Sabbath and Law-Keepers - Gracious convo please!

LoveGodsWord · Nov 5, 2017

bekkilyn said:
Post #68 did not address anything about observing the Sabbath in Matthew 5:17-19 specifically. Jesus was speaking about the *entire* Mosaic law that he fulfilled on the cross, and then he went on to provide details on *his* commandments in his Sermon on the Mount, which included not one iota of a mention of observing the Sabbath.

Post # 68 did indeed answer your question. Well the above is also easy to answer. Do you believe when Jesus is referring to all the law that this includes God's Law (10 commandments)? How many commandments are in the 10 commandments? The 4th commandment is one of the ten isn't it? It is very clear for all to see that Jesus includes just what he says in Matthew 5:17-19; and that is all the law and the prophet. This includes the 4th commandment.

bekkilyn said:
Considering how the claim is that observing a Saturday Sabbath is *the* only way into heaven, it is curiously left out of Jesus's teachings and not emphasized at all in any of the epistles of other writings in the New Testament.

Who claimed as you say that..............

observing a Saturday Sabbath is *the* only way into heaven

I do not think that anyone has claimed that here at all. If no one has claimed such things are you only arguing against yourself and if no one is saying what you have said what do you have to argue about? What is being discussed however is that unrepentant SIN will keep you out of God's Kingdom (Hebrews 10:26-27) and that sin is breaking God's commandments of which the 4th commandment is one of the ten (James 2:11; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4; Romans 3:20). Yep that's the issue here SIN; breaking God's commandments......................

bekkilyn said:
You are assuming that Jesus's commandments are the same as the ten commandments of the Old Covenant. You are assuming that every time someone in the New Testament mentions the words "commandments" that they are writing about the ten commandments of Mosaic law rather than Jesus's commandments. Whenever the word "law" is mentioned, you are assuming a division between ten commandments (moral) vs. ceremonial law, and choosing which one best fits your interpretation, rather than acknowledging the Mosaic law as a whole. This is part of what is causing this disconnect on this Sabbath issue.

There is no need to assume anything as you have suggested if you know God's Word. God's Word tells us what it is referring to even if you only want to look at the NT scriptures when it talks about God's Law.

Let's have a look................................................

What does Jesus say when he talk about the commandments. Jesus is quoting from Old testament scriptures of Deuteronomy 6:5 and Leviticus 19:18.................

Matthew 22
36, Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
37, Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38, This is the first and great commandment.
39, And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
40, ON THESE TWO COMMANDMENTS HANG ALL THE LAW AND THE PROPHETS.

Let's get clearer......................................................

Matthew 19
16, And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
17, And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: BUT IF YOU WILL ENTER INTO LIFE KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS.
18, He saith unto him, WHICH? JESUS SAID, THOU SHALT NOT MURDER, THOU SHALT NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, THOU SHALT NOT STEAL, THOU SHALT NOT LIE, HONOR YOU MOTHER AND FATHER AND THOU SHALT LOVE THY NEIGHBOR AS THYSELF
20, The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet? 21, Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me. <Jesus showed him that he may have fulfilled His duty of love to his neighbor but not to God breaking commandment 1 and 2 loving riches more than God>

Well Jesus makes it very clear that what he is talking about it is the 10 commandments of God's Law.

What about James................................................................

James 2
8, If ye fulfill the royal law according to the scripture, THOU SHALT LOVE THY NEIGHBOR AS THYSELF, ye do well:
9, But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
10, FOR WHOSOEVER SHALL KEEP THE WHOLE LAW AND YET OFFEND IN ONE POINT, HE SHALL BE GUILTY OF ALL.
11, FOR HE THAT SAID, DO NOT COMMIT ADULTERY SAID ALSO DO NOT KILL. NOW IF YOU DO NOT COMMIT ADULTERY AND YOU KILL, YOU HAVE BECOME A TRANSGRESSOR OF GOD'S LAW.
12, So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.

Well James makes it very clear what he is talking about when he talks about the Royal Law of love. He is talking about the 10 commandments. So Jesus and James both agree that they are talking about God's 10 commandments which also include the 4th commandment which is one of the ten.

What about Paul? He wrote a lot of books in God's Word...........................

Romans 13
8, Owe no man any thing, but to LOVE ONE ANOTHER: for HE THAT LOVES ANOTHER HAS FULFILLED THE LAW.
9, For this, THOU SHALT NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, THOU SHALT NOT KILL, THOU SHALT NOT STEAL, THOU SHALT NOT LIE, THOU SHALT NOT COVET; and IF THERE SHALL BE ANY OTHER COMMANDMENT, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, THOU SHALT LOVE THY NEIGHBOR AS THYSELF.
10, Love works no ill to his neighbour: therefore LOVE IS THE FULFILLING OF THE LAW.

Paul makes it very clear what he is talking about as well when he is talking about God's Law. It seems like Jesus, James and Paul all agree together what it is they are referring to when talking about God's Law. They are all referring to God's 10 commandments which includes the 4th commandment which is one of the ten (Exodus 20:1-17)

So now that God's Word shows us what it is referring to. No need to guess, what are talking about, it is God's 10 commandments.

What does God's Word tell us about God's Law (10 commandments).........

The Law of God (10 commandments) which includes the 4th commandment is the work of God (Exodus 32:16) whatsoever God does is forever nothing can be added to it or taken away (Ecclesiastes 3:14). God's Law is perfect converting the soul (Psalms 19:7). It is the very standard of the Old and New Covenants (Exodus 20:1:17, Hebrews 8:10-12). God's Law was spoken by God himself to His people (Exodus 20:1-22). Jesus says Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away (Matthew 25:35). Gods Law is still in force today (Psalms 111:7-8, Revelation 12:17, 14:12, 22:14, 1 John 3:5-8, 1 John 2:3-4 etc.). The Law of God reveals sin to us so we can see ourselves as we truly are sinners in need of a Saviour (Romans 3:20; 1 John 3:4). It is the great standard of the judgement (Ecclesiastes 12:13-14, James 2:10-12, 1 John 3:4, Acts 17:31). God's Law is our teacher revealing sin and the character of God and brings us to Christ at the foot of the cross that we might be saved by faith by Him who loves us and washed us in His own blood (Galatians 3:24; Revelation 1:5).

What did the Jesus and the Apostles teach about God's Law....................

Jesus taught the 10 commandments…..

