What think ye of Ezekiel's Temple?

[ralliann]

You continue to fail to understand that that had been what the Nation Israel had been expected to believe, which is why Peter preaches that had been the case in Acts 2 and 3; why Paul preaches that to Jews, throughout Acts; and why he mentions it in Romans 10, right in the middle of his explanation in Romans 9-11 of how Israel fell.

John 1:40 One of the two which heard John speak, and followed him, was Andrew, Simon Peter's brother. 1:41 He first findeth his own brother Simon, and saith unto him, We have found the Messias, which is, being interpreted, the Christ. 1:42 And he brought him to Jesus. And when Jesus beheld him, he said, Thou art Simon the son of Jona: thou shalt be called Cephas, which is by interpretation, A stone.

1:45 Philip findeth Nathanael, and saith unto him, We have found him, of whom Moses in the law, and the prophets, did write, Jesus of Nazareth, the son of Joseph.

1:47 Jesus saw Nathanael coming to him, and saith of him, Behold an Israelite indeed, in whom is no guile!

1:49 Nathanael answered and saith unto him, Rabbi, thou art the Son of God; thou art the King of Israel.

1:51 And he saith unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Hereafter ye shall see heaven open, and the angels of God ascending and descending upon the Son of man.

John 5:43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive. 5:44 How can ye believe, which receive honour one of another, and seek not the honour that cometh from God only? 5:45 Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust. 5:46 For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me. 5:47 But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words?

John 9:35 Jesus heard that they had cast him out; and when he had found him, he said unto him, Dost thou believe on the Son of God? 9:36 He answered and said, Who is he, Lord, that I might believe on him? 9:37 And Jesus said unto him, Thou hast both seen him, and it is he that talketh with thee. 9:38 And he said, Lord, I believe. And he worshipped him.

And so on - for those of that Nation who Believed He was Israel's Prophesied Christ were the church (assembly) He was building a new Nation of Physical, Believing sons of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob out of.

He said the following to THEM - that AFTER the majority of THEIR Nation had continued to refuse to believe that He was THEIR Prophesied Christ, and He began to focus more on those of that Nation who had believed that He was their Prophesied Christ...

Matthew 16:4 A wicked and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given unto it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas. And he left them, and departed.

16:13 When Jesus came into the coasts of Caesarea Philippi, he asked his disciples, saying, Whom do men say that I the Son of man am? 16:14 And they said, Some say that thou art John the Baptist: some, Elias; and others, Jeremias, or one of the prophets. 16:15 He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am? 16:16 And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God. 16:17 And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven. 16:18 And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it. 16:19 And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven. 16:20 Then charged he his disciples that they should tell no man that he was Jesus the Christ.

Later, we read of THAT "church" and ITS' Leadership over a New Nation of Believing, Physical sons of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob...

Matthew 19:27 Then answered Peter and said unto him, Behold, we have forsaken all, and followed thee; what shall we have therefore? 19:28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel. 19:29 And every one that hath forsaken houses, or brethren, or sisters, or father, or mother, or wife, or children, or lands, for my name's sake, shall receive an hundredfold, and shall inherit everlasting life. 19:30 But many that are first shall be last; and the last shall be first.

Get a clue, already.

Rom. 5:6-8.

Jesus came speaking just to Jews. My point in saying this is...You seem to be drawing continuity of thought between Christs ministry just to Jews, and Paul's Apostleship to the Gentiles.
Ac 11:19 Now they which were scattered abroad upon the persecution that arose about Stephen travelled as far as Phenice, and Cyprus, and Antioch, preaching the word to none but unto the Jews only.
They also thought it was Jew's only.

The entire Church was shocked that Gentiles had been called equally.
So quoting Jesus comments to the jew's to prove what? The Church is only Jew's?

 

[Danoh]

Jesus came speaking just to Jews. My point in saying this is...You seem to be drawing continuity of thought between Christs ministry just to Jews, and Paul's Apostleship to the Gentiles.
Ac 11:19 Now they which were scattered abroad upon the persecution that arose about Stephen travelled as far as Phenice, and Cyprus, and Antioch, preaching the word to none but unto the Jews only.
They also thought it was Jew's only.

The entire Church was shocked that Gentiles had been called equally.
So quoting Jesus comments to the jew's to prove what? The Church is only Jew's?

That is your misinterpretation of what I was saying.

To this very day, most Jews do not believe that Jesus had been their Prophesied Christ.

