spent months doing that study about decade ago. Fascinating study as the concept is found throughout scripture. I was interested in it because it refutes a heresy that was growing in the SDA church at the time and I remembered a sermon I had heard at Friday night vespers in the mid 70s. I finally had all the tools to do a thorough study on it with all the e-Bibles anf downloadable free books available.

I realize that is a confusing answer but it's how I see it. Yes it in in the Torah, but's not all the law of Moses, at least the way you understand the law of Moses.

Are you completely confused yet?

How do you understand the law of Moses?

 

[Gary K]

How do you understand the law of Moses?

I don't even like the term. God gave all the laws Moses gave to the Israelites, but only one set of them did He speak directly to them. The rest he gave to the Isrealites through Moses.

 

[Leaf473]

I don't even like the term. God gave all the laws Moses gave to the Israelites, but only one set of them did He speak directly to them. The rest he gave to the Isrealites through Moses.

So everything in Genesis through Deuteronomy that God spoke through Moses is the law of Moses? And only the things that God spoke directly to the Israelites are not the law of Moses?

 

[Gary K]

So everything in Genesis through Deuteronomy that God spoke through Moses is the law of Moses? And only the things that God spoke directly to the Israelites are not the law of Moses?

You're really confused as to my position. Only the 10 commandments are not the law of Moses. Deuteronomy is part of the Torah but it is was given as a blessing and cursing book depending on how the Israelites behaved. Most of the rest is the law of Moses as the laws were given through Moses.

 

[Leaf473]

You're really confused as to my position. Only the 10 commandments are not the law of Moses. Deuteronomy is part of the Torah but it is was given as a blessing and cursing book depending on how the Israelites behaved. Most of the rest is the law of Moses as the laws were given through Moses.

I thought you said earlier that both Deuteronomy and Leviticus were not the law of Moses. Now are you saying that only the Ten Commandments are not the law of Moses?

 

[Gary K]

I thought you said earlier that both Deuteronomy and Leviticus were not the law of Moses. Now are you saying that only the Ten Commandments are not the law of Moses?

Yes. Ithink that is a better explanation. If you haven't noticed, I am constantly learning. My ego is way to small to stubbornly cling to a point when I finally figure out I'm wrong. I sat in a Sabbath school class in the late seventies and the teacher said something that I was sure was heresy about the nature of Christ. It took me a couple of decades to figure out I was wrong, but when I did I changed my beliefs. All the resources available now weren't available back then so it took me a long time. These days I'd have it figured out in an hour or so. Truth is just really importamf to me. It's gift from God that He gave me from birth, but it got me a bunch of whippings as a kid as I just was too stubborn to let go of truth when my old man would get mad. I remember one time he whipped me a bunch of times consecutively and would ask me if I was going to do what he wanted to do but he was in the wrong and I wouldn't quit. He finally pushed me out the door and told me I was spending the night outside, I was madder than a wet hen before the whippings started and afterwards.

 

[Leaf473]

Yes. Ithink that is a better explanation.

Which is a better explanation?

If you haven't noticed, I am constantly learning.

Oh, that's fine Of course, people will have difficulty following what you're saying.

My ego is way to small to stubbornly cling to a point when I finally figure out I'm wrong.

I sat in a Sabbath school class in the late seventies and the teacher said something that I was sure was heresy about the nature of Christ. It took me a couple of decades to figure out I was wrong, but when I did I changed my beliefs. All the resources available now weren't available back then so it took me a long time. These days I'd have it figured out in an hour or so.

That's great! You may wish to say when your position has changed, so people will know what's going on

Truth is just really importamf to me. It's gift from God that He gave me from birth, but it got me a bunch of whippings as a kid as I just was too stubborn to let go of truth when my old man would get mad. I remember one time he whipped me a bunch of times consecutively and would ask me if I was going to do what he wanted to do but he was in the wrong and I wouldn't quit. He finally pushed me out the door and told me I was spending the night outside, I was madder than a wet hen before the whippings started and afterwards.

I'm sad to hear about the abuse you experienced as a young person.

 

[Gary K]

Which is a better explanation?


Oh, that's fine Of course, people will have difficulty following what you're saying.





That's great! You may wish to say when your position has changed, so people will know what's going on


I'm sad to hear about the abuse you experienced as a young person.

The better explanation is that which you asked if I thought that both Leviticus and Deuteronomy were both not the law of Moses.

I explained that my position changed so that everyone would know it.

As to what I went through as a kid, that's just life in a world of sin. There are a lot of people who have, and are, going through much worse than what I went through. It used to make me angry what many parents did to their kids because I had gone through it myself. Now it just makes me sad, and I'm grateful to God for using those experiences to teach me about the power of sin and the even greater power of God to change snd heal us as I believe that the healing of the scars of sin is a very big part of sanctification. It's a large part of what enables us to obey God.

 

[Leaf473]

The better explanation is that which you asked if I thought that both Leviticus and Deuteronomy were both not the law of Moses.

If Deuteronomy and Leviticus are not the law of Moses, where is the law of Moses found?

I explained that my position changed so that everyone would know it.

That's cool

As to what I went through as a kid, that's just life in a world of sin. There are a lot of people who have, and are, going through much worse than what I went through. It used to make me angry what many parents did to their kids because I had gone through it myself. Now it just makes me sad, and I'm grateful to God for using those experiences to teach me about the power of sin and the even greater power of God to change snd heal us as I believe that the healing of the scars of sin is a very big part of sanctification. It's a large part of what enables us to obey God.

 

[Gary K]

If Deuteronomy and Leviticus are not the law of Moses, where is the law of Moses found?


That's cool

You misunderstood my post. What I meant, and I probably confused you with my wording, is that both books contained the law of Moses'

 

[Leaf473]

You misunderstood my post. What I meant, and I probably confused you with my wording, is that both books contained the law of Moses'

Okay... Would you like to clarify, then, how this works?

The Torah contains the Mosaic law but is not the Mosaic law.

What is in the Torah in addition to the Mosaic law?

 

[Gary K]

Okay... Would you like to clarify, then, how this works?

How it works? I don't understand what you mean.

As to your last question, isn't that obvious? What is in Genesis and early in Exodus?