1. Jesus kept God’s Law (10 commandments) and said the Law and the prophets would not pass away (Matt 5:17-18)
2. Jesus taught others to follow the 10 commandments (Mark 10:17-21)
3. Jesus taught that Love is the fulfilling (doing) of God’s Law (10 commandments Matt 22:36-40)
4. If we break God’s Law by following man-made traditions we are not following God (Matt 15:3-9)
5. Jesus says if we commit sin we are a servant of sin and he has come to free us from sin (John 8:32-36)
6. Jesus taught if you love God you will keep God’s Law and abide in His Love (John 14:15; 15:10
7. If anyone is breaking any of God’s commandments and teaching others to do so will be called least in the kingdom of heaven <least = lost> (Matt 5:19)
8. No one can obey God’s Law producing the fruit of obedience of ourselves and unless we abide in Jesus we can do nothing (John 15:4-10)

Paul affirms the Ten Commandments……

1. Paul teaches God's people keep the Sabbath Hebrews 4.
2. Paul tells gentiles that "what matters is KEEPING the Commandments of GOD" 1 Cor 7:19
3. Paul tells gentiles "it is not the HEARERS of the Law that are just before God but the DOERS of the Law will be justified... on the day when according to my GOSPEL God will judge all mankind" Rom 2:13-16
4. Paul asks that gentiles consider the doctrine of LAW "Do we then make void the LAW of God by our faith? God forbid! In fact we establish the Law of God" Rom 3:31
5. Paul tells ALL Christians that it is only the lost who will "not subject themselves to the Law of God neither indeed CAN they" Rom 8:6-8
6 Paul reaches all Christians under the NEW Covenant that God's LAW as known in Jer 31:31-33 is "written on the heart and mind" Heb 8:7-11
7. Paul tells all Christians that the OT text is to be used for Doctrine 2Tim 3:16
AND He never claims that "if I did not write it -- it is not scripture for us today" -- as one or two have imagined for us.
8. Paul tells all Christians that the 5th commandment is the "FIRST commandment with a promise" Eph 6:1-2 and is binding on all Christians.
9. God's Law (10 commandments) are holy, just and good (Rom 7:12)
10. God's Law gives us a knowledge of what sin is (Rom 3:20; 7:7)
11. The penalty of breaking God's Law without Jesus is death (Rom 6:23)
12. If we break God's Law we dishonor God (Rom 2:23)
13. If we sin we are "under the Law" and guilty before God (Rom 3:19)
14. We are saved by faith but our faith establishes the Law in us (Rom 3:31)
15. If we are saved by grace we should not break God's Law (Rom 6:1-7)
16. We should not break God's Law if we are under grace (Rom 6:15)
17. We are to serve the Law of God through the mind because that is where sin starts (Rom 6:17; 7:25; 8:4; 12:2)
18. It is God's Law that brings us to Jesus (Gal 3:24)
19. God's salvation frees us from sin so we can be obedient to God's Law and live a life of holiness (Rom 6:22)
20. We will be judged by God's Law and only those that are obedient will be justified because of their faith (Rom 2:4-13)
21. God's Law can only be obeyed through love and a changed heart which comes by faith in God's Word (Rom 2:21-29; 13:9-10; Heb 8:9-10)
22. If we break God's Law and are in unrepentant sin we will be lost and will received God's judgements (Heb 10:26-27)

John affirms the 10 commandments……

1. John says it is only by keeping God’s 10 commandments that we know that we know God (1 John 2:3)
2. If someone says that they know God and do not keep God’s 10 commandments they are lying and not telling the truth (1 John 2:4)
3. We should purify ourselves as Jesus is pure (1 John 3:3)
4. Sin is the breaking of God’s 10 commandments (1 John 3:4)
5. Whoever is abiding in Christ does not commit sin (1 John 3:6; John 15:4-10)
6. If you are in unrepentant sin you have not seen Jesus or know him (1 John 3:6)
7. John warns us that only those that are obedience to God’s Law are his true followers (1 John 3:7)
8. If someone is committing unrepentant sin they are following the devil and not God (1 John 3:7)
9. If you are born of God and abiding in him you will not commit sin (1 John 3:9; 1 John 3:6; John 15:4-10
10. It is the keeping of God’s commandments that is the difference between those that are following God and those that are not following God (1 John 3:10; 1 John 5:3)
11. It is only by Love through faith that we can keep God’s commandments (1 John 5:3-4)
12. God’s true believers in the end days will keep all of God’s commandments through faith in Jesus (Rev 14:12; 22:14)

James also affirms the 10 commandments…….

1. James says God’s Law (10 commandments) are a Royal Law (James 2:8)
2. If we break one of God’s commandments we a guilty before God as sinners breaking all of God’s Law and gave some examples of breaking God’s Law (James 2:9-11)
3. James says God’s Law is a law of liberty and freedom (James 2:12)
4. The 10 commandments (God’s Law) are the standard in the judgment (James 2:12)
5. If our faith does not have the fruit of obedience to God’s Law it is dead and not true faith (James 2:16-26)

Peter affirms the 10 commandments……..

1. Sanctification is to obedience to God’s Law (1 Pet 1:2)
2. We can only be changed from sin to obedience to God’s Law by the power of God and it will be revealed in the last days (1 Pet 1:5)
3. We should give up our sins to be holy because Jesus is holy (1 Pet 1:13-16)
4. Jesus is your example who did no sin (1 Pet 2:21-22)
5. Cease from sin and do not live in the flesh (1 Pet 4:1-3)
6. Judgement will begin at the house of God and sinners (those breaking God’s 10 commandments) will not be saved.
7. God has given us his precious promises and as we believe them God will grant us his divine power to live a life of Godliness (obedience to God’s Law; 2 Pet 1:2-4)
8. The Un-Godly (disobedient to God’s Law) will be like Sodom and Gomorrah (2 Pet 2:6)
9. If any turn away from God’s Law and are in unrepentant sin breaking any of God’10 commandments they will be lost (2 Pet 2:20-22)
10 God is not willing that any should perish but that everyone should come to repentance and turn away from sin to follow God’s 10 commandments because those that do not will receive the judgements of God (2 Pet 3:5-14)

What did Jesus and the Apostles teach about the Sabbath in the New Testament?

