Sabbath and Law-Keepers - Gracious convo please!

[Original Happy Camper]

I don't see how your quoted Scripture agrees with your statement. Since the law can't condemn us, we're not under is jurisdiction. If I'm in Texas doing 80 (legal posted speed limit on I-10), I'm not violating California law limiting me to 65 even if I'm a legal resident of California..

The law condems us to death if we violate it which we all do
Romans 6:23
For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

 

[listed]

The law condems us to death if we violate it which we all do
Romans 6:23
For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

In keeping with my comment the law can't condemn us I quote:
Romans 8:1
There is therefore now no condemnation to them which are in Christ Jesus, who walk not after the flesh, but after the Spirit.

2 For the law of the Spirit of life in Christ Jesus hath made me free from the law of sin and death.

The law of sin and death is what I'm redeemed from. This includes the law which only brings death for violation. If I'm free from sin the law has no purpose.

Who is the law for these days?

1 Timothy 1:8 But we know that the law is good, if a man use it lawfully;

9 Knowing this, that the law is not made for a righteous man, but for the lawless and disobedient, for the ungodly and for sinners, for unholy and profane, for murderers of fathers and murderers of mothers, for manslayers,

10 For whoremongers, for them that defile themselves with mankind, for menstealers, for liars, for perjured persons, and if there be any other thing that is contrary to sound doctrine;

11 According to the glorious gospel of the blessed God, which was committed to my trust.

We see the law is only for the wicked. The law no longer applies to the Christian. Christians are called the righteous in the above quote. Your verse does describe the Christian prior to becoming a Christian. Paul deals with our dual nature in Romans 7 and 8. 1 John 1:9 makes provision for the sin of the Christian. James 1:14 explains how this can happen.

You most likely meant to quote Romans 3:23. My comments are based on you opener and not your verse. They don't match.

 

[FreeAtLast]

The law condems us to death if we violate it which we all do
Romans 6:23
For the wages of sin is death; but the gift of God is eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.

The Law cannot condemn us to death IF we are truly born again by faith in Yeshua as G-d, trust in His complete, total and for all time forgiveness of sin and are filled with His Holy Spirit. i.e. saved for eternity.

The only ones the Old Covenant Law of Moses will condemn as the unsaved that are under the Law of Moses, THEY will be judged by it, not the forgiven children of G-d through Yeshua.

Romans 3:23-27
23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of G-d, 24 and are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, 25 whom God put forward as a propitiation by his blood, to be received by faith. This was to show God's righteousness, because in his divine forbearance he had passed over former sins. 26 It was to show his righteousness at the present time, so that he might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.

27 Then what becomes of our boasting? It is excluded. By what kind of law? By a law of works? No, but by the law of faith.

 

[SAAN]

The Law cannot condemn us to death IF we are truly born again by faith in Yeshua as G-d, trust in His complete, total and for all time forgiveness of sin and are filled with His Holy Spirit. i.e. saved for eternity.

The only ones the Old Covenant Law of Moses will condemn as the unsaved that are under the Law of Moses, THEY will be judged by it, not the forgiven children of G-d through Yeshua.

Romans 3:23-27
23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of G-d, 24 and are justified by his grace as a gift, through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus, 25 whom God put forward as a propitiation by his blood, to be received by faith. This was to show God's righteousness, because in his divine forbearance he had passed over former sins. 26 It was to show his righteousness at the present time, so that he might be just and the justifier of the one who has faith in Jesus.

27 Then what becomes of our boasting? It is excluded. By what kind of law? By a law of works? No, but by the law of faith.

How can the unsaved by condemned by the law that you claim was fulfilled and abolished???

How are they accountable to a law that no longer applies and were for the Israelite???

In order have grace, you have to had done something wrong, like break the law of God. That is why we have grace, is because we break his commands.

 

[Doug Melven]

How can the unsaved by condemned by the law that you claim was fulfilled and abolished???

How are they accountable to a law that no longer applies and were for the Israelite???

In order have grace, you have to had done something wrong, like break the law of God. That is why we have grace, is because we break his commands.

