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Which Abominations are OK?

Saint JOHN

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PS..how to get saved..

Ac 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

repent..babies cant
baptism .. full immersion..
ask GOD (not men) for holy Spirit ..and do it right and God responds (in your face real !!)
and the residual is signs .. see above..and read acts !!
 
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HARK!

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I’m not an Israelite, so I’ll eat shrimp.

Are you suggesting that what YHWH considers an abomination, doesn't apply to anyone but Israel?

On a side note, I would argue that all who are in Messiah are Israel.
 
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HARK!

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Wrong as usual. Commentary is when a present day scholar gives his unsupported opinion of what the scriptures "really say."
Quoting Origen, Gregory Thaumaturgus and other ECF is not commentary, it is the historical record of the faith and practice of the early church.

Historically Origen's unsupported opinions have been quite controversial.
 
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HARK!

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It depends. You mentioned homosexuality in the OP. Is that mentioned in the NT? Why, yes it is.

Homosexuality is a sin because it goes against God’s purpose for marriage. Eating shrimp was a sin for Israel because God wanted a separate people.

This thread is about abominations, not necessarily about sin.

I'm sure that YHWH presented a distinction for a good reason. One of the posters in this thread pointed out that the KJV translates several different words as "abomination." I look forward to what this telling clue reveals.
 
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Hammster

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Are you suggesting that what YHWH considers an abomination. doesn't apply to anyone but Israel?

On a side note, I would argue that all who are in Messiah are Israel.
I say that He did for Israel.
 
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HARK!

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Not being Jewish, I'll enjoy my bacon-wrapped scallops. But I'm told they're unhealthy.

Are you suggesting that abominations only apply to Jews?

By the way, the ambiguous word "Jew" wasn't created until about 400 years ago.
 
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HARK!

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In order to know what is and isn't sin or abomination according to God, we must consult the New Testament scriptures.

The word abomination doesn't appear in the NT scriptures.
 
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Der Alte

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Historically Origen's unsupported opinions have been quite controversial.
I didn't just quote Origen I also quoted Gregory Thaumaturgus. Origen is the poster boy ECF for UR.
 
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HARK!

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So is wearing mixed fabrics or cutting your hair, according to Leviticus. But we are not subject to levitical law.

Are you suggesting that all of the abominations listed in Leviticus are OK?
 
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HARK!

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I say that He did for Israel.

YHWH destroyed Sodom before Israel was born. When did homosexuality become an abomination? Did it cease to be an abomination; or is it still an abomination today, for Israel only?
 
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I’m not an Israelite. I’m sure.

This verse says that the gentiles who sojourn with Israel can't commit abominations either:

Leviticus 18:26
Ye shall therefore keep my statutes and my judgments, and shall not commit any of these abominations; neither any of your own nation, nor any stranger that sojourneth among you:
 
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Semper-Fi

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Eat whatever is sold in the SHAMBLES (whatever those are) unless it causes brethren/sistern to stumble.

Romans 14...

Him that is weak in the faith receive
ye, but not to doubtful disputations.

The first thing we see here is that this
chapter is about relating to a weak brother.

:2 For one believeth that he may eat all
things: another, who is weak, eateth herbs.

The subject here? Vegetarianism

:3 Let not him that eateth despise him that eateth not; and let not him which eateth not judge him that eateth: for God hath received him.

So, if you encounter one who is weak in the faith and believes he must eat vegetables only, don’t let this puff you up…

2Co 10:12 For we dare not make ourselves of the number, or compare ourselves with some that commend themselves: but they measuring themselves by themselves, and comparing themselves among themselves, are not wise.

What is the gold standard here?

1Pe 2:21 For even hereunto were ye called: because Christ also suffered for us, leaving us an example, that ye should follow his steps:

Eph 4:13 Till we all come in the unity of the faith, and of the knowledge of the Son of God, unto a perfect man, unto the measure of the stature of the fulness of Christ:

Rom 14:4 Who art thou that judgest another man's servant? to his own master he standeth or falleth. Yea, he shall be holden up: for God is able to make him stand.

Now to the meat and potatoes…

Rom 14:5 One man esteemeth one day above another: another esteemeth every day alike. Let every man be fully persuaded in his own mind.
Rom 14:6 He that regardeth the day, regardeth it unto the Lord; and he that regardeth not the day,
to the Lord he doth not regard it. He that eateth, eateth to the Lord, for he giveth God thanks;
and he that eateth not, to the Lord he eateth not, and giveth God thanks.

Why is eating and fasting (not eating)
connected to days here? Let’s see…

Luk 18:11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican. Luk 18:12 I fast twice in the week,
I give tithes of all that I possess.

From Bullingers Companion Bible…

Luke 18:12 twice in the week.
The law prescribed only one in the year
(Lev_16:29. Num_29:7).

By the time of Zec_8:19 there were four yearly fasts. In our Lord's day they were bi-weekly (Monday and Thursday), between Passover and Pentecost; and between the Feast of Tabernacles and the Dedication.

Yes they fasted two days a week, Monday and Thursday, EVERY MONDAY and EVERY THURSDAY.

Rom 14:7 For none of us liveth to himself, and no man dieth to himself. Rom 14:8 For whether we live, we live unto the Lord; and whether we die, we die unto the Lord: whether we live therefore, or die, we are the Lord's.

Rom 14:9 For to this end Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both
of the dead and living. Rom 14:10 But why dost thou judge thy brother? or why dost thou set at nought thy brother? for we shall all stand before the judgment seat of Christ.

