Abiogenesis and Evolution

[crjmurray]

You forgot verse 50 ...

Ezekiel 16:50 And they were haughty, and committed abomination before me: therefore I took them away as I saw good.

What'd they do? Eat some crawfish? Sacrifice the wrong animal? Were women learning, was that it?

 

[AV1611VET]

What'd they do? Eat some crawfish? Sacrifice the wrong animal? Were women learning, was that it?

They were homosexualing.

You guys are big on the dictionary.

Where does it say the word "sodomy" comes from?

 

[crjmurray]

They were homosexualing.

You guys are big on the dictionary.

Where does it say the word "sodomy" comes from?

And that's bad?

 

[AV1611VET]

And that's bad?

Is this a trick question?

 

[crjmurray]

Is this a trick question?

Does it matter?

 

[malvina]

You are in the area of the forum that allows non believers to post.

If that bothers you, you can stick to the Christian only sections.

It doesn't bother me I find it fascinating that Atheists join a Christian forum. Going by your posts the purpose is to cause dissension and mock Christianity. As I said earlier - be careful what you do because 'God is not mocked' You are likely to come off the worse for wear . Either that or you will get 'caught' especially if you keep using scripture. I'll never forget watching Malcolm Muggeridge as a girl in The Brains Trust. It came on every week. He would sit making these faces expounding his great wealth of knowledge to the other 4? members - using it to explain away the Christian Faith. He was very clever at it. A priest would argue with him using scripture and Malcolm used scripture to show how much he was wrong. He combed the bible more and more until one day he got caught! and spent the rest of his life having to make up for all the damage he'd done to the public He wrote top selling Christian books etc (Please excuse typos etc I'm 81 and my 'Outside' eyes are not good)

 

[Not_By_Chance]

But that IS the part of the process of random creation. Those are elements of randomness in mutations which allegedly created all of life we observe today from a single life form of long ago.



If you wish to claim that random mutation was the mechanism which created the various life forms we observe today, with the elements I've listed which are part of randomness, then you're going to have to support that with evidence based on the scientific method. If you don't believe randomness includes those elements, please point out which of mindless, meaningless, purposeless or goalless isn't part of the random creation which produced humanity from an alleged single life form.



Back to ya.



You require faith to embrace the view that only naturalistic mechanisms produced you from an alleged single life form of long ago.

I think the confusion here is that the meaningless and all the other ...less words quoted may be negatives in themselves, but they are referring to a positive process, i.e., the beginning of life from non-living chemicals, so despite the arguments that your statement is a negative one, it is no such thing and you are therefore correct to demand proof or at least some evidence from those who advocate such a process.

 

[crjmurray]

I think the confusion here is that the meaningless and all the other ...less words quoted may be negatives in themselves, but they are referring to a positive process, i.e., the beginning of life from non-living chemicals, so despite the arguments that your statement is a negative one, it is no such thing and you are therefore correct to demand proof or at least some evidence from those who advocate such a process.

Then its a good thing that no one advocates such a process.

 

[bhsmte]

It doesn't bother me I find it fascinating that Atheists join a Christian forum. Going by your posts the purpose is to cause dissension and mock Christianity. As I said earlier - be careful what you do because 'God is not mocked' You are likely to come off the worse for wear . Either that or you will get 'caught' especially if you keep using scripture. I'll never forget watching Malcolm Muggeridge as a girl in The Brains Trust. It came on every week. He would sit making these faces expounding his great wealth of knowledge to the other 4? members - using it to explain away the Christian Faith. He was very clever at it. A priest would argue with him using scripture and Malcolm used scripture to show how much he was wrong. He combed the bible more and more until one day he got caught! and spent the rest of his life having to make up for all the damage he'd done to the public He wrote top selling Christian books etc (Please excuse typos etc I'm 81 and my 'Outside' eyes are not good)

Based on your own posts, I am quite certain you feel you can read my mind, as to why I joined these forums and continue to post here, it does not surprise me.