That has to be proven to them first, before presenting to them that Christ died for their sins.

For they are taught He had not been their Prophesied Christ.

You see examples of that in Acts 9; in Acts 13; in Acts 17; and so on.

In contrast, Gentiles were / are not raised believing He had not been anyone's Prophesied Christ.

Thus, it is a simple matter of preaching their sin condition to them, followed by the preaching that Christ died for their sins, Romans 5 and 6.

Rom. 5:6-8.

 

[BABerean2]

That is your misinterpretation of what I was saying.

To this very day, most Jews do not believe that Jesus had been their Prophesied Christ.

That has to be proven to them first, before presenting to them that Christ died for their sins.

For they are taught He had not been their Prophesied Christ.

You see examples of that in Acts 9; in Acts 13; in Acts 17; and so on.

In contrast, Gentiles were / are not raised believing He had not been anyone's Prophesied Christ.

Thus, it is a simple matter of preaching their sin condition to them, followed by the preaching that Christ died for their sins, Romans 5 and 6.

Rom. 5:6-8.

The "suffering servant" of Isaiah chapter 53, and the New Covenant promised to Israel and Judah in Jeremiah 31:31-34, and the timeline of Daniel chapter 9 prove that the baby born in a manger is the Messiah promised in the Hebrew scriptures of the Old Testament.


Forbidden Chapter in the Tanakh (Isaiah chapter 53) Jewish Evangelism

Modern Jew finds the promise of the New Covenant

Daniel Chapter 9: Dr. Kelly Varner

.

 

[Danoh]

Jesus came speaking just to Jews. My point in saying this is...You seem to be drawing continuity of thought between Christs ministry just to Jews, and Paul's Apostleship to the Gentiles.
Ac 11:19 Now they which were scattered abroad upon the persecution that arose about Stephen travelled as far as Phenice, and Cyprus, and Antioch, preaching the word to none but unto the Jews only.
They also thought it was Jew's only.

The entire Church was shocked that Gentiles had been called equally.
So quoting Jesus comments to the jew's to prove what? The Church is only Jew's?

That's just your reading into things.

You really should read all of Isaiah, with these kinds of questions in mind.

They were to have evangelized Israel first, and then a redeemed Israel would evangelize the Gentiles.

Some of which is summarized in Isaiah 2; Isaiah 60; and Isaiah 66.

And their evangelizing of Israel first, was to have continued into His return, see Matthew 10:23 and then Matthew 24:14, which was to have taken place after 10:23.

Here is an example of that in the following - verse 1 and verses 3-5 are after the Tribulation, which is followed by the Lord's return, both of which are mentioned in verse 2.

Isaiah 60:1 Arise, shine; for thy light is come, and the glory of the LORD is risen upon thee. 60:2 For, behold, the darkness shall cover the earth, and gross darkness the people: but the LORD shall arise upon thee, and his glory shall be seen upon thee. 60:3 And the Gentiles shall come to thy light, and kings to the brightness of thy rising. 60:4 Lift up thine eyes round about, and see: all they gather themselves together, they come to thee: thy sons shall come from far, and thy daughters shall be nursed at thy side. 60:5 Then thou shalt see, and flow together, and thine heart shall fear, and be enlarged; because the abundance of the sea shall be converted unto thee, the forces of the Gentiles shall come unto thee.

That is describing Gentile salvation through, with, and after Israel's rise to its Prophesied glory, first.

Here that is again...

Isaiah 2:1 The word that Isaiah the son of Amoz saw concerning Judah and Jerusalem. 2:2 And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the LORD's house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it. 2:3 And many people shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD, to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the LORD from Jerusalem. 2:4 And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people: and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more. 2:5 O house of Jacob, come ye, and let us walk in the light of the LORD.

In contrast to that, Romans 15 mentions that intent but does so in light of what Romans 11 has already said about its having been temporarily interrupted.

This why they were shocked.

Because this did not play out first...

Matthew 10:22 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved. 10:23 But when they persecute you in this city, flee ye into another: for verily I say unto you, Ye shall not have gone over the cities of Israel, till the Son of man be come.

Why?

God interrupted it. That was to have been after He poured out His wrath, which He interrupted.

What played out instead?

Romans 3:9 What then? are we better than they? No, in no wise: for we have before proved both Jews and Gentiles, that they are all under sin; 3:10 As it is written, There is none righteous, no, not one: 3:11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

3:21 But now the righteousness of God without the law is manifested, being witnessed by the law and the prophets;

Note the interruption...

