Was the Sabbath given to man at creation as a special day to worship God?

[BobRyan]

I posted this

In that He says, “A new covenant,” He has made the first obsolete...
Hebrews 8:13

as Gal 3 and Romans 3 point out - when a person accepts Christ as savior they come under the New Covenant and are no longer condemned by the "obey and live" rulership of the Old Covenant ... by which all mankind is lost today apart from the gospel.

1. The old covenant still exists - it is the covenant according to Paul in Romans 3:19-22 under which all mankind are lost - still to this very day
2. the New Covenant is in the OT - Jer 31:31-34
and is unchanged in the NT Hebrews 8:6-12.
It is the "ONE Gospel" of Gal 1:6-9
that was "preached to Abraham" Gal 3:8
"preached to us JUST AS it was to them also" Heb 4:2
which is how Moses and Elijah stand with Christ in glory in Matthew 17 - before the cross.

1 Cor 10
2 and all were baptized into Moses in the cloud and in the sea; 3 and all ate the same spiritual food; 4 and all drank the same spiritual drink, for they were drinking from a spiritual rock which followed them; and the rock was Christ.


in Gal 3 and Rom 3.

Gal 3
11 Now that no one is justified by the Law before God is evident; for, “The righteous man shall live by faith.” 12 However, the Law is not of faith; on the contrary, “He who practices them shall live by them.”

That is the "Obey and Live" rule off the Old Covenant

Gal 3
13 Christ redeemed us from the curse of the Law, having become a curse for us—for it is written, “Cursed is everyone who hangs on a tree”— 14 in order that in Christ Jesus the blessing of Abraham might come to the Gentiles, so that we would receive the promise of the Spirit through faith.
15 Brethren, I speak in terms of human relations: even though it is only a man’s covenant, yet when it has been ratified, no one sets it aside or adds conditions to it. 16 Now the promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed. He does not say, “And to seeds,” as referring to many, but rather to one, “And to your seed,” that is, Christ. 17 What I am saying is this: the Law, which came four hundred and thirty years later, does not invalidate a covenant previously ratified by God, so as to nullify the promise. 18 For if the inheritance is based on law, it is no longer based on a promise; but God has granted it to Abraham by means of a promise.

The "Gospel" was preached to Abraham Gal 3:8

The Old Covenant was "obey and live". "saved by grace through faith" is the Gospel that was preached to Abraham Gal 3:8 - we call it the "New Covenant"

Rom 3:19-22 the single rule by which all to this very day are lost - apart from the Gospel

19 Now we know that whatever the Law says, it speaks to those who are under the Law, so that every mouth may be closed and all the world may become accountable to God; 20 because by the works of the Law no flesh will be justified in His sight; for through the Law comes the knowledge of sin.
...23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,

All are lost under the Old Covenant - still to this day and no one is released from it apart from accepting Christ as Savior... apart from the Gospel.

Totally False.

If "you say so"??..
Well at least I can agree that not everyone will enjoy the Bible texts I quoted.

The scriptures teach us the law of Moses has been abolished, set aside, taken out of the way.

If "you say so"??

The book of Hebrews says it has indeed changed.

It says the Law regarding priesthood changed... it does not say that the command to not take God's name in vain has been abolished.

details matter.

For the priesthood being changed, of necessity there is also a change of the law. Hebrews 7:12

it does not say that the command to not take God's name in vain has been abolished.

.

You need to learn about the Abrahamic Covenant of which we who are “in Christ” are grafted into.

As I already pointed out above - Abraham was given the one Gospel (Gal 1:6-9, Gal 3:8) that is the same in all of time.


The New Covenant is not the “renewed” or “refreshed” covenant - there is only one Gospel and that was preached to Abraham. It is the New Covenant... the only one with forgiveness of sins in it.

The one where The LAW was written on the heart.