And, I rarely use scripture, because I don't find it to be credible.

 

[justlookinla]

You do realize that most people who believe in evolution are theists?

You do realize that the people who believe in theistic evolution (as contrasted with the different Darwinist evolution) do not believe they're the product of a random, mindless, meaningless, purposeless and goalless mechanism?

 

[justlookinla]

Why doesn't God heal amputees?
When it comes to miracles, you have to ask yourself this question (I'm blanking on who this was originally said by)

"Have the laws of nature been suspended in your favor and in a way that you approve or have you made a mistake?"

Why did God heal me?

 

[justlookinla]

I think the confusion here is that the meaningless and all the other ...less words quoted may be negatives in themselves, but they are referring to a positive process, i.e., the beginning of life from non-living chemicals, so despite the arguments that your statement is a negative one, it is no such thing and you are therefore correct to demand proof or at least some evidence from those who advocate such a process.

Yes, the claim that it's a negative isn't valid for the reasons you posted.

 

[justlookinla]

Then its a good thing that no one advocates such a process.

What part of random, mindless, meaningless, purposeless and goalless is in error.....and why?

 

[crjmurray]

Why did God heal me?

Because the Warhawks need fans?

 

[justlookinla]

Because the Warhawks need fans?

Nope, try again.

 

[DogmaHunter]

But there is life in every scoop. And DNA from fish in every drop.

Excellent job avoiding the obvious point being raised.

A++

 

[SkyWriting]

Excellent job avoiding the obvious point being raised.

A++

My counter point is that life and signs of life are pervasive.
Additionally, it is presumed to be a natural process driven
by the laws of physics, nature, what have you.

Which natural laws are responsible for the formation of life?
They should be prevalent as well. Universally prevalent.

It has been said that God didn't just wink life into existence
in one place. Based on that idea, what prevalent, universal
laws do we find that are responsible for the formation of life
in natural material? They should be everywhere, now and in
the past.

 

[Loudmouth]

I can fill up books of the 50 years of healings and miracles in my life and lives of those I've ministered to I ran a large Christian Book and Drop-in Centre for 20yrs without a dollar or asking for help except to the Lord. - 4 large shops. If we had a need we just prayed and it would come in the door - from people all over South Australia right out in the country Someone would pass by have prayer and get help then send people to me with antiques and all kinds of blessings. The healings to my body is a testimony alone. But you cannot convince a non-believer of this no matter how much you try - they only believe if they want to.
I know there will be some here that will say like 'it was all your imagination' as my daughter once did even though she was with me a few times when things happened she closed her inside eyes and mind to them simply because she had chosen a life-style that didn't include The Lord and that's how it is with everyone - we believe what we want to believe according to the life we want to lead. I ask God to bless everyone and become closer to Him,
God Bless You

That's nice and all, but it really has nothing to do with the topic.

 

[Loudmouth]

the fact still remains, the placebo effect is a reality.
it is the direct result of a persons expectations, their belief that it will work.

The placebo effect is also completely off topic.

 

[Loudmouth]

I think that Loudmouth's original question should be addressed specifically and solely to deists, or at least those who hold a deistic view on the creation of life. Those who deny evolution due to their fundamentalist religious stance aren't willing to accept that "all the life and species we see today evolved through natural processes", even for the sake of argument.

My own objection to a deistic creation of life is that, like Laplace, we have "no need for that hypothesis." Given the results of the classic Miller-Urey experiment (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miller–Urey_experiment) and many similar ones, it appears that having a supernatural creator for life is unparsimonious- it adds an unnecessary entity of explanation, and is thus pared away by Occam's Razor:

(Substitute "Life" for "The Universe", there.)

In fact that little .gif is my own answer to any form of the Cosmological Argument.

For the purposes of this thread, life did not come about by abiogenesis. The first life came about through supernatural processes.

The only question is how this would affect the theory of evolution, if this scenario were true.