The Ten Commandments are the Covenant, did you know?

[SabbathBlessings]

What I am asking is how you reconcile your belief that the New Covenant is the Decalogue with Galatians 3, as stated earlier. And also, while we’re at it, with the other scriptures I mentioned.

Since it is clear that Galatians 3 deprecates the Law as a source of holiness or salvation. This does not equal a license to sin, this point must be stressed, but rather a focus on grace, which is integral to what Scripture actually says about the New Covenant.

The law being referred to in Galatians is not the Ten Commandments but being circumcised for salvation and to hear the gospel.

This is the main law and theme of Galatians if read in context

Gal 2:. 3 Yet not even Titus who was with me, being a Greek, was compelled to be circumcised.

As stated Paul is not teaching one to sin - break God’s law 1 John 3:4 so we really can’t have it both ways. Either this is about the Ten Commandments or the law being referred to is something else, the main theme of Galatians. Not once does it say the Ten Commandments in Galatians 3, but its a continuation of the law being referred to throughout Galatians, circumcision .

 

[The Liturgist]

The law being referred to in Galatians is not the Ten Commandments but being circumcised for salvation and to hear the gospel.

How do you know? it doesn’t say that. And the Decalogue is found in the same text as the rest.

Furthermore, Genesis contains the law that was obligatory for gentiles, the Noachide Law, which is basically the same as what the Council of Jerusalem agreed upon in Acts 15.

 

[The Liturgist]

Either this is about the Ten Commandments or the law being referred to is something else, the main theme of Galatians.

No, that’s begging the question. There is another interpretation of Galatians, that being that while we should not sin, if we do sin we have the grace of our Lord, God and Savior Jesus Christ to forgive us, which is the actual thrust of the New Covenant.

This is a time when the Lutheran emphasis on the Law vs. the Gospel is extremely helpful.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

How do you know? it doesn’t say that. And the Decalogue is found in the same text as the rest.

Furthermore, Genesis contains the law that was obligatory for gentiles, the Noachide Law, which is basically the same as what the Council of Jerusalem agreed upon in Acts 15.

I just quoted it. You didn’t quote any scripture that says the law Paul is quoting from that was bewitching the Galatians was the Ten Commandments. You said previously it wasn’t. Are you saying only worshipping God is bewitching the Galatians? Stealing? Murder? Really??

 

[SabbathBlessings]

No, that’s begging the question. There is another interpretation of Galatians, that being that while we should not sin, if we do sin we have the grace of our Lord, God and Savior Jesus Christ to forgive us, which is the actual thrust of the New . Covenant.

This is a time when the Lutheran emphasis on the Law vs. the Gospel is extremely helpful.

I again prefer scripture

Heb 8:10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.

So God claimed the Ten Commandments as His- He wrote it He spoke it Exo 20:6

So you obviously view the law in Galatians as Ten Commandments despite no Text and not reconciling with the rest of what Paul or Jesus taught. It essentially is saying God is bewitching the Galatians by following what God wrote on their hearts, just as He wrote it on ours, so we are not just hearers of His Word, but doers James 1:22 through our faith, love and cooperation in Him

 

[The Liturgist]

God numbered His commandments by design and the number I see is Ten, not 614

Actually, the numbers assigned to the commandments are arbitrary and not in the original text of Exodus. But if you read Exodus or Deuteronomy, there are 614 commandments in total binding on the Jews, according to the Jews themselves including the Decalogue, which is not binding on the Gentiles, who instead are subject to the Noachide Laws found in Genesis.

All that really matters is the summary of the Law provided by Christ our True God, to love God with all our heart, mind and soul and love our neighbor as ourselves. If we do those two things, and are baptized, and eat his Body and drink His Blood in the Eucharist as he commanded in John 6 and in the four synoptic Gospels and 1 Corinthians 11, we have done that which is required.

It is impossible to sin if we continually love our neighbor as ourself and love God with all our heart and mind and soul, but because humans frequently lapse into selfishness, myself included, very few people are able to achieve that continually in this lifetime. Indeed the only person born of normal sexual intercourse between a man and a woman who did continually love God with all her heart and mind and soul and who did continually love her neighbor as herself, as demonstrated at the Wedding Feast in Cana, was the Mother of God, our glorious lady Theotokos and ever Virgin Mary, who was selected by God to be His mother owing to her righteousness. For this reason, the Bible declares that all generations shall call her blessed.