Saved by grace through faith - forgiveness of sins and the LAW written on the heart. Thus God says of Abraham "he kept my LAWs" Gen 26:5

Including that unit of TEN where "The first commandment with a promise" is the 5th commandment - Eph 6:1-2

 

[JLB777]

The New Covenant is not the “renewed” or “refreshed” covenant -

The New Covenant is the renewed or refreshed Abrahamic Covenant.


We are grafted into the natural olive tree as “wild olive branches” that the root that supported Abraham also supports us as well.




For I speak to you Gentiles; inasmuch as I am an apostle to the Gentiles, I magnify my ministry, if by any means I may provoke to jealousy those who are my flesh and save some of them. For if their being cast away is the reconciling of the world, what will their acceptance be but life from the dead?
For if the firstfruit is holy, the lump is also holy; and if the root is holy, so are the branches. And if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive tree, were grafted in among them, and with them became a partaker of the root and fatness of the olive tree, do not boast against the branches. But if you do boast, remember that you do not support the root, but the root supports you. Romans 11:13-18


JLB

 

[YeshuaFan]

You just added to scripture. Give me the verse that it says it's a sign of the OT covenant. God specifically says it's a sign between him and Israel. Israel is set apart to show who the people of God are, for true believers.

Here's the actual verse Exodus 31:17 "It is a sign between me and the children of Israel for ever: for in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, and on the seventh day he rested, and was refreshed."

Prior to this verse it actually says it's a perpetual covenant, not "old covenant only". Exodus 31:16

If you want to take this verse so literally. Why don't you believe that it's only the actual children of Jacob then? Since he was named Israel.

We are heirs of Israel and Abraham. We inherit everything so you cannot say it was only to Israel at that time, that is clearly false.

Galations 3:29 "If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise"

Ephesians 2:12-13 "Remember that you were at that time separated from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ"

Romans 11:17-18, 24 "But if some of the branches were broken off, and you, although a wild olive shoot, were grafted in among the others and now share in the nourishing root of the olive tree, do not be arrogant toward the branches. For if you were cut from what is by nature a wild olive tree, and grafted, contrary to nature, into a cultivated olive tree, how much more will these, the natural branches, be grafted back into their own olive tree"

Seems like people are not wanting to be truly part of that "olive tree" and are broken off from it. Israel is indeed our inheritance and we are grafted in them as children of God even if it's not of the pure bloodline, we are still part of Israel as God's children. Hence why the Sabbath is the sign of God's TRUE children. It's the sign of who is really your father and the true God and it's how people can know.

10 Commandment of the Mosaic law were the OT covenant between God and Israel, and sabbath as the sign between them and God, never applied towards us now in the new One!

 

[BobRyan]

10 Commandment of the Mosaic law were the OT covenant between God and Israel, and sabbath as the sign between them and God, never applied towards us now in the new One!

NEW Covenant has God's Ten Commandment moral law written on the heart according to Jer 31:31-34.. So a lot of folks go with that.

Including the groups in my signature line.

 

[BobRyan]

The New Covenant is the renewed or refreshed Abrahamic Covenant.

Not according to Jer 31:31-34 or Hebrews 8:6-11 where the New Covenant is actually quoted and shown to be "unchanged" between the two.

 

[YeshuaFan]

NEW Covenant has God's Ten Commandment moral law written on the heart according to Jer 31:31-34.. So a lot of folks go with that.

Including the groups in my signature line.

Those that you list did NOT hold to Sabbath for the Church!

 

[JLB777]

Not according to Jer 31:31-34 or Hebrews 8:6-11 where the New Covenant is actually quoted and shown to be "unchanged" between the two.

People that state their opinion then “tag” their opinion with a scripture reference but no scripture, are usually just peddling what they have been taught from a pulpit of book.


Now the LORD had said to Abram:
“Get out of your country,
From your family
And from your father’s house,
To a land that I will show you.
I will make you a great nation;
I will bless you
And make your name great;
And you shall be a blessing.
I will bless those who bless you,
And I will curse him who curses you;
And in you all the families of the earth shall be blessed.”
Genesis 12:1-3

This phrase refers to Christ and the New Covenant.

