Why worry about the Ten Commandments, if you are disregarding the Sabbath?

[Jesus Is Real]

Connie, you told Windmill that she has been deceived because she believes in keeping the 7th day Sabbath holy.

This indicates to me that you believe that the 7th day Sabbath has been done away with.

Also, you stated that the Sabbath day is a rest from sin, thus being a spiritual facet of the Christian faith.

This indicates that you don't believe that it is literal, thus being a designated time/day by God's command in which we are still required to worship God.

But according to Isa. 66:23 The sabbath day hasn't or ever will be done away with.

So then, according to the Bible:

1. The Sabbath rest is designated to a literal day
2. It hasn't been done away with
3. It never will be done away with

Now, since the Bible speaks of the Sabbath day as existing in the new Jerusalem, it is up to you at this point to prove from the Bible that it isn't the 7th day, but some other day instead.

But then you face the problem of proving that it isn't the 7th day when the Bible designates it as such, and does not clearly state that it is any other day but that one..

Regarding Red Bold above:

woobadooba,

No I didn't. Re-Read my post to her again. *chuckles~*
I never told her this,....you'll see.
Your jumping to conclusions.......I know we can all do this from time to time.

Our conversation started here: http://www.christianforums.com/showpost.php?p=23277769&postcount=887
Then she answered: http://www.christianforums.com/showpost.php?p=23277898&postcount=888
Then I answered that post of her in saying:http://www.christianforums.com/showpost.php?p=23278636&postcount=893

I never said she was deceived regarding 'SABBATH' - *chuckles*

Connie

 

[woobadooba]

Regarding Red Bold above:

No I didn't. Re-Read my post to her again. *chuckles~*
I never told her this,....you'll see.
Your jumping to conclusions.......I know we can all do this from time to time.

Our conversation started here: http://www.christianforums.com/showpost.php?p=23277769&postcount=887
Then she answered: http://www.christianforums.com/showpost.php?p=23277898&postcount=888

Connie

Connie, let's just make this simple. Do you believe that I am wrong for stating that the 7th day Sabbath is still binding to the Christian?

 

[Jesus Is Real]

Connie, let's just make this simple. Do you believe that I am wrong for stating that the 7th day Sabbath is still binding to the Christian?

Restore me.

I have NOT ever come in here to change the Day you Worship God for any of the reasons many has marked out.

Restore me first in this. I pray you. For you have sat here in Judgment of me for things I have not said.

 

[woobadooba]

Restore me.

I have NOT ever come in here to change the Day you Worship God for any of the reasons many has marked out.

Restore me first in this. I pray you.

So then you agree that the 7th day Sabbath is still binding to the Christian?

 

[Jesus Is Real]

So then you agree that the 7th day Sabbath is still binding to the Christian?

Restore me please.
You will be fulling the Whole Law if you do!
For it's an act of "The perfect Love of God"!

If we don't restore a wrong we shall surely die.
If we do,....we shall surely live.

 

[woobadooba]

Restore me please.
You will be fulling the Whole Law if you do!
For it's an act of "The perfect Love of God"!

Connie, I am not angry with you. I just want to know if you believe me to be wrong for saying that the 7th day Sabbath is still binding to the Christian. That's all.

 

[rstrats]

ThreeAM,

re: "The firstfruits Nisan 16th which is the TYPE of the resurrection..."

Are you saying that the moment of resurrection fulfilled the type/antitype of Firstfruits and not when the Messiah presented himself (the wave sheave) to the Father?

 

[rstrats]

Windmill,

re: "I never said that."

Sorry. When you said that Paul was telling the Jewish Christians to stop criticizing the gentiles for not keeping the annual Sabbaths, I thought that you were saying that the issue in Romans chapter 14 had to do with the Jewish Christians criticizing the gentiles for not keeping the annual Sabbaths.

re: "Okay... examples... sure...Leviticus 23:24...Leviticus 23:27-32..."

So you’re saying that the Feast of Trumpets and the Day of Atonement are not annual Sabbaths?

 

[applepowerpc]

Shabbat Shalom.

 

[woobadooba]

Shabbat Shalom.

Thank you.

 

[jochanaan]

Hello, Connie, and welcome to the discussion!