Romans 11:25 For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fulness of the Gentiles be come in. 11:26 And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob: 11:27 For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.

We then see not only that they still matter within God's Prophesied purpose in, through, and for them, despite that interruption, but that because they nevertheless still matter during this interruption, God has included saving them during this age of a Gentile salvation...

11:28 As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes. 11:29 For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance. 11:30 For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief: 11:31 Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy. 11:32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all. 11:33 O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!

Towards His intent of a work among both absent of His other intent - the one he has temporarily interrupted.

The one that He would now be carrying out at some point after the fulness of this Gentile salvation first, be come in (which at the same time, does not leave the Jew out)...

Note...

Romans 9:22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: 9:23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory, 9:24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?

He was now doing that (and still is).

While having interrupted the other - this one here...

Romans 9:27 Esaias also crieth concerning Israel, Though the number of the children of Israel be as the sand of the sea, a remnant shall be saved: 9:28 For he will finish the work, and cut it short in righteousness: because a short work will the Lord make upon the earth.

This planned Mystery interruption of the Prophesied aspect of His plan and purpose threw them off, when He sent Peter to Gentiles not only way after Pentecost, before they had reached all of Israel.

Israel first, followed by Judah and the Israelite-Samaritans (Judah and said Israelite-Samaritans were His "other sheep not of" the fold that was then Israel; and were "scattered abroad").

That all the way into His return, then the Gentiles.

Isaiah 61:6 But ye shall be named the Priests of the LORD: men shall call you the Ministers of our God: ye shall eat the riches of the Gentiles, and in their glory shall ye boast yourselves.

Isaiah 61:9 And their seed shall be known among the Gentiles, and their offspring among the people: all that see them shall acknowledge them, that they are the seed which the LORD hath blessed.

Isaiah 62:2 And the Gentiles shall see thy righteousness, and all kings thy glory: and thou shalt be called by a new name, which the mouth of the LORD shall name.

Isaiah 66:19 And I will set a sign among them, and I will send those that escape of them unto the nations, to Tarshish, Pul, and Lud, that draw the bow, to Tubal, and Javan, to the isles afar off, that have not heard my fame, neither have seen my glory; and they shall declare my glory among the Gentiles.

That is why they were thrown off.

Acts 17:11, 12

 

[Danoh]

The "suffering servant" of Isaiah chapter 53, and the New Covenant promised to Israel and Judah in Jeremiah 31:31-34, and the timeline of Daniel chapter 9 prove that the baby born in a manger is the Messiah promised in the Hebrew scriptures of the Old Testament.


Forbidden Chapter in the Tanakh (Isaiah chapter 53) Jewish Evangelism

Modern Jew finds the promise of the New Covenant

Daniel Chapter 9: Dr. Kelly Varner

.

Let's try this once again - "That is YOUR misinterpretation of what I was saying.

To this very day, MOST Jews do not believe that Jesus had been their Prophesied Christ."

Rom. 5:6-8.

 

[BABerean2]

The one that He would now be carrying out at some point after the fulness of this Gentile salvation first, be come in (which at the same time, does not leave the Jew out)...

Based on the words of Christ below, the "times of the Gentiles" comes to an end at the Second Coming of Christ.


Luk 21:24 And they will fall by the edge of the sword, and be led away captive into all nations. And Jerusalem will be trampled by Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.
Luk 21:25 "And there will be signs in the sun, in the moon, and in the stars; and on the earth distress of nations, with perplexity, the sea and the waves roaring;
Luk 21:26 men's hearts failing them from fear and the expectation of those things which are coming on the earth, for the powers of the heavens will be shaken.
Luk 21:27 Then they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.
Luk 21:28 Now when these things begin to happen, look up and lift up your heads, because your redemption draws near."

.

 

[ralliann]

That's just your reading into things.

What is my read into things?
To Jews only?
That is what the text says.
The gospels are a testimony to Christ and his work. Which the prophets spoke of him. Why all the claims concerning the nation of Israel?

 

[Danoh]

Based on the words of Christ below, the "times of the Gentiles" comes to an end at the Second Coming of Christ.