Indeed the best way to get close to our Lord, God and Savior Jesus Christ is through a deep veneration of His mother. For He is the new Adam, and she is the new Eve, according to the fathers of the Early Church who gave us the New Testament and the Nicene Creed and the liturgy.

 

[The Liturgist]

I just quoted it. You didn’t quote any scripture that says the law Paul is quoting from that was bewitching the Galatians was the Ten Commandments. You said previously it wasn’t. Are you saying only worshipping God is bewitching the Galatians? Stealing? Murder? Really??

I am saying nothing of the kind, and neither is St. Paul. You are mistaken about the point Galatians 3 is trying to make. I would respectfully suggest you read it again.

 

[The Liturgist]

I again prefer scripture

Indeed, so do I, and so do the Lutherans. Now, I don’t believe the Lutheran position is entirely correct, but it is much more correct than any interpretation which ties our salvation to how well or poorly we adhered to the decalogue, since everyone transgresses the decalogue in various ways, and thus everyone is dependent on the mercy of Christ our True God for forgiveness.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

I am saying nothing of the kind, and neither is St. Paul. You are mistaken about the point Galatians 3 is trying to make. I would respectfully suggest you read it again.

You are going to need to clarify your position. Do you think the law being referred to is the Ten Commandments? Either yes or no. If no, the discussion is a moot point because thats not the law Paul is referring to.

 

[The Liturgist]

I again prefer scripture

Heb 8:10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.

So God claimed the Ten Commandments as His- He wrote it He spoke it Exo 20:6

So you obviously view the law in Galatians as Ten Commandments despite no Text and not reconciling with the rest of what Paul or Jesus taught. It essentially is saying God is bewitching the Galatians by following what God wrote on their hearts, just as He wrote it on ours, so we are not just hearers of His Word, but doers James 1:22 through our faith, love and cooperation in Him

But none of that establishes that Galatians 3 is talking about the ceremonial law vs. the entire Torah. And even if Galatians 3 is talking about the ceremonial law, elsewhere St. Paul expressly tells us not to allow anyone to judge us on our observance of sabbaths, etc.

 

[The Liturgist]

You are going to need to clarify your position. Do you think the law being referred to is the Ten Commandments? Either yes or no. If no, the discussion is a moot point because thats not the law Paul is referring to.

I already addressed this issue in post 83: The Ten Commandments are the Covenant, did you know?

 

[SabbathBlessings]

Actually, the numbers assigned to the commandments are arbitrary and not in the original text of Exodus.

Nothing arbitrary on the number God wrote and God spoke and numbered by design because He knew man would try to tinker with what He divinely wrote. Yes it is in the original Text.


Exo 34:28 So he was there with the LORD forty days and forty nights; he neither ate bread nor drank water. And He wrote on the tablets the words of the covenant, the Ten Commandments.


Deut 4:13 So He declared to you His covenant which He commanded you to perform, the Ten Commandments; and He wrote them on two tablets of stone.

Original Word: עֶשֶׂר
Part of Speech: Noun
Transliteration: `eser
Pronunciation: EH-ser or ah-sah-RAH
Phonetic Spelling: (eh'ser)
Definition: Ten
Meaning: ten

 

[fhansen]

Indeed - in the new covenant, Theosis is possible. To quote St. Athanasius, God became man so that man could become god, meaning that we become by grace what Christ is by nature.

Naturally, theosis includes deliverance from sin, since God is by definition incapable of sin, since sin is a disease that consists of a misalignment between our will and that of God, which causes us to experience the burning fire of His love as wrath.

Yes, I think it could be said that the journey, theosis, itself, is our salvation, consistent with Rom 6:22.

 

[The Liturgist]

Nothing arbitrary on the number God wrote and God spoke and numbered by design because He knew man would try to tinker wwith what He divinely wrote. Yes it is in the original Text.

I was not referring to the total number of commandments, which is ten, but rather to numbers assigned to the individual commandments.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

I already addressed this issue in post 83: The Ten Commandments are the Covenant, did you know?

You keep saying it’s the thrust of the covenant, but from what I can read the New Covenant is about God writing His law in our hearts and minds, right where sin begins, in the heart. When we keep our rules over obeying God’s commandments Jesus said one’s heart is far from Him. Mat 15:3-14 because we are rebelling against what God placed there.

Heb 8:10 For this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord: I will put My laws in their mind and write them on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people.