This event foreshadowed the Gospel and justification by faith fore the Gentiles.


And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the Gentiles by faith, preached the gospel to Abraham beforehand, saying, “In you all the nations shall be blessed. Galatians 3:8




Abraham and the covenant the Lord Jesus made with him, before He became flesh, is the covenant the law of Moses was added to until the Seed, the Messiah should come.


Now to Abraham and his Seed were the promises made. He does not say, “And to seeds,” as of many, but as of one, “And to your Seed,” who is Christ. And this I say, that the law, which was four hundred and thirty years later, cannot annul the covenant that was confirmed before by God in Christ, that it should make the promise of no effect. For if the inheritance is of the law, it is no longer of promise; but God gave it to Abraham by promise.
What purpose then does the law serve? It was added because of transgressions, till the Seed should come to whom the promise was made; and it was appointed through angels by the hand of a mediator.
Galatians 3:16-19



The law of Moses did not annul or do away with the Abrahamic Covenant which always intended Gentiles to be a part of it, since Abraham is a Gentile, and foreshadowed how the Gentiles would be justified by faith.



JLB

 

[BobRyan]

Those that you list did NOT hold to Sabbath for the Church!

are you sure?

On these areas of the discussion board it may "seem like" there is no agreement on anything.

But as it turns out there are a number of points that BOTH the pro-Bible-7th-day-Sabbath and the pro-Sunday scholars DO agree on!

Here is an example of claims made by the pro-Sunday sources - and 6 of the 7 are actually correct according to the Bible!.

Yes that is right - 6 of the 7 are actually common ground between Sabbath keeping and Sunday keeping Christians.

1. That the Sabbath Commandment is first given to mankind in Gen 2:1-3
2. That all mankind was obligated by the TEN commandments in the OT and to this very day.
3. That the seventh day as the Sabbath was Saturday the seventh day of the week from Gen 2:1-3 until NT times - including at the cross.
4. That the Ten Commandments are the moral Law of God
5. That the moral law of God is written on the heart under the New Covenant
6. that the Ten Commandments as the moral law of God are in no way opposed to grace and the Gospel.
7. That the Sabbath commandment can rightly be BENT by man-made-tradition to point to week-day-1 after the cross.

I agree with 6 out of 7 as listed above - (Obviously I don't agree to point 7)

So then of the SIX points where BOTH sides admit to the Bible details - we have a result that confirms there is such a thing as "obvious Bible details that BOTH sides admit to".

And frankly at that point we conclude "it just does not GET any easier than that!".

Everyone has free will and can object to whatever they wish - but it is nice to find that in a world of 'differences' some Bible details are so obvious BOTH sides admit to them.

Nice!

An example where Charles Stanley seems to hold out a similar view as the Baptist Confession of Faith -- section 19 and 20

read the section in the quote box.

1 John 5 quoted above - but as I understand it some folks like to see all the text from John that can be included on-topic... so for them. Jesus affirms scripture - and the fact that His words are not His own - but rather the Father's Commandments.

================================

John 14
9 Jesus *said to him, “Have I been so long with you, and yet you have not come to know Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; how can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? 10 Do you not believe that I am in the Father, and the Father is in Me? The words that I say to you I do not speak on My own initiative, but the Father abiding in Me does His works.

John 12
49 For I did not speak on My own initiative, but the Father Himself who sent Me has given Me a commandment as to what to say and what to speak. 50 I know that His commandment is eternal life; therefore the things I speak, I speak just as the Father has told Me.”

Matt 19
17 And He said to him, “Why are you asking Me about what is good? There is only One who is good; but if you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments.” 18 Then he *said to Him, “Which ones?” And Jesus said, “You shall not commit murder; You shall not commit adultery; You shall not steal; You shall not bear false witness; 19 Honor your father and mother; and You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” 20 The young man *said to Him, “All these things I have kept; what am I still lacking?” 21 Jesus said to him, “If you wish to be complete, go and sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me.”