Luk 21:24 And they will fall by the edge of the sword, and be led away captive into all nations. And Jerusalem will be trampled by Gentiles until the times of the Gentiles are fulfilled.
Luk 21:25 "And there will be signs in the sun, in the moon, and in the stars; and on the earth distress of nations, with perplexity, the sea and the waves roaring;
Luk 21:26 men's hearts failing them from fear and the expectation of those things which are coming on the earth, for the powers of the heavens will be shaken.
Luk 21:27 Then they will see the Son of Man coming in a cloud with power and great glory.
Luk 21:28 Now when these things begin to happen, look up and lift up your heads, because your redemption draws near."

.

Lol, you're amusing; you really are.

It is fascinating how consistently wrong you are - Luke 21's times of the Gentiles...fulfilled refers to end of Gentile Political Power; Israel the tail, no longer the head it once was and was meant to be, Politically, until the Lord returns, Daniel 2; Daniel 9; Daniel 11; Luke 1, etc.

In contrast, Romans 11's fulness of the Gentiles be come in refers to the end of this present Age's Gentile Spiritual Status before God (during this Mystery AGE of Grace), in contrast to Israel's Fallen Spiritual Status before God, Acts 7, in light of Matthew 12 and Luke 13; c.f. Acts 13; Acts 15; Roman 3; Romans 9-11, etc.

But you haven't a clue what I have just said - you're too busy reading your guessing at and endless errors and misrepresenations of your pet authors and youtube video pseudo-experts on Dispensationalism...into things.

Acts 17:11,12.

 

[Inkfingers]

It CANNOT be a real Temple of God as only the Body of Christ is that now.

So it is either symbolic or a future counterfeit temple built by a liar.

 

[ralliann]

Lol, you're amusing; you really are.

It is fascinating how consistently wrong you are - Luke 21's times of the Gentiles...fulfilled refers to end of Gentile Political Power; Israel the tail, Politically, no longer the head it once was and was meant to be, Politically, until the Lord returns, Daniel 2; Daniel 9; Daniel 11; Luke 1, etc.

In contrast, Romans 11's fulness of the Gentiles be come refers to the end of this present Age's Gentile Spiritual Status before God (during this Mystery AGE of Grace), in contrast to Israel's Fallen Spiritual Status before God, Acts 7, in light of Matthew 12 and Luke 13; c.f. Acts 13; Acts 15; Roman 3; Romans 9-11, etc.

But you haven't a clue what I have just said - you're too busy reading your guessing at and endless errors and misrepresenations of your pet authors and youtube video pseudo-experts on Dispensationalism...into things.

Acts 17:11,12.

Wow, how rude

 

[Danoh]

What is my read into things?
To Jews only?
That is what the text says.
The gospels are a testimony to Christ and his work. Which the prophets spoke of him. Why all the claims concerning the nation of Israel?

Until you read ALL of Isaiah, you are not going to properly understand why that turn to the Gentiles threw them off - for Israel was supposed to have been / is supposed to be redeemed FIRST.

Until you read all of Isaiah, round and round we will go with your reading what you think was going on into those things - absent of all that Isaiah had Prophesied as to the order of things.

Or as Isaiah put it...

Isaiah 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

Fact is that the interruption of those things was NOT Prophesied - it was a Mystery UNTIL GOD BEGAN TO unfold said interruption...

Acts 1:6 When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel? 1:7 And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.

So when then?

Acts 15:14 Simeon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name. 15:15 And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written, 15:16 After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up: 15:17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things. 15:18 Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.

See that, they simply decided not to question the change and delay, but to go along with God.

Hear, read some more...

Romans 9:19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will? 9:20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? 9:21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour? 9:22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: 9:23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory, 9:24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?

Some more...

2 Peter 3:1 This second epistle, beloved, I now write unto you; in both which I stir up your pure minds by way of remembrance: 3:2 That ye may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us the apostles of the Lord and Saviour: 3:3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts, 3:4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.

3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

3:15 And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; 3:16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.

Acts 17: 11, 12.

 

[Danoh]

Wow, how rude

You reading into things again. He has been
misrepresenting Dispensationalism on here for years now.

Just as he is ever mixing passages together that do not go together.

Rom. 5:6-8.

 

[ralliann]

Until you read ALL of Isaiah, you are not going to properly understand why that the Gentiles through them off because Israel was supposed to have / is supposed to be redeemed FIRST.

Until you read all of Isaiah, round and round we will go with your reading what you think was going on into those things - absent of all that Isaiah had Prophesied as to the order of things.

Or as Isaiah put it...

Isaiah 8:20 To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them.

Fact is that the interruption of those things was NOT Prophesied - it was a Mystery UNTIL GOD BEGAN TO unfold said interruption...

