What did Jesus mean when He told Peter he was the rock he would build his church upon?

[Concord1968]

.

 

[Erik Nelson]

Is. It. Necessary. To. Put. A. Period. After. Every. Word. Or. Two?

That's the way speech recognition comes out on this device. I don't have time to finger type all day. Sorry for any confusion, though.

 

[Concord1968]

That's the way speech recognition comes out on this device. I don't have time to finger type all day. Sorry for any confusion, though.

Ok. In retrospect that was way snarkier than I should have been. I hadn't considered VR software. I withdraw the question. My apologies.

 

[prodromos]

Ok. In retrospect that was way snarkier than I should have been. I hadn't considered VR software. I withdraw the question. My apologies.

I thought it was quite humourous. I didn't pick up any snarkiness.

 

[Concord1968]

I thought it was quite humourous. I didn't pick up any snarkiness.

Oh, I had the snark function fully engaged lol. A bad habit of mine

 

[Gregory95]

From every source I've looked up they rained over 1000 years and even taking Constantine from Rome switching their faith to the first or second fall non of the dates make 1000 years? Did you mean to say IF the Bible is true?

I'm just being non controversial. Every Christian believes. That. The True Spiritual Church of Christ is the spiritual temple constructed of spiritual stones. Symbolizing each individual true. Christian.

So one way or another everybody acknowledges that the rock which. Bowls down the statue of Daniel. Represents Jesus Christ and his church on Earth. Everyone even agrees in principle that Saint Peter is a principle. Member of that church.

And everyone's history books already shows that that Church of Christ. bowled down the statue in the third and fourth and fifth centuries AD.

Incidentally. Everyone's history books on their home library shelves also says that the Christian Empire Constantine. Founded in Constantinople was the quote "1000 year Millennium long Christian Empire of Byzantium" end quote. Everyone everywhere has been calling it that for the past 600 years.

 

[Concord1968]

From every source I've looked up they rained over 1000 years and even taking Constantine from Rome switching their faith to the first or second fall non of the dates make 1000 years? Did you mean to say IF the Bible is true?

Did they really take liquid form and fall on people? Or did you mean "reigned"?

 

[Gregory95]

Did they really take liquid form and fall on people? Or did you mean "reigned"?

We both know what I meant, attacking words and not what was said is not profitable to the discussion . it raise s the question of if you have any real information to provide. I don't spend money on good phones nor do I have a computer thus typing is a chore my bad.

 

[Erik Nelson]

From every source I've looked up they rained over 1000 years and even taking Constantine from Rome switching their faith to the first or second fall non of the dates make 1000 years? Did you mean to say IF the Bible is true?

Constantinople was a Christian capital city for about a thousand years

the bible does not require that the millennium last precisely 1000.00000000 years down to the millisecond

 

[Erik Nelson]

according to the book Faith Basics: Serving Two Masters - Why Catholics Still Can't Be Masons by Deacon Dominic Cerrato...

the word "religion" comes from the Latin word religare meaning "to bind" and refers to the beliefs religious adherents are bound to hold.

so the power to bind and unbind / loose is the power to (help) define what the religion is.

 

[Erik Nelson]

Pope Saint Clement wrote 1 Clement to the Corinthian congregation before 100ad, while or immediately after Saint John was still alive. Christian congregations looked to leadership and judgements from Rome in the first century, while or immediately after the Apostles were still alive

 

[prodromos]

Pope Saint Clement wrote 1 Clement to the Corinthian congregation before 100ad, while or immediately after Saint John was still alive. Christian congregations looked to leadership and judgements from Rome in the first century, while or immediately after the Apostles were still alive

Corinth was a Roman colony with strong cultural and commercial ties to Rome as well as the Church in Corinth and Rome having the Apostle Paul in common. Clement had travelled with Paul so the Church in Corinth had probably also had ties with him also. Factor in the regular trade and thus communication between Rome and Corinth, and it easily explains why they wrote to Rome and not to the Apostle John.

 

[Albion]

You are NIT picking.

That would be one opinion. Mine is that to know the truth of most things, it is necessary to be able to differentiate between similar facts or concepts.

Jesus, for example, is God; he is not one of the gods, nor is he a man who merely knew God. He rose bodily from the grave; he did not merely come back as a ghost. But other people could think of such dlstinctions as nit-picking.