I would like to say just a couple of things. One comment of your seems to indicate that you think the Sabbath is a Seventh-day Adventist doctrine. Well, it is--but not just SDA. I am a Seventh Day Baptist, and we also rest and worship on the seventh-day Sabbath that most people call Saturday. We do this not to gain any credit for our own righteousness ("filthy rags" indeed!), but rather in loving submission to the many times the Bible says to keep the seventh day holy. And since we're setting aside one day in seven, why not the one that many, not just Jews, affirm is the Biblical Sabbath?

Yes, the Sabbath is a foreshadowing of the eternal rest, just as marriage is a foreshadowing of the union we, as the Bride of Christ, will have with our Lord and Lamb, Jesus of Nazareth. Should we then fail to honor literal marriage or the actual seventh day? Rather, I keep the Sabbath in joyful anticipation of a full rest in Heaven. Again, not to make myself righteous--I can never make myself righteous enough!--but with love, joy, peace, and the rest of the Spirit's fruit. (Galatians 5:22-23)

Again, welcome, and I look forward to exchanging more ideas with you.

 

[Child_of_Yahweh]

Hello, Connie, and welcome to the discussion!

I would like to say just a couple of things. One comment of your seems to indicate that you think the Sabbath is a Seventh-day Adventist doctrine. Well, it is--but not just SDA. I am a Seventh Day Baptist, and we also rest and worship on the seventh-day Sabbath that most people call Saturday. We do this not to gain any credit for our own righteousness ("filthy rags" indeed!), but rather in loving submission to the many times the Bible says to keep the seventh day holy. And since we're setting aside one day in seven, why not the one that many, not just Jews, affirm is the Biblical Sabbath?

Yes, the Sabbath is a foreshadowing of the eternal rest, just as marriage is a foreshadowing of the union we, as the Bride of Christ, will have with our Lord and Lamb, Jesus of Nazareth. Should we then fail to honor literal marriage or the actual seventh day? Rather, I keep the Sabbath in joyful anticipation of a full rest in Heaven. Again, not to make myself righteous--I can never make myself righteous enough!--but with love, joy, peace, and the rest of the Spirit's fruit. (Galatians 5:22-23)

Again, welcome, and I look forward to exchanging more ideas with you.

Hey! Not sure which comment you mean but I don't believe that keeping the Sabbath is "just" a Seventh Day Advenist doctrine, but some of my family members refer to me as such, although I'm not. I, nor does my husband, claim to be of any particular "denomination" so to speak, but only read the Holy Bible and try our best to abide by it. Hope this helps in your confusion about my previous post, whichever one you were referring to.

 

[ThreeAM]

ThreeAM,

re: "The firstfruits Nisan 16th which is the TYPE of the resurrection..."

Are you saying that the moment of resurrection fulfilled the type/antitype of Firstfruits and not when the Messiah presented himself (the wave sheave) to the Father?

He apparently did see His Father on the 1st day of the week but not before he spoke to Mary. I believe the wave sheaf was Harvested first then presented to God so both things were likely needed to fulfill firstfruits.

The wave sheaf was the first of the harvest and was the highest quality that the harvest produced. The wave sheaf represented the resurrection and Christ was the first in quality of those resurrected. Nisan 16th was the TYPE of the resurrection and God did not make Firstfruits a Holy Convocation. See Lev. 23 It was not a day of rest in fact it was a day of work because the barley harvest always began on that day.

That would seem to indicate that the resurrection did not make Sunday a Holy day.

 

[woobadooba]

Hey! Not sure which comment you mean but I don't believe that keeping the Sabbath is "just" a Seventh Day Advenist doctrine, but some of my family members refer to me as such, although I'm not. I, nor does my husband, claim to be of any particular "denomination" so to speak, but only read the Holy Bible and try our best to abide by it. Hope this helps in your confusion about my previous post, whichever one you were referring to.

Actually, he was referring to another Connie. See post #927

 

[BrightCandle]

BrightCandle,

I do forgive you (Job a righteous man/person) - I forgive you because this is the Whole of the Law and this is how I'm not doing my own work but speaking and doing his Law, by forgiving you even before you asked me too for His Law is written in my heart to do His Good Pleasure,...everyday not just a certain day,...for me Sabbath and all what that means is EVERYDAY - I'm in His Rest. By the Grace of God I can say and do as much as lies within me.