1. It is lawful to do good on the Sabbath (Matt 12:1-8; 10-12; 24:20; Mark 3:1-5; Luke 6:1-10; 13:14-16; 14:1-5; John 7:22-23; 9:14; Mark 1:21; Mark 6:2; Luke 4:16; 31; Luke 14:1; 23:56)
2. Jesus made the Sabbath for all mankind (Mark 2:27)
3. Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath (Mark 2:28)
4. If you do not believe and follow God you cannot enter His Sabbath rest (Hebrews 4)
5. It is one of God’s 10 commandments we break it we are guilty or breaking all (James 2:8-12)
6. Breaking it is sin (1 John 3:4)
7. God’s true followers keep it Holy as God commanded (Rev 14:12; Rev 22:14; Eze 20:20)
8. Jesus is our example and he kept the Sabbath (Matt 12:1-8; 10-12; 24:20; Mark 3:1-5; Luke 6:1-10; 13:14-16; 14:1-5; John 7:22-23; 9:14; Mark 1:21; Mark 6:2; Luke 4:16; 31; Luke 14:1; 23:56; John 2:6; Matt 16:24; 1 Cor 11:1; Eph 5:1-21; Pet 2:20-22)
9. The Apostle kept the Sabbath (Acts 13:14; 13:27; 13:44; 15:21; 16:13; 17:2; 18:4; Rev 1:10)

God’s Law in the NC is written on our hearts it is through love and it is love the fulfils God’s Law in us as we walk not after the flesh but after the spirit and is why Jesus says f you love me keep my commandments. (John 14:15; John 15:10). If we knowingly break one of God’s commandments we commit sin (1 John 3:4). This includes the 7th Day Sabbath which Jesus made for us and commands us to keep as a holy day.

Seems like Jesus and the Apostles all taught the same thing and agreed together that SIN is breaking God's Law and SIN will keep you out of God's Kingdom (Hebrews 10:26-27)

This includes the 4th commandment the 7th day Sabbath which is one of the ten.

Sunday worship is a tradition of man that breaks the commandments of God. Many have forsaken God's 4th commandment to follow after the traditions of man that break the commandment of God.

In times of ignorance God winks at but when a knowledge of the truth has come calls all men everywhere to repent and believe His Word.

Who should we follow the teachings and traditions of man or the Word of God?. Jesus says if we follow the traditions of man over the Word of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9)

Now where does it say in God's Word that God's 4th commandment has now been ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a Holy day?

May God bless you as you seek him through His Word.

LoveGodsWord · Nov 5, 2017

FreeAtLast said:
Shalom!

How can we be under the Old Covenant Law of Moses since Yeshua fulfilled it, completing it and then gave us His NEW Covenant?

What do you think of these Scriptures?
Acts
The law is an unbearable yoke. (Acts 15:10)

Romans
The law reveals sin but cannot fix it. (Romans 3:20)

If the law worked then faith would be irrelevant. (Romans 4:14)

The law brings wrath upon those who follow it. (Romans 4:15)

The purpose of the law was to increase sin. (Romans 5:20)

Christians are not under the law. (Romans 6:14)

Christians have been delivered from the law. (Romans 7:1-6)

The law is good, perfect and holy but cannot help you be good, perfect or holy. (Romans 7:7-12)

The law which promises life only brings death through sin. (Romans 7:10)

The law makes you sinful beyond measure. (Romans 7:13)

The law is weak. (Romans 8:2-3)

1 Corinthians
The strength of sin is the law (1 Corinthians 15:56)

2 Corinthians
The law is a ministry of death. (2 Corinthians 3:7)

The law is a ministry of condemnation. (2 Corinthians 3:9)

The law has no glory at all in comparison with the New Covenant. (2 Corinthians 3:10)

The law is fading away. (2 Corinthians 3:11)

Anywhere the law is preached it produces a mind-hardening and a heart-hardening veil. (2 Corinthians 3:14-15)

Galatians
The law justifies nobody. (Galatians 2:16)

Christians are dead to the law. (Galatians 2:19)

The law frustrates grace. (Galatians 2:21)

To go back to the law after embracing faith is “stupid”. (Galatians 3:1)

The law curses all who practice it and fail to do it perfectly. (Galatians 3:10)

The law has nothing to do with faith. (Galatians 3:11-12)

The law was a curse that Christ redeemed us from. (Galatians 3:13)

The law functioned in God’s purpose as a temporary covenant from Moses till John the Baptist announced Christ. (Galatians 3:16 & 19, also see… Matthew 11:12-13, Luke 16:16)

If the law worked God would have used it to save us. (Galatians 3:21)

The law was our prison. (Galatians 3:23)

The law makes you a slave like Hagar. (Galatians 4:24)

Ephesians
Christ has abolished the law which was a wall of hostility (Ephesians 2:15)

Philippians
Paul considered everything the law gained him as “skybalon” which is Greek for “poop”. (Philippians 3:4-8)

1 Timothy
The law is only good if used in the right context. (1 Timothy 1:8) (see next verse for the context)

It was made for the unrighteous but not for the righteous. (1 Timothy 1:9-10)

Hebrews
The law is weak, useless and makes nothing perfect. (Hebrews 7:18-19)

God has found fault with it and created a better covenant, enacted on better promises. (Hebrews 8:7-8)

It is obsolete, growing old and ready to vanish. (Hebrews 8:13)

It is only a shadow of good things to come and will never make someone perfect. (Hebrews 10:1)

You seem to be confused about the purpose of God's Law (10 commandments) which are forever and the Mosaic laws that were temporary shadows of things to come.....

bekkilyn · Nov 5, 2017

LoveGodsWord said:
Post # 68 did indeed answer your question. Well that is easy to answer. Do you believe when Jesus is referring to all the law that this includes God's Law (10 commandments)? How many commandments are in the 10 commandments? The 4th commandment is one of the ten isn't it? It is very clear for all to see that Jesus includes just what he says in Matthew 5:17-19; and that is all the law and the prophet. This includes the 4th commandment.

Yes, the law that Jesus *fulfilled* on the cross. Then he went on to detail *his* commandments in his Sermon on the Mount and didn't mention observing the Sabbath even once. Very curious considering it is supposedly *the* commandment upon which all salvation hinges.

Who claimed as you say that..............

I do not think that anyone has claimed that here at all. If no one has claimed such things are you only arguing against yourself and if no one is saying what you have said what do you have to argue about?

So you do not agree that anyone who bears the mark of the beast (Sunday worship according to your tradition) will not enter God's kingdom, and that only those who observe the Sabbath on Saturday will have the seal of God? Is this not a complex way of stating that observing the Saturday Sabbath is *the* required path to salvation?

