• Starting today August 7th, 2024, in order to post in the Married Couples, Courting Couples, or Singles forums, you will not be allowed to post if you have your Marital status designated as private. Announcements will be made in the respective forums as well but please note that if yours is currently listed as Private, you will need to submit a ticket in the Support Area to have yours changed.

  • CF has always been a site that welcomes people from different backgrounds and beliefs to participate in discussion and even debate. That is the nature of its ministry. In view of recent events emotions are running very high. We need to remind people of some basic principles in debating on this site. We need to be civil when we express differences in opinion. No personal attacks. Avoid you, your statements. Don't characterize an entire political party with comparisons to Fascism or Communism or other extreme movements that committed atrocities. CF is not the place for broad brush or blanket statements about groups and political parties. Put the broad brushes and blankets away when you come to CF, better yet, put them in the incinerator. Debate had no place for them. We need to remember that people that commit acts of violence represent themselves or a small extreme faction.

Abiogenesis and Evolution

whois

rational
Mar 7, 2015
2,523
119
✟3,336.00
Faith
Non-Denom
I've experienced healing without taking anything.....pure faith.
i must point out that this type of thing IS NOT common, but it IS consistent.
what is really curious about this is, if this can be coupled with epigenetics.
if so, then the ramifications for humanity is astounding.
a small handful of people . . .
 
Upvote 0

justlookinla

Regular Member
Mar 31, 2014
11,767
199
✟35,675.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
i must point out that this type of thing IS NOT common, but it IS consistent.
what is really curious about this is, if this can be coupled with epigenetics.
if so, then the ramifications for humanity is astounding.
a small handful of people . . .

Right, it's not common.
 
Upvote 0

malvina

Newbie
Aug 22, 2014
490
111
91
South Australia
✟23,706.00
Gender
Female
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Single
Politics
AU-Labor
I can fill up books of the 50 years of healings and miracles in my life and lives of those I've ministered to I ran a large Christian Book and Drop-in Centre for 20yrs without a dollar or asking for help except to the Lord. - 4 large shops. If we had a need we just prayed and it would come in the door - from people all over South Australia right out in the country Someone would pass by have prayer and get help then send people to me with antiques and all kinds of blessings. The healings to my body is a testimony alone. But you cannot convince a non-believer of this no matter how much you try - they only believe if they want to.
I know there will be some here that will say like 'it was all your imagination' as my daughter once did even though she was with me a few times when things happened she closed her inside eyes and mind to them simply because she had chosen a life-style that didn't include The Lord and that's how it is with everyone - we believe what we want to believe according to the life we want to lead. I ask God to bless everyone and become closer to Him,
God Bless You
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

bhsmte

Newbie
Apr 26, 2013
52,761
11,792
✟254,941.00
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
to I can fill up books of the 50 years of healings and miracles in my life and lives of those I've ministered to I ran a large Christian Book and Drop-in Centre for 20yrs without a dollar or asking for help except to the Lord. - 4 large shops. If we had a need we just prayed and it would come in the door - from people all over South Australia right out in the country Someone would pass by have prayer and get help then send people to me with antiques and all kinds of blessings. The healings to my body is a testimony alone. But you cannot convince a non-believer of this no matter how much you try - they only believe if they want to.
I know there will be some here that will say like 'it was all your imagination' as my daughter once did even though she was with me a few times when things happened she closed her inside eyes and mind to them simply because she had chosen a life-style that didn't include The Lord and that's how it is with everyone - we believe what we want to believe according to the life we want to lead. I ask God to bless everyone and become closer to Him,
God Bless You

If prayer heals, why does God let 9 million children die each year before the age of five.

You think these children's families and parents aren't desperately praying for them?
 
Upvote 0

justlookinla

Regular Member
Mar 31, 2014
11,767
199
✟35,675.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
If prayer heals, why does God let 9 million children die each year before the age of five.

You think these children's families and parents aren't desperately praying for them?

What does it matter, they're nothing but relatively worthless sacks of chemicals, aren't they?
 