Acts 1:6 When they therefore were come together, they asked of him, saying, Lord, wilt thou at this time restore again the kingdom to Israel? 1:7 And he said unto them, It is not for you to know the times or the seasons, which the Father hath put in his own power.

So when then?

Acts 15:14 Simeon hath declared how God at the first did visit the Gentiles, to take out of them a people for his name. 15:15 And to this agree the words of the prophets; as it is written, 15:16 After this I will return, and will build again the tabernacle of David, which is fallen down; and I will build again the ruins thereof, and I will set it up: 15:17 That the residue of men might seek after the Lord, and all the Gentiles, upon whom my name is called, saith the Lord, who doeth all these things. 15:18 Known unto God are all his works from the beginning of the world.

See that, they simply decided not to question the change and delay, but to go along with God.

Hear, read some more...

Romans 9:19 Thou wilt say then unto me, Why doth he yet find fault? For who hath resisted his will? 9:20 Nay but, O man, who art thou that repliest against God? Shall the thing formed say to him that formed it, Why hast thou made me thus? 9:21 Hath not the potter power over the clay, of the same lump to make one vessel unto honour, and another unto dishonour? 9:22 What if God, willing to shew his wrath, and to make his power known, endured with much longsuffering the vessels of wrath fitted to destruction: 9:23 And that he might make known the riches of his glory on the vessels of mercy, which he had afore prepared unto glory, 9:24 Even us, whom he hath called, not of the Jews only, but also of the Gentiles?

Some more...

2 Peter 3:1 This second epistle, beloved, I now write unto you; in both which I stir up your pure minds by way of remembrance: 3:2 That ye may be mindful of the words which were spoken before by the holy prophets, and of the commandment of us the apostles of the Lord and Saviour: 3:3 Knowing this first, that there shall come in the last days scoffers, walking after their own lusts, 3:4 And saying, Where is the promise of his coming? for since the fathers fell asleep, all things continue as they were from the beginning of the creation.

3:9 The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. 3:10 But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night; in the which the heavens shall pass away with a great noise, and the elements shall melt with fervent heat, the earth also and the works that are therein shall be burned up.

3:15 And account that the longsuffering of our Lord is salvation; even as our beloved brother Paul also according to the wisdom given unto him hath written unto you; 3:16 As also in all his epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are some things hard to be understood, which they that are unlearned and unstable wrest, as they do also the other scriptures, unto their own destruction.

Acts 17: 11, 12.

1Pe 2:9 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light:
Mt 19:28 And Jesus said unto them, Verily I say unto you, That ye which have followed me, in the regeneration when the Son of man shall sit in the throne of his glory, ye also shall sit upon twelve thrones, judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
Lu 22:30 That ye may eat and drink at my table in my kingdom, and sit on thrones judging the twelve tribes of Israel.
These twelve were Jew's presiding over Israel.

 

[ralliann]

You reading into things again. He has been
misrepresenting Dispensationalism on here for years now.

Just as he is ever mixing passages together that do not go together.

Rom. 5:6-8.

I disagree with a lot of what you say. But, Your response to someone you disagree was over the top I think.

 

[parousia70]

The Temple does not deny the sacrifice of Jesus Christ. On the contrary, all sacrifices in the future Temple will point to the sacrifice of Jesus Christ, just as all the Old Testament sacrifices indicated the future sacrifice of Jesus Christ. But in the new Temple the order of sacrifice will be changed: there will be no more evening sacrifice (Jesus Christ died in the evening), there will be no more sacrifices of the Passover lambs. Obviously, the largest number of sacrifices in the Temple will be peaceful sacrifices.Visitors to the temple will eat the meat of these peaceful sacrifices, which will be cooked in the kitchens. Twenty-four refectory rooms for the Israelites, as well as four more refectory for the Levites, are located on the outer court of the Temple.

And REQUIRED Physical Circumcision? you know, the Practice that St Paul says "is nothing"? (1 Corinthians 7:19)

Yet In Zeke's temple, you claim it will be "something required" again?

Now, The Explanation of "memorial Sacrifices" is not new to me, and really does not answer the fundamental problem for you, in that the sacrifices mentioned in Ezekiel 40-44 are the ones prescribed by Moses in the Mosaic Law. These are not "memorial sacrifices" by any stretch of the imagination. They are animal blood sacrifices for atonement for sin. Premillennialists (Cerinthians) are heading back to, *gasp*, animal blood sacrifices and circumcision of flesh (Ez 44:7,9). What a knock against the finished work of Christ. What a misunderstanding.

