Vambram said:

Americans shatter fundraising records after Charlie Kirk's tragic death at university event

Americans have donated millions to online fundraisers on GoFundMe and GiveSendGo for Charlie Kirk's family following the conservative activist's assassination at Utah Valley University.

www.foxbusiness.com

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MAGAdonians sure do love handing over their cash to millionaires, don’t they?

Lippy the Lion and Hardee Har Har

essentialsaltes said:

Russia Follows Up Drone Attack on Poland by Threatening to Destroy Finland​

In a social media post from the Russian Ministry of Foreign Affairs, Medvedev issued a stark warning to Finland about “building a new ‘Mannerheim Line'” — referring to the Finnish defensive fortification built against the Soviet Union in WWII — saying that “confrontation with Russia can lead to the collapse of Finnish statehood — this time forever.”

“Unlike in 1944, no one will go soft on them this time,” Medvedev added. “As the saying goes, ‘sitä saa, mitä tilaa’ – you get
what you ask for.”

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Great. We were planning to go to Finland next March. Will we need a Finnish visa or a Russian one...

Abraxos said:

They are not adorned for glory like the white horse rider

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Remember, this is symbolism. You don't apply the same idea. While I see your point, the rules of symbolism conflict with it. While sackcloth is an outward appearance of an inner struggle, these 2 witnesses would have to be two overcomers in general (if you set aside the white rider for a moment) because we know that crowns are given to overcomers (Church of Philadelphia as an example). God wouldn't use people who haven't overcome or won't eventually overcome, because technically that would mean they wouldn't be his. You wouldn't have 2 unsaved people running around speaking for the Lord. So the symbolic reference of the rider being adorned for glory, would be their heavenly symbolic reference, while the sackcloth and ashes are earthly.

Abraxos said:

The two witnesses appear much later, at a time when the Antichrist is about to emerge onto the world stage.

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Here is where we differ. I do not think Revelation is in chronological order. It seems to be in order by topic, rather than timeline. Those chapters like the 144,000 and the 2 witnesses are like inserts. Imagine John trying to write everything he sees that happens simultaneously, that would be really hard to do. So he writes about something, pauses, writes about another topic, and then continues in the timeline. To give you an example, the information about the beast which is the anti-christ isnt until chapter 13 which is after trumpet 7. Then you have the bowls, then you have the beast mentioned again, with mystery babylon and then the discussion about her fall but its bowl 7 that comes her judgement when she is given his full wrath. So it's like, Timeline- pause- timeline -pause -pause-backtrack to reference when the downfall occurred 3 chapters previous (so he could add information that was happening simultaneously for reference, if that makes sense). This is why I look at the information presented instead of where the literal chapters are listed. So I place them at the start, dying in the middle with an overlap of the antichrist in full authority where he then goes after and kills the church (based from Daniel).

Abraxos said:

both Elijah and Moses.

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I'm curious why you expect a Moses mantel? His mantel doesn't fit in a scenario where you have two people who are judging both the church and the lost (hence the plagues IE: Judgements). While the abilities performed are reminiscent of Moses, actually a lot of what happened in Exodus was performed by Aaron. Water into blood, frogs, gnats and it was specifically Aarons staff that was turned into a snake as well as they both were involved in doing the boils plague.

But even if Revelation played out in stages like you presume, you still have the issue of the 1260 day run time for both prophets. They would have to start on the same day in order to die on the same day. Since God has a propensity for sending people out in 2's, that keeps with his nature. So the rider still can't be in reference to only 1 witness.

rambot said:

Really?
I had he had signed deals with Japan and the UK (was it?)

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No. Both were just sort of "we agree on what we'd like to do" papers, but not actual deals. The UK one also specifically in the text itself says that this is not a deal nor binding towards anything in any way.

HARK! said:

There were several important points of contention;

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Really? From here: Bondi Reveals ‘Disturbing Facts’ About Dem Darling Kilmar Abrego Garcia’s Human Trafficking Scheme

“On May 21st, a grand jury in the Middle District of Tennessee returned a sealed indictment, charging Abrego Garcia with alien smuggling and conspiracy to commit alien smuggling,” Bondi said. “Our government presented El Salvador with an arrest warrant, and they agreed to return him to our country. We’re grateful to President Bukele for agreeing to return him to our country to face these very serious charges.”

Now, Bondi says, there is no longer any doubt that Abrego Garcia was a criminal.'

Did she lie? If she didn't then you are now letting him off all of those charges. And you consider this justice. As Garcia himself might say 'Que risa!'