The tone was what you saw in yourself.......not in me. In other words,...you are looking through your own eyes not mine. You were judging me for what's inside of you,....not in me. Please keep this in mind. For this is where you must do Warfare upon your own Heart-Land. God can lead you if you will keep following Him as you always have.

Actually you weren't judging me you were Judging Christ' servant and how He has created me to be "In Him." Judge Righteously, please.

Jesus said to hang all that Law and the Prophet on this word? What was that Word?

Peace,
Connie

sorry updated:

Connie:

I wasn't judging your relationship with God, I was simply making an observation regarding your posts, which are very difficult to decifer.

How do you presume, what was going inside of myself? Only God knows that. Don't try to play God. All we can do is respond to what you have written in your posts. Jesus' commands are not hard to understand, but when we try to spiritualize them away to suit our own preferences, that is when the clear words of the Bible give us light as to what is truth and what is error. That is why I posted the long list of Scriptures backing up the literal 7th day Sabbath that we are commanded by Jesus to keep. Resting in Jesus everday doesn't release us from keeping the literal 7th day Sabbath. The texts that you posted, with no exegisis, are referring to the ceremonial sabbaths, not the Sabbath of the 4th commandment of the 10 Commandments.

 

[jochanaan]

Actually, he was referring to another Connie. See post #927

Yes, I was. But welcome to you too, Connie, Child of Yahweh! So good to see another Sabbathkeeper on these threads.

Do you keep the Sabbath independently, or as part of a local fellowship or Bible study?

 

[BrightCandle]

Hey! Not sure which comment you mean but I don't believe that keeping the Sabbath is "just" a Seventh Day Advenist doctrine, but some of my family members refer to me as such, although I'm not. I, nor does my husband, claim to be of any particular "denomination" so to speak, but only read the Holy Bible and try our best to abide by it. Hope this helps in your confusion about my previous post, whichever one you were referring to.

Just curious, how did you come to keep Sabbath over Sunday?

 

[BrightCandle]

Check out this article from the founder of the Ten Commandments Day organization, who is an orthodox Jew. There seems to be a new alliance forming between the Jews and Evangelicals to promote the Ten Commandments, here in the USA. The question is while both groups profess to honor and obey the Ten Commandments, will the Evangelicals promote the 7th day Sabbath that the Jews keep, and will the Jews promote the Sunday sabbath that the Evangelicals keep?

The Church in America: Israel’s Friend and Ally

By Ron Wexler

Is the Church in America solidly behind Israel ? A recent meeting of Christian leaders offers great hope.

On February 7th and 8th some of the nation's most influential Evangelical ministries and leaders gathered in San Antonio, Texas to pledge their support and solidarity to the nation and the people of Israel. Under the leadership of the Rev. John Hagee the group formed a new organization called Christians United for Israel (CUFI).

During this historic convocation those assembled heard a message that has gone largely unnoticed in many sectors of the Christian realm – and that is even contrary to the dogmas and doctrines being taught in many of America 's churches today. The message was that the Church must help and support Israel and the Jewish people – and that CUFI was formed for that purpose only. They were told that personal agendas would not be a part of this special effort, and that even such goals as pro-life and missions efforts – including and specially those focused on converting the Jews to the Christian faith – would have no place in CUFI.

Under the looming threat of a major catastrophe that Israel and the world is facing from countries like Iran and Islamic terrorist groups, this historic meeting provided a unifying force for Christians desiring to take a bold stand for the nation of Israel.

Hagee emphasized that such an organization as CUFI is needed to make a clear distinction between those Christians who are obeying the biblical mandate to support the nation of Israel , and those in the church who are clearly not its allies. In his recent best seller Jerusalem Countdown , Hagee writes that it is crucial to “bring to the forefront the uglier side of Christianity, the evil of anti-Semitism…. We need to do this so we can rid ourselves of its hold once and for all -- not just for the sake of the Jews, but also for our own sakes. Unless we repent of this devastating, sinful attitude, we cannot expect the blessing of God to flow through our lives.”