Upvote 0

malvina

Newbie
Aug 22, 2014
490
111
91
South Australia
✟23,706.00
Gender
Female
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Single
Politics
AU-Labor
If prayer heals, why does God let 9 million children die each year before the age of five.

You think these children's families and parents aren't desperately praying for them?
If you Believed in Him you wouldn't have to ask that question
You can see a couple of miracles in my new blog. a child on her 3rd birthday and Jotta
 
Upvote 0

Faith77

Newbie
Jul 10, 2011
36
15
✟23,101.00
Faith
Pentecostal
to I can fill up books of the 50 years of healings and miracles in my life and lives of those I've ministered to I ran a large Christian Book and Drop-in Centre for 20yrs without a dollar or asking for help except to the Lord. - 4 large shops. If we had a need we just prayed and it would come in the door - from people all over South Australia right out in the country Someone would pass by have prayer and get help then send people to me with antiques and all kinds of blessings. The healings to my body is a testimony alone. But you cannot convince a non-believer of this no matter how much you try - they only believe if they want to.
I know there will be some here that will say like 'it was all your imagination' as my daughter once did even though she was with me a few times when things happened she closed her inside eyes and mind to them simply because she had chosen a life-style that didn't include The Lord and that's how it is with everyone - we believe what we want to believe according to the life we want to lead. I ask God to bless everyone and become closer to Him,
God Bless You

I, too, have experienced far more "coincidences" than an average person's fair share. I can accept that maybe some physical healings have been nothing more than the placebo effect, but I don't know how to explain things that involve genes (birth of children without birth defects when they were expected to, or having a child healed of effects when a gene is still deleted) or things involving other people, like purchasing and sale of homes. In the end, there's no way I could prove anything because those things are not amenable to empirical testing.

But with regards to the original post, I don't think anything has to change. I think the evolution is a brilliant mechanism. Yes, it may seem random, but randomness does not equate to meaninglessness.
 
Upvote 0

WeakButHopeful

Senior Member
Oct 25, 2003
612
40
72
East Coast of USA
Visit site
✟23,470.00
Faith
Catholic
As a Christian I have no problem with evolution being part of God's plan, and I further strongly believe that Jesus, if he posted to this thread, would ask that we make His Father's plan more a part of our (Christians') plans. In other words, I believe that arguing about matters such as evolution or faith healing is similar to the straw men that Jesus' opponents used to erect ("why did you pick ears of corn on the Sabbath Jesus, huh?" or "which brother is the husband of that widow, huh?).

Granted, I agree that forum threads are a valid and reasonable social exercise for exchanging ideas among Christians and between Christians and others. However, many aspects of these debates end up revisiting points and counterpoints that have been covered in books, some of them quite old, yet written by good thinkers who took time to study the pros and cons. I have always found C. S. Lewis (originally an atheist who converted) to be an exceptionally sharp mind and in books like "Miracles", and "Mere Christianity" he covered much of this ground. There is also Pasal's Wager https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascal's_Wager and I would also recommend G. K. Chesterton's works, he was another very intelligent author.

That's my 2 cents.
 
Upvote 0

justlookinla

Regular Member
Mar 31, 2014
11,767
199
✟35,675.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
As a Christian I have no problem with evolution being part of God's plan, and I further strongly believe that Jesus, if he posted to this thread, would ask that we make His Father's plan more a part of our (Christians') plans. In other words, I believe that arguing about matters such as evolution or faith healing is similar to the straw men that Jesus' opponents used to erect ("why did you pick ears of corn on the Sabbath Jesus, huh?" or "which brother is the husband of that widow, huh?).

Granted, I agree that forum threads are a valid and reasonable social exercise for exchanging ideas among Christians and between Christians and others. However, many aspects of these debates end up revisiting points and counterpoints that have been covered in books, some of them quite old, yet written by good thinkers who took time to study the pros and cons. I have always found C. S. Lewis (originally an atheist who converted) to be an exceptionally sharp mind and in books like "Miracles", and "Mere Christianity" he covered much of this ground. There is also Pasal's Wager https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pascal's_Wager and I would also recommend G. K. Chesterton's works, he was another very intelligent author.