The law is for unbelievers ONLY.
Not for the Righteous. 1 Timothy 1:8-9
Christ is the end of the law for believers. Romans 10:4
If someone does not accept the payment Jesus made, but wants to make his own payment, he will owe a debt. Romans 4:4
As believers we do not need a list of rules to know right from wrong. God tells us personally, we know His Voice. John 10:4

 

[SAAN]

The law is for unbelievers ONLY.
Not for the Righteous. 1 Timothy 1:8-9
Christ is the end of the law for believers. Romans 10:4
If someone does not accept the payment Jesus made, but wants to make his own payment, he will owe a debt. Romans 4:4
As believers we do not need a list of rules to know right from wrong. God tells us personally, we know His Voice. John 10:4

Why we unbelievers be accountable to a law they dont even know?If they have never heard of Jesus or God, they might not even know of the commandments in the bible to reject them.

The list of rules to know right from wrong is what ALL of Gods followers had for 4000yrs before the Messiah and still followed after his resurrection. The law is to point out our sin and to show our need for a Messiah and repentance. God tells you through his word, because it is there you read what sin was, so you know not to do it.

ROMANS 7:7
What then shall we say? That the law is sin? By no means! Yet if it had not been for the law, I would not have known sin. For I would not have known what it is to covet if the law had not said, “You shall not covet.”

 

[FreeAtLast]

How can the unsaved by condemned by the law that you claim was fulfilled and abolished???

I never said the Old Covenant Law was abolished, that is not correct and in fact, it is the opposite of what I and Yeshua said - that he came to fulfill, not abolish. I have said repeatedly that Yeshua FULFILLED the Old Covenant Law so that it does not apply any longer, (fulfill means to complete, fill up). Please do not bear false witness against me by saying I said something I did not. This is violation of the Law.

The UNSaved are not under Yeshua's NEW Covenant, so they are still under the Old system. Only born again believers in Yeshua, those who know that He is G-d, He died for their sins, they repent of their sins, accept His forgiveness and are filled with the Holy Spirit, are saved i.e. under the New Covenant. Anyone, even those who think they will be saved by adhering to the Old Covenant Law of Moses to be saved, will not. Only those who follow Yeshua and His NEW Covenant are.

How are they accountable to a law that no longer applies and were for the Israelite???

Seeng judged by the Old Covenant Law of Moses, those Jews AND Gentiles who are not born again into Yeshua and accept His NEW Covenant will be judged by the Old Covenant Law of Moses.

In order have grace, you have to had done something wrong, like break the law of God. That is why we have grace, is because we break his commands.

No. We are given grace when we accept Yeshua's sacrifice for our sins, turn away from them and accept His forgiveness by His NEW Covenant, not the Old Covenant Law of Moses. ONLY those who are born again receive grace and forgiveness of sin. Not those who look to the Old Covenant to do that.

Please read this, it provides the Scriptures I referenced.
How to be BORN AGAIN

 

[Paidiske]

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[Bob S]

The question remains, is it a sin not to observe the Israelite Sabbath? I know how SDAs believe and since we have a group of Messianics in the forum I would like your opinion and the scripture to back up your belief.

 

[bekkilyn]

The question remains, is it a sin not to observe the Israelite Sabbath? I know how SDAs believe and since we have a group of Messianics in the forum I would like your opinion and the scripture to back up your belief.

I am curious to see how non-SDA believe about it too.

United Methodists believe that there are three parts to the process of salvation. Prevenient grace, in which God is always reaching out to us to bring us into relationship with him, even before we are aware of it. Justification, in which we confess, repent, and accept Jesus as Lord and Savior...the "being saved" part (and I've used "salvation" for this part too since it tends to be common usage for multiple denominations) and then Sanctification, in which we grow and mature as Christians and are ultimately "made perfect" in Christ.

We do tend to give importance to the ten commandments as part of the *Sanctification* part of the way we define the salvation process. Following the sabbath is not required to be "saved", but we do tend to believe it is important to keep a sabbath day of rest since God also rested from his work during creation. We do not believe that it must be on any particular day of the week though. For example, my pastor takes a day of sabbath rest on Fridays since he works all weekend with church services, weddings, funerals, visitations, etc.

