• Welcome to Christian Forums
  1. Welcome to Christian Forums, a forum to discuss Christianity in a friendly surrounding.

    Your voice is missing! You will need to register to be able to join in fellowship with Christians all over the world.

    We hope to see you as a part of our community soon and God Bless!

  2. The forums in the Christian Congregations category are now open only to Christian members. Please review our current Faith Groups list for information on which faith groups are considered to be Christian faiths. Christian members please remember to read the Statement of Purpose threads for each forum within Christian Congregations before posting in the forum.
  3. Please note there is a new rule regarding the posting of videos. It reads, "Post a summary of the videos you post . An exception can be made for music videos.". Unless you are simply sharing music, please post a summary, or the gist, of the video you wish to share.
  4. There have been some changes in the Life Stages section involving the following forums: Roaring 20s, Terrific Thirties, Fabulous Forties, and Golden Eagles. They are changed to Gen Z, Millennials, Gen X, and Golden Eagles will have a slight change.
  5. CF Staff, Angels and Ambassadors; ask that you join us in praying for the world in this difficult time, asking our Holy Father to stop the spread of the virus, and for healing of all affected.
  6. We are no longer allowing posts or threads that deny the existence of Covid-19. Members have lost loved ones to this virus and are grieving. As a Christian site, we do not need to add to the pain of the loss by allowing posts that deny the existence of the virus that killed their loved one. Future post denying the Covid-19 existence, calling it a hoax, will be addressed via the warning system.

Very concerned about Jerusalem / US embassy

Discussion in 'Eschatology - Endtimes & Prophecy Forum' started by friend of, Jan 3, 2018.

  1. seventysevens

    seventysevens Well-Known Member

    +833
    Christian
    In Relationship
    I have watched Jonathan on the jvmi.org.PNG TV show and he does not speak ill of Israel as a nation - he supports it - Johnathan is not the guy in that video
     
  2. TribulationSigns

    TribulationSigns Well-Known Member Supporter

    +832
    United States
    Christian
    Private
    You are playing games here.

    First, you said,

    "Your posts reflect that Christians should only focus on evangelizing and not loving all people"

    I corrected you that it was not true and I have explained my position in my previous post. Now you are coming back with the new accusation by saying that we should focus on evangelism while not helping nation Israel from her enemies. That is lame. You were not listening to a word I said. Obviously, you are too obsessed with nation Israel that you do not really understand the true purpose of the great commission.

    The great commission is to carry the gospel to every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation. Nation including Israel. It all about brings Gospel to all creatures, both Jews and Gentiles, Israel and France. Do you get it in bold? To bring in all Jews and Gentiles in Christ into the spiritual kingdom of God that has been taking place since the Cross.

    Isaiah 2:1-4

    • "The word that Isaiah the son of Amoz saw concerning Judah and Jerusalem.
    • And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the LORD'S house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it.
    • And many people shall go and say, Come ye, and let us go up to the mountain of the LORD, to the house of the God of Jacob; and he will teach us of his ways, and we will walk in his paths: for out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the LORD from Jerusalem.
    • And he shall judge among the nations, and shall rebuke many people: and they shall beat their swords into plowshares, and their spears into pruninghooks: nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall they learn war any more."
    And all nations shall flow unto it is pointing to the great commission where Christ told us to preach the gospel to the ends of the earth, and the nations/gentiles flowing into it are the fruits of these labors in Christ Jesus. This started at the cross and ends when all Israel is Sealed unto the day of redemption. We can't get hung up on the word translated "nations" and start thinking like the evangelicals, of the nation of Israel and other physical nations, that's not what God has in view. The political nations aren't saved or kept from being deceived by satan, individuals are saved and they come into the "Spiritual Nation," and become "Spiritual Jews" and are brought "Spiritual Peace" and comfort in the "Spiritual" Israel of God (Romans 2:28-29, Ephesians 2:11-22). These nations in Scripture contrast the Jewish people [i.e., meaning non-Jews.] That is our great commission where we help individually, whether Jews or Gentiles, to become a spiritual Jew in Christ.

    Galatians 2:15
    • "We who are Jews by nature, and not sinners of the Gentiles,"
    So much for trying to protect ungodly nation Israel from her enemies.

    I am done discussing with you on this subject.
     
  3. seventysevens

    seventysevens Well-Known Member

    +833
    Christian
    In Relationship
    No games- just pointing out that you are telling people who have expressed concern for the lives of people living in a very dangerous area of the world -that they don't understand what loves is .
    Then you go on to say that people should not be concerned with protecting Israel and focus on people whom YOU think are more important to do the work of the great commission- the great Commission is to go to ALL Nations and make disciples , you express that the nation of Israel of people to not be concerned about .
    True love is loving all people and that is why there are missionaries that go to dangerous places in the world putting there own lives at risk to help people learn who Christ is , putting your own life at risk to help people know Christ is just as important as telling people about Christ that live down the street.
    Jesus said there is no greater love than someone willing to lay down their own life for to save the lives of others -as he showed he would do
     
  4. TribulationSigns

    TribulationSigns Well-Known Member Supporter

    +832
    United States
    Christian
    Private
    Obviously, you do have a reading comprehension difficulty. Read again:

    The great commission is to carry the gospel to every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation. Nations including Israel. It all about brings Gospel to all creatures, both Jews and Gentiles, Israel and France. Do you get it in bold? To bring in all Jews and Gentiles in Christ into the spiritual kingdom of God that has been taking place since the Cross.
     