The Liturgist said:

Theology literally means “Knowledge of God”, which our Lord, God and Savior Jesus Christ certainly did teach, as did his Apostles, particularly St. John the Beloved Disciple, who in my church we venerate as the Theologian (indeed we regard there as having been only three worthy of being venerated as theologians, the others being St. Gregory Nazianzus and St. Symeon the New).

The Orthodox also believe an infant and a mentally disabled person can acquire Theology proper.

What people often conflate with theology is the study of theology, which in English was historically called Divinity, which is still the formal name for academic studies leading to ministry - the typical professional degree of a clergyman is a Masters of Divinity, some getting a Doctorate of Divinity, and the traditional word for a scholar of theologian is a “Divine”, which does not mean they are a god, but rather that they focus their lives on the study of God’s teachings.

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I thought it literally meant the " study of God" which in context, Jesus Christ of Nazareth did not study God because He is God. This is why there are so many theological views. People are perpetually studying and adding to His Gospel.
Thanks for sharing!

Vambram said:

I have posted many facts in many different threads. It ain't my fault that you don't believe those facts.

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See nothing here

Hans Blaster said:

At its heart, this whole "vases made by machines" denies the actual skilled work of talented artisans working with methods that developed over centuries. Instead they substitute machines that did not exist and invent motives for production.

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Okay: I took a deep breath and checked this thread again, and saw this. What immediately came to mind are three machines that we might not even regard as such, but can be pretty simple: Drills, potter's wheels, and lathes.

The simplest drill is a point on a shaft. You can twist it or roll it between your hands. A step up is a point on a shaft with a thong wrapped around the shaft and attached to a bow. Use something to press down on the end of the shaft to hold it in place and move the bow back and forth. Need a high speed drill? Put a balance weight on the shaft. attach a couple of thongs to the shaft and connect the ends to a short bow. Press the bow down, being careful to allow momentum to wrap it back on the shaft, and you get bursts of high speed. Cultures have used all three not only to bore holes but to make fire.

Need a potter's wheel? Mount a flywheel onto a shaft; place it where it can rotate with the shaft vertical; run the shaft through a hole in a mount to keep the thing upright; put a small wheel ion the top, and presto! A potter's wheel. Plop something down in the center, get the speed up on the flywheel by spinning it with your feet, and form clay or grind to your heart's content.

Want a lathe? The simplest is what one traveling repairman in the 19th Century used. He needed to make a spindle, so he put two mounts into the ground, secured a length of wood between them, wrapped a thong around it; and had a helper pull it back and forth while he applied a chisel. What something better? Make a raised wooden mount, attach a length of wood between it; mount a spring pole above it; put a foot pedal under it; attach a thong to the spring pole, wrap around the length of wood, attach to the pedal, and pump the pedal to rotate the wood back and forth while you apply the chisel. What something fancier? Build a vertical flywheel, attach to a point to rotate the length of wood; make a rig like for a grind stone; pump the pedal to get up speed, then apply the chisel without worrying about back and forth motion.

Basically, if you can get a piece of wood or a block of stone rotating, you can do all sorts of things with it. Stone needs nothing more than grit and patience. Want an elliptical shape? Make a simple rig to turn rotary motion into reciprocal motion, attach the grinding pad to it, and turn away.

All machines and all simple, and all would have been known to the Egyptians.

Krypto the Superdog

A New Dawn said:

State and local governments ARE governments. That’s why they are called governments. And they violated our rights as Christians, to which you even agreed was illegal a few posts back. So which is it?

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Okay then the government fixed your problems. Thanks Joe.

A New Dawn said:

Spewing leftist talking points makes him a leftest, no matter what he does, or doesn’t, call himself.

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What leftist talking points?

DaisyDay said:

He did.

He gave you the basis.

And a representational democracy, John Birch Society's argument not withstanding.

No one has even tried. Are you deliberately fudging the difference between simple redistricting, which is mandated under some circumstances, and gerrymandering? Because that's how it appears.

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Thanks for the backup.

As per usual - when MAGA logical inconsistencies are confronted with their own hypocrisy, and real world data, they just ... disappear!

What's a good emoji for "Whoosh - outtahere!"

Yarddog said:

You haven't shown me instances where the government violated our rights.

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State and local governments ARE governments. That’s why they are called governments. And they violated our rights as Christians, to which you even agreed was illegal a few posts back. So which is it?

Yarddog said:

Name those that turned out to be Democrats. Trump's shooter was a Republican. The guy in Florida was a Republican.