It's about Christian growth in our faith and building a better relationship with God. There is no threat of "going to hell" if it is not observed though.

 

[Bob S]

I am curious to see how non-SDA believe about it too.

United Methodists believe that there are three parts to the process of salvation. Prevenient grace, in which God is always reaching out to us to bring us into relationship with him, even before we are aware of it. Justification, in which we confess, repent, and accept Jesus as Lord and Savior...the "being saved" part (and I've used "salvation" for this part too since it tends to be common usage for multiple denominations) and then Sanctification, in which we grow and mature as Christians and are ultimately "made perfect" in Christ.

We do tend to give importance to the ten commandments as part of the *Sanctification* part of the way we define the salvation process. Following the sabbath is not required to be "saved", but we do tend to believe it is important to keep a sabbath day of rest since God also rested from his work during creation. We do not believe that it must be on any particular day of the week though. For example, my pastor takes a day of sabbath rest on Fridays since he works all weekend with church services, weddings, funerals, visitations, etc.

It's about Christian growth in our faith and building a better relationship with God. There is no threat of "going to hell" if it is not observed though.

Hi bekkilyn, I was brought up a Methodist and after leaving Adventism I returned to my upbringing. Methodists are one of the most non judgemental groups I am aware. We have the freedom to vary in our beliefs and no one judges us. I do not believe we are subject to the 10 commandments 2Cor3:7-11 and there is no command in the new covenant telling us to observe days and the congregation know my belief. I am in no way castigated for believing as I do and am accepted as an equal. I believe I am doing God's will because I follow the following guide taken from !Jn3:19 This is how we know that we belong to the truth and how we set our hearts at rest in his presence: 20 If our hearts condemn us, we know that God is greater than our hearts, and he knows everything. 21 Dear friends, if our hearts do not condemn us, we have confidence before God 22 and receive from him anything we ask, because we keep his commands and do what pleases him. 23 And this is his command: to believe in the name of his Son, Jesus Christ, and to love one another as he commanded us. 24 The one who keeps God’s commands lives in him, and he in them. And this is how we know that he lives in us: We know it by the Spirit he gave us.

Adventists do believe one cannot be saved if they do not "keep" the Sabbath. Ellen White wrote volumes and they believe all she wrote was inspired, really equal to scripture. The following taken from various books makes my point:

It means eternal salvation to keep the Sabbath holy unto the Lord. God says: "Them that honor Me I will honor." {6T 356.4}

But if we turn aside from the fourth commandment, so positively given by God, to adopt the inventions of Satan, voiced and acted by men under his control, we cannot be saved. We cannot with safety receive his traditions and subtleties as truth. {RH, July 6, 1897 par. 4}

No one who disregards the fourth commandment, after becoming enlightened in regard to the claims of the Sabbath, can be held guiltless in the sight of God. {RH, July 6, 1897 par. 14}

As persons become convinced from the Scriptures that the claims of the fourth commandment are still binding, the question is often raised, Is it necessary in order to secure salvation that we keep the Sabbath? This is a question of grave importance. If the light has shone from the word of God, if the message has been presented to men, as it was to Pharaoh, and they refuse to heed that message, if they reject the light, they refuse to obey God, and cannot be saved in their disobedience. {RH, January 5, 1886 par. 2}

But if we turn aside from the fourth commandment, so positively given by God, to adopt the inventions of Satan, voiced and acted by men under his control, we cannot be saved. We cannot with safety receive his traditions and subtleties as truth. {RH, July 6, 1897 par. 4}

All will be judged according to the light that has shone upon them. If they have light upon the Sabbath, they cannot be saved in rejecting that light.{HS 234.3}

All will be judged according to the light that has shone upon them. If they have light upon the Sabbath, they cannot be saved in rejecting that light.{HS 234.3}

As persons become convinced from the Scriptures that the claims of the fourth commandment are still binding, the question is often raised, Is it necessary in order to secure salvation that we keep the Sabbath? This is a question of grave importance. If the light has shone from the word of God, if the message has been presented to men, as it was to Pharaoh, and they refuse to heed that message, if they reject the light, they refuse to obey God, and cannot be saved in their disobedience. {RH, January 5, 1886 par. 2}

 

[FreeAtLast]

The question remains, is it a sin not to observe the Israelite Sabbath? I know how SDAs believe and since we have a group of Messianics in the forum I would like your opinion and the scripture to back up your belief.