    Last edited: Jan 4, 2018
  5. parousia70

    parousia70 Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow Supporter

    +3,951
    United States
    Catholic
    Married
    US-Others
    There are many today who teach an odd false teaching that today's jews are still in covenant relationship with Jehovah. This, of course, is not what Jesus and the apostles taught (1 Jn 2:23; Jn 15:23-24; Jn 5:22-23; Acts 3:22-24) nor what the historic Church has ever taught.

    When one simply looks at the Mosaic Covenant to see if Jehovah is still honoring his covenant with todays racial/poltical jews as his People, We see clearly He is not, for in Exodus 34 Jehovah made a covenant promise that he would never allow an attack on the nation during the high festivals. During the entire Mosaic Period Jehovah honored this promise. Well, in 2002 there was an attack on Israel on Passover. Also, the war of 1967 took place on Yom Kippur. This alone is concrete proof that today's political Israel is NOT in covenant relations with Jehovah. Perhaps most importantly, the Old Covenant with Israel reached its end at AD70 when Jerusalem and Temple Judaism were destroyed and the jewish Church established as the Covenant People (with the addition of the gentiles).

    Today's jews are not in our New Covenant (if they don't have Jesus), and they clearly are not in ANY other covenant that Jehovah is still honoring to them. The Holy Day attacks on today's political Israel are just one of countless proofs that the only people in covenant relations with Jehovah now are those who have the Messiah, Jesus (1 Jn 2:23; Jn 15:23-24; Jn 5:22-23; Acts 3:22-24).
     
  6. seventysevens

    seventysevens Well-Known Member

    +833
    Christian
    In Relationship

    Obviously you said

    your words
     
  7. TribulationSigns

    TribulationSigns Well-Known Member Supporter

    +832
    United States
    Christian
    Private
    Did I say that you can't preach Gospel to people of Israel here, didn't I? No! I was saying that our commission is NOT about protecting nation Isreal or any political nation for that matter but rather sharing Gospel to anyone AMONG YOU, may they be Jews or Gentiles, in Israel or in France, in your state, etc.

    You don't seem to understand that salvation is available to "EVERYONE" on an individual basis. Even in the Old Testament when God delivered Israel again and again and again. The nation was NEVER all the true children of God, salvation was on an individual basis. For example, Jacob God loved, Esau He hated. "THAT" is individual salvation. There is no "national salvation," and never has been! God is immutable. This idea of yours that God is going to save the nation Israel that we should "protect" is bankrupt of any virtue or God-breathed truth. Israel, even as it was the covenanted nation of God in the Old Testament, was never all saved. And the idea that God will soon save a remnant from Israel is redundant, for God is saving a remnant of Israel RIGHT NOW. Almost the entire early Church was from Israel, starting with the 12 Apostles.

    Romans 11:4-5
    • "But what saith the answer of God unto him? I have reserved to myself seven thousand men, who have not bowed the knee to the image of Baal.
    • Even so then at this present time also there is a remnant according to the election of grace."
    Saying God will save a remnant from Israel is like making the word of God that He is even now saving a remnant from Israel, null and void. The problem with Premillennialism/Dispensationalism is that it ignores fulfilled scriptures in order to hold onto Jewish fables about the return of a physical nation. This is a pipe dream, not the prophecy of God's word.

    It is about individual salvation rather than national salvation. This is what our great commission is based on!

    Selah!
     
    Last edited: Jan 4, 2018
  8. seventysevens

    seventysevens Well-Known Member

    +833
    Christian
    In Relationship
    ;giggle: , copy/paste - gotta get some popcorn and and coca-cola :preach: :liturgy:
     
  9. dreadnought

    dreadnought Lip service isn't really service. Supporter

    +3,408
    United States
    United Methodist
    Celibate
    I try to obey the Lord's commandments.
     
  10. TribulationSigns

    TribulationSigns Well-Known Member Supporter

    +832
    United States
    Christian
    Private
    Glad you enjoy it.
     
  11. parousia70

    parousia70 Livin' in yesterday's tomorrow Supporter

    +3,951
    United States
    Catholic
    Married
    US-Others
    Indeed, We as Christians have no more a requirement to protect "National Israel" from her enemies than we do National Egypt, or National France, National Canada, etc...

    God is no respecter of persons, or Nations, or Tribes today.

    As I pointed out earlier in this thread, If God were presently Honoring any covenant with National Israel, they would not need our "protection" from their enemies, for He would be protecting them with His own Hand as He did for the entire duration of the Mosaic Economy.

    National Israel today is the Same in God's eyes as National Egypt, or National Peru, or National Finland.
     
  12. BABerean2

    BABerean2 Newbie Supporter

    +6,847
    Christian
    Married
    Which set of commandments found in the verse below are you trying to obey?