Hagee warns that hatred or denigration of Israel is not an option for Christians. “For centuries the Jews have been beaten, murdered, robbed, and raped while fanatics scream ‘Christ killers,'” he says.

As a people the Jews had nothing to do with the political conspiracy against Jesus Christ. The high priest Caiaphas was appointed by Herod to do the will of Rome . He was an illegitimate priest who was not selected by the Jewish people to do there will. Into this political setting came Jesus Christ.

The popularity of Jesus spread like lightening. He was a very serious political threat to Herod and his high priest Caiaphas, so they entered into a politically inspired plot to kill Jesus. The high priest and his circle of conspirators had no mandate from the Jewish people. They certainly did not represent the Jews living in Israel at the time, much less all the other Jews who were scattered over the Roman Empire . This religious group was a miniscule handful led by the high priests to do Rome 's dirty job.

The gathering in San Antonio was truly unique. Attendees were given an eye-opening historical overview of how the historical Church actually motivated a hatred for the Jewish people. They were confronted with the unspeakable atrocities and brutalities of the Crusaders -- who were themselves motivated by the Catholic Church to liberate Jerusalem . These were the “heroes” of the Church that left behind rivers of Jewish blood and the total destruction of complete communities.

They heard about the bloody Dark Ages and the Spanish Inquisition – a period when hundreds of thousand of Jews were tortured and murdered. They were reminded of the Church's involvement in the expulsion of complete communities from England , France , and Germany . And they were confronted with Hitler's terrible revelation that his foundation of hatred for the Jewish people came from the writings of Martin Luther.

“Millions of Jews since the time of Christ found there terrible deaths in the name of our Lord Jesus Christ,” notes Hagee. “For Judaism, Christianity is not better that the electric chair, and therefore their suspicions of our motives now are clear and understandable.”

Not surprising, a report on the San Antonio gathering in the February 23 rd issue of the Israeli daily Ha'aretz drew mixed emotions from Jewish readers in Israel and abroad.

Not everyone in the Church shares Hagee's views, of course. The concept of “Replacement Theology” -- that the Church has completely replaced the nation of Israel in the heart of God -- is popular in many of America 's churches. Such a notion is completely unscriptural – and is a dangerous tenet for the Church to embrace, says Hagee.

Hagee warns that replacement theology is like a cancer in the Church, and points to the Apostle Paul's reminder to his Gentile readers that the Jewish people “are beloved for the sake of the fathers” -- meaning Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.

“God's word is very clear,” declares Hagee. “There will be great consequences for the nation or nations that attempt to divide up the land of Israel . God's love for Israel is expressed in the words of Zechariah: ‘He who touches you ( Israel ) touches the apple of his eye' (Zech 2:8).”

Christians are called to support the nation of Israel because it brings the blessings of God to them personally. “I will bless all who bless you and curse all who will curse you” was God's promise to Abraham (Gen. 12) and is the guideline and blue print for those who gathered in San Antonio .

Pastor John Hagee concluded the gathering of Christians United for Israel with a quotation from Psalms 122:6, in which King David commands all Christians to “pray for the peace of Jerusalem: may they prosper who love you.”

I am proud to be a Jew and I was proud to have been in San Antonio on February 7th and 8th of 2006.

Ron Wexler, an Orthodox Jew, is founder and president of the Ten Commandments Commission,

 

[Child_of_Yahweh]

Just curious, how did you come to keep Sabbath over Sunday?

The Holy Bible clearly states OVER and OVER again to keep THE Seventh Day of the week as the Sabbath which is also included as the 4th of the Ten Commandments that Yahweh said to keep FOREVER.


For some reason many Christians assume that becuase Yahshua arose on Sunday (in my opinion somewhere between late Sautrday night and early Sunday morning) that the Sabbath was then "changed" to "The Lord's Day" (Sunday).


There is no evidence of this in the bible, for Yahweh santified THE Sabbath day before Yahshua was ever even concived and made it for MAN. He commanded to keep it FORVER....NOT to change it to the day that Yahshua arose.

So how did YOU come to belive it ?

 

[Oblio]

Check out this article from the founder of the Ten Commandments Day organization, who is an orthodox Jew

We should put stock in writings by those who are enemies of our Lord ?