What is being discussed however is that unrepentant SIN will keep you out of God's Kingdom (Hebrews 10:26-27) and that sin is breaking God's commandments of which the 4th commandment is one of the ten (James 2:11; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4; Romans 3:20). Yep that's the issue here SIN; breaking God's commandments......................

Which all boils down to is that it is observation of the Saturday Sabbath, rather than Jesus's free gift of grace that cleanses sin and frees us from the law, that is mandatory for salvation.

If Saturday Sabbath replaces Jesus, then there wasn't any point to his death.

There is no need to assume anything as you have suggested if you know God's Word.

Or apparently if you *think* you know God's Word rather than your own interpretation.

God's Word tells us what it is referring to even if you only want to look at the NT scriptures when it talks about God's Law.

Ah yes, the whole "scripture defines scripture" argument. Of course, it would need to imply that the initial interpretations are correct.

Let's have a look................................................

Here we go again.

(Same cut and paste arguments as the last 200 times)

Yet again, you are assuming that "commandments" in the New Testament are the ten commandments rather than Jesus's commandments, and yet again, there is no explanation as to why Jesus leaves out what is supposedly the most important of all commandments in the entire bible out of his Sermon on the Mount, considering how extraordinarily crucial the fourth commandment of the Decalogue is for salvation.

Original Happy Camper · Nov 5, 2017

FreeAtLast said:
I will put my law within them,

and whaat law might that be?

LoveGodsWord · Nov 5, 2017

bekkilyn said:
Yes, the law that Jesus *fulfilled* on the cross. Then he went on to detail *his* commandments in his Sermon on the Mount and didn't mention observing the Sabbath even once. Very curious considering it is supposedly *the* commandment upon which all salvation hinges.

So you do not agree that anyone who bears the mark of the beast (Sunday worship according to your tradition) will not enter God's kingdom, and that only those who observe the Sabbath on Saturday will have the seal of God? Is this not a complex way of stating that observing the Saturday Sabbath is *the* required path to salvation?

Which all boils down to is that it is observation of the Saturday Sabbath, rather than Jesus's free gift of grace that cleanses sin and frees us from the law, that is mandatory for salvation.

If Saturday Sabbath replaces Jesus, then there wasn't any point to his death.

Or apparently if you *think* you know God's Word rather than your own interpretation.

Ah yes, the whole "scripture defines scripture" argument. Of course, it would need to imply that the initial interpretations are correct.

Here we go again.

(Same cut and paste arguments as the last 200 times)

Yet again, you are assuming that "commandments" in the New Testament are the ten commandments rather than Jesus's commandments, and yet again, there is no explanation as to why Jesus leaves out what is supposedly the most important of all commandments in the entire bible out of his Sermon on the Mount, considering how extraordinarily crucial the fourth commandment of the Decalogue is for salvation.

I noticed you left out all the scripture I provided in your post quoting me above. Only God's Word has been provided to you and we should follow it over the teachings and traditions of man that break the commandments of God as Jesus told us in Mathew 15:3-9.

If you do not believe the scriptures I posted to you in post # 126 (linked). That is ok it is between you and God. I would suggest however that you at least try and answer them for yourself because they clearly disagree with what you have posted so far.

If you cannot than there is a problem for you. Also, try and answer the question............

Where in God's Word does it say that God's 4th commandment is ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to Keep Sunday as a Holy day?

If you cannot answer the scriptures that disagree with your interpretation or the question asked maybe you should consider if what you believe is true because it is God's Word that is to judge us all in the last days.

May God bless you as you seek him through His Word.

FreeAtLast · Nov 5, 2017

Original Happy Camper said:
and whaat law might that be?

Yeshua's NEW Covenant Law, spoken of in Jeremiah 31:31-34, where G-d says He will make NEW Covenant, not like the Old Covenant at Sinai. And Yeshua spoke it in Luke 22:20.

HARK! · Nov 5, 2017

Original Happy Camper said:
and whaat law might that be?

LOL!

Bob S · Nov 5, 2017

If someone uses the 10 commandments to tell themwhat sin is they are using a very limited example. For instance their is no command to love your neighbor or love God. There is not command not to become a drunkard. How about smoking The SDA church will not baptize anyone who smokes or drinks. They must be terrible sins and yet not in the 10.

klutedavid · Nov 5, 2017

LoveGodsWord said:
You seem to be confused about the purpose of God's Law (10 commandments) which are forever and the Mosaic laws that were temporary shadows of things to come.....

Hello LGW.

Speaking about the ten commandments.

Do you regard the following as a commandment?

2 Thessalonians 3:6
Now we command you, brethren, in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, that you keep away from every brother who leads an unruly life and not according to the tradition which you received from us.

klutedavid · Nov 5, 2017

Bob S said:
If someone uses the 10 commandments to tell themwhat sin is they are using a very limited example. For instance their is no command to love your neighbor or love God. There is not command not to become a drunkard. How about smoking The SDA church will not baptize anyone who smokes or drinks. They must be terrible sins and yet not in the 10.

Hello Bob S.

The ten includes all sin.

Bob S · Nov 5, 2017

HARK! said:
Let's take a look anyway. I'm not one to so lightly start tearing pages out of the Bible, to support my interpretation of one snippet of the Bible.

(CLV) Hb 1:9
Thou lovest righteousness (kept THE LAW) and hatest injustice (disregard for THE LAW) ; Therefore Thou art anointed by The God, (tou theou) (YHWH), Thy God, with the oil of exultation beyond Thy partners."

(CLV) 1Jn 3:9
Everyone who is begotten of The God, (tou theou) (YHWH) is not doing sin, for His seed is remaining in him, and he can not be sinning, for he is begotten of The God (tou theou) (YHWH).

(CLV) Mt 5:17
"You should not infer that I came to demolish THE LAW or the prophets. I came not to demolish, but to fulfill.

(CLV) Mt 5:18
For verily, I am saying to you, Till heaven and earth should be passing by, one iota or one serif may by no means be passing by from THE LAW till all should be occurring.

(CLV) Mt 5:19
"Whosoever, then, should be annulling one of the least of these precepts, and should be teaching men thus, the least in the kingdom of the heavens shall he be called. Yet whoever should be doing and teaching them, he shall be called great in the kingdom of the heavens.

(CLV) Lk 16:17
Yet it is easier for heaven and earth to pass by than for one serif of THE LAW to fall.