=============================

D.L. Moody not entirely opposed to John 14:15 --

1. agrees that the Sabbath was binding on all mankind - starting in Eden.

========================================
D.L. Moody notices that some are opposed to the Sabbath Commandment - but notice how this sermon on the TEN Commandments also fits the summary of 7 points listed here on page 1??

THE TEN COMMANDMENTS text by D. L. Moody

BY THE
DWIGHT L. MOODY
The Ten Commandments:
Exodus 20:2-17
.
The Fourth Commandment


Remember the Sabbath Day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: for in six days the LORD made heaven and Earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath Day, and hallowed it.​

[FONT=&quot]THERE HAS BEEN an awful letting-down in this country regarding the Sabbath during the last twenty-five years, and many a man has been shorn of spiritual power, like Samson, because he is not straight on this question. Can you say that you observe the Sabbath properly? You may be a professed Christian: are you obeying this commandment? Or do you neglect the house of God on the Sabbath day, and spend your time drinking and carousing in places of vice and crime, showing contempt for God and His law? Are you ready to step into the scales? Where were you last Sabbath? How did you spend it?

I honestly believe that this commandment is just as binding today as it ever was. I have talked with men who have said that it has been abrogated, but they have never been able to point to any place in the Bible where God repealed it. When Christ was on earth, He did nothing to set it aside; He freed it from the traces under which the scribes and Pharisees had put it, and gave it its true place.
"The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath." (Mark 2:27)
It is just as practicable and as necessary for men today as it ever was- in fact, more than ever, because we live in such an intense age.

The Sabbath was binding in Eden, and it has been in force ever since. The fourth commandment begins with the word remember, showing that the Sabbath already existed when God wrote this law on the tables of stone at Sinai. How can men claim that this one commandment has been done away with when they will admit that the other nine are still binding?

I believe that the Sabbath question today is a vital one for the whole country. It is the burning question of the present time. If you give up the Sabbath the church goes;

------------------------------------------

This Sabbath Commandment section of Moody's Ten Commandment sermon goes quot]on with more detail. Here is a segment of that same section -- the ending concluding segment - that might help shed even more light on Moody's Intent - #229 post is on this

 

[YeshuaFan]

are you sure?

yes very sure that they did not hold Jewish Sabbath also now for the Church!

 

[BobRyan]

Those that you list did NOT hold to Sabbath for the Church!

are you sure?

On these areas of the discussion board it may "seem like" there is no agreement on anything.

But as it turns out there are a number of points that BOTH the pro-Bible-7th-day-Sabbath and the pro-Sunday scholars DO agree on!

Here is an example of claims made by the pro-Sunday sources - and 6 of the 7 are actually correct according to the Bible!.

Yes that is right - 6 of the 7 are actually common ground between Sabbath keeping and Sunday keeping Christians.

1. That the Sabbath Commandment is first given to mankind in Gen 2:1-3
2. That all mankind was obligated by the TEN commandments in the OT and to this very day.
3. That the seventh day as the Sabbath was Saturday the seventh day of the week from Gen 2:1-3 until NT times - including at the cross.
4. That the Ten Commandments are the moral Law of God
5. That the moral law of God is written on the heart under the New Covenant
6. that the Ten Commandments as the moral law of God are in no way opposed to grace and the Gospel.
7. That the Sabbath commandment can rightly be BENT by man-made-tradition to point to week-day-1 after the cross.

I agree with 6 out of 7 as listed above - (Obviously I don't agree to point 7)

So then of the SIX points where BOTH sides admit to the Bible details - we have a result that confirms there is such a thing as "obvious Bible details that BOTH sides admit to".

And frankly at that point we conclude "it just does not GET any easier than that!".

