Did all the laws end at the cross- Part 2

[Leaf473]

I see only a single step. You say you believe the 10 commandments apply to you apply to you except for the 4th commandment, therefore you don't really believe the others should be applicable either. That's a one step process. It's impossible for me to see it any other way.

Okay... so in the interest of clarity, where did I say that? I don't remember saying that.

I do think that the principles in the Ten Commandments apply to us. I don't think they should be followed literally, to the letter. But I don't separate out the fourth commandment.

Indeed, I think all of the instructions in the Old Testament are to be followed in principle. I don't separate the Ten Commandments out of the rest of the law, as far as keeping the principles of the law.

Bible Gateway passage: Psalm 19:7 - New Century Version

The teachings of the LORD are perfect; they give new strength. The rules of the LORD can be trusted; they make plain people wise.

www.biblegateway.com

 

[Gary K]

Okay... so in the interest of clarity, where did I say that? I don't remember saying that.

I do think that the principles in the Ten Commandments apply to us. I don't think they should be followed literally, to the letter. But I don't separate out the fourth commandment.

Indeed, I think all of the instructions in the Old Testament are to be followed in principle. I don't separate the Ten Commandments out of the rest of the law, as far as keeping the principles of the law.

Bible Gateway passage: Psalm 19:7 - New Century Version

The teachings of the LORD are perfect; they give new strength. The rules of the LORD can be trusted; they make plain people wise.

www.biblegateway.com

Yoy have never said it, but you demonstrate it in your beliefs just as I demonstrate what I say in my beliefs.

 

[Leaf473]

Yoy have never said it, but you demonstrate it in your beliefs just as I demonstrate what I say in my beliefs.

I think you are misunderstanding my beliefs.

That's why it's good to have discussions, hopefully people can gain a better understanding of what other people are saying, thinking, believing.

This came to my mind

Bible Gateway passage: James 3:17 - New Century Version

But the wisdom that comes from God is first of all pure, then peaceful, gentle, and easy to please. This wisdom is always ready to help those who are troubled and to do good for others. It is always fair and honest.

www.biblegateway.com

 

[Gary K]

I think you are misunderstanding my beliefs.

That's why it's good to have discussions, hopefully people can gain a better understanding of what other people are saying, thinking, believing.

This came to my mind

Bible Gateway passage: James 3:17 - New Century Version

But the wisdom that comes from God is first of all pure, then peaceful, gentle, and easy to please. This wisdom is always ready to help those who are troubled and to do good for others. It is always fair and honest.

www.biblegateway.com

I am misunderstanding that you believe the 10 commandments apply to you? Now I am confused.

 

[Leaf473]

I am misunderstanding that you believe the 10 commandments apply to you? Now I am confused.

Well, let's go back to here

Bible Gateway passage: Galatians 5:14 - New American Standard Bible

For the whole Law is fulfilled in one word, in the statement, “YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.”

www.biblegateway.com

Do we agree that the whole law is fulfilled by loving your neighbor as yourself?

 

[Gary K]

Well, let's go back to here

Bible Gateway passage: Galatians 5:14 - New American Standard Bible

For the whole Law is fulfilled in one word, in the statement, “YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.”

www.biblegateway.com

Do we agree that the whole law is fulfilled by loving your neighbor as yourself?

No. Just half of it. The other half is to love God with all our strength, heart and mind as there are two sections to the 10 commandments.

 

[Leaf473]

No. Just half of it. The other half is to love God with all our strength, heart and mind as there are two sections to the 10 commandments.

The translation isn't really acceptable, then? It should be
For half of the law Law is fulfilled in one word, in the statement, “YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF” ?

 

[Gary K]

The translation isn't really acceptable, then? It should be
For half of the law Law is fulfilled in one word, in the statement, “YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF” ?

Jesus told the Jewish lawyer the following:

Luk 10:26 He said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou?
Luk 10:27 And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself.
Luk 10:28 And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live.

 

[Leaf473]

Jesus told the Jewish lawyer the following:

Okay... Why does Paul leave out part of this?

Bible Gateway passage: Luke 10:27 - King James Version

And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself.

www.biblegateway.com

 

[Gary K]

Okay... Why does Paul leave out part of this?

Bible Gateway passage: Luke 10:27 - King James Version

And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself.

www.biblegateway.com

You would have to ask Paul what his motivations were. I'm not competent enough to question them.

 

[Leaf473]

You would have to ask Paul what his motivations were. I'm not competent enough to question them.

Paul isn't here, it's you and I having the discussion

Paul specifies One word, probably using Word there to mean commandment. Why do you say it's two words?

 

[Gary K]

Paul isn't here, it's you and I having the discussion

Paul specifies One word, probably using Word there to mean commandment. Why do you say it's two words?

What text are you referring to? I didn't know before but I knew what Jesus said so it wasn't important to me at the time.

 

[Leaf473]

What text are you referring to? I didn't know before but I knew what Jesus said so it wasn't important to me at the time.

This text

Bible Gateway passage: Galatians 5:14 - New American Standard Bible

For the whole Law is fulfilled in one word, in the statement, “YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.”

www.biblegateway.com

 

[Gary K]

This text

Bible Gateway passage: Galatians 5:14 - New American Standard Bible

For the whole Law is fulfilled in one word, in the statement, “YOU SHALL LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF.”

www.biblegateway.com

I'm only guessing, but I would say what he's thinking is that it's because the only way to love your neighbor as yourself is to have Christ in the first place in your heart. Then we have the love for others as God would have us to have.

Make sense to you?

 

[Leaf473]

I'm only guessing, but I would say what he's thinking is that it's because the only way to love your neighbor as yourself is to have Christ in the first place in your heart. Then we have the love for others as God would have us to have.

Make sense to you?

Yes, and that makes sense. So it's one word / law that fulfills the entire law, yes?

 

[Gary K]

Yes, and that makes sense. So it's one word / law that fulfills the entire law, yes?

In that context, I think that's true.

 

[Leaf473]

In that context, I think that's true.

In what context is it not true?

 

[Gary K]

In what context is it not true?

I'm not sure exactly what you're asking. It's true that Paul used the word in different contexts as sometimes he spoke of law in reference to the oral law, or Talmud, sometimes in reference to the ceremonial law or the Torah as a whole, and sometimes in reference to the 10 commandments. What he is speaking to is found in the surrounding context. The Jews of his day saw all of them as law but didn't apply any of them to their hearts.

 

[Leaf473]

I'm not sure exactly what you're asking. It's true that Paul used the word in different contexts as sometimes he spoke of law in reference to the oral law, or Talmud, sometimes in reference to the ceremonial law or the Torah as a whole, and sometimes in reference to the 10 commandments. What he is speaking to is found in the surrounding context. The Jews of his day saw all of them as law but didn't apply any of them to their hearts.

Which law is he speaking about there in Galatians 5?

 

[Gary K]

Which law is he speaking about there in Galatians 5?

I think the context makes it obvious. He lists a bunch of sins and then the fruit of the Spirit which breaks no law and as sin is the transgression of the law what else but the 10 commandments?