(CLV) 1Jn 3:4
Everyone who is doing sin, is doing LAWLESSNESS also, and sin is LAWLESSNESS.

(CLV) Mt 24:12
And, because of the multiplication of LAWLESSNESS, the love of many shall be cooling.

(CLV) Mt 24:13
Yet he who endures to the consummation, he shall be saved.

(CLV) 1Jn 2:4
He who is saying that I know him, and is not keeping his precepts, is a liar; and the truth of The God, (tou theou) (YHWH) is not in this one.

(CLV) 1Jn 3:8
Yet he who is doing sin is of the Adversary, for from the beginning is the Adversary sinning. For this, was the Son of The God (tou theou) (YHWH manifested, that He should be annulling the acts of the Adversary.

(CLV) Mt 23:28
Thus you, also, outside, indeed, are appearing to men to be just, yet inside you are distended with hypocrisy and LAWLESSNESS.

(CLV) Mt 7:21
"Not everyone saying to Me `Lord! Lord!' will be entering into the kingdom of the heavens, but he who is doing the will of My Father Who is in the heavens.
(CLV) Mt 7:22
Many will be declaring to Me in that day, `Lord! Lord! Was it not in Your name that we prophesy, and in Your name cast out demons, and in Your name do many powerful deeds?'

(CLV) Mt 7:23
And then shall I be avowing to them that `I never knew you! Depart from Me, workers~ of LAWLESSNESS!'
(CLV) Mt 13:41
The Son of Mankind shall be dispatching His messengers, and they shall be culling out of His kingdom all the snares and those doing LAWLESSNESS,

So...!

How do you reconcile your interpretation of what Paul is trying to say, with what Yahshua's closest disciples, and even what Yahshua himself, made abundantly clear?

If you can't reconcile your interpretation of what Paul is trying to tell you with what Yahshua himself has told you; why would you add more weight to your interpretation of Paul, than to Yahshua's clear message?

I didn't write 2Cor3:7-11 so I guess your argument is with Paul not me. The 10 were part of the old covenant which is replaced by the new one. the 10 as a guide have been replaced by the Holy Spirit as our guide. Israel didn't fair very well under the guidance of the 10. The Holy Spirit guides us to live a righteous life.

Bob S · Nov 5, 2017

klutedavid said:
Hello Bob S.

The ten includes all sin.

Oh?

HARK! · Nov 5, 2017

LoveGodsWord said:
Post # 68 did indeed answer your question. Well the above is also easy to answer. Do you believe when Jesus is referring to all the law that this includes God's Law (10 commandments)? How many commandments are in the 10 commandments? The 4th commandment is one of the ten isn't it? It is very clear for all to see that Jesus includes just what he says in Matthew 5:17-19; and that is all the law and the prophet. This includes the 4th commandment.

Who claimed as you say that..............

I do not think that anyone has claimed that here at all. If no one has claimed such things are you only arguing against yourself and if no one is saying what you have said what do you have to argue about? What is being discussed however is that unrepentant SIN will keep you out of God's Kingdom (Hebrews 10:26-27) and that sin is breaking God's commandments of which the 4th commandment is one of the ten (James 2:11; Romans 7:7; 1 John 3:4; Romans 3:20). Yep that's the issue here SIN; breaking God's commandments......................

There is no need to assume anything as you have suggested if you know God's Word. God's Word tells us what it is referring to even if you only want to look at the NT scriptures when it talks about God's Law.

Let's have a look................................................

What does Jesus say when he talk about the commandments. Jesus is quoting from Old testament scriptures of Deuteronomy 6:5 and Leviticus 19:18.................

Matthew 22
36, Master, which is the great commandment in the law?
37, Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.
38, This is the first and great commandment.
39, And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
40, ON THESE TWO COMMANDMENTS HANG ALL THE LAW AND THE PROPHETS.

Let's get clearer......................................................

Matthew 19
16, And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
17, And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: BUT IF YOU WILL ENTER INTO LIFE KEEP THE COMMANDMENTS.
18, He saith unto him, WHICH? JESUS SAID, THOU SHALT NOT MURDER, THOU SHALT NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, THOU SHALT NOT STEAL, THOU SHALT NOT LIE, HONOR YOU MOTHER AND FATHER AND THOU SHALT LOVE THY NEIGHBOR AS THYSELF
20, The young man saith unto him, All these things have I kept from my youth up: what lack I yet? 21, Jesus said unto him, If thou wilt be perfect, go and sell that thou hast, and give to the poor, and thou shalt have treasure in heaven: and come and follow me. <Jesus showed him that he may have fulfilled His duty of love to his neighbor but not to God breaking commandment 1 and 2 loving riches more than God>

Well Jesus makes it very clear that what he is talking about it the 10 commandments of God's Law.

What about James................................................................

James 2
8, If ye fulfill the royal law according to the scripture, THOU SHALT LOVE THY NEIGHBOR AS THYSELF, ye do well:
9, But if ye have respect to persons, ye commit sin, and are convinced of the law as transgressors.
10, FOR WHOSOEVER SHALL KEEP THE WHOLE LAW AND YET OFFEND IN ONE POINT, HE SHALL BE GUILTY OF ALL.
11, FOR HE THAT SAID, DO NOT COMMIT ADULTERY SAID ALSO DO NOT KILL. NOW IF YOU DO NOT COMMIT ADULTERY AND YOU KILL, YOU HAVE BECOME A TRANSGRESSOR OF GOD'S LAW.
12, So speak ye, and so do, as they that shall be judged by the law of liberty.

Well James makes it very clear what he is talking about when he talks about the Royal Law of love. He is talking about the 10 commandments. So Jesus and James both agree that they are talking about God's 10 commandments which also include the 4th commandment which is one of the ten.

What about Paul he wrote a lot of books in God's Word...........................

Romans 13
8, Owe no man any thing, but to LOVE ONE ANOTHER: for HE THAT LOVES ANOTHER HAS FULFILLED THE LAW.
9, For this, THOU SHALT NOT COMMIT ADULTERY, THOU SHALT NOT KILL, THOU SHALT NOT STEAL, THOU SHALT NOT LIE, THOU SHALT NOT COVET; and IF THERE SHALL BE ANY OTHER COMMANDMENT, it is briefly comprehended in this saying, namely, THOU SHALT LOVE THY NEIGHBOR AS THYSELF.
10, Love works no ill to his neighbour: therefore LOVE IS THE FULFILLING OF THE LAW.

