Babylon of Revelation 17-18 was Jerusalem/unfaithful Israel

[Douggg]

So you believe Jesus was addressing faithful Jews/Jerusalem/Israel when he spoke in Matthew 23?

It is not an issue of faithful/unfaithful. Jesus was indicating when the Jews corporately would receive him as their King and Savior - in conjunction with the Mt of Olives discourse following in Matthew 24. The fig tree generation.

I agree. And who is the true Israel? It is those who are in Christ who are Abraham's seed:

You are taking the content of those verses out of context. Ezekiel 38 and 39 are clearly about the nation of Israel the country in the middle east.

 

[Revealing Times]

Who is the woman on the beast in Revelation 17-18?
_______________________________________________________________
The woman is the great city
Revelation 17:18
And the woman you saw is the great city that rules over the kings of the earth.”

What did John SEE? The Vision is only four verses, verses 3-6. Here is what the Angel reminded John that he saw. He wanted John to REMEMBER what he saw !!

Rev. 17:3 So he carried me away in the spirit into the wilderness: and I saw a woman sit upon a scarlet coloured beast, full of names of blasphemy, having seven heads and ten horns. 4 And the woman was arrayed in purple and scarlet colour, and decked with gold and precious stones and pearls, having a golden cup in her hand full of abominations and filthiness of her fornication:

5 And upon her forehead was a name written, Mystery(COMMA), Babylon The Great, The Mother Of Harlots And Abominations Of The Earth. 6 And I saw the woman drunken with the blood of the saints, and with the blood of the martyrs of Jesus: and when I saw her, I wondered with great admiration.

So what is that GREAT CITY that John saw? Well of course its Babylon the Great.................
(Not Mystery Babylon).

A.)the great city is Jerusalem
Revelation 11:8
Their bodies will lie in the street of the great city—figuratively called Sodom and Egypt—where their Lord was also crucified.

Just because a CITY is called a GREAT CITY that doesn't mean its the only GREAT CITY. There were quite a few cities that would be considered GREAT CITIES back in the day. Babylon, Jerusalem, Rome, Damascus etc. etc. etc. So every time a GREAT CITY is mentioned doesn't make it the same city. That's erroneous thinking.

B.) Peter states that the church in Jerusalem, is in Babylon.
1 Peter 5:13
She who is at Babylon, who is likewise chosen, sends you greetings, and so does Mark, my son.

How do you know who Peter is speaking to here ? I however through much research think he was implying that Rome was a sort of Babylon of its day. (though its not provable in full).

That is at Babylon.—Three places have claimed to be understood under this name: (1) A little place called Babylon in Egypt, which has nothing to plead for itself except the unlikelihood of St. Peter ever being at the Oriental Babylon, coupled with the difficulty of supposing that the name is used quite figuratively. Perhaps, also, we should mention the traditional connection of St. Mark with Egypt. No one now, however, maintains this view. (2) The literal Babylon in the East. This has for itself the simple way in which St. Peter uses the word without any circumlocution. But it has ‘nothing else for it, to set against all the overwhelming arguments in favour of the third claimant; besides which we learn from Josephus of a great expulsion of Jews from the Oriental Babylon a few years before this date: these Jews might of course, however, have gathered there again, as they did at Rome, in spite of frequent expulsions. (3) It may be called the established interpretation that the place meant is Rome. We never hear of St. Peter being in the East, and the thing in itself is improbable, whereas nothing but Protestant prejudice can stand against the historical evidence that St. Peter sojourned and died at Rome. Whatever theological consequences may flow from it, it is as certain that St. Peter was at Rome as that St. John was at Ephesus. Everything in the Letter also points to such a state of things as was to be found at Rome about the date when we believe the Letter to have been written.

According to Eusebius (H. E. c. 15), Papias already was of opinion that the name Babylon is here used figuratively, and that by it Rome is to be understood. The same view is adopted by Clemens Alex., Hieronymus, Oecumenius, Beda, Luther, and by most of the Catholic interpreters;[289] in more recent times by Thiersch, Ewald, Hofmann, Wiesinger, Schott, etc. The principal reasons brought forward in support of this view are—(1) The tradition of the primitive church, which speaks of the apostle’s stay in Rome, but makes no mention of his having lived in Babylon; (2) The designation of Rome as Babylon in Revelation, chap. Revelation 14:8, Revelation 18:2; Revelation 18:10;

So its more than likely meant as a code word for Rome. But one thing is for sure, hes not speaking about Jerusalem. He wouldn't have needed to use a Code word for Jerusalem.