You are fooling yourself about Ezekiel 40-44's sacrifices. They are propitiatory:

Ezekiel 40:39
In the porch of the gate were two tables on each side, on which to slaughter the burnt offering, the sin offering and the guilt offering.

Ezekiel 42:13
the priests who are near to the LORD shall eat the most holy things. There they shall lay the most holy things, the grain offering, the sin offering and the guilt offering;

Ezekiel 43:20
'You shall take some of its blood and put it on its four horns and on the four corners of the ledge and on the border round about; thus you shall cleanse it and make atonement for it.

Ezekiel 43:21
'You shall also take the bull for the sin offering

Ezekiel 43:22
'On the second day you shall offer a male goat without blemish for a sin offering

Ezekiel 43:27
'When they have completed the days, it shall be that on the eighth day and onward, the priests shall offer your burnt offerings on the altar, and your peace offerings; AND I WILL ACCEPT YOU

Ezekiel 44:9
'Thus says the Lord GOD, "No foreigner uncircumcised in heart and uncircumcised in flesh of all the foreigners who are among the sons of Israel, shall enter My sanctuary.

Ezekiel 44:10
"But the Levites who went far from Me when Israel went astray, who went astray from Me after their idols, shall bear the punishment for their iniquity. Yet they shall be ministers in My sanctuary, having oversight at the gates of the house and ministering in the house; they shall slaughter the burnt offering and the sacrifice for the people

Ezekiel 44:23
"Moreover, they shall teach My people the difference between the holy and the profane, and cause them to discern between the unclean and the clean.

Ezekiel 43:7
Son of man, this [stone temple] is the place of My throne and the place of the soles of My feet, where I will dwell among the sons of Israel forever. (Note that FOREVER is much longer than 1000 years)

All these offerings are the propitiatory offerings of the Mosaic Law that Jesus came to do away with forever. The teaching of a reinstitution of this blood sacrificial system is a rebuke against the blood of Jesus Christ, and a cause for anathema according to the apostles. A return to this system is a falling away from salvation, according to the apostles. A falling from the grace of Jesus Christ.

Again, you need to explain the requirement of Physical Circumcision in the supposed "Millennium", How do you reconcile that one?

Ezekiel 44:9
'Thus says the Lord GOD, "No foreigner uncircumcised in heart and uncircumcised in flesh of all the foreigners who are among the sons of Israel, shall enter My sanctuary.

Was St Paul Wrong?

 

[ralliann]

That is your misinterpretation of what I was saying.

To this very day, most Jews do not believe that Jesus had been their Prophesied Christ.

That has to be proven to them first, before presenting to them that Christ died for their sins.

This was already done. That is what the Gospels are. John the Baptist came first. But their crooked rulers (as distinct from the people) would not listen to him either. Willful sin vs sins of ignorance.

they are taught He had not been their Prophesied Christ You see examples of that in Acts 9; in Acts 13; in Acts 17; and so on.

Who is who here?
Their rulers teach he is not their prophesied Christ. So yes that is what they are taught.

In contrast, Gentiles were / are not raised believing He had not been anyone's Prophesied Christ.

What? I am a Gentile and have known many other Gentiles that were in fact raised being taught of Jesus Christ.

 

[Danoh]

It CANNOT be a real Temple of God as only the Body of Christ is that now.

So it is either symbolic or a future counterfeit temple built by a liar.

People tend to confuse the two. But two they are. For example, the Twelve and their converts are depicted in passages like the following as being both a spiritual temple and yet worshipping in The Temple - and this AFTER the Spirit came upon them to guide them.

Acts 2:36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ. 2:37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do? 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. 2:39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the LORD our God shall call.

2:41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls. 2:42 And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers. 2:43 And fear came upon every soul: and many wonders and signs were done by the apostles. 2:44 And all that believed were together, and had all things common; 2:45 And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all men, as every man had need. 2:46 And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart, 2:47 Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

Acts 3:1 Now Peter and John went up together into the temple at the hour of prayer, being the ninth hour. 3:2 And a certain man lame from his mother's womb was carried, whom they laid daily at the gate of the temple which is called Beautiful, to ask alms of them that entered into the temple; 3:3 Who seeing Peter and John about to go into the temple asked an alms. 3:4 And Peter, fastening his eyes upon him with John, said, Look on us. 3:5 And he gave heed unto them, expecting to receive something of them. 3:6 Then Peter said, Silver and gold have I none; but such as I have give I thee: In the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth rise up and walk. 3:7 And he took him by the right hand, and lifted him up: and immediately his feet and ankle bones received strength. 3:8 And he leaping up stood, and walked, and entered with them into the temple, walking, and leaping, and praising God.