Shalom,

I would just like to clarify something as to what is meant by"Israelite" Sabbath?

To my understanding, there is no such thing. The Sabbath of G-d is recorded in Genesis, before there were any sons of Israel on the Earth and before there was any covenants or law in effect.

I think it is accurate to say that the 7th day Sabbath, is the Sabbath of G-d and anyone who says they belong to G-d, acknowledges this truth from Scriptures.

Genesis 2
1 Thus the heavens and the earth were finished, and all the host of them. 2 And on the seventh day G-d finished his work that he had done, and he rested on the seventh day from all his work that he had done. 3 So God blessed the seventh day and made it holy, because on it G-d rested from all his work that he had done in creation.

Point: G-d made the 7th day HOLY and blessed it. It is Scriptural truth and it has never been rescinded or UNblessed and is not dependent on the Covenants or Law to be fact.

I'll respond to the rest of the question in a separate post.

 

[FreeAtLast]

The question remains, is it a sin not to observe the Israelite Sabbath? I know how SDAs believe and since we have a group of Messianics in the forum I would like your opinion and the scripture to back up your belief.

See my post above regarding that I do not see any "Israelite Sabbath" in Scripture, but in Genesis 2, G-d rested on the 7th day, blessed it and called it holy. It remains as fact to believers and non.

That said, I assume the question is; are we, as Believers in Yeshua required to adhere to the Old Covenant Law of Moses regarding the Sabbath of G-d?

The answer is unequivocally and categorically, NO.

I have typed and re-typed my Scriptures that support of my answer so many times, I hope you will allow me to paste an answer from One for Israel ministry that I agree with and which addresses most of the common Law-Keeper arguments that we see here over and over.

Are followers of Jesus under the Law? Is there really such a thing as ''Torah Observant''? - ONE FOR ISRAEL Ministry

Is there really such a thing as “Torah Observant”? Does God expect us to try and keep the 613 commandments of the Sinai covenant while we are under the New covenant of Yeshua? (*Tip: read all the way until the end!)

When we renovated the second floor of our facilities, we forgot to take into consideration how much we love coffee; for this reason, you will find a tiny kitchenette poorly situated in the middle of a narrow hallway. This hallway is always messy and crowded with thirty of us walking by and, of course, stopping to make coffee. One day we hope to replace this tiny kitchenette with a spacious, beautiful, perfect, fully-functioning kitchen. But until that day comes, we must make do with what we have, and make the extra effort to keep things in order. Our boss established several rules regarding the kitchenette: Keep quiet so as not to disturb your co-workers working nearby; clean up after yourself immediately, because the sink is so tiny; and do not prepare meals in the kitchenette—meals result in noise and unwanted odors. These rules will help us maintain order (and keep our boss happy)—until that glorious day arrives when we have a new kitchen! When that day comes, there may be new principles we can implement in our lives and in our new kitchen, but most of the old kitchenette’s laws will no longer be applicable to the beautiful new kitchen.

Basically, Keeping the Law Has Become Impossible! But what if you really wanted, with all of your heart and mind—just for the sake of argument—to keep the Law (be “Torah observant”)? Well, it is simply impossible. There is no priesthood, no temple, and no sacrificial system—all of which comprise the heart and essence of the Law (the commandments are all associated with it). You see, we cannot separate the Sinai Covenant from the Law. The laws are merely an outgrowth of the covenant; they cannot stand on their own, just as eating mayonnaise and mustard is pointless without the sandwich itself. The covenant was ratified by the shedding of blood (Exod 24:8) and was maintained by the blood of the sacrifices upon the altar (Exod 30:10). Without the sacrificial system we are unable to keep the Sinai Covenant. All we can do is keep a few leftover laws, which are not related to the temple, the priesthood or the sacrificial system. Moreover, while these laws continue to speak to us as inspired Scripture, many of these laws were given to Israel 3,500 years ago in order to establish a nation in the context of the Ancient Near Eastern world. If we were to establish a new nation today, we would give its people laws and rules (traffic, family, taxes, torts, civil, labor, etc.) according to their situation, lifestyle, era and location. However, many of Moses’ laws are practically impossible to keep in our day and age, due to the current reality in which we live: for example, issues concerning slavery or purification rituals are no longer relevant.