Everyone has free will and can object to whatever they wish - but it is nice to find that in a world of 'differences' some Bible details are so obvious BOTH sides admit to them.

Nice!

An example where Charles Stanley seems to hold out a similar view as the Baptist Confession of Faith -- section 19 and 20

yes very sure that they did not hold Jewish Sabbath also now for the Church!

read the section in the quote box regarding your claim "Those that you list did NOT hold to Sabbath for the Church!"

1 John 5 quoted above - but as I understand it some folks like to see all the text from John that can be included on-topic... so for them. Jesus affirms scripture - and the fact that His words are not His own - but rather the Father's Commandments.

================================

John 14
9 Jesus *said to him, “Have I been so long with you, and yet you have not come to know Me, Philip? He who has seen Me has seen the Father; how can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? 10 Do you not believe that I am in the Father, and the Father is in Me? The words that I say to you I do not speak on My own initiative, but the Father abiding in Me does His works.

John 12
49 For I did not speak on My own initiative, but the Father Himself who sent Me has given Me a commandment as to what to say and what to speak. 50 I know that His commandment is eternal life; therefore the things I speak, I speak just as the Father has told Me.”

Matt 19
17 And He said to him, “Why are you asking Me about what is good? There is only One who is good; but if you wish to enter into life, keep the commandments.” 18 Then he *said to Him, “Which ones?” And Jesus said, “You shall not commit murder; You shall not commit adultery; You shall not steal; You shall not bear false witness; 19 Honor your father and mother; and You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” 20 The young man *said to Him, “All these things I have kept; what am I still lacking?” 21 Jesus said to him, “If you wish to be complete, go and sell your possessions and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven; and come, follow Me.”

=============================

D.L. Moody not entirely opposed to John 14:15 --

1. agrees that the Sabbath was binding on all mankind - starting in Eden.

========================================
D.L. Moody notices that some are opposed to the Sabbath Commandment - but notice how this sermon on the TEN Commandments also fits the summary of 7 points listed here on page 1??

THE TEN COMMANDMENTS text by D. L. Moody

BY THE
DWIGHT L. MOODY
The Ten Commandments:
Exodus 20:2-17
.
The Fourth Commandment


Remember the Sabbath Day, to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work: but the seventh day is the Sabbath of the LORD thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates: for in six days the LORD made heaven and Earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the LORD blessed the Sabbath Day, and hallowed it.​

[FONT=&quot]THERE HAS BEEN an awful letting-down in this country regarding the Sabbath during the last twenty-five years, and many a man has been shorn of spiritual power, like Samson, because he is not straight on this question. Can you say that you observe the Sabbath properly? You may be a professed Christian: are you obeying this commandment? Or do you neglect the house of God on the Sabbath day, and spend your time drinking and carousing in places of vice and crime, showing contempt for God and His law? Are you ready to step into the scales? Where were you last Sabbath? How did you spend it?

I honestly believe that this commandment is just as binding today as it ever was. I have talked with men who have said that it has been abrogated, but they have never been able to point to any place in the Bible where God repealed it. When Christ was on earth, He did nothing to set it aside; He freed it from the traces under which the scribes and Pharisees had put it, and gave it its true place.
"The Sabbath was made for man, and not man for the Sabbath." (Mark 2:27)
It is just as practicable and as necessary for men today as it ever was- in fact, more than ever, because we live in such an intense age.

The Sabbath was binding in Eden, and it has been in force ever since. The fourth commandment begins with the word remember, showing that the Sabbath already existed when God wrote this law on the tables of stone at Sinai. How can men claim that this one commandment has been done away with when they will admit that the other nine are still binding?

I believe that the Sabbath question today is a vital one for the whole country. It is the burning question of the present time. If you give up the Sabbath the church goes;

------------------------------------------

This Sabbath Commandment section of Moody's Ten Commandment sermon goes quot]on with more detail. Here is a segment of that same section -- the ending concluding segment - that might help shed even more light on Moody's Intent - #229 post is on this