Acts 4:1 And as they spake unto the people, the priests, and the captain of the temple, and the Sadducees, came upon them, 4:2 Being grieved that they taught the people, and preached through Jesus the resurrection from the dead. 4:3 And they laid hands on them, and put them in hold unto the next day: for it was now eventide.

4:8 Then Peter, filled with the Holy Ghost, said unto them, Ye rulers of the people, and elders of Israel, 4:9 If we this day be examined of the good deed done to the impotent man, by what means he is made whole; 4:10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.

You see that there about Peter being "filled with the Holy Spirit said unto them..."?

That is this...

Matthew 10:19 But when they deliver you up, take no thought how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that same hour what ye shall speak. 10:20 For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you.

The Spirit was guiding these temples of God as they worshipped in The Temple of God, at Jerusalem.

You're confusing the Spirit's indwelling Redeemed Israelites with His later indwelling of Gentiles not even allowed into that Temple.

Food for thought.

Acts 17:11, 12.

 

[Danoh]

This was already done. That is what the Gospels are. John the Baptist came first. But their crooked rulers (as distinct from the people) would not listen to him either. Willful sin vs sins of ignorance.

Who is who here?
Their rulers teach he is not their prophesied Christ. So yes that is what they are taught.

What? I am a Gentile and have known many other Gentiles that were in fact raised being taught of Jesus Christ.

Most SECULAR Gentiles.

Likewise with MOST Jews.

Take this how you might - you need to quit reading into a thing. Pause a bit, actually think a thing through a bit more.

Rom. 5:6-8.

 

[Inkfingers]

People tend to confuse the two. But two they are. For example, the Twelve and their converts are depicted in passages like the following as being both a spiritual temple and yet worshipping in The Temple - and this AFTER the Spirit came upon them to guide them.

Acts 2:36 Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made that same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ. 2:37 Now when they heard this, they were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, Men and brethren, what shall we do? 2:38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost. 2:39 For the promise is unto you, and to your children, and to all that are afar off, even as many as the LORD our God shall call.

2:41 Then they that gladly received his word were baptized: and the same day there were added unto them about three thousand souls. 2:42 And they continued stedfastly in the apostles' doctrine and fellowship, and in breaking of bread, and in prayers. 2:43 And fear came upon every soul: and many wonders and signs were done by the apostles. 2:44 And all that believed were together, and had all things common; 2:45 And sold their possessions and goods, and parted them to all men, as every man had need. 2:46 And they, continuing daily with one accord in the temple, and breaking bread from house to house, did eat their meat with gladness and singleness of heart, 2:47 Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

Acts 3:1 Now Peter and John went up together into the temple at the hour of prayer, being the ninth hour. 3:2 And a certain man lame from his mother's womb was carried, whom they laid daily at the gate of the temple which is called Beautiful, to ask alms of them that entered into the temple; 3:3 Who seeing Peter and John about to go into the temple asked an alms. 3:4 And Peter, fastening his eyes upon him with John, said, Look on us. 3:5 And he gave heed unto them, expecting to receive something of them. 3:6 Then Peter said, Silver and gold have I none; but such as I have give I thee: In the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth rise up and walk. 3:7 And he took him by the right hand, and lifted him up: and immediately his feet and ankle bones received strength. 3:8 And he leaping up stood, and walked, and entered with them into the temple, walking, and leaping, and praising God.

Acts 4:1 And as they spake unto the people, the priests, and the captain of the temple, and the Sadducees, came upon them, 4:2 Being grieved that they taught the people, and preached through Jesus the resurrection from the dead. 4:3 And they laid hands on them, and put them in hold unto the next day: for it was now eventide.

4:8 Then Peter, filled with the Holy Ghost, said unto them, Ye rulers of the people, and elders of Israel, 4:9 If we this day be examined of the good deed done to the impotent man, by what means he is made whole; 4:10 Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole.

You see that there about Peter being "filled with the Holy Spirit said unto them..."?

That is this...

Matthew 10:19 But when they deliver you up, take no thought how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that same hour what ye shall speak. 10:20 For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father which speaketh in you.

The Spirit was guiding these temples of God as they worshipped in The Temple of God, at Jerusalem.