 

[Revealing Times]

Punishment for the woman in Revelation 17-18

A.)God uses the beast and 10 horns to desolate the woman, who is unfaithful Jerusalem.
Revelation 17:16-17
And the ten horns and the beast that you saw will hate the prostitute. They will leave her desolate and naked, and will eat her flesh and burn her with fire. 17For God has put it into their hearts to carry out His purpose by uniting to give their kingdom to the beast, until the words of God are fulfilled.

God uses the 10 Horns in League with the Beast to kill off all False Religion (HARLOT) because he wants to be worshiped as the ONLY GOD, thus he kills off Islam, Buddhism, Hinduism and all Religions, thus he murders the Remnant Church and chases Israel into the Wilderness where God protects them for 1260 days.

Why was the woman punished?

A.) she killed the saint of Jesus
Revelation 17:6
could see that the woman was drunk with the blood of the saints and of the witnesses for Jesus. And I was greatly astonished at the sight of her.

B.) She killed the prophets and saints
Revelation 18:24
And there was found in her the blood of prophets and saints, and of all who had been slain on the earth.

C.) Her sins were piled to heaven
Revelation 18:5
For her sins are piled up to heaven, and God has remembered her iniquities.

D.) She had been immoral with other nations
Revelation 18:3
All the nations have drunkc the wine of the passion of her immorality.
The kings of the earth were immoral with her, and the merchants of the earth have grown wealthy through the extravagance of her luxury.”

A. False Religion killed the Saints of old and the witnesses of Jesus/Martyrs of Jesus.

B. You mixed in Rev. chapter 18. Babylon of Rev. ch. 18 is NOT THE HARLOT of Rev ch. 17.

C. Again, you are conflating two different entities. Rev. ch. 17 is about the Harlot (False Religion) and Rev. ch 18 is about Babylon. (False Governance under Satan)

D. Again, you are in the wrong chapter.

When did her punishment occur?

When Jesus said it would, on the generation of his audience:

matthew 23:35
And so upon you will come all the righteous blood shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah son of Berekiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar. 36Truly I tell you, all these things will come upon this generation.

Revelation 18:24
And there was found in her the blood of prophets and saints, and of all who had been slain on the earth.
_________________________________________________________________________

The woman was unfaithful Jerusalem (israel), who was made desolate by the roman armies because of all the righteous blood it had spilled.

Wow, you are all over the place.

Let me break it down to you.

The Harlot is ALL FALSE RELIGION, she is judged in Rev. ch. 17 and killed off, Rev. ch. 17 happens beginning in Rev. ch 6, the midway point and thats when the Anti-Christ comes to power and when he is going to destroy ALL RELIGIONS thus the Harlot is Judged (God puts it in their hearts) and because the Beast wants to be worshiped as the ONLY GOD there is no room on earth for any other Religion. Islam is wiped out along with all religions.

Babylon = False Governments we can see that in Rev. 16:19, we can also see that the Head of the Statue in Dan. 2 is Babylon. Babylon is the WHOLE WORLD under Satan's control. In Luke ch. 4 Satan tells Jesus, if you will just bow down and worship me all of these Kingdoms will be yours, for it is given me to do as I will with them. Babylon = the Kingdoms of this World. Satan is the god of this world, so says the scriptures.

Babylon getting hit with Plagues in ch. 18 is the world getting hit with Gods Seals, Trumpets and Vial plagues, of course. The Merchants complaining is of course what happens when you lose all of your business to these plagues. 1/3 of the tress burn up, all the grasses burn up, 1/3 of the sea creatures are destroyed, 1/3 of the ships are destroyed, 1/3 of the waters become poisoned, then all the sea is turned to blood when the Vials are poured out and all the sea creatures die, all the drinking waters are poisoned etc. etc., of course the Merchants are crying about losing all of their business !! Its the World being hit by Gods Plagues !! Its not ONE CITY !!