Paul makes it very clear what he is talking about as well when he is talking about God's Law. It seems like Jesus, James and Paul all agree together what it is they are referring to. God's 10 commandments or which the 4th commandment is one of the ten (Exodus 20:1-17)

So now that God's Word shows us what it is referring to. No need to guess, we are talking about God's Law (10 commandments). What does God's Word tell us about God's Law.........

The Law of God (10 commandments) which includes the 4th commandment is the work of God (Exodus 32:16) whatsoever God does is forever nothing can be added to it or taken away (Ecclesiastes 3:14). God's Law is perfect converting the soul (Psalms 19:7). It is the very standard of the Old and New Covenants (Exodus 20:1:17, Hebrews 8:10-12). God's Law was spoken by God himself to His people (Exodus 20:1-22). Jesus says Heaven and earth shall pass away, but my words shall not pass away (Matthew 25:35). Gods Law is still in force today (Psalms 111:7-8, Revelation 12:17, 14:12, 22:14, 1 John 3:5-8, 1 John 2:3-4 etc.). The Law of God reveals sin to us so we can see ourselves as we truly are sinners in need of a Saviour (Romans 3:20; 1 John 3:4). It is the great standard of the judgement (Ecclesiastes 12:13-14, James 2:10-12, 1 John 3:4, Acts 17:31). God's Law is our teacher revealing sin and the character of God and brings us to Christ at the foot of the cross that we might be saved by faith by Him who loves us and washed us in His own blood (Galatians 3:24; Revelation 1:5).

What did the Jesus and the Apostles teach about God's Law....................

Jesus taught the 10 commandments…..

1. Jesus kept God’s Law (10 commandments) and said the Law and the prophets would not pass away (Matt 5:17-18)
2. Jesus taught others to follow the 10 commandments (Mark 10:17-21)
3. Jesus taught that Love is the fulfilling (doing) of God’s Law (10 commandments Matt 22:36-40)
4. If we break God’s Law by following man-made traditions we are not following God (Matt 15:3-9)
5. Jesus says if we commit sin we are a servant of sin and he has come to free us from sin (John 8:32-36)
6. Jesus taught if you love God you will keep God’s Law and abide in His Love (John 14:15; 15:10
7. If anyone is breaking any of God’s commandments and teaching others to do so will be called least in the kingdom of heaven <least = lost> (Matt 5:19)
8. No one can obey God’s Law producing the fruit of obedience of ourselves and unless we abide in Jesus we can do nothing (John 15:4-10)

Paul affirms the Ten Commandments……

1. Paul teaches God's people keep the Sabbath Hebrews 4.
2. Paul tells gentiles that "what matters is KEEPING the Commandments of GOD" 1 Cor 7:19
3. Paul tells gentiles "it is not the HEARERS of the Law that are just before God but the DOERS of the Law will be justified... on the day when according to my GOSPEL God will judge all mankind" Rom 2:13-16
4. Paul asks that gentiles consider the doctrine of LAW "Do we then make void the LAW of God by our faith? God forbid! In fact we establish the Law of God" Rom 3:31
5. Paul tells ALL Christians that it is only the lost who will "not subject themselves to the Law of God neither indeed CAN they" Rom 8:6-8
6 Paul reaches all Christians under the NEW Covenant that God's LAW as known in Jer 31:31-33 is "written on the heart and mind" Heb 8:7-11
7. Paul tells all Christians that the OT text is to be used for Doctrine 2Tim 3:16
AND He never claims that "if I did not write it -- it is not scripture for us today" -- as one or two have imagined for us.
8. Paul tells all Christians that the 5th commandment is the "FIRST commandment with a promise" Eph 6:1-2 and is binding on all Christians.
9. God's Law (10 commandments) are holy, just and good (Rom 7:12)
10. God's Law gives us a knowledge of what sin is (Rom 3:20; 7:7)
11. The penalty of breaking God's Law without Jesus is death (Rom 6:23)
12. If we break God's Law we dishonor God (Rom 2:23)
13. If we sin we are "under the Law" and guilty before God (Rom 3:19)
14. We are saved by faith but our faith establishes the Law in us (Rom 3:31)
15. If we are saved by grace we should not break God's Law (Rom 6:1-7)
16. We should not break God's Law if we are under grace (Rom 6:15)
17. We are to serve the Law of God through the mind because that is where sin starts (Rom 6:17; 7:25; 8:4; 12:2)
18. It is God's Law that brings us to Jesus (Gal 3:24)
19. God's salvation frees us from sin so we can be obedient to God's Law and live a life of holiness (Rom 6:22)
20. We will be judged by God's Law and only those that are obedient will be justified because of their faith (Rom 2:4-13)
21. God's Law can only be obeyed through love and a changed heart which comes by faith in God's Word (Rom 2:21-29; 13:9-10; Heb 8:9-10)
22. If we break God's Law and are in unrepentant sin we will be lost and will received God's judgements (Heb 10:26-27)

John affirms the 10 commandments……

1. John says it is only by keeping God’s 10 commandments that we know that we know God (1 John 2:3)
2. If someone says that they know God and do not keep God’s 10 commandments they are lying and not telling the truth (1 John 2:4)
3. We should purify ourselves as Jesus is pure (1 John 3:3)
4. Sin is the breaking of God’s 10 commandments (1 John 3:4)
5. Whoever is abiding in Christ does not commit sin (1 John 3:6; John 15:4-10)
6. If you are in unrepentant sin you have not seen Jesus or know him (1 John 3:6)
7. John warns us that only those that are obedience to God’s Law are his true followers (1 John 3:7)
8. If someone is committing unrepentant sin they are following the devil and not God (1 John 3:7)
9. If you are born of God and abiding in him you will not commit sin (1 John 3:9; 1 John 3:6; John 15:4-10
10. It is the keeping of God’s commandments that is the difference between those that are following God and those that are not following God (1 John 3:10; 1 John 5:3)
11. It is only by Love through faith that we can keep God’s commandments (1 John 5:3-4)
12. God’s true believers in the end days will keep all of God’s commandments through faith in Jesus (Rev 14:12; 22:14)

James also affirms the 10 commandments…….

1. James says God’s Law (10 commandments) are a Royal Law (James 2:8)
2. If we break one of God’s commandments we a guilty before God as sinners breaking all of God’s Law and gave some examples of breaking God’s Law (James 2:9-11)
3. James says God’s Law is a law of liberty and freedom (James 2:12)
4. The 10 commandments (God’s Law) are the standard in the judgment (James 2:12)
5. If our faith does not have the fruit of obedience to God’s Law it is dead and not true faith (James 2:16-26)

Peter affirms the 10 commandments……..

