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.Douglaangu v2.0 said:Hold still, you're dodging again. [Perhaps you're missing the point again?]
More to the point, there's no way to falsify your ideas. [I accept your white flag]
The moment something 'supernatural' is revealed to be a normal process or whatever, you can just claim there's still more, or we don't know enough or somesuch excuse. [ You guys can learn]
I thought that you couldnt prove god, [Er, sorry, what it is is that they cannot prove God! You need to receive, not reject Him first] and that you had to accept his existance on faith alone? [ If any man come to Him, He will make Himself known] Or is that just an 'interpretation'?
I'm not talking about 'needing' the heat.
I'm talking about the massive amount of energy that would be released when particals moving at an infinite speed impact. [Physical particles of course you mean. Think about it]
Unless of course you're going to say it doesn't matter, and we'll all live in a magicworld without consequences and without evidence or justification or basis in reality. [Pretty much, compared to the death, sorrow, sickness, sadness, and utterly limited old physical world we now live in]
A fantasty land if you will. [Compared to realities of the box, a magical world, of course. Different enough to be called that by the boxonlyians]
I gottacha.
Everything you've been talking about is you trying to rationalise the inconsistances that the your biblical interpretation has with reality. [reality of the Godless, spririt blind, detection challenged, box]
"The earth is 6000 years old, but there are stars more and 6000 light years away, therefore lightspeed must have been infinite before the 'split"
"My biblical endtimes fantasy violates known laws of physics therefore the laws must be wrong and ignorable" [No, they are right for our temporary prison of time, and physiacl only universe! They are dead wrong when tried to be applied beyond the box]
You STILL didn't answer the question.
Why is your interpretation of the layout of the universe as detailed in the bible, correct when others are not?Hell, I'll even rephrase it for you.
Why is your interpretation of the bibles description of the universe correct, when others are not? [If you mean others who do not believe it is a special, spiritual, book deliverered from the 'other side'- then it matters not much. Besides, it is alive, and when He turns the key to unlock the hidden mysteries, who cares who never used to understand it?]
No, I get your point. That you don't have to provide any testable evidence of your 'theory' and you're making excuses.Perhaps you're missing the point again?
Physical particles of course you mean. Think about it
Pretty much, compared to the death, sorrow, sickness, sadness, and utterly limited old physical world we now live in
Compared to realities of the box, a magical world, of course. Different enough to be called that by the boxonlyians
reality of the Godless, spririt blind, detection challenged, box
And your evidence of this is that they cause problems with your interpretation of scripture.No, they are right for our temporary prison of time, and physiacl only universe! They are dead wrong when tried to be applied beyond the box
If you mean others who do not believe it is a special, spiritual, book deliverered from the 'other side'- then it matters not much. Besides, it is alive, and when He turns the key to unlock the hidden mysteries, who cares who never used to understand it?
dad said:Well, thank you. I don't go to church myself, but if you feel it is your bag, then enjoy.
dad said:Excellent. I'm glad some people are paying attention. Under this new idea in this thread, we have the split taking time to completely split. Kind of a slow burn. In other words, it now would not have split until the flood time. Perhaps some things were affected right away, others took more time?
Freodin said:Summary of dad´s position:
I am right. What I say might be impossible, but this problem can be solved by assuming that everyone else is wrong.
Excellent. I'm glad some people are paying attention. Under this new idea in this thread, we have the split taking time to completely split. Kind of a slow burn. In other words, it now would not have split until the flood time. Perhaps some things were affected right away, others took more time
dad said:Hold still, you're dodging again. [Perhaps you're missing the point again?]
More to the point, there's no way to falsify your ideas. [I accept your white flag]
The moment something 'supernatural' is revealed to be a normal process or whatever, you can just claim there's still more, or we don't know enough or somesuch excuse. [ You guys can learn]
I thought that you couldnt prove god, [Er, sorry, what it is is that they cannot prove God! You need to receive, not reject Him first] and that you had to accept his existance on faith alone? [ If any man come to Him, He will make Himself known] Or is that just an 'interpretation'?
I'm not talking about 'needing' the heat.
I'm talking about the massive amount of energy that would be released when particals moving at an infinite speed impact. [Physical particles of course you mean. Think about it]
Unless of course you're going to say it doesn't matter, and we'll all live in a magicworld without consequences and without evidence or justification or basis in reality. [Pretty much, compared to the death, sorrow, sickness, sadness, and utterly limited old physical world we now live in]
A fantasty land if you will. [Compared to realities of the box, a magical world, of course. Different enough to be called that by the boxonlyians]
I gottacha.