    Joh 15:10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

    .
     
  13. dreadnought

    dreadnought Lip service isn't really service. Supporter

    +3,408
    United States
    United Methodist
    Celibate
    “You know the commandments: `Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Honor your father and mother.'" Luke 18:20 RSV
     
  14. BABerean2

    BABerean2 Newbie Supporter

    +6,847
    Christian
    Married
    Luk 18:18 And a certain ruler asked him, saying, Good Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life?
    Luk 18:19 And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? none is good, save one, that is, God.
    Luk 18:20 Thou knowest the commandments, Do not commit adultery, Do not kill, Do not steal, Do not bear false witness, Honour thy father and thy mother.
    Luk 18:21 And he said, All these have I kept from my youth up.


    Do you believe the young man had really kept all of the commandments?

    .
     
  15. dreadnought

    dreadnought Lip service isn't really service. Supporter

    +3,408
    United States
    United Methodist
    Celibate
    Interesting question. Perhaps he obeyed the letter of the law but not the spirit.
     
  16. BABerean2

    BABerean2 Newbie Supporter

    +6,847
    Christian
    Married
    Christ could have called the man a liar, because Christ is the only one to ever keep the 10 commandments.

    Nobody alive today has ever been guilty of breaking the 4th commandment, because it was the "sign" of a temporary covenant.

    In Galatians 3:16-29 Paul reveals that the Sinai Covenant was "added" 430 years "after" the promise made to Abraham "until" the seed (Christ) could come to whom the promise was made.

    In Galatians 4 Paul compares the Sinai Covenant to "bondage" and compels the Galatians believers to "cast out" the covenant of bondage.

    In Acts chapter 15 Peter calls the Law of Moses a "yoke", that they have never been able to bear.

    In Jeremiah 31:31-34 and Hebrews 8:6-13 we find that the New Covenant would not be like the Old Covenant and the Old Covenant has been made "obsolete" in Hebrews 8:13.

    We are under the Law of Christ found below. It is a higher law than the law of Moses.

    1Jn 3:22 And whatsoever we ask, we receive of him, because we keep his commandments, and do those things that are pleasing in his sight.


    1Jn 3:23 And this is his commandment, That we should believe on the name of his Son Jesus Christ, and love one another, as he gave us commandment.

    1Jn 3:24 And he that keepeth his commandments dwelleth in him, and he in him. And hereby we know that he abideth in us, by the Spirit which he hath given us.






    .

    .
     
  17. dreadnought

    dreadnought Lip service isn't really service. Supporter

    +3,408
    United States
    United Methodist
    Celibate
    It's true that we've all sinned, but the object is to repent of our sin. Perhaps the man had done that. However, I might still suggest that it's not good enough to obey merely the letter of the law.
     
  18. BABerean2

    BABerean2 Newbie Supporter

    +6,847
    Christian
    Married
    Do you keep the 4th commandment of the Sinai Covenant?

    .
     
  19. dreadnought

    dreadnought Lip service isn't really service. Supporter

    +3,408
    United States
    United Methodist
    Celibate
    Yes.
     
  20. seventysevens

    seventysevens Well-Known Member

    +833
    Christian
    In Relationship
    James
    10 For whoever keeps the whole law and yet stumbles at just one point is guilty of breaking all of it

    12 Speak and act as those who are going to be judged by the law that gives freedom,
    13 because judgment without mercy will be shown to anyone who has not been merciful. Mercy triumphs over judgment.

    Colos 2
    16 Therefore do not let anyone judge you by what you eat or drink, or with regard to a religious festival, a New Moon celebration or a Sabbath day.
    17 These are a shadow of the things that were to come; the reality, however, is found in Christ.

    18 Do not let anyone who delights in false humility and the worship of angels disqualify you. Such a person also goes into great detail about what they have seen; they are puffed up with idle notions by their unspiritual mind.

    19 They have lost connection with the head, from whom the whole body, supported and held together by its ligaments and sinews, grows as God causes it to grow.

    Romans 14
    5 One person considers one day more sacred than another; another considers every day alike. Each of them should be fully convinced in their own mind.

    6 Whoever regards one day as special does so to the Lord. Whoever eats meat does so to the Lord, for they give thanks to God; and whoever abstains does so to the Lord and gives thanks to God.

    7 For none of us lives for ourselves alone, and none of us dies for ourselves alone.
    8 If we live, we live for the Lord; and if we die, we die for the Lord. So, whether we live or die, we belong to the Lord.
    9 For this very reason, Christ died and returned to life so that he might be the Lord of both the dead and the living.
    10 You, then, why do you judge your brother or sister? Or why do you treat them with contempt? For we will all stand before God’s judgment seat.
    11 It is written:
    “‘As surely as I live,’ says the Lord,
    ‘every knee will bow before me;
    every tongue will acknowledge God.’”
    12 So then, each of us will give an account of ourselves to God.
    13 Therefore let us stop passing judgment on one another. Instead, make up your mind not to put any stumbling block or obstacle in the way of a brother or sister.
     
Loading...