1. Sanctification is to obedience to God’s Law (1 Pet 1:2)
2. We can only be changed from sin to obedience to God’s Law by the power of God and it will be revealed in the last days (1 Pet 1:5)
3. We should give up our sins to be holy because Jesus is holy (1 Pet 1:13-16)
4. Jesus is your example who did no sin (1 Pet 2:21-22)
5. Cease from sin and do not live in the flesh (1 Pet 4:1-3)
6. Judgement will begin at the house of God and sinners (those breaking God’s 10 commandments) will not be saved.
7. God has given us his precious promises and as we believe them God will grant us his divine power to live a life of Godliness (obedience to God’s Law; 2 Pet 1:2-4)
8. The Un-Godly (disobedient to God’s Law) will be like Sodom and Gomorrah (2 Pet 2:6)
9. If any turn away from God’s Law and are in unrepentant sin breaking any of God’10 commandments they will be lost (2 Pet 2:20-22)
10 God is not willing that any should perish but that everyone should come to repentance and turn away from sin to follow God’s 10 commandments because those that do not will receive the judgements of God (2 Pet 3:5-14)

What did Jesus and the Apostles teach about the Sabbath in the New Testament?

1. It is lawful to do good on the Sabbath (Matt 12:1-8; 10-12; 24:20; Mark 3:1-5; Luke 6:1-10; 13:14-16; 14:1-5; John 7:22-23; 9:14; Mark 1:21; Mark 6:2; Luke 4:16; 31; Luke 14:1; 23:56)
2. Jesus made the Sabbath for all mankind (Mark 2:27)
3. Jesus is Lord of the Sabbath (Mark 2:28)
4. If you do not believe and follow God you cannot enter His Sabbath rest (Hebrews 4)
5. It is one of God’s 10 commandments we break it we are guilty or breaking all (James 2:8-12)
6. Breaking it is sin (1 John 3:4)
7. God’s true followers keep it Holy as God commanded (Rev 14:12; Rev 22:14; Eze 20:20)
8. Jesus is our example and he kept the Sabbath (Matt 12:1-8; 10-12; 24:20; Mark 3:1-5; Luke 6:1-10; 13:14-16; 14:1-5; John 7:22-23; 9:14; Mark 1:21; Mark 6:2; Luke 4:16; 31; Luke 14:1; 23:56; John 2:6; Matt 16:24; 1 Cor 11:1; Eph 5:1-21; Pet 2:20-22)
9. The Apostle kept the Sabbath (Acts 13:14; 13:27; 13:44; 15:21; 16:13; 17:2; 18:4; Rev 1:10)

God’s Law in the NC is written on our hearts it is through love and it is love the fulfils God’s Law in us as we walk not after the flesh but after the spirit and is why Jesus says f you love me keep my commandments. (John 14:15; John 15:10). If we knowingly break one of God’s commandments we commit sin (1 John 3:4). This includes the 7th Day Sabbath which Jesus made for us and commands us to keep as a holy day.

Seems like Jesus and the Apostles all taught the same thing and agreed together that SIN is breaking God's Law and SIN will keep you out of God's Kingdom (Hebrews 10:26-27)

This includes the 4th commandment the 7th day Sabbath which is one of the ten.

Sunday worship is a tradition of man that breaks the commandments of God. Many have forsaken God's 4th commandment to follow after the traditions of man that break the commandment of God.

In times of ignorance God winks at but when a knowledge of the truth has come calls all men everywhere to repent and believe His Word.

Who should we follow the teachings and traditions of man or the Word of God?. Jesus says if we follow the traditions of man over the Word of God we are not following God (Matthew 15:3-9)

Now where does it say in God's Word that God's 4th commandment has now been ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to keep Sunday as a Holy day?

May God bless you as you seek him through His Word.

Great work! I know that putting this post together took a lot of time and thought. It wasn't spent in vain. I learned a little truth that I have been searching for, for quite some time, from this post. I told my family about it over dinner. Post this far and wide, to let YHWH's light shine! Keep up the great work!

HARK! · Nov 5, 2017

Bob S said:
I didn't write 2Cor3:7-11 so I guess your argument is with Paul not me. The 10 were part of the old covenant which is replaced by the new one. the 10 as a guide have been replaced by the Holy Spirit as our guide. Israel didn't fair very well under the guidance of the 10. The Holy Spirit guides us to live a righteous life.

What do you suppose that Paul meant by this:

(CLV) Ro 3:31
Are we, then, nullifying law through faith? May it not be coming to that! Nay, we are sustaining law

What does he mean by sustaining the law?

Romans 6:15 - What then? Shall we sin because we are not under Law but under grace? Certainly not! 16 Do you not know that to whom you present yourselves slaves to obey, you are that one's slaves whom you obey, whether of sin [leading] to death, or of obedience [leading] to righteousness?

What's this? Obedience to the law?

Romans 7:14 - For we know that the Law is spiritual, but I am carnal, sold under sin.

I don't understand this one at all. If he was purchased for a price; who sold him?

I really like this one:

2 Corinthians 6:14 - English Standard Version

Do not be unequally yoked with unbelievers (true believers keep The Law). For what partnership has righteousness (law keepers) with lawlessness (law breakers)?

So how do you reconcile these verses with practicing lawlessness?

Doug Melven · Nov 5, 2017

The purpose of the law and why Jesus affirmed it.
Isaiah 42:21 says that Jesus will magnify the law and make it honorable.