You're confusing the Spirit's indwelling Redeemed Israelites with His later indwelling of Gentiles not even allowed into that Temple.

Food for thought.

Acts 17:11, 12.

The building was no longer the house of God. That, at Pentecost, became the church. They still visited the old building but THEY were the temple.

 

[Danoh]

And REQUIRED Physical Circumcision? you know, the Practice that St Paul says "is nothing"? (1 Corinthians 7:19)

Yet In Zeke's temple, you claim it will be "something required" again?

Now, The Explanation of "memorial Sacrifices" is not new to me, and really does not answer the fundamental problem for you, in that the sacrifices mentioned in Ezekiel 40-44 are the ones prescribed by Moses in the Mosaic Law. These are not "memorial sacrifices" by any stretch of the imagination. They are animal blood sacrifices for atonement for sin. Premillennialists (Cerinthians) are heading back to, *gasp*, animal blood sacrifices and circumcision of flesh (Ez 44:7,9). What a knock against the finished work of Christ. What a misunderstanding.

You are fooling yourself about Ezekiel 40-44's sacrifices. They are propitiatory:

Ezekiel 40:39
In the porch of the gate were two tables on each side, on which to slaughter the burnt offering, the sin offering and the guilt offering.

Ezekiel 42:13
the priests who are near to the LORD shall eat the most holy things. There they shall lay the most holy things, the grain offering, the sin offering and the guilt offering;

Ezekiel 43:20
'You shall take some of its blood and put it on its four horns and on the four corners of the ledge and on the border round about; thus you shall cleanse it and make atonement for it.

Ezekiel 43:21
'You shall also take the bull for the sin offering

Ezekiel 43:22
'On the second day you shall offer a male goat without blemish for a sin offering

Ezekiel 43:27
'When they have completed the days, it shall be that on the eighth day and onward, the priests shall offer your burnt offerings on the altar, and your peace offerings; AND I WILL ACCEPT YOU

Ezekiel 44:9
'Thus says the Lord GOD, "No foreigner uncircumcised in heart and uncircumcised in flesh of all the foreigners who are among the sons of Israel, shall enter My sanctuary.

Ezekiel 44:10
"But the Levites who went far from Me when Israel went astray, who went astray from Me after their idols, shall bear the punishment for their iniquity. Yet they shall be ministers in My sanctuary, having oversight at the gates of the house and ministering in the house; they shall slaughter the burnt offering and the sacrifice for the people

Ezekiel 44:23
"Moreover, they shall teach My people the difference between the holy and the profane, and cause them to discern between the unclean and the clean.

Ezekiel 43:7
Son of man, this [stone temple] is the place of My throne and the place of the soles of My feet, where I will dwell among the sons of Israel forever. (Note that FOREVER is much longer than 1000 years)

All these offerings are the propitiatory offerings of the Mosaic Law that Jesus came to do away with forever. The teaching of a reinstitution of this blood sacrificial system is a rebuke against the blood of Jesus Christ, and a cause for anathema according to the apostles. A return to this system is a falling away from salvation, according to the apostles. A falling from the grace of Jesus Christ.

Again, you need to explain the requirement of Physical Circumcision in the supposed "Millennium", How do you reconcile that one?

Ezekiel 44:9
'Thus says the Lord GOD, "No foreigner uncircumcised in heart and uncircumcised in flesh of all the foreigners who are among the sons of Israel, shall enter My sanctuary.

Was St Paul Wrong?

And yet there's Paul, AS the temple of the Lord, engaged in various rituals and animal sacrifices IN The Temple at Jerusalem, in Acts 21.

And yes, the "memorial" as explanation is an error.

Where the nation Israel is concerned the issue there concerns the outward uncleaness - we're talking the return of an aspect of The Law Economy, see Isaiah 2, for example - of ritual outward cleansings: which involve even the various tables, and pots and other instruments used in the Temple having to be ritually "atoned" or cleansed with the blood of one animal sacrifice or another, before it could be used in the service of God.

Exodus 24:6 And Moses took half of the blood, and put it in basons; and half of the blood he sprinkled on the altar.

Exodus 24:8 And Moses took the blood, and sprinkled it on the people, and said, Behold the blood of the covenant, which the LORD hath made with you concerning all these words.

Exodus 29:16 And thou shalt slay the ram, and thou shalt take his blood, and sprinkle it round about upon the altar.

And so on...

Acts 17: 11, 12