That's my 2 cents.

The problem is that in some views of evolution, mankind is simply the result of an evolutionary random creation process, no plan, purpose or goal. Mankind is nothing more than a randomly created sack of chemicals in certain evolutionary views.

Christianity teaches that mankind is more than that and that we aren't the products of a random, mindless, meaningless, purposeless and goalless process (Darwinist evolution).
 
Upvote 0

Faith77

Newbie
Jul 10, 2011
36
15
✟23,101.00
Faith
Pentecostal
The problem is that in some views of evolution, mankind is simply the result of an evolutionary random creation process, no plan, purpose or goal. Mankind is nothing more than a randomly created sack of chemicals in certain evolutionary views.

Christianity teaches that mankind is more than that and that we aren't the products of a random, mindless, meaningless, purposeless and goalless process (Darwinist evolution).

Just because it appears that there is no plan, purpose or goal doesn't mean that that's the case. Of course, we could never prove that God intended to guide the process, but what's to say that it is unguided? We can only say that it happens randomly, but we can't say that God didn't design it that way, or that every random mutation wasn't already known and planned by Him. Science cannot infer God, but I don't have a problem with science, as long as it does what it does best - provide hypotheses for what we can observe, and from what the data shows, evolution seems to be the best explanation.
 
Upvote 0

justlookinla

Regular Member
Mar 31, 2014
11,767
199
✟35,675.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
Just because it appears that there is no plan, purpose or goal doesn't mean that that's the case.

That's a subjective viewpoint. I differ and say that it appears there was a plan, purpose and goal.

Of course, we could never prove that God intended to guide the process,

Neither can we prove, with the scientific method as a basis, that it's a completely random process.

but what's to say that it is unguided? We can only say that it happens randomly, but we can't say that God didn't design it that way, or that every random mutation wasn't already known and planned by Him.

As Christians, we can say that God had a plan to create humanity.

Science cannot infer God, but I don't have a problem with science, as long as it does what it does best - provide hypotheses for what we can observe, and from what the data shows, evolution seems to be the best explanation.

Depends on what form of evolution you're speaking of. The form which claims that humanity is driven by randomness with the result being nothing more than various forms of sacks of chemicals isn't supported by the scientific method.
 
Upvote 0

JonFromMinnesota

Well-Known Member
Sep 3, 2015
2,171
1,608
Minnesota
✟60,266.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Single
If you Believed in Him you wouldn't have to ask that question
You can see a couple of miracles in my new blog. a child on her 3rd birthday and Jotta

Why doesn't God heal amputees?
When it comes to miracles, you have to ask yourself this question (I'm blanking on who this was originally said by)

"Have the laws of nature been suspended in your favor and in a way that you approve or have you made a mistake?"
 
Upvote 0

JonFromMinnesota

Well-Known Member
Sep 3, 2015
2,171
1,608
Minnesota
✟60,266.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Single
I'm sure if you ask The Lord that He will give you a suitable answer

I asked a fair question. If God exists, why doesn't he heal amputees? Why not Alzheimer's? Why not Parkinsons disease? We have never seen a limb regenerate or the two diseases mention magically disappear from a patient.
Have the laws of nature been suspended in your favor and in a way that you approve or have you made a mistake?
 
Upvote 0

whois

rational
Mar 7, 2015
2,523
119
✟3,336.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Why doesn't God heal amputees?
When it comes to miracles, you have to ask yourself this question (I'm blanking on who this was originally said by)

"Have the laws of nature been suspended in your favor and in a way that you approve or have you made a mistake?"
the fact still remains, the placebo effect is a reality.
it is the direct result of a persons expectations, their belief that it will work.
 
Upvote 0

JonFromMinnesota

Well-Known Member
Sep 3, 2015
2,171
1,608
Minnesota
✟60,266.00
Gender
Male
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Single
Upvote 0

malvina

Newbie
Aug 22, 2014
490
111
91
South Australia
✟23,706.00
Gender
Female
Faith
Charismatic
Marital Status
Single
Politics
AU-Labor
Upvote 0