Because the Israelites had watered down the law and replaced some of it with there tradition.
In Exodus 19 God told Moses to tell the people that they would be a kingdom of priests.
Notice, this did not happen. Only the Levites could be priests under the law.
When Moses told them this they replied, "All that God has said we can do."
Up to that point they had utterly failed at doing what God told them to do.
They broke the Sabbath by picking up sticks on the Sabbath, they complained all of the time.
When they said they were able to do what God said, they showed there self-righteousness.
Immediately God's tone changed, now they had to sanctify themselves and not have relations with there wives.
Then God told Moses to come up to Him in the mount, He would not speak to the people, He only spoke the law to Moses and Aaron.
The law was given to expose the peoples sin. Romans 5:20, 7:7, Galatians 3:19
Without the law we would not have known what evil sinners we were.
The law is holy, just and good. But it has no power to make us holy, just and good.
The law not only exposed sin, it gave sin strength.
Paul said he had not known lust, except the law said, "Thou shalt not covet"
But sin that it might appear sin taking occasion by the commandment wrought in me all manner of lust.
Then in 1 Corinthians 15:56 Paul said, "The strength of sin is the law".
Now we know that the law is good, if one uses it lawfully. Knowing this that the law was not made for a righteous man.
But it was made for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of
fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers, For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers,
for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine; 1 Timothy 1:8-10

If you are a born-again Christian, you are righteous according to 2 Corinthians 5:21.
A believer is not without law, he is under the law of faith.
So, if we don't have the law to tell us how to live, how will we know what to do?
Romans 8:4 says that the righteous requirement of the law is fulfilled in us as we walk after the Spirit.
Galatians 5:16 says that if we walk in the Spirit, we will not fulfill the lust of the flesh.
Isaiah 30:20-21 says that we will hear a Voice behind us saying this is the way, walk in it.

The law is a ministry of death and condemnation according to 2 Corinthians 3:3-8
There was only one law written on stone, the 10 Commandments.
When the law was given in Exodus 3000 people died.
When the Spirit was given at Pentecost, 3000 people got saved.
Illustrating the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life.

bekkilyn · Nov 5, 2017

LoveGodsWord said:
I noticed you left out all the scripture I provided in your post quoting me above. Only God's Word has been provided to you and we should follow it over the teachings and traditions of man that break the commandments of God as Jesus told us in Mathew 15:3-9.

Do you seriously think anyone is going to spend hours individually addressing every single verse of scripture you post when the point remains the same? We are saved by Jesus, not the Mosaic law.

If you do not believe the scriptures I posted to you in post # 126 (linked). That is ok it is between you and God. I would suggest however that you at least try and answer them for yourself because they clearly disagree with what you have posted so far.

I certainly do believe the scriptures, but what I don't believe is your *interpretation* of the scriptures. I simply do not agree that we are saved by observing the fourth commandment. That whole concept makes Jesus's death on the cross entirely meaningless.

If you cannot than there is a problem for you. Also, try and answer the question............

Where in God's Word does it say that God's 4th commandment is ABOLISHED and we are now commanded to Keep Sunday as a Holy day?

I have never once stated that the Law was abolished, but I have stated many times that it was *fulfilled* by Jesus. The entire law pointed to Jesus and when he died on the cross he fulfilled its purpose. Under the New Covenant, we are to follow *his* commandments, not the Mosaic laws of the Old Covenant.

Also, no one has stated that it is commanded to keep Sunday as a holy day. Christians decided to celebrate it as it is the day of the Lord's resurrection, as Christians have been gathering on the first day of the week since the time of the apostles. There are no days in which we are forbidden to worship.

If you cannot answer the scriptures that disagree with your interpretation or the question asked maybe you should consider if what you believe is true because it is God's Word that is to judge us all in the last days.

May God bless you as you seek him through His Word.

Jesus has already justified those of us who accept his free gift of grace and has already proclaimed us not guilty. It is the blessed assurance that Jesus promised and Jesus is not a liar.

HARK! · Nov 5, 2017

bekkilyn said:
We are saved by Jesus, not the Mosaic law.

YesheYahu (Isa) 43:
11 I, even I, am YHWH; and beside Me there is no savior.

YesheYahu (Isa) 45:21-25
21 Tell and bring them near; yes let them take counsel together: who has declared this from ancient time? who has told it from that time? have not I YHWH? and there is no Elohiym else beside Me; a just Elohiym and a Savior; there is none beside Me.

22 Look to Me, and be saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am Elohiym, and there is none else.

23 I have sworn by Myself, the word is gone out of My mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, That to Me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear.

24 Surely, shall one say, in YHWH I have righteousness and strength: even to Him shall men come; and all that are incensed against Him shall be ashamed.

25 In YHWH shall all the seed of Israel be justified, and shall glory.

Hoshea 13:4
4 Yet I am YHWH, your Elohiym from the land of Egypt, and you shall know no ‘god’ but Me: for there is no savior besides Me.

YesheYahu (Isa) 12:2
2 Behold, Elohiym is my salvation; I will trust, and not be afraid: for Yahh YHWH is my strength and my song; He is also my salvation

bekkilyn · Nov 5, 2017

HARK! said:
YesheYahu (Isa) 43:
11 I, even I, am YHWH; and beside Me there is no savior.

YesheYahu (Isa) 45:21-25
21 Tell and bring them near; yes let them take counsel together: who has declared this from ancient time? who has told it from that time? have not I YHWH? and there is no Elohiym else beside Me; a just Elohiym and a Savior; there is none beside Me.

22 Look to Me, and be saved, all the ends of the earth: for I am Elohiym, and there is none else.

23 I have sworn by Myself, the word is gone out of My mouth in righteousness, and shall not return, That to Me every knee shall bow, every tongue shall swear.

24 Surely, shall one say, in YHWH I have righteousness and strength: even to Him shall men come; and all that are incensed against Him shall be ashamed.

25 In YHWH shall all the seed of Israel be justified, and shall glory.

Hoshea 13:4
4 Yet I am YHWH, your Elohiym from the land of Egypt, and you shall know no ‘god’ but Me: for there is no savior besides Me.

YesheYahu (Isa) 12:2
2 Behold, Elohiym is my salvation; I will trust, and not be afraid: for Yahh YHWH is my strength and my song; He is also my salvation

Do you reject the divinity of Jesus then?

HARK! · Nov 5, 2017

bekkilyn said:
Do you reject the divinity of Jesus then?

That depends on what your definition of divine is.

If you're asking me if Yahshua is Yahshua's Elohim and Father (Yahweh); the answer is emphatically NO!

bekkilyn · Nov 5, 2017

HARK! said:
That depends on what your definition of divine is.

If you're asking me if Yahshua is Yahshua's Elohim and Father (Yahweh); the answer is emphatically NO!

Do you believe in the Trinity...as in *one* God in three persons, Father, Son (Jesus), and Holy Spirit?

Sabbath and Law-Keepers - Gracious convo please!

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Contemplative Christian

One of GODS Children I am a historicist

Well-Known Member

Messianic Jew

שמע

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

Well-Known Member

שמע

שמע

Well-Known Member

Contemplative Christian

שמע

Contemplative Christian

שמע

Contemplative Christian

Similar threads