 

[Erik Nelson]

That would be one opinion. Mine is that to know the truth of most things, it is necessary to be able to differentiate between similar facts or concepts.

Jesus, for example, is God; he is not one of the gods, nor is he a man who merely knew God. He rose bodily from the grave; he did not merely come back as a ghost. But other people could think of such dlstinctions as nit-picking.

john 10:36

But now you're changing the subject.

The fact remains even Orthodox in Protestant Scholars, who do not agree that Isaiah 22 justifies the papacy. Still, recognize the parallel. In Isaiah 22. Eliakim is briefly the Prime Minister. Grand Vizier. Grand Viceroy. Of Jewish King Hezekiah.

Prime ministers. As a title. May not have existed until. Recent times. But the position under other titles like Visier and viceroy Existed in the days of Joseph and the Pharaohs. 4000 years ago.

 

[Erik Nelson]

Corinth was a Roman colony with strong cultural and commercial ties to Rome as well as the Church in Corinth and Rome having the Apostle Paul in common. Clement had travelled with Paul so the Church in Corinth had probably also had ties with him also. Factor in the regular trade and thus communication between Rome and Corinth, and it easily explains why they wrote to Rome and not to the Apostle John.

Rome was the trade hub of the empire. So everybody would have had incentive to communicate with Rome.

The epistel of, One Clement. Is regarded as scripture in some churches And is near Canonical in status. What other non Apostolic writings? Not considered full cannon. are still considered almost Canon. Of status equal to come parable with or even in excess of one Clement?

Palestine turned to Italy for authority. In the letter to the Hebrews. Greece turned to Italy for authority in the letter of one Clement. All in the mid first century AD.

 

[Root of Jesse]

No, there was not such a 'one head.' That has already been explained, using the facts of history.

So
So Jesus wasn't the head of His Church?

 

[Albion]

So
So Jesus wasn't the head of His Church?

I clearly wrote "such a 'one head.'" Get it? Singular Earthly administrator, i.e. leader, of the visible church. That's what we all had been discussing here.

 

[Albion]

The epistel of, One Clement. Is regarded as scripture in some churches....

Which churches would those be (by name)?

And is near Canonical in status.

In other words, NOT Canonical.

Palestine turned to Italy for authority.

Even if that were true, it doesn't establish that anyone believed in such a thing as a Papal office or that Peter was seen as above the other bishops. In fact, it is an argument for the opposite conclusion--that the prominence of the city itself provided some benefits for the bishop of the city and diocese.

 

[Erik Nelson]

Which churches would those be (by name)?



In other words, NOT Canonical.


Even if that were true, it doesn't establish that anyone believed in such a thing as a Papal office or that Peter was seen as above the other bishops. In fact, it is an argument for the opposite conclusion--that the prominence of the city itself provided some benefits for the bishop of the city and diocese.

"The letter appears to have been written by a single church leader in Rome. In Corinth, the letter was read aloud from time to time. This practice spread to other churches, and Christians translated the Greek work into Latin, Syriac, and other languages. Some early Christians even treated the work like scripture...

The Epistle to the Hebrews' call for leadership from the church in Rome has been thought to have been influential...

CANONICAL RANK
The epistle was publicly read from time to time at Corinth, and by the 4th century this usage had spread to other churches. It was included in the 5th century Codex Alexandrinus, which contained the entire Old and New Testaments. It was included with the Gospel of John in the fragmentary early Greek and Akhmimic Coptic papyrus designated Papyrus 6. First Clement is listed as canonical in "Canon 85" of the Canons of the Apostles, suggesting that First Clement had canonical rank in at least some regions of early Christendom.[citation needed] Ibn Khaldun also mentions it as part of the New Testament, suggesting that the book may have been in wide and accepted use in either 14th century Spain or Egypt"

First Epistle of Clement - Wikipedia

the Epistle of one Clement. Has higher? Canonical status. Then any other non Apostolic writing. After the Apostles. Pope Saint Clement. Wrote with the highest. Scriptural authority. Of any known figure. From. Early Christianity.

 

[Albion]

"The letter appears to have been written by a single church leader in Rome. In Corinth, the letter was read aloud from time to time. This practice spread to other churches, and Christians translated the Greek work into Latin, Syriac, and other languages. Some early Christians even treated the work like scripture...

The Epistle to the Hebrews' call for leadership from the church in Rome has been thought to have been influential...

It looks like there are no identifiable churches which considered it to be "near canonical," after all.