In modern terms, asking if someone can be justified by keeping the Law is like giving someone an old laptop without its motherboard or processor and asking them to live their lives with its assistance. Even though the laptop might be able to “do” a few things (such as typing on the keyboard), there is no point without the motherboard and processor (the blood of the covenant). Furthermore, the new and upgraded laptop we received as a gift is meant to be the exclusive mechanism!

As we show in our new book “The Torah’s Goal?” there are many implications in the Law to our lives today.

However, there really is no such thing as “Torah observant”, as most of the 613 commandments are impossible to keep even if we wanted to try. Those that are left, are usually being cherry picked from, ignoring most of them and ending up with only a few.

If somebody is telling you he is Torah observant, try to randomly pick a few commandments and see if he really observes them or not, for example, you may ask them:

– Do you keep your diet 100% animal fat free, as in accordance with Leviticus 3:17 ?
– Do you stone your children if they curse you, as in accordance with Leviticus 20:9 ?
– Do you never shave your facial hair, as in accordance with Leviticus 19:27 ?
– Do you support the killing of gays and lesbians, as in accordance with Leviticus 20:13 ?
– During the Shabbat, do you not drive or BBQ? (and if you lived before the nineteenth century, will you not turn on lights nor start the heating in the winter if you are cold?), as in accordance with Exodus 35:3 ?
– Do you always wear only one kind of fabric on your body so not to mix between linen and wool, as in accordance with Deuteronomy 22:11 ?
– Do you never buy fruit in the supermarket as their producers do not wait until the 5th year to start selling them? (not to mention the fact that the majority of today’s supermarket food products includes corn or soy), as in accordance with Leviticus 19:23-25?
These are only 7 examples of the hundreds of Sinai commandmends, and remember, if in Yeshua we still under the authority of the Sinai covenant, we can’t just keep some commandments, we must keep them all: “For whoever keeps the whole law but fails in one point has become accountable for all of it.” (James 2:10)

But the more important question is – are you convinced that God is really interested in us following these commandments and being under their authority today under the new covenant?

If the answer is “yes”, then you don’t believe in a New Covenant, but in a Renewed Covenant. And that would be in contradiction to Jeremiah’s words:
“The days are coming,” declares the Lord, “when I will make a new covenant with the people of Israel and with the people of Judah.
It will not be like the covenant I made with their ancestors when I took them by the hand to lead them out of Egypt, because they broke my covenant, though I was a husband to them,” declares the Lord.
“This is the covenant I will make with the people of Israel after that time,” declares the Lord. “I will put my law in their minds and write it on their hearts. I will be their God, and they will be my people.” (Jeremiah 31:31-33)

Some in the Hebrew roots movement appeal to John 14:15 to support their position that Yeshua’s followers are obligated to keep the Law. “If you love me, you will keep my commandments” (John 14:15; see 14:21, 23-24). There is absolutely nothing in the immediate context, however, which would lead one to conclude that “my commandments” refers to the Law. Biblical interpretation relies heavily on context and the immediate context clarifies the specific commandments to which Yeshua refers. “This is my commandment, that you love one another as I have loved you….These things I command you, so that you will love one another. (John 15:12, 17; other commandments given by Yeshua in the immediate context include John 14:1, 11, 27; 15:4, 7, 9; 16:24).

“Let no debt remain outstanding, except the continuing debt to love one another, for whoever loves others has fulfilled the law.” (Romans 13:8)

So, are we throwing the Torah out of the window?