Galatians is referring to a law that is bewitching the Galatians, so obviously not the law God placed in our hearts and minds that God said He would not alter Psa 89:34 Mat 5:18-30

 

[Maria Billingsley]

Can you please provide the Text for that.

The commandments Paul quoted from to define the one of the greatest commandments to love thy neighbor were from the Ten Commandments

God numbered His commandments by design and the number I see is Ten, not 614

Deut 4:13 So He declared to you His covenant which He commanded you to perform, the Ten Commandments; and He wrote them on two tablets of stone.

If the second greatest commandments come directly from the Ten Commandments on how we love our neighbor, it only makes sense the greatest commandments on how we love God with all our soul and might come from this same unit of Ten. I can’t imagine the greatest commandments would include we can worship other gods coming right from the Ten Commandments. No wonder Jesus taught not to break or teach others to break the least of these mat 5:19-30

I don't know what translation you use but here is a link in which you can do comparative.

Romans 13:8–10 NKJV - Owe no one anything except… | Biblia

Owe no one anything except to love one another, for he who loves another has fulfilled the law. For the commandments, “You shall not commit...

biblia.com

 

[SabbathBlessings]

I don't know what translation you use but here is a link in which you can do comparative.

Romans 13:8–10 NKJV - Owe no one anything except… | Biblia

Owe no one anything except to love one another, for he who loves another has fulfilled the law. For the commandments, “You shall not commit...

biblia.com

I’m using the same translation

Rom 13:8 Owe no one anything except to love one another, for ghe who loves another has fulfilled the law. 9 For the commandments, h“You shall not commit adultery,” “You shall not murder,” “You shall not steal,” 2“You shall not bear false witness,” “You shall not covet,” and if there is any other commandment, are all summed up in this saying, namely, i“You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” 10 Love does no harm to a neighbor; therefore jlove is the fulfillment of the law.

Which commandments is Paul quoting from that summarizes the Second Greatest commandment to love thy neighbor?

 

[SabbathBlessings]

When Jesus quoted the greatest commandments to love God with all our hearts and love man, He was quoting Old Testament Deut 6:5 and Lev 19:18

The summary of the second greatest commandment to love our neighbor comes directly from the Ten that deal with love to our neighbor Rom 13:9

What about the greatest commandment to love God with all our hearts and minds what makes up this very important commandment.

Moses just finished repeating the Ten Commandments then goes on to say…


Deut 6:2 that you may fear the Lord your God, to keep all His statutes and His commandments which I command you, you and your son and your grandson, all the days of your life, and that your days may be prolonged. 3 Therefore hear, O Israel, and [a]be careful to observe it, that it may be well with you, and that you may multiply greatly as the Lord God of your fathers has promised you—‘a land flowing with milk and honey.’

4 “Hear, O Israel: [b]The Lord our God, the Lord is one! 5 You shall love the Lord your God with all your heart, with all your soul, and with all your strength.

6 “And these words which I command you today shall be in your heart. 7 You shall teach them diligently to your children, and shall talk of them when you sit in your house, when you walk by the way, when you lie down, and when you rise up. 8 You shall bind them as a sign on your hand, and they shall be as frontlets between your eyes. 9 You shall write them on the doorposts of your house and on your gates.

So the greatest commandment to love God with everything we have absolutely includes the Ten Commandments ( His version) our Heavenly Father divinely wrote, His personal Testimony Exo 31:18

 

[Maria Billingsley]

I’m using the same translation

Rom 13:8 Owe no one anything except to love one another, for ghe who loves another has fulfilled the law. 9 For the commandments, h“You shall not commit adultery,” “You shall not murder,” “You shall not steal,” 2“You shall not bear false witness,” “You shall not covet,” and if there is any other commandment, are all summed up in this saying, namely, i“You shall love your neighbor as yourself.” 10 Love does no harm to a neighbor; therefore jlove is the fulfillment of the law.

Which commandments is Paul quoting from that summarizes the Second Greatest commandment to love thy neighbor?

He is quoting Jesus Christ of Nazareth!
AKA, the New Covenant.

 

[SabbathBlessings]

He is quoting Jesus Christ of Nazareth!
AKA, the New Covenant.

I already provided the quotes. Deut 6:5 Lev 19:18 are you saying the greatest commandments Jesus gave in the OT He forgot about in the NC? But Paul didn’t? Rom 13:9