Rom 14:11 For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God. :12 So then every one of us shall give account of himself to God.

Rom 14:13 Let us not therefore judge one another any more: but judge this rather,
that no man put a stumblingblock or an occasion to fall in his brother's way. Rom 14:14 I know, and am persuaded by the Lord Jesus, that there is nothing unclean of itself: but to him that esteemeth any thing to be unclean, to him it is unclean. Rom 14:15 But if thy brother be grieved with thy meat, now walkest thou not charitably.
Destroy not him with thy meat, for whom Christ died.

Now Paul shifts his attention to meat offered to idols. At the time, meat and drink were offered to pagan idols. After it was offered it was sold in a meat market called the ‘Shambles’.

1Co 10:25 Whatsoever is sold in the shambles, that eat, asking no question for conscience sake:

Shambles…
G3111
µa´?e????
makellon

Thayer Definition:
1) a place where meat and other articles of food are sold, meat market
Part of Speech: noun neuter
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number:
of Latin origin [macellum]
Citing in TDNT: 4:370, 549

There were those who were weak in the faith (verse 1) who were offended by this. They somehow thought that eating that food was somehow connecting them with the idolatrous practices around them. This is why the following is written…

Rom 14:16 Let not then your good be evil spoken of: Rom 14:17 For the kingdom of God is not meat and drink; but righteousness, and peace, and joy in the Holy Ghost.

Meat here is…

G1035
ß???s??
bro¯sis
bro'-sis
From the base of G977; (abstractly) eating (literally or figuratively); by extension (concretely) food (literally or figuratively): - eating, food, meat.

Notice it is food, not clean or unclean flesh.

G4213
p?´s??
posis
pos'-is
From the alternate of G4095; a drinking (the act), that is, (concretely) a draught: - drink.

Drinking, can be alcoholic or non-alcoholic beverages. Paul was dealing with ascetism and the belief that doing without was somehow a show of character.

He dealt with this issue at Colossae also…

Col 2:21 (Touch not; taste not; handle not;
22 Which all are to perish with the using
after the commandments and doctrines of men?
23 Which things have indeed a shew of wisdom
in will worship, and humility, and neglecting of
the body; not in any honour to the satisfying of
the flesh.

Rom 14:18 For he that in these things serveth
Christ is acceptable to God, and approved of men. :19 Let us therefore follow after the things which make for peace, and things wherewith one may edify another. :20 For meat destroy not the work of God. All things indeed are pure; but it is evil for that man who eateth with offence.

The word for meat here is broma, from Thayer’s…

G1033
ß???µa
bro¯ma
Thayer Definition:
1) that which is eaten, food
Part of Speech: noun neuter
A Related Word by Thayer’s/Strong’s Number: from the base of G977
Citing in TDNT: 1:642, 111

Again, we are dealing with food.

Rom 14:21 It is good neither to eat flesh, nor to drink wine, nor any thing whereby thy brother stumbleth, or is offended, or is made weak.

So, it is not dealing with clean and unclean, but with flesh (meat) and wine (drink) that makes a weak brother stumble.

Rom 14:22 Hast thou faith? have it to thyself before God. Happy is he that condemneth not himself in that thing which he alloweth. :23 And he that doubteth is damned if he eat, because he eateth not of faith: for whatsoever is not of faith is sin.

There is no passage in Rom 14 that deal
with the Sabbath or clean and unclean meats.

The subjects are vegetarianism, fasting
and food and drink offered to idols.
 
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Semper-Fi

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Leviticus 20

1And the Lord spake unto Moses, saying,..

23 And ye shall not walk in the manners of the nation, which I cast out before you: for they committed all these things, and therefore
I abhorred them.

Jesus Christ the same yesterday,
and to day, and for ever.
 
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Hammster

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YHWH destroyed Sodom before Israel was born. When did homosexuality become an abomination? Did it cease to be an abomination; or is it still an abomination today, for Israel only?
I addressed that already. But since you brought it up, did He destroy any cities for eating shrimp?
 
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Hammster

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This verse says that the gentiles who sojourn with Israel can't commit abominations either:

Leviticus 18:26
Ye shall therefore keep my statutes and my judgments, and shall not commit any of these abominations; neither any of your own nation, nor any stranger that sojourneth among you:
I’m not a Gentile sojourning with the Israelites, either.
 
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Tone

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I addressed that already. But since you brought it up, did He destroy any cities for eating shrimp?


There is this:

Isaiah 65:4
"3to a people who continually provoke Me to My face, sacrificing in the gardens and burning incense on altars of brick, 4sitting among the graves, spending nights in secret places, eating the meat of pigs and polluted broth from their bowls. 5They say, ‘Keep to yourself; do not come near me, for I am holier than you!’ Such people are smoke in My nostrils, a fire that burns all day long. 6Behold, it is written before Me: I will not keep silent, but I will repay; I will pay it back into their laps."

And the thought that Covid-19 may be the result of people messing (eating?) with unclean animals (bats).
 
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Hammster

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There is this:

Isaiah 65:4
"3to a people who continually provoke Me to My face, sacrificing in the gardens and burning incense on altars of brick, 4sitting among the graves, spending nights in secret places, eating the meat of pigs and polluted broth from their bowls. 5They say, ‘Keep to yourself; do not come near me, for I am holier than you!’ Such people are smoke in My nostrils, a fire that burns all day long. 6Behold, it is written before Me: I will not keep silent, but I will repay; I will pay it back into their laps."

And the thought that Covid-19 may be the result of people messing (eating?) unclean animals (bats).
That’s a non sequitur.
 
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