Rev. 18:2 And he cried mightily with a strong voice, saying, Babylon the great is fallen, is fallen, and is become the habitation of devils, and the hold of every foul spirit, and a cage of every unclean and hateful bird.

Satan is cast out of Heaven and has but a little time, Apollyon and his Demon Hordes are released from the bottomless pit. So this above verse is 100 percent correct, the earth has become a HABITATION OF DEVILS. (Babylon is the whole World under Satan's rule)

Rev. 18:4 And I heard another voice from heaven, saying, Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues.

This is God telling Israel to COME OUT OF HER MY PEOPLE, so that you do not partake in her sins and thus receive of HER PLAGUES.....Seals, Trumpets and Vials. Thus she flees to the Wilderness for 1260 days.

Rev 18:8 Therefore shall her plagues come in one day (Day of the Lord 3.5 Year Period), death, and mourning, and famine; and she shall be utterly burned with fire: for strong is the Lord God who judgeth her.

9 And the kings of the earth, who have committed fornication and lived deliciously with her, shall bewail her, and lament for her, when they shall see the smoke of her burning,

Now in Rev. 17:16 the Kings HATE THE HARLOT and Kill her off...........But above they CRY and Lament Babylon being BURNED !! Why? Because its TWO DIFFERENT ENTITIES !!

Harlot = False Religion, the Kings want to destroy her because they want the Beast to be Worshiped as the ONLY GOD !!

Babylon = False Governance under Satan. When all of these Cites/Governments are burning then the Kings of the Earth cry and lament her demise.

Rev. 18 starts in Rev. ch. 6 and ends in Rev. 16 with the Seventh Vial. God sees the Nations He comes against as BABYLON....WATCH

Rev. 16:19 And the great city(Jerusalem/Earthquake) was divided into three parts, and the cities of the nations fell (BABYLON Falls): and great Babylon came in remembrance before God, to give unto her the cup of the wine of the fierceness of his wrath.

God sees them as BABYLON !! He destroys Babylon at Armageddon.

Jerusalem is called a GREAT CITY here..............Babylon as you see is called GREAT also. They are both GREAT CITIES.

 

[John Prewett]

I’m by no means a “papist” nor am i a practicing Catholic.

You've been doing the work of one.

In order to prove your point, you must provide
1.)scripture that shows the papacy is the great city that was compared to Egypt and sodom

The Jews of the NT era looked back at Babylon of old as the center of Satanic power in the previous era.
In NT era they saw Rome as the new/current center of Satanic power .... thus they gave Rome the nickname "Babylon."

2.) Please provide scripture that shows Jesus was crucified in the Vatican City.

Obviously Jesus was crucified in Jerusalem.

3.)Please provide scripture that shows papacy would be punished for the blood of the prophets and saints

The punishment of the Great harlot is plainly revealed in Revelation 17:16 and in Rev 18.

and their dead bodies will lie in the street of the great city that symbolically
is called Sodom and Egypt, where their Lord was crucified. Revelation 11:8

The Great harlot is described in Revelation 17-18. Not in Revelation 11.

And in her was found the blood of prophets and of saints,
and of all who have been slain on earth.” Revelation 18:24

For the past 1700 or so years, the Vatican (which began as the Roman State Trinitarian cult)
has masterminded a bloody war against Jesus's people.

During this time span Jerusalem was virtually dead. A non-player on the world scene.
Not (for instance) "fornicating with the kings" as Vatican famously did (and does).

You are ignoring Jesus's people and the persecution of Jesus's people all during the time span between the NT Acts era and today. As if Jesus had no "prophets and saints" in the year (for instance) 1000 AD.

The Christians of history were among those labeled "heretic" by the Roman Catholic Inquisitors.
These Christians called "heretic" died as Christ died .... tortured and murdered due to demand of the religious establishment .... The Vatican.

 

[Revealing Times]

You've been doing the work of one.


The Jews of the NT era looked back at Babylon of old as the center of Satanic power in the previous era.
In NT era they saw Rome as the new/current center of Satanic power .... thus they gave Rome the nickname "Babylon."


Obviously Jesus was crucified in Jerusalem.


The punishment of the Great harlot is plainly revealed in Revelation 17:16 and in Rev 18.