Not liking Kirk doesn't make one a leftist.

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Spewing leftist talking points makes him a leftest, no matter what he does, or doesn’t, call himself.

Oompa Loompa said:

I believe you are mistaking a post from Harry Sisson which he lated pulled down about him dressing up as Trump for Halloween. But it was actually him dressing is a costume that made him mockingly look like he was riding on top of Donald Trump. Lies travel across the globe before the truth puts on its shoes.

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I think maybe you meant to quote the other guy.

o_mlly said:

We would expect mathematicians and experimental scientists to be able to resolve whatever disagreements confront them. We would think that concluding those differences to be irresolvable as scandalous and intolerable. We also think that they are morally obligated to sustain their efforts to settle their disputes until they finally succeed in doing so.

However, if those scientists determine that the constraints imposed by the scientific method make resolution in there realm impossible then they must accept the conclusions offered by other realms of inquiry.

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Very true. Bearing in mind that mathematicians can use proof as opposed to experimental scientists who can't. But if you have 98 scientists agree that in their opinion, the evidence points to one conclusion and 2 that say it points to an opposite conclusion, then which one are you going to go with?

This goes back to the flat earther in that I could prove to her satisfaction that a couple of claims that she made were wrong. So she ignored those and headed off in another direction.

Chesterton said:

My sources are telling me he once ate a sandwich from Chick-fil-A. A Chick-fil-A secretly owned by Israelis.

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I believe you are mistaking a post from Harry Sisson which he later pulled down about him dressing up as Trump for Halloween. But it was actually him dressing is a costume that made him mockingly look like he was riding on top of Donald Trump. Lies travel across the globe before the truth puts on its shoes.

2PhiloVoid said:

I agree with you that it is possible your flat-earther may have been dishonest, but I think the social-psychological dynamics that Tali Shalot mentions in the following video (5 minutes) unfortunately have to be considered in the evaluation of our harboring expectations of another person's epistemic culpability here:

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So, my earlier affirmation about the psychological presence of "locus of trust" plays a part in the extent/degree to which any one person is willing to adapt and/or adopt new information into his existing view of the world, even if that new information is in essence updated and completely accurate. Sometimes the locus of trust catalyzes a delusional state in a person; sometimes, though, that same relation with a trusted source simply causes a person to be hesitant to accept outside information, even though he or she intuits or understands that it is 'technically' correct.

Some of what I'm saying here should be already familiar to both of us since we both read (and trust) respective sources on neuro-science and psychology, or even evolutionary psychology. It also plays into how you prefer to listen to someone like Robert Sapolsky but I prefer to listen to someone like Malcolm A. Jeeves.

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I agree with the points made in the video. Interestingly, at the the very end, she points out the concept of common ground which was mentioned upstream. In the case of vaccines and autism, don't argue that the one doesn't cause the other as you'll just end up throwing stats at each other. Just show a mother a picture of a kid with a severe case of measles and say that we both don't want this to happen to her child.

rambot said:

You've given up trying to justify anything you say with facts relevant to your argument but your fall back is "democrats are awful"

If your point was valid there would be more behind it than JUST kvetching about the other guy

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I have posted many facts in many different threads. It ain't my fault that you don't believe those facts.

Someone help me out there:

It's radiometric dating. I get that. Uranium decays at a known rate, producing thorium, and thorium producing radium, and so forth until you get to the stable element lead. Different isotopes of uranium produce different isotopes of lead. I get that. Looking at the ratio of a particular isotope of uranium with a particular isotope of lead and applying the rate of decay gives how long it's been since the uranium started to decay. I get that.

What I don't understand is how pre-existing lead is ruled out of the equation. Is lead stable but some lead is more stable than others? It's still lead but becomes a different isotope of lead? If that's the case, is there a ceiling to the time range uranium-lead dating can be uses, sort of like there's a floor to carbon dating? What I'm getting at is if a the isotope of lead they compare to an isotope of uranium would have already decayed into a different isotope of lead by the time someone measures the ratios.

Side question: Am I right in assuming that the uranium came from fossilization minerals and not from the animal? Thinking of how strontium 90 ends up in bones, but that isn't what's happening with uranium-lead dating.

Vambram said:

The praying and moments of silence was not weaponized at all. Democrats in Congress are stupid in suggesting that it wawas.

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You've given up trying to justify anything you say with facts relevant to your argument but your fall back is "democrats are awful"

If your point was valid there would be more behind it than JUST kvetching about the other guy