Of course not! The commandments of the Sinai Covenant continues to function as inspired Scripture. The Law witnesses against us, points us to Yeshua, teaches us about God, offers us wisdom and insight, deepens our understanding of the person and work of Yeshua, and challenges us to love God and our neighbor. As we continue to meditate on the riches of the Torah, may we, like David, desire its teachings more “than gold, even much fine gold.” May it be to us “sweeter also than honey and drippings from the honeycomb” (Ps 19:10) After all, “All Scripture is breathed out by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, and for training in righteousness, that the man of God may be complete, equipped for every good work.” (2 Tim 3:16-17)

FAQ:


Question: “So now I can murder? And with the Law, how does one knows how to love his neighbor?”

Answer: That would be to take what we’ve said out of context! As followers of the Messiah, we were given a perfect example of perfect life. A role model. Did Yeshua teach us to murder? Did he not show us in His life and actions how to love others?
Remember, God promised a New Covenant, which will “not be like the covenant I made with their ancestors” (Jer 31:31). This one He says, He will: “write it on their hearts” (Jeremiah 31:33).
Why? because “when the priesthood is changed, the law must be changed also…Jesus has become the guarantor of a better covenant” (Hebrews 7)
Why? Because “the law was our guardian until Christ came that we might be justified by faith.” (Gal 3:24)
So how do we now know how to please God?
“…When he, the Spirit of truth, comes, he will guide you into all the truth” (John 16:13)
You see, it’s the Holy Spirit in our hearts which now tells us not only how to love our neighbor, but even how to love our enemies!

Question: “Do you eat Kosher? if you don’t you broke his commandment!”

Answer: Why stop there? He also said not to eat rare steaks (blood) or any kind of animal fat. Keeping the food laws of Leviticus 11 is an essential component of what people mean when they speak of “Torah observance” today. What people often fail to see, however, and what the writer of Hebrews has so perceptively observed, is the connection between the food laws and the tabernacle. Leviticus 11 is part of a larger section in Leviticus (Lev 11–15) called the Laws of Purity, all of which are tied to the purity of the tabernacle (Lev 16). Beyond the fact that there is no longer a functioning tabernacle/temple, followers of Yeshua are now the temple of the Holy Spirit (1 Cor 3:16), the purity of which is no longer contingent upon following the Laws of Purity in Lev 11–15, but upon the final and perfect sacrifice of the Messiah Yeshua. Yeshua has fulfilled all the Laws of Purity for us, including the food laws! For this reason, both Paul and the writer of Hebrews are able to declare to Yeshua’s followers, both Jewish and Gentile, that all foods are clean (Heb 9:8–10; 13: 9; 1 Tim 4:1–5).

The continuous operation of the tabernacle with its sacrificial system, the Levitical priesthood, the ceremonial washings, etc. (i.e., the Sinai Covenant), was specifically designed not to last. And as we meditate on the description of the tabernacle and its significance as found in Scripture for all believers today, its symbolism and built-in limitations are designed to point us to a better high priest, a better sacrifice, and a better temple to which we now have direct access in Yeshua. Elsewhere we also see that even the feasts were specifically designed with the Messiah in mind. “Therefore let no one pass judgment on you in questions of food and drink, or with regard to a festival or a new moon or a Sabbath. These are a shadow of the things to come, but the substance belongs to Christ” (Col 2:16–17).

Eitan Bar is a native Jewish-Israeli who was born and raised in Tel Aviv, Israel (1984). Graduated with his B.A. in Biblical Studies from Israel College of the Bible (Jerusalem, 2009), his M.A. in Theology from Liberty University (2013) and is now pursuing his Doctorate with Dallas Theological Seminary. Eitan currently serves as ONE FOR ISRAEL's Director of Media & Evangelism. (From 2006 to 2013, Eitan worked for CRU, in which his roles included serving as Israel's VLM-SLM leader.)

Eitan's professional background is in "Multimedia Design and Visual Communications" working for various secular advertising agencies in Tel-Aviv.

Eitan is the producer of:
1) I MET MESSIAH (Jewish testimonials).
2) Answering Rabbinic Objections to Jesus.