Everything you've been talking about is you trying to rationalise the inconsistances that the your biblical interpretation has with reality. [reality of the Godless, spririt blind, detection challenged, box]
"The earth is 6000 years old, but there are stars more and 6000 light years away, therefore lightspeed must have been infinite before the 'split"
"My biblical endtimes fantasy violates known laws of physics therefore the laws must be wrong and ignorable" [No, they are right for our temporary prison of time, and physiacl only universe! They are dead wrong when tried to be applied beyond the box]
You STILL didn't answer the question.
Why is your interpretation of the layout of the universe as detailed in the bible, correct when others are not?Hell, I'll even rephrase it for you.
Why is your interpretation of the bibles description of the universe correct, when others are not? [If you mean others who do not believe it is a special, spiritual, book deliverered from the 'other side'- then it matters not much. Besides, it is alive, and when He turns the key to unlock the hidden mysteries, who cares who never used to understand it?]
.Numenor said:The 'split' (I presume that's your synonym for the Fall) was instantaneous, not gradual. As soon as Adam and Eve sinned they were expelled from Eden. [Oh really? How do you know? I thought it was somewhat later, as they made themselves a covering of fig leaves, and were hiding out in the bush. Besides the spiritual splitting from the physical was a result of the fall, in all liklihood, but but not the fall itself. All that was was our wrong choice, and listening to the voice of the lying devil. How long does it take. or did He take for the process? I don't know any more than you do, was it a second, a minute, a milleniem and a half? Why not take some time for the process? After all, look at men's lifespans! They gradually changed over time as well-why? Don't think you can wave it away that easy. ]
They weren't allowed to loiter for a while which would have been the case if it was a gradual expulsion which is what you are saying, [Whoa. What has where Adam and Eve lived got to do with God's seperation timing? No, the seperation of the spirit world from the physical was not by any means, as I see it, the expulsion. The spirit world, or universe is much bigger than some mickey mouse garden! It affected the stars, and our whole universe] they weren't allowed to go back in and collect any belongings.
Stop murdering the word of God, you have no scientific nor biblical basis for this babbling, [Hey, get a clue, before running off at the upper orrifice, palsy] and just like a babbling brook you never shut up. Come back when you have something with scientific and scriptural support. [Come back when all heaven, God, and the spirit universe fit in your silly prison of a physical only box? Sorry, they don't fit in there, and it's ganna be demolished anyhow]
Oh yes it does, despite some not being able to perceive it.dad, you do realize that absolutely none of this twaddle has any meaning whatsoever in a science discussion
Nathan Poe said:Alternate summary of dad's position:
Goddidit.
dad said:Oh yes it does, despite some not being able to perceive it.
dad's inane babbling said:Oh really? How do you know?
dad rants on said:Besides the spiritual splitting from the physical was a result of the fall, in all liklihood, but but not the fall itself.
more babbling from dad said:Why not take some time for the process?
more from dad *yawn* said:Don't think you can wave it away that easy
unbelievable nonsense said:Whoa. What has where Adam and Eve lived got to do with God's seperation timing?
blah blah blah said:No, the seperation of the spirit world from the physical was not by any means, as I see it, the expulsion.
takes the biscuit said:The spirit world, or universe is much bigger than some mickey mouse garden!
hard to believe the irony said:Hey, get a clue, before running off at the upper orrifice, palsy
more garbage said:Come back when all heaven, God, and the spirit universe fit in your silly prison of a physical only box? Sorry, they don't fit in there, and it's ganna be demolished anyhow
Well the only time/potential for such was with the first couple of instants with the big bang (again those conjectures seeemed to be more conjecture than theory).ImmortalTechnique said:i guess we could ask him to present some evidence that the physical laws ever changed... that would be expecting too much, wouldn't it...
And-U-Say said:I am more convinced than ever. Dad is a troll, nothing more, nothing less. Nobody could really be this stupid. I imagine that he is laughing at our attempts to correct the insanity he has crafted.
dad said:I have thought that when the new heavens are revealed, that the physical only universe will cease to exist, as it will be a complete spiritual/physical universe then. Of course the laws of physics, and gravity will not apply as they now do. I also suspect the bible indicates such a state existed before in our early history, but the two had to be seperated, probably as a result of the fall.
I have speculated that this split was fast, maybe instant, probably at the time of the fall of man. That is still what I think.
However, thinking about a water canopy of some kind, enough to really cause a flood, has led to a new possibility! I think it is pretty well known, and accepted, really, that such a canopy would be impossible, due to the great heat, and other things the laws of physics simply prohibit.
How about this, then. The split was not instant, but perhaps never really was completed till during the flood!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This makes it entirely possible, as the merged laws were different. Presto- all arguements hitherto used against a canopy no longer valid!!! I like that. With science, then being neutered, this leaves only objections of a biblical nature to be a possible theory killer here.(?) But that's not going to happen, I am almost positive! So, evos, check, and MATE!!
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