The Great harlot is described in Revelation 17-18. Not in Revelation 11.



For the past 1700 or so years, the Vatican (which began as the Roman State Trinitarian cult)
has masterminded a bloody war against Jesus's people.

During this time span Jerusalem was virtually dead. A non-player on the world scene.
Not (for instance) "fornicating with the kings" as Vatican famously did (and does).

You are ignoring Jesus's people and the persecution of Jesus's people all during the time span between the NT Acts era and today. As if Jesus had no "prophets and saints" in the year (for instance) 1000 AD.

The Christians of history were among those labeled "heretic" by the Roman Catholic Inquisitors.
These Christians called "heretic" died as Christ died .... tortured and murdered due to demand of the religious establishment .... The Vatican.

The Harlot is ALL FALSE RELIGION, not the RCC/Papacy or Jerusalem. The Harlot is not what Rev. ch. 18 is about, Rev. 18 is about Babylon. The two are different entities.

The Kings hate the Harlot in Rev. 17:16 but Cry and Lament when Babylon is burned/destroyed in Rev. ch. 18.

False Religion (Harlot) is Judged by the 10 Kings (God places it in their hearts to destroy her)

Babylon (World Governance under Satan) is Judged by Gods Seals, Trumpets and Vials. By the PLAGUES of God. Babylon is the whole World, all the Nations that come against God at Armageddon. (SEE Rev 16:19, God says the Nations that come against him are seen as BABYLON.

 

[Davy]

There weren’t any Jews who were unfaithful and blind to the messiah at the time Jesus gave this speech, who would later convert and believe and thereby “see/perceive” Jesus as the Christ?

You're bringing in irrelevance.

When I said that won't be until Jesus returns, it's about to whom He spoke this to...

Matt 23:39
39 For I say unto you, Ye shall not see Me henceforth, till ye shall say, 'Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.'
KJV

He did not say that to believing Jews.

 

[claninja]

It is not an issue of faithful/unfaithful.

Actually it is. The context of Matthew 23 is unfaithful Israel.

Jesus was indicating when the Jews corporately would receive him as their King and Savior -

Absolutely Agree.

You are taking the content of those verses out of context.

If this doesn't mean what it says it means as you state it is "taken out of context", then you're going to have to explain to me how gentiles are now not a part of Abraham's offspring (Israel).

Galatians 3:28-29
There is neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither slaveg nor free, there is no male and female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29And if you are Christ’s, then you are Abraham’s offspring, heirs according to promise.

Ezekiel 38 and 39 are clearly about the nation of Israel the country in the middle east.

The author of Hebrews quotes Jeremiah 31:31-34. This "new" covenant is for Israel. This is the "new" covenant that Jesus shed his blood for. Israel under the new covenant is anyone (Jew and Gentile) who belongs to the body of Christ.

unfaithful Israel under the old covenant faced their destruction. God will never reinstate the Old covenant.

Hebrews 8:7-13
7For if there had been nothing wrong with that first covenant, no place would have been sought for another. 8But God found fault with the people and saidb :

“The days are coming, declares the Lord,when I will make a new covenant with the people of Israel, and with the people of Judah. 9It will not be like the covenant I made with their ancestors when I took them by the hand to lead them out of Egypt, because they did not remain faithful to my covenant, and I turned away from them, declares the Lord. 10This is the covenant I will establish with the people of Israel after that time, declares the Lord. I will put my laws in their minds and write them on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people. 11No longer will they teach their neighbor,or say to one another, ‘Know the Lord,’ because they will all know me, from the least of them to the greatest. 12For I will forgive their wickedness and will remember their sins no more.”c

13By calling this covenant “new,” he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and outdated will soon disappear.

 

[Soar Like and Eagle]

Revelation is a Spiritual Book not a literal Book john was in Spirit on the Lord's day nothing physical or carnal in this whole book

The Women is the Church realm and Baby-lon is the religious political man made system
The Beast is our carnal nature

Jerusalem is God's chosen people spiritually not naturally

Zion is God's elect

 

[claninja]

Just because a CITY is called a GREAT CITY that doesn't mean its the only GREAT CITY. There were quite a few cities that would be considered GREAT CITIES back in the day. Babylon, Jerusalem, Rome, Damascus etc. etc. etc. So every time a GREAT CITY is mentioned doesn't make it the same city. That's erroneous thinking.