 

[Bob S]

Removed by Bob S

 

[Bob S]

Removed by Bob S

 

[Danthemailman]

Adventists do believe one cannot be saved if they do not "keep" the Sabbath. Ellen White wrote volumes and they believe all she wrote was inspired, really equal to scripture. The following taken from various books makes my point:

It means eternal salvation to keep the Sabbath holy unto the Lord. God says: "Them that honor Me I will honor." {6T 356.4}

But if we turn aside from the fourth commandment, so positively given by God, to adopt the inventions of Satan, voiced and acted by men under his control, we cannot be saved. We cannot with safety receive his traditions and subtleties as truth. {RH, July 6, 1897 par. 4}

No one who disregards the fourth commandment, after becoming enlightened in regard to the claims of the Sabbath, can be held guiltless in the sight of God. {RH, July 6, 1897 par. 14}

As persons become convinced from the Scriptures that the claims of the fourth commandment are still binding, the question is often raised, Is it necessary in order to secure salvation that we keep the Sabbath? This is a question of grave importance. If the light has shone from the word of God, if the message has been presented to men, as it was to Pharaoh, and they refuse to heed that message, if they reject the light, they refuse to obey God, and cannot be saved in their disobedience. {RH, January 5, 1886 par. 2}

But if we turn aside from the fourth commandment, so positively given by God, to adopt the inventions of Satan, voiced and acted by men under his control, we cannot be saved. We cannot with safety receive his traditions and subtleties as truth. {RH, July 6, 1897 par. 4}

All will be judged according to the light that has shone upon them. If they have light upon the Sabbath, they cannot be saved in rejecting that light.{HS 234.3}

All will be judged according to the light that has shone upon them. If they have light upon the Sabbath, they cannot be saved in rejecting that light.{HS 234.3}

As persons become convinced from the Scriptures that the claims of the fourth commandment are still binding, the question is often raised, Is it necessary in order to secure salvation that we keep the Sabbath? This is a question of grave importance. If the light has shone from the word of God, if the message has been presented to men, as it was to Pharaoh, and they refuse to heed that message, if they reject the light, they refuse to obey God, and cannot be saved in their disobedience. {RH, January 5, 1886 par. 2}

What is it with this perverted Sabbath gospel? Keeping the Sabbath in order to secure salvation is certainly a "different" gospel and is a disturbing false doctrine to say the least! Another disturbing teaching by Ellen White is..... those who reject God's memorial of creatorship--the Bible Sabbath--choosing to worship and honor Sunday...will receive the mark of the beast."

Bible Truth Versus Adventist Truth - Mark of the Beast

 

[Bob S]

What is it with this perverted Sabbath gospel? Keeping the Sabbath in order to secure salvation is certainly a "different" gospel and is a disturbing false doctrine to say the least! Another disturbing teaching by Ellen White is..... those who reject God's memorial of creatorship--the Bible Sabbath--choosing to worship and honor Sunday...will receive the mark of the beast."

Bible Truth Versus Adventist Truth - Mark of the Beast

Ellen White was obsessed with the Sabbath and she wrote anything to coerce her avid followers and those they were able to convince into following her obsessions. I do believe she was a pawn of those who she sided with like her husband James and men like Joseph Bates. They used he as a puppet and her pen never stopped scratching out their whims. That does not mean that she was not clever. She invented the "I saw" and "my accompanying angel"

Here is one of her "visions". Are you able to find any error in her account of the plan of salvation?

"Sorrow filled heaven, as it was realized that man was lost ... I saw the lovely Jesus and beheld an expression of sympathy and sorrow upon His countenance. Soon I saw Him approach the exceeding bright light which enshrouded His Father. Said my accompanying angel, He is in close converse with the Father.... Three times He was shut in by the glorious light about the Father, and the third time He came from the Father, His person could be seen.... He then made known to the angelic host that a way of escape had been made for lost man. He told them that He had been pleading with His Father, and had offered to give His life a ransom, to take the sentence of death upon Himself ... Jesus bade the heavenly host be reconciled to the plan that His Father had accepted..." Early Writings, pp. 149-151.

 

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