I agree. In the scriptures, Ninevah was called "the great city", Gibeon was called "a great city", Resen was called "the great city". Jerusalem has been called "a great city."

In order to interpret revelation, we have to use the descriptions given in revelation and have a strong knowledge of OT language. Otherwise, we can make any symbol to mean what we (both you and I) want it to mean.

As we agree, there have been many cities called "the great city" So how in the world are we to know which "great city" the woman is? By looking in revelation to see if it defines what the great city is.

The great city is first described in revelation as being figuratively Sodom and Egypt and where Jesus was crucified.

We know Jerusalem fits this description as it has been compared to Sodom and Egypt in the OT and Jesus was crucified there.

To say the great city is a different city in Revelation 17 and 18, then you must provide proof that the there is a new description of the what the great city is between revelation 12 and 16.

How do you know who Peter is speaking to here ?

Peter is writing to those dispersed (Diasporas) among the greeks in Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia, and Bithynia. The last time we see Peter is in Acts 15 and he is in Jerusalem.

Just read the first verse in 1 Peter and it tells you his audience..................

1Peter, an apostle of Jesus Christ,
To God’s elect, exiles scattered throughout the provinces of Pontus, Galatia, Cappadocia, Asia and Bithynia, 2who have been chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through the sanctifying work of the Spirit, to be obedient to Jesus Christ and sprinkled with his blood:
Grace and peace be yours in abundance.

(3) It may be called the established interpretation that the place meant is Rome. We never hear of St. Peter being in the East, and the thing in itself is improbable, whereas nothing but Protestant prejudice can stand against the historical evidence that St. Peter sojourned and died at Rome. Whatever theological consequences may flow from it, it is as certain that St. Peter was at Rome as that St. John was at Ephesus. Everything in the Letter also points to such a state of things as was to be found at Rome about the date when we believe the Letter to have been written.

I'm sure Peter could have been executed in Rome, but this is based on tradition. That last Location of peter is recorded in Acts 15, which is Jerusalem.

Wow, you are all over the place.

I could same the same for you, but let's stick to objective arguments[/QUOTE]

 

[claninja]

Again, you are conflating two different entities. Rev. ch. 17 is about the Harlot (False Religion) and Rev. ch 18 is about Babylon. (False Governance under Satan)

Scripture disagrees with you:

Revelation 17:5-6, 18
The name written on her forehead was a mystery: Babylon the great the mother of prostitutes and of the abominations of the earth. 6I saw that the woman was drunk with the blood of God’s holy people, the blood of those who bore testimony to Jesus. The woman you saw is the great city that rules over the kings of the earth.”

Revelation 18:1, 14, 24
Fallen! Fallen is Babylon the Great!’a, Woe! Woe to you, great city, In her was found the blood of prophets and of God’s holy people, of all who have been slaughtered on the earth.”

 

[claninja]

You've been doing the work of one.

Let's stick to objective arguments please. There are many non catholic denomination believers who don't believe the papacy is the antichrist.

Obviously Jesus was crucified in Jerusalem.

We agree then.

So which city is Revelation 11:8 describing then?

Their bodies will lie in the public square of the great city—which is figuratively called Sodom and Egypt—where also their Lord was crucified.

The Great harlot is described in Revelation 17-18. Not in Revelation 11.

The great harlot is the great city

Revelation 17:18

 

[parousia70]

There weren’t any Jews who were unfaithful and blind to the messiah at the time Jesus gave this speech, who would later convert and believe and thereby “see/perceive” Jesus as the Christ?

Paul Comes to mind....

 

[parousia70]

It is not an issue of faithful/unfaithful. Jesus was indicating when the Jews corporately would receive him as their King and Savior

Did they not "Corporately" receive Him here?:

Acts 2:41 Then those who gladly received his word were baptized; and that day about three thousand souls were added to them.

 

[claninja]

He did not say that to believing Jews.

Agree, that was my point.

When I said that won't be until Jesus returns, it's about to whom He spoke this to...

There were many Jews (and still are) who came (didn't at first, but later did) to see Christ as the messiah before his 2nd coming.

The greek word for "see" in the verse, doesn't necessarily mean seeing with eyes. It can be meant as seeing spiritually, as well.

Do you think Saul the pharisee (who later became paul) was standing there when Jesus was making this speech? Because his blindness was removed and he did see Christ for who He truly was. I bet you, paul wasn't the only blinded Jewish person who later saw Christ for who He truly was.

 

[Douggg]

Did they not "Corporately" receive Him here?:

Acts 2:41 Then those who gladly received his word were baptized; and that day about three thousand souls were added to them.

No, or else the Jews would not have been sent in exile to the nations for the past 2000 years. This (ours) is the generation though when Jerusalem says blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.

 

[claninja]

No, or else the Jews would not have been sent in exile to the nations for the past 2000 years. This (ours) is the generation though when Jerusalem says blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.

Do you believe this because Israel is a state again with physical land?

 

[parousia70]

No, or else the Jews would not have been sent in exile to the nations for the past 2000 years. This (ours) is the generation though when Jerusalem says blessed is he who comes in the name of the Lord.

Thats like saying that the Majority of disbelieving Hebrews who were slain after 40 years in the wilderness are TRUE Israel while the minority Believing remnant who entered the promised land were NOT true Israel...

Totally oposite to what Scripture teaches.

 

[Davy]

Agree, that was my point.



There were many Jews (and still are) who came (didn't at first, but later did) to see Christ as the messiah before his 2nd coming.

The greek word for "see" in the verse, doesn't necessarily mean seeing with eyes. It can be meant as seeing spiritually, as well.

Do you think Saul the pharisee (who later became paul) was standing there when Jesus was making this speech? Because his blindness was removed and he did see Christ for who He truly was. I bet you, paul wasn't the only blinded Jewish person who later saw Christ for who He truly was.

In Matthew 23 Jesus said this to the blind scribes and Pharisees who sought to kill Him...

Matt 23:27-33
27 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness.
28 Even so ye also outwardly appear righteous unto men, but within ye are full of hypocrisy and iniquity.
29 Woe unto you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! because ye build the tombs of the prophets, and garnish the sepulchres of the righteous,
30 And say, If we had been in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partakers with them in the blood of the prophets.
31 Wherefore ye be witnesses unto yourselves, that ye are the children of them which killed the prophets.
32 Fill ye up then the measure of your fathers.
33 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?
KJV

The very last thing He said to them was...

Matt 23:39
39 For I say unto you, Ye shall not see Me henceforth, till ye shall say, 'Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.'
KJV

Jesus was quoting that from Psalms 118:26. It's about the time of His return when those will look at Him in shame while saying that about Him.

In Luke 23 He turned to the daughters of Jerusalem who wept for Him when He carried His cross to be crucified. He quoted the parable of the barren woman from Isaiah 54 to them, and told them to not cry for Him, but for theirselves and their children, because the day would come when they will say, "Blessed are the barren, and the wombs that never bare, and the paps which never gave suck." (Luke 23:29).

Same thing in Luke 23 there, the deceived Jews in Jerusalem will be saying that, "Blessed are the barren..." to Christ's elect when Jesus returns because it means only those who didn't fall away and remained as a "chaste virgin" for Christ will be those spiritual barren.

 

[claninja]

The very last thing He said to them was...

Matt 23:39
39 For I say unto you, Ye shall not see Me henceforth, till ye shall say, 'Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord.'
KJV

It sounds like your saying these Jews wouldn’t see Christ as the messiah until the 2nd coming.

If that’s the case, that’s just wrong, there plenty of Jews who saw Christ for who was later, specifically in the book of acts.

Paul was one of these Pharisees

 

[Davy]

It sounds like your saying these Jews wouldn’t see Christ as the messiah until the 2nd coming.

If that’s the case, that’s just wrong, there plenty of Jews who saw Christ for who was later, specifically in the book of acts.

Paul was one of these Pharisees

The Jews He was speaking to in that Matt.23 chapter were not 'believing' Jews! They were His enemies, the one's He called the "synagogue of Satan" in Rev.3:9. And there He told His elect of the Church of Philadelphia that He would make those false Jews come to worship at His elect's feet.

So yes, most definitely, I am saying THOSE Jews, won't see Jesus